If someone had told me beforehand that BSc = 16 hours a wek BEng = 40 of lectures I know which I'd have done 
- no one apart from the xEng contingent seem to know the difference or indeed care once you're out in the world (with a few honourable exceptions of course).
Chat Forum
Government e-petition to make 'Engineer' a protected title
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Posted 6 months ago #
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wrecker - sure, but a new graduate Mechanical Engineer will also fully understand all of those things - plus structural mechanics, dynamics, strength of materials, control systems, manufacturing processes and a whole raft of other things.
They study heating/refrigeration systems in a lot of detail (most of 2nd year thermodynamics if I remember rightly).
Not sure who put the boiler in the fridge though...
Posted 6 months ago # -
don simon - Member
Isn't this simply about demanding some kind of respect rather than earning it?
I'm quite sure the general public are well aware that the washing machine engineer isn't a real engineer and equally they wouldn't expect any of the well educated engineers we have here to able to fix a washing machine either.I am not so sure. While doing my degree, people would ask what I was studying and when I said 'mechanical engineering' many would say something like "oh, so you want to repair cars, do you?"
Posted 6 months ago # -
I can't deny that steveo, but if talking purely about a refrigeration system, the refrigeration engineer will know more about that particular system than a mechanical designer will. 6 months dedicated to refrigeration vs 2 years?
I inspected a buildings M&E systems for defects some time ago (following complaints). It was designed by a by high profile consultancy.
I found a VRF outdoor unit located directly below a fire escape landing (a few inches). A VRF unit rejects heat upwards, an engineer would know this, result didn't work. The Water chillers were in a tiny compound with no air flow too close together, result didnt work. Water tank had a vent duct 2" above it, it could not be inspected and therefore unsafe, result drained down cannot use (L8 regs). Too many designers see equipment as boxes (in my industry) and fail to see how the plant actually works. I shouldnt complain, it keeps me in work!
Also, I've met many "M&E engineers" who do nothing but use IES every day! How are they engineers?Posted 6 months ago # -
Boiler, eh?
Yup, you know the exchanger where the the refrigerant is actually "boiled" off. Call it a different name if you like but that is what happens in it. I was talking about closed indirect loop stuff although for LPG carriers they normally used a direct loop stuff.
You actually have no idea of the training people go through
No I don't, but I do know that refigeration systems aren't complicated.
Posted 6 months ago # -
So if there was a plane on a treadmill?
anyone that can answer that can have the title
Posted 6 months ago # -
I am not so sure. While doing my degree, people would ask what I was studying and when I said 'mechanical engineering' many would say something like "oh, so you want to repair cars, do you?"
And it was the competence and superior knowledge of mech engineers that allowed me to excell in my role as a sales engineer (I must have been an engineer as it said so on my business cards and mech engineers couldn't funtion without me).
I'm still quite sure that the public would see a mechanic as a mechanic and not as some kind of engineer.Posted 6 months ago # -
People sat at PCs using software should not have an exclusive right to the term engineer. They should be called designers
Designing the software that other people use is only part of the work, about 10%. Software and Information is just more abstract than wire, gears and concrete. Software Engineers are Engineers.
Posted 6 months ago # -
wrecker - yeah, that's often where new graduates make mistakes is in terms of simple practicality. Made a few myself (nothing disastrous that I can remember!).
I think people suffer not so much from arrogance as from feeling that they HAVE to do it all themselves. There's no substitute for taking your flash new design over to the guys who are actually going to make/install/maintain it and saying "what do you think"?
Posted 6 months ago # -
Posted 6 months ago #
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What watch for engineers ?
Posted 6 months ago # -
Buzz, I wasn't referring to software engineers ( I have no idea what their job involves). I was talking about the IES (for example) jockeys and "spreadsheet" engineers.
I could point out a few things here but really don't want the thread to turn into a petty squabble so I'll shut up now.
The point is designer does not equals engineer, they're just a type of engineer.Posted 6 months ago # -
You PROPER engineers need to spend more time designing stuff that works so that we pretendy engineers don't have to spend all day every day putting the buggers right!
Posted 6 months ago # -
Saying that an engineeer has to be able to turn there hand to anything rather than a small area of experties is rubbish and even more so to compare it to Dr's. Try working in a hospital and you will soon realise that Dr's train to specalise in a single area and are very uncofortable to go out side of that.
