No idea if anyone can help (and I have posted similar before) but our 10 week old twin girls are waking very early. It starts around sunrise and they start to fidget and mumble/chatter. One will start and wake the other, then go to sleep and the second one will start again and wake the first (they share a cot bed in their own sleeping bags). It becomes a cycle and the signs are that they are not hungry (no rooting or crying), just slightly more awake. The thing is, once we pick them up, they fall back asleep again, only to wake when put back down to start the cycle all over.

At the moment they are having a final feed around 8.30/9pm and sleeping well until around 3.30/4am. They will then go back off after their feeds and start their waking around 5.30/6am. We tried giving them a final feed later (11pm) but they still wake at the same time and go through the same cycle – it seems to be related to the time, not hunger.

The room is very dark (blackout blind and blackout curtains) and very little noise (only outside noise is birds but they are barely audible through the double glazing).

They are clearly tired when they do this (we can tell by the immediate falling asleep when we pick them up and by their rubbing hands over eyes/faces) so I am trying to sort it for them, not for me – I know I cannot expect them to sleep perfectly at 10 weeks, but they have got into this routine and we want to break it.

Any thoughts or suggestions most welcome.

scarily, I read this as 'how to stop our twin babies walking so early' and was about to suggest you hobble them (a la misery)…but realise that I must wear my glasses

i seriously cant remember what we did with ours – think we just got up and on with it and put them back when they fell asleep and then crashed ourselves until he woke again- now ours is older we leave a pile of books and a small box with some little toys in the bed late at night – seems to occupy him for an hour so each morning (at least judging by the whoops and crys of 'wow' as he discovers whats in the box), but I am guessing they are too young for that.

I had this with my twin girls (now 8 years old) and the best solution was to put them in separate rooms and close the doors. May not be an option for you I realise. If they can't hear each other and you can't hear them they may just go back to sleep naturally. If they do really need you I'd be surprised if you didn't hear them even from behind a closed door.

The thing is, they simply do not go back down again – it they wake at 5.30am, we can hold them and they sleep till 9am. If we keep putting them down they simply keep waking up.

Tick

may not be an option for you I realise.

Unfortunately not – they share the cot bed now and have their own room where they will have a bed each (but still next to each other). We have a third room but it is an attic room which is difficult to regulate the temperature in – and is too small to be made into our bedroom.

I'm with doc blues, thought you said walking and had fencing nails already in my mind… 😯

Sometimes a bit of background noise helps the littluns sleep, ours would stay awake all night when it was dark and quiet and then sleep through all sorts of noise in the day time, maybe put music on or something

Separating them might be worse, our friends tried that with their twins at about 9 months old, they then didn't sleep at all. They're still in together now (at 4).

But the noise level is the same before they wake and after (apart from the birds being a potential addition).

Leave them to it. TBH they're obviously not hungry, they probably won't be massively stressed out, and unless they're really screaming the house down, then just let them get on with it.

If we leave them to it, they get louder and louder until one does start crying – but not wanting a feed (the one time we did feed them, they just remained awake doing the same cycle)! As soon as we pick them up they fall asleep again – sorry I didn't make that clear in the OP. We are trying to stop the cycle from starting so they (and us to an extent) get a proper sleep.

We have a 9 week only boy (just the one) and that is pretty much his exact routine. Maybe it's just what babies do. However when he wakes up at 5.30/6 it's usually cos he's been grunting for 10 minutes trying to squeeze one out!!

Over the last few nights we've brought the whole routine forward so he goes to bed at 7.30. This means we have an evening. He still follows the same pattern of sleep, first sleep for about 5 hours until 1ish, then three hours until 4ish then a further 2/3 hours until 6 or 7. So we get a couple of hours in the evening, he sleeps for an extra couple of hours but we have to wake up one more time in the night.

Ours is 13 weeks. Between 9-13 weeks she changed a lot. We didn't really realise it but the problem was that we were putting her to bed too late (about 8.30 – 9). We brought it forward to 7.30, then 7, then 6.30, now it's 6-6.30. She'll then sleep until 2-3 then 6-7.
Do yours get much sleep during the day? If ours doesn't she won't sleep properly at night.
We have a set routine of quick bath, feed, bed. It works well. No experience with twins though!

he's been grunting for 10 minutes trying to squeeze one out!!

We actually thought that at first (that or wind/discomfort) but never any signs of it.

We can't get them to sleep any earlier – they 'cluster feed' about two or three times between 4 and 9pm then settle at about 10pm.

I am sure it will all sort itself out eventually!

Do yours get much sleep during the day? If ours doesn't she won't sleep properly at night.

We try to ensure they get plenty of sleep, but they will only sleep in chairs (not the cot or the Moses baskets).

We are going to try to see if we can get them to sleep earlier, but as stated above, they cluster feed so if we fed them at 6pm (which we often do), they will be screaming for more in about 1.5 hours. Perhaps we could try putting them down and just feeding them like a night feed…

Could be worth a try.

There is no way to stop this IME, we had this chirping for a few months, Ours are 8 months and have grown out of it. We sometimes need to do an early feed 5:00-6:00, but they go back to sleep, but usually they sleep through to 7:00/7:30

Ours fed every two hours through the night and generally just came into our bed from when we went to bed until the morning. They'd generally wake up at about 5am.

Our youngest still doesn't always sleep through and she'll be 4 in November.

The oldest (6) takes until 9:30 to get to sleep even now and the youngest wakes at 6am.

That's no help to you, other than a heads-up to not take baby sleeping advice fom me 🙂

Do you do the bath/feed/bed routine? We've done this sine week 2 and I think it makes a massive difference, especially when you want to move bed time earlier. You just close the curtians and follow the routine and they think it's bedtime (I've not tried to see if it works at midday – that might be a bit cruel).

I think was why we found it easy to move bedtime forwards. Ours has always cluster fed in the evening but if he thinks its bedtime he seems to forget that he'd normally have food at 8 and then at 9.30 and just sleeps through it.

Just read your last post properly – yes follow the normal bedtime routine but do it earlier – worth a try for a night – what's the worse that can happen 😉

Father if 4 speaking and youngest is 4 months, we have got better with practice so to speak and the youngest is now nearly sleeping through from 7.30 till 6, things we have learnt over the years

Bath then feed in bedroom then straight to bed after winding now stories playtime or owt like that

Let them cry for 15 mins then pick up quick cuddle to settle then back down and walk out, if they start crying again then repeat, normally they stop crying by themselves when they realise that you aint coming running, now Mia just sucks her thumb and tries to grab her toes!

Not sure how this works with twins but as someone said above never ever let them sleep in your bed!

Do you do the bath/feed/bed routine?

We were advised a routine wasn't necessary until about 12 weeks so haven't tried yet, but are about to put one in place.

but as someone said above never ever let them sleep in your bed!

We don't let them sleep in our bed as such, but we will hold them in our arms in bed, them put them back down when settled. It works fine at the night feed – feed, hold for 10 minutes (to make sure feed stays down) then back in their bed.

We have 4 week old twin girls so I'm very new to all of this but have you tried dummies?

1) You have babies you have no right to sleep!
2) You have twin babies you have no right to sleep * 2.
3) Having two babies is not twice hard but squared 2*2.

Good luck.

We have 4 week old twin girls so I'm very new to all of this but have you tried dummies?

Evie has a dummy which she sometimes likes, other times prefers not to have it. Izzi doesn't like them. And to be fair, I would rather neither uses one at all – Evie isn't allowed hers during the day.

Anyway – how are you coping Wheeler? Having fun?

You have babies you have no right to sleep!

I don't mind for me, it is for them I am bothered – I want to make sure they are sleeping as they should so they develop as they should.

as someone said above never ever let them sleep in your bed!

If letting them sleep in your bed works for you, then let them sleep in your bed…

I want to make sure they are sleeping as they should so they develop as they should.

*** proud dad alert ***

Our eldest especially sleeps very little, and always has slept very little. She's just turned 6 but is in age 7-8 clothes; is one of the top in her year at school despite being one of the youngest in the year group; is reading way above her age – reading Secret Seven and Roald Dahl books to herself; and is stupidly fit and strong.

Don't get too hung up on the amount of sleep – if they're tired, they'll go to sleep 🙂

if they're tired, they'll go to sleep

As I have said though – the minute we hold them, they DO fall asleep and show other signs of tiredness which makes me believe they do need the sleep, but not getting it.

Yep, loads of fun. And nappy changes.

Even though it's early days we're trying to keep to a routine for our own sanity but we're not getting too fixated on it as they're still very young. Basically 7pm to 7am is the 'night time' (so they're in the bedroom with lights out etc.) and those times we try to stick to rigidly. 3 hour feed times during the day (but flexible enough to allow drift), on demand at night.

We try to keep them both in sync but this is made more complicated by one being a breast refusenik and so is fed a heady cocktail of expressed milk and formula by bottle.

afraid all you can do is put them in different rooms our twins did the same. No easy answer still the same at 8 one will wake up and wake the other for a chat early on the a sat or sun morning.

As I have said though – the minute we hold them, they DO fall asleep and show other signs of tiredness which makes me believe they do need the sleep, but not getting it.

sounds like a comforting thing. 10 weeks old is tiny small, they are probably looking for a little reassurance and a cuddle. If babies are tired they will sleep no matter whether the curtains are shut or whatever noise is in the house.

No two babies are the same and I reckon you'll just have to get on with it and grab a hour or two's sleep whenever you can. At least once a week its a good idea to go to bed when they do to try and catch up a bit.

Basically 7pm to 7am is the 'night time' (so they're in the bedroom with lights out etc.)

We will have to try this, but I can imagine we will wear the stair carpets out very soon – I KNOW it sounds like sense, but I don't know whether it will work with our two. Ours sound similar to yours in other ways though – a mix of breast, express and formula with one better at breast than the other (but a very messy bottle feeder) 🙂

On the plus side, from I've heard many of these patterns don't last and so what might seem like an established bad habit might just be a phase which in a week or two they may have moved on from (and into a more annoying habit…).

🙂

Routine, even at this early age, bathtime followed by feed time followed by bed, and keep at it

Just think, when they are teenagers you can turn the tables

Just curious…how do you know they are waking/mumbling/chattering?? Do you use a baby monitor? Get rid of it then you won't hear them.
We fed both of ours as late as possible in the evening…it nearly finished me off having to stay up til 11.00pm…but it meant they slept through til 7.00am. I know you say you have tried this…but give it a few days.
I am not trying to be controversial about the monitor thing. When our eldest came home from hospital we put her in our room. I managed all of 4 hrs listening to the snuffling etc. before she went in her own room. As we had a 3 storey house she even slept on a different level. BUT I always heard her as soon as she started crying for a feed.

Good luck….this time will soon be gone and you won't be able to wake them til midday!! 8)

Routine, even at this early age, bathtime…

Have you tried bathing two babies every night? It is not fun! I am looking forward to when they can sit up and play in the bath.

At the moment they are bathed every third day* and body-washed on the other days.

*Nappy explosions excepted.

Do you use a baby monitor?

They are in a cot next to our bed! We are planning on decanting them to their own room at about 4 months.

For 10 week olds they are doing pretty well.

They are really little, let them get into a routine and relax. Get rid of the monitor, feed them late and don't be afraid to let them be in their cot awake, they will soon let you know if they need something.

Their habits will change all of the time anyway, just relax.

A lot of new parents would love to have babies sleeping as well as yours.

Ours tend to settle well after bath and feed at 7, then get the 'dream feed' at 11 (although this is never as 'dreamy' as our book suggest – especially if a nappy change has been required).

Then the bottle fed baby will sleep solidly to 3:30 or so, feed and go till 7am whilst the breast fed one will want feeding around every 2-3 hours throughout the night.

I don't feel qualified to give out advice as we're both just trying to figure things out ourselves! I personally wouldn't separate them unless they're really desturbing each other as I think they comfort each other but I may have to retract that if things change over the next few weeks.