TandemJeremy – Member
another vote for Ikea here.

Fascist! 😀

No actually some IKEA stuff is really good. I think my mum's going for an IKEA kitchen when she eventually gets around to having hers done. Good quality stuff, at very reasonable prices.

Everything blazing saddles said is bob on.

Personally I avoid howdens at all costs. The quality is average, but the prices are premium. Customer service is rubbish and they pester you like mad to order from them.

I use magnet trade and their birch premium carcas'. They're a lot cheaper than you think of very good quality, 20 year warranty. I usually get my doors from either TKC or Hills, much cheaper than magnet and they will make custom sizes to order.
Usually fit CDA appliances if the customer asks me to choose them. 5 year guarantee on them and a catalogue half an inch thick.

I also wouldn't pay much attention to most of the advice on this thread either.

TheFunkyMonkey you must have a rubbish Howdens , as one of their prime directives from above is to BEAT ANY like for like price, I'd take a butchers at another branch if I were you

Also, not having a go but DON'T follow PP's advice on worktop fitting, very much the wrong way to go about things,

Go on then, tell us. You can't just leave that hanging with no explanation to back it up. 🙂

Are you telling me it's not a good idea to cut the holes with the worktop in place or to measure twice, cut once?

EDIT
I've just been back and re-read what I said about it. Go on, I dare you to argue with that. It's just common sense!

OK, a wee bit of experience here – two new kitchens in the same house within 20 years.

First one was fitted by County Kitchens who did a superb job. Second one fitted by Magnet by extremely shoddy fitters. Eventually had to get the Manager to take a look. Even then the repairs were of a poor standard.

Oven – have had 2 Neff fan-assisted double ovens and the newer one was definitely not as good as the first one. If it was me, I would look at my fave appliance manufacturer to see what they offered (Miele).

If I was after a new kitchen, I would buy units and get someone, from personal recommendation, to fit. The Magnet units were of a decent quality though. Did you know there is a Howdens just off the A30? My doors came from there. Although it's trade, they will let you look at the products.

Good luck!

Cheers CG. I'll have a look for the Howdens, but I reckon at this rate we'll be buying from ABC in Aldershot. We've had 2 bathrooms from them and they are very good. The salesmen are salaried, no comission, so they don't try and ram stuff you don't want down your throat.

Last weekend we took our bannister rail out, and I've got a chippy in on Friday to fit the new newels and I'll finish it myself.

The big job in the kitchen is removing the stud wall that's in there. I don't think it's structural (I'll get an opinion on that though) and if it's not, I can see me attacking it with a sledgehammer soon.

This kitchen is a big job, not all of which I can do myself, but I'll be damned if I'm paying someone to fit the units, which I've done before (You saw our old house's kitchen!) and will do again before paying the silly prices we've been quoted for it. I know a good plumber for the gas, a superb sparky, and I've been recommended a good plasterer too. 🙂

I'd leave this to pro's unless you want it to look crap

all tradesman say that

there are a few tricks to doing a mason mitre properly, not to mention quite a few expensive tools.

can't I hire them?

I like doing stuff like this and I'm prepared to take the risk as I don't want the additional cost of a tradesman. Maybe the worktop supplier could do the joint?

The above comment is precisely why you should leave it to do pro

But why? If he's prepared to have a shot at it, then why not? What's the worst that can happen? Make a mess of it and then get someone in. Nothing to loose by trying. 🙂

I'll be screwing my own flat pack units to the walls, thanyouverymuch. Anyone with half a brain and a dash of common sense can do that. ANd the money saved will go on a really nice worktop, professionally fitted.

why, because I don't know what I'm doing? 😀
If[/u] I do this myself, I intend to use the old worktop I'm removing to practice on.
Anyway, it's a bleedin' wood joint, it's not the Sistine Chapel.

