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Well not all of it.
I was sat at the computer when it suddenly sounded like the tiles were sliding off the roof. I looked out the window and realised it was the canopy above the front door which had fallen off the wall. It looks a bit like this:
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On closer inspection it appears to have been held in with 8 screws which were only about 2½ inches into the brickwork. The gap between my front door and the footpath is only about 3 feet and the canopy ended up on the footpath - anyone passing by could have been been seriously hurt and I'm trying not to think about my daughter going out the door and slammed it behind her causing it to come down.
The house is only 5 years old - I moved in when it was new - and there are many of these canopies on the development I live on. They are still building here so I am going to the sales centre tomorrow to see if I can pique the builders interest. Hopefully they will take this seriously as this thing took three of us to move it even after all the tiles had fallen off so the consequences of one of these falling onto someone would be pretty.
The question is, do I have any comeback with the builder in getting this sorted, would it be covered by the NHBC guarantee? I could go down the insurance route but this will end up costing me incrased premiums for years. Not putting it back is not an option as the cheapskates have put breezeblocks in the wall in the area where the canopy sits.
If you bought it new surely you have the usual (10?) year warranty on new houses? That's an abomination, and exactly why I never trust anyone to build or fix anything properly, I'd rather cock it up myself and know it's a risk than pay someone to do it AND not know! Bad luck, hope it gets sorted easily, I'm sure it will.
IIRC, there should be a 10 year guarantee with the house through NHBC. They should fix something like that.
2 and a half inches?!? 😯
You need to check what's covered with the NHBC guarantee.
I'd reckon they might be worried about sorting this, since it could happen to any of the other houses built around the same time, for the reasons you suggest.
Pretty likely that this would come under building warranty.
Getting NHBC to settle it though is another matter.
Take a photo of it in the morning. It should have been held in by more than just screws, probably anchor bolts or similar. At 5 years old it should be covered by NHBC but to be honest it may be easier and quicker for you to sort it.
Getting NHBC to settle it though is another matter.
+1
They're bastards.
Photos. Now.
What's the overall length of the screws that were "holding" it on to the wall? I can just picture the scenario on the day it was put up...
nhbc not worth the paper its written on.. complete and utter waste of time.
You need to check what's covered with the NHBC guarantee.
I'd reckon they might be worried about sorting this, since it could happen to any of the other houses built around the same time, for the reasons you suggest.
From what I have read in the past the whole house has to disappear into a hole which you have to prove you knew nothing about before the NHBC become interested.
I'm honestly more concerned with no one being under one of these if it falls off so I'm hoping the builders treat this with some degree of seriousness.
This is what it looked like after it came down:
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And eight of these is all that was holding it up:
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That is fantastically shonky just wait for the next snow fall and see how many more fall off.
A structural engineer would raise an eyebrow at that.
That is indeed shonkier than a shonky thing in shonky town.
That is fantastically shonky just wait for the next snow fall and see how many more fall off.
This is something I don't understand - the canopy had a foot and a half of snow on it for the best part of 2 weeks last December and was also hit by an avalanch of ice from the roof when the thaw came. I can only assume this has weakened the fixings but why it chose to fall off tonight is anyone's guess.
Presumably these went into heavy duty rawl-plugs?
Aye, the NHBC wont be interested but the onsite rep might.
A structural engineer would raise an eyebrow at that.
If I get no joy from the builder I think I will have a word with Building Control at the local council to see if there any regulations regarding the installation of these things.
It's hard to know. Maybe a baby Robin landed on it and that was the final straw 🙂
That's criminally dangerous. Which is a phrase you probably should use while having a word with the building people.
Presumably these went into heavy duty rawl-plugs?
It's a bit dark to see at the moment but looking at the picture of the screw I posted above there is a bit of the plug left on the screw and it looks like a standard issue brown rawlplug to me - [url= 
]here is a link to a larger version of the image.[/url]
but why it chose to fall off tonight is anyone's guess
Er have you checked upstairs for burglars ?
It's hard to know. Maybe a baby Robin landed on it and that was the final straw
I was actually wondering if any spoon handles or chewing gum had been used in the installation. 😆
Looks like a brown wall plug which means a no 12 screw. But to be fair, there should be proper wall bolts in there. Christ, I use 12s for skirting sometimes if I really need them to pull into the wall.
Er have you checked upstairs for burglars ?
I might have noticed them climbing in the window as I was sat in the room immediately above the canopy.
I have absolutely no faith in new build houses.
When I eventually stop buying shiny and start buying brickwork it will be bticks that have stood the test of time!!!
Seriously dodgy that, not to put the wind up you but it makes me wonder where else they have cut corners.
Still, luckily no one was injured!
Looks like a brown wall plug which means a no 12 screw. But to be fair, there should be proper wall bolts in there. Christ, I use 12s for skirting sometimes if I really need them to pull into the wall.
I did say to one of the neighbours that I would think twice about putting bookshelves up with the screws which were holding this thing up.
Prolonged dry period/shrinkage may have played a part. Plus it had to happen to someone first.
It's hard to guess the conditions under which things fail. Any snow loading, being straight down, may have increased the grip of the fixings in the masonary, so the failure mode at that time was most likely to be shear. Conversely, the canopy at its lightest may have reduced the downwards loading on the upper fixings, allowing a rotation about the lower fixings while the uppers fixings pulled straight out of the wall.
Either that or check for a large swallows nest.
allowing a rotation about the lower fixings while the uppers fixings pulled straight out of the wall.
At least one of the lower fixings has sheared - I could see the remnants of the screw in the wall, but it has clearly rotated away from the wall to end up where it did.
Off to bed now - thanks for all the comments.
Remember to pick a busy time at sales centre and talk loudly about the failings, sure they will rush to assist you if it stops costing them sales.
I would give your local council building control office a call on monday (not a dangerous structure anymore so no need to call out now) and share your concerns as mentioned above.
Initially show them the pic and tell them your 6 year old daughter is in hospital as a result and that your solicitor/Anne Robinson will be in touch.
That'll stir em......
>Seriously dodgy that, not to put the wind up you but it makes me wonder where else they have cut corners.<
Breeze block instead of facing bricks?
Are these three blocks standing proud in any way / designed to take some of the load?
Eiether way that's and incredibly inadequate design.
IMO it's an open and shut case - the NHBC have a legal responsibility. I would hurry things along by getting in touch with the Mirror or the Sun (depending on your political persuasion) they will almost certainly be interested in the story - specially if it involves interesting and "shocking" pictures, and they can write an alarmist story about the whole estate being at risk and the threat to children's lives.
Show no mercy - the builders and sub-contractors deserved to be hammered. Do your best to try and ensure that they are.
not been hanging any porches lately have you Ernie? Your Insurance up to scratch?
😉
Not very recently (my last porch was about 8 months ago and was considerably larger than that one) As far as I'm aware none of my porches have ever fallen off. In fact, as far as I'm aware nothing I have ever fixed has ever fallen off. Never had a come back - ever.
cant beat gripfill can you.
🙂
You can actually - epoxy resin. The wall plates on my last porch relied on the power of epoxy resin 8)
you haven't got any children you can hit, just claim it was the porch and then send the photos to the papers.
bit late i know cos i think they may have already noticed but you need to let others know with the same type of porch to wear safty helmets when entering or leaving their homes me i would be off to wicks for some 2x2 to support it till it was inspected.. nhbc is a none starter its a money earner that does not protect the home owner just creats an industry of paper pushers and they will just make things as hard as possible. remember you have to give them the right to repair but if you do anything yourself let them know and keep photos and bills,
I would be circulating pics of that around all neighbours - then they will all kick off. That'll wake the builders up.
Shocking work :-O
Shocking. As above, let your neighbours know asap.
I've just been to the sales centre. The woman in there was with a customer and really couldn't get me out of the door quick enough. All she would say was that it was outside the builders guarantee period and was completely unconcerned that another of these things could fall off and hurt someone. She told me to ring head office in the morning but I had to fight to get her to give me the number.
I am a bit reticent about going round all the neighbours and stirring anything up until I've given the builder (Bellway by the way) a chance to deal with the issue. I've been round and counted 17 more of this exact same design on the development and also some much larger ones which appeared to be supported in the same way. I will ring the head office first thing, if they don't show some urgent interest then I will be onto building control and round the neighbours.
The canopy as it is now (without any slates) takes two people to lift and we estimated the weight to be somewhere about 100kg. There are 66 tiles on next doors canopy and having weighed one I know they weigh just over 2kg each. So this thing weighs well north of 200kg. On closer inspection in the daylight I discovered there were actually only 6 screws holding it up and they were only into brown rawlplugs, on one of these the plug was into mortar and doing nothing to provide support. And