Ok, so long story but my frame developed an ovalized lower headtube after a small off last weekend (as well as possibly bending the steerer of my Lyriks-The whole lot is 2months old!).

I have been trying to work out how a small off could do this but i think i may know….Now have removed the headset cups (the lower alomost fell out and the top only took a couple taps).

I can see that the paint inside the headtube hasn’t been ‘scraped’ (from inserting the headset) off all the way around…Meaning that the tolerances of the frame to headset must be pretty loose/not entirely round.

In the past when i have installed headsets into new frames myself it often scores a think layer of aluminium above the cup up into the frame. Here, the paint hasn’t even come off!

Take a look at the pic and see what you think. In my mind a poorly fitting headset would only increase the forces of the frame under an impact/knock and increase the probability of damage.

Am i clutching at straws?

Cheers guys/Gals for any input!

what pic?

Possibly…good luck.

You still crashed it though.

EDIT I don’t see the relevance of the tool if it was fitted correctly.

2nd EDIT: Whoah spooky druidh cheeky edit crossover!!!

Photo? I’d agree that a loose fitting headset would only make things worse in a crash, but as the lawyer says, you crashed.

Yes, i did come off the bike (went into a shallow ditch, got thrown over the bars. I didnt see the ditch due to grass cover.) But it was not some crazy crash where i was trying to clear several buses or anything.

Surely a bike sold for ‘Agressive All Mountain’ can take a few crashes? My MX bike certainly doesnt write itself off everytime i come off!

Bottom (flaired one)

and top one:

Cheers

Tres bizarre. The cup should defo have removed the paint on its way in and the top looks strange too.

New bike?

One word:

loctite.

Brand new bike at Christmas. Bought complete (frame made in Taiwan, not sure where it was built though). This was it’s 3rd offroad ride, i did this. Frames buggered and the forks seem to be bent (but i reckon its the frame making them look bent TBH.)

I am hoping to get a warrenty job on it, or at worst a replacement front end for ‘Trade’/crash replacement price.

After finding this though, i don’t think its right!

No way will some play in the HS make the forks look bent.

Sorry but you crashed it, you’ll get nowhere with a warranty IME, worth a try-on for crash replacement.

Only ever fitted a headset myself once, but the cups were a very tight fit. The fact that tools with big torquey handles exist to press headset cups into head tubes probably answers your question

No way will some play in the HS make the forks look bent.

Sorry but you crashed it, you’ll get nowhere with a warranty IME, worth a try-on for crash replacement.

Not play in the headset mate, the headtube is flaired about 2mm back and the bearings fell out on the floor. That’s what i think made the forks look bent backwards.

I will see how i get on. Thanks

go buy a steel ruler FFS

take forks out and check the steerer !

if the frames ovalised and the forks are not bent then you might convince them it was not crash damage ….

if your forks are bent you crashed and thats that !

fwiw i crashed and bent my steerer on my rc31s last weekend but my frames fine …. good quality kit 😉

Sounds dodgy to me, it should be a very tight fit.

Was it a new headset?

Could you get (LBS?) a set of vernier callipers and measure all the relative dimensions, but if the HS is the correct size, and it didn’t even remove the paint from the inside of the headtube, I’d say the frame must have been ovalised before you started.

Good luck,

APF

Why would you loctite a headset in?! Interference fit – no need. Something isn’t right, including saying he crashed it so no warranty. What frame? Where did you buy it? Can you post a pic of the forks. Cheers.

When I said play I meant in the head tube.

Oh adn you’ll need amicrometer screw guage to measure the head tube with sufficient accuracy – not that any measurements will have any meaning now.

FWIW IME/O low speed or seemingly minor crashes can have a greater impact than you’d (like to) think – the bike lifting your bodyweight up when it hits a ditch puts a lot of force on the fork.

I cracked the head tube on a ti frame, dented the stanchions and bent the steerer in a similar crash once.

If the headtube has ovalised and you need to get it running again ( no warrenty) then use a deep insertion headset and use loctite bearing fit.

Running with a loose headset I ovalised the headtube on my tndem – doing this has stopped it being an issue at all.

Thanks for the input…Except Trail Rat for the most part. I have a steel rule thanks, and the steerer is straight. But that’s not to say that it is not bent in the crown. There was no need for the FFS was there!

Forks:

The whole bike was a new 2009 Felt Redemption 2 from wiggle.

I am sending the forks off anyway as the 2-step is loosing travel (sitting at approx 150mm already when they should be at 160mm on full travel)

A vernier will be able to measure the headtube and headset if used carefully. Accurate to a few hundredths of a mm. My headset was ovalised more than .25 mm and I could also easily measure the difference between a tight fitting and loose fitting headset. Bicycles are not made to that high a tolerence IME

Tolerances on “proper” light press fit parts need to be within +/- 0.02mm IIRC.

Sounds about right. just about on the limit of what you can measure with a vernier however if they are out of tolerence then that will be possible to measure with a vernier.

From the pic it definitely looks as though the crown has bent – must have taken quite an impact to do that and I’m not surprised the head tube is damaged as well.

Certainly it doesn’t look as though the headtube was reamed and faced as it should have been, though that’s not uncommon. It’s impossible to say now (after damage) whether the headtube was to spec when the headset was fitted. In any case, I wouldn’t say that has any bearing on frame damage with a crash of this magnitude.

the only verniers I have seen measure to 0.1mm at best.

edit -Ah well – mine measure to 0.02 mm and they are manual ones. Electronic ones measure to smaller increments than that but they are not as accurate as a micrometer.

Cheers for the input lads.

Its definately not right, regardless of stacking it.

I will mention it to the warrenty dept.

Cheers!

Furry muff.

Verniers maybe read to 0.02mm, but chances are any measurements taken with them won’t be that accurate. They’re nicknamed Very-nears for a reason 😉
If you want accuracy, you need a micrometer, bore gauge, or a good telescopic gauge.

*punches air*

And now that I’ve found all my notes from this weeks research, the recommended press fit tolerance for a headset is 0.1mm (i.e. cup size is 0.1mm larger than the head tube)