PMSL @ Bakes. Well said. 🙂

JulianA – Member

the hustler – Member
Hmm matsui being an ownbrand of the DSG chain I would be surprised if it was supplied by howdens

Well it certainly came from Howdens… Thought it was a Matsui – maybe not. Anyway, an oven from Howdens caused us problems. It's an hja 3300 model, anyway.

i know this might sound daft, but was the glass taken out and 'maybe' put in back to front?? i don't get it myself, but apparantly the inner glass will only withstand the heat from one side..???

ref the oven, Howdens have got their own Lomona range now, made by Beko who also make a whole load of other brands – agree appliances you can normally get cheaper online than a decent discount from Howdens…

Have to agree with Funky M: I must of done more than a hundred butt and scribe joints over the years and still reckon it's a tricky job and if you've never used a 1800W router before you could damage more than the jig or the worktop: you'll be paying £20 for the blackened cutter you return to the hire centre anyway so why not get someone in for this.
If you do stone/resin worktops you need special sanding equipment (Festool)with proper extraction and even then the wiff of Cyandates in the dust is fairly grim.
Why would you put a cr*p oven in a new kitchen, why not cut a hole in the worktop and hotglue a washing up bowl to the underside…same difference IMO. Get Neff or something similar for heavens sake!!

Go on then, I'll bite….

Nowt wrong with assembling your own units and 'screwing them to the wall' make sure you check them for square before nailing the backs on. work to a level line and screw several units together flush first before attaching them to anything. do spend plenty of time getting the lot as level and plumb as you can, It'll make fitting the doors and work tops easier. A lot of people can easily fit a new kitchen, a pro can fit it in quarter the time and very well (usually)

walls can (most likely will be) be out of square to each other, using the prefinished end of the work top won't allow for this, also most time the end is mashed or the laminate doesn't go right to the end. Best to take lots of measurements and cut both end of the worktop to the right shapes 1st.

I always offer the work tops in and mark the sink/hob cut out positions then remove and cut the holes out, this is for several reasons….

1- Cutouts should not have sharp internal corners better to have a slight radius.

2- Your jigsaw will not fit close enough to the wall most time to be able to get the blade in the right place.

3- You risk cutting into the units underneath unless you're very careful.

4- seal the cutouts with Silicone before fitting the sinks/hob, this is easier to do in open space, also fitting the majority of sink/hob clips is impossible with the work top fitted in situ.

Nowt stopping you having a go at your own mitres and you can hire the kit. You'll need a powerful router 1650w+ with a straight flute blade which will be toast by the time you've finished, a jigsaw with down cut blades, a mitre jig (easily damaged and expensive to replace, rubber hammer, ratchet spanner, colourfil compound, silicone and plenty of time.

the worst that can happen is that you'll wreck the worktop as some cuts require 100% 1st time accuracy, you could wreck the jig by slipping with the router and putting a nick in the cutting edge.

I'm all for people expanding their skill base, after all that's how you learn new stuff but it really boils my piss when people have no respect for someone who's been i the trade for over 15 years, think that it's a doddle and because you're a pro tradesman you're out to rip everybody off. Hell, I've got a computer think I'll have a bash at this website design malarky, looks a piece of p**s.

We've just got half a kitchen fitted in our house. Removed the previous owners faux cow hide bench.

Most expensive part by far was the granite, had to match the rest of the kitchen but otherwise we would have looked for something else.

The stuff that is original was done by a kitchen fitter – absolutely shocking work. Plumbing, electrics and joinery all dodgy. Luckily our builder is pretty good and as we have had all trades on site we've got most things corrected when we've found them.

Problem with kitchen fitters is that they aren't going to be able to do all the gas, plumbing, electrics and joinery to a high standard as normally they are done by different people.

Personally if I was going for a new kitchen I've get a building company in and probably go to somewhere like Howdens. There is a joiner in the area that does fully bespoke oak kitchens but they are £££. But if you are going to spend a lot that's what I'd go for.

I fitted the kitchen myself – it's not rocket science and the units / sinks come with instructions / cut out templates erc.