For what its worth i cosider my self an engineer. I don't have a degree but thats more to do with my learing diffuculties restriciting me from being able to do what the acidemic world wants. i work in a engineering deapartment, have to fault find and report back on problems as well as man mange. Its amazing how many projects go on here with cEng's looking after them that can't see problems in looking after the tat that they have put in nor it seems do they care as they are on to the next thing by then.Posted 6 months ago # -
Dr's train to specalise in a single area and are very uncofortable to go out side of that.
just like Electrical, Mechanical, Software, etc Engineers then?
Posted 6 months ago # -
legend - Member
nOpe more specalist than that as those are vast feilds and are more like say Dr's or Vets.Dr's train to specalise in a single area and are very uncofortable to go out side of that.
just like Electrical, Mechanical, Software, etc Engineers then?
Posted 23 minutes ago # Report-Post
Posted 6 months ago # -
There's no substitute for taking your flash new design over to the guys who are actually going to make/install/maintain it and saying "what do you think"?
Rather depends on whether those opinions are subsequently acted upon
Posted 6 months ago # -
I started keeping quiet about being an engineer once I found out what 'Financial Engineers' were doing...
Posted 6 months ago # -
who cares, just get on with the job and fix something
Posted 6 months ago # -
What a load of boll**ks.
I am an 'engineer' I have no engineering degree but engineering training from the RAF, I then went onto become a lead systems engineer at Marconi, and now am a Senior systems engineer in the biggest defence company in the world.
I work with degree qualified chartered Engineers, who are bloody useless. Stright out of uni, to sit at a desk. They order the parts that I tell them to order, I design a system for them, and then they sign it off! They cannot do any 'engineering' them selves because they are 24, and from the playstation generation who tbh cant think for themselves. They do not understand even the basics!
Yet, I cant sign a system off because I dont have the right degree!
Posted 6 months ago # -
Engineers?
I've sh!t 'em.
Posted 6 months ago # -
Posted 6 months ago # -
Engineers are the single most bizarre group of people that I've ever had to work with.
They amaze with both their brilliance and weirdness in equal measure almost every day.
Posted 6 months ago # -
^^^ you've never worked with chemists, then?
Posted 6 months ago # -
Engineers are the single most bizarre group of people that I've ever had to work with.
They amaze with both their brilliance and weirdness in equal measure almost every day
bingo.
Posted 6 months ago # -
and now am a Senior systems engineer in the biggest defence company in the world.
Do you know Dave Coughlin?
Posted 6 months ago # -
Stoner aint a tagger.
Id love to see the authors of the tags names though Posted 6 months ago # -
I can account for two, neither of them to your detriment stoner.
Gobshiting on a forum doesn't make you hard though
Is actually funny. Gobshiting in the most anonymous way makes you the precise opposite of "hard". Was it meant as ironic? I can only hope.Posted 6 months ago # -
Fixing a Bugatti Veyron = Skilled tradesman (Mechanic)
Designing a Bugatti Veyron = Genius (Engineer)
Posted 6 months ago # -
Knowing that a Bugatti Veyron uses more than mech engineering = priceless
Posted 6 months ago # -
I agree that engineers are great and should be protected - if nothing else than for their versatility and helpfulness. I have just been told that one is coming round on Monday to mend my tap.
Posted 6 months ago # -
I wasn't referring to software engineers ( I have no idea what their job involves)
neither have they!
Posted 6 months ago # -
Is actually funny. Gobshiting in the most anonymous way makes you the precise opposite of "hard". Was it meant as ironic? I can only hope.
That was me. Sorry, it wasn't put with the tags to be anonymous, it was there to be alongside the taggers=cowards. On the Internet, I am neither a hard man, or a coward. Why? Because its the Internet, nobody can actually hurt you!
Posted 6 months ago # -
I really don't get why this petition is even being made?
The title 'Chartered Engineer' IS protected in law. Engineering is a profession with many aspects and levels, fact.
Ok so maybe the person who mends my washing machine is a mechanic or technician rather than and engineer ...the fact is that he/she is still undertaking a form of Engineering.
After all the Dr. title isn't only reserved for medical professionals it is for any one who has a PHD.
Its totally right that a the 'Chartered Engineer' title is legally protected and those who fail to recognise the value of professional registration don't understand the engineering profession.
Regds, Frodo CEng MICE
Posted 6 months ago # -
Knowing that a Bugatti Veyron uses more than mech engineering = priceless
Knowing some engineer turned even parts of that abomination into reality = a sad day for engineering
Knowing that when you heating is broke and your freezing your tits off= you not arguing the GCH guy knows more than you do.
Posted 6 months ago #
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