Did everything from plumbing, gas, electrics, tiling, bit of plastering, had to borrow the odd tool – jigsaw and Circular saw for cutting the solid wood worktops. Wasn't as quick as a pro, but was a hell of a lot cheaper and quite satisfying.

have no respect for someone who's been i the trade for over 15 years, think that it's a doddle and because you're a pro tradesman you're out to rip everybody off

I have the utmost respect for those with a trade, I sometimes wish I had one
but I like to do stuff myself, it reminds me that I'm capable of more than being an office drone, and above all I can't afford to pay your fees!

As a joiner and kitchen fitter i've fitted kitchens from all the big companies,if it was my money i'd go for an ikea one or get a mate with a trade card to get you one from b&q howdens etc,got to agree with the others and get someone who knows how to do the masons joint in the worktop,if not look here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD-ioF7GIAY

'm all for people expanding their skill base, after all that's how you learn new stuff but it really boils my piss when people have no respect for someone who's been i the trade for over 15 years, think that it's a doddle and because you're a pro tradesman you're out to rip everybody off.

I don't think that at all. I just know I can do a good job and not have to pay someone for it. We simply don't have the money to pay someone for stuff I can do myself. My daily rate to me is £0.00. What will you charge me? It really is that simple.
I know what I can do, and what I can't.

And this bit –

I always offer the work tops in and mark the sink/hob cut out positions then remove and cut the holes out, this is for several reasons….

1- Cutouts should not have sharp internal corners better to have a slight radius.

2- Your jigsaw will not fit close enough to the wall most time to be able to get the blade in the right place.

3- You risk cutting into the units underneath unless you're very careful.

4- seal the cutouts with Silicone before fitting the sinks/hob, this is easier to do in open space, also fitting the majority of sink/hob clips is impossible with the work top fitted in situ.

I must question

I wrote this
The main one is this – If you're cutting holes for hob & sink, put the worktop in place BEFORE you cut the holes. Worktop is very heavy, and if you do it elsewhere and then move it into place, it'll just snap where the thin bits are!
No need to screw it down, just rest it on the units, make sure it's clear underneath and then cut the holes before sliding gently into place.

Are you saying that worktop won't snap when you lift it when it's got big holes cut into it?
Your points are null and void IMO. Moving it round is just making life hard for yourself: Work with your brain before you start using muscle! 🙂
All that can be done with the worktop on top of the units just as easily as it can be done on a bench elsewhere. I did say just rest it on the units …… before sliding gently into place so it's not screwed down, there's room at the back to move the jigsaw, so you cut and finish the hole, fit the sink, then slide it back 6in into place. What could be easier?

Is this a case of the pros trying to make it sound harder than it is? 😉

Are you saying that worktop won't snap when you lift it when it's got big holes cut into it?
Your points are null and void IMO. Moving it round is just making life hard for yourself: Work with your brain before you start using muscle!

Yep that's exactly what I'm saying, in 15 years doing MY trade i've snapped zero work tops at a sink or hob hole. Maybe chucking it in place and cutting the hole out is easier but it would hardly ever be the best way.

My brain is fully engaged before touching any part of a customers job thank you very much for your concern, although, thanks to your extensive experience fitting kitchens If you have any other tips for me feel free to send them over. maybe you can also nip over to your grandmothers at the weekend and teach her how to suck eggs?

Problem with kitchen fitters is that they aren't going to be able to do all the gas, plumbing, electrics and joinery to a high standard as normally they are done by different people.

The word Normally in that statement is the crux, I'm a time served kitchen fitter and undertake all except the gas work. I'd say my work is to a very high standard and my customers seem to agree. I admit there are a lot of "kitchen fitters" that seem to sub out all of the work and make a hash of fitting the kitchen too, I've been called to a fair few mess ups to make good, don't tar everybody with the same brush please.

Check out my article for tips on avoiding a crap kitchen company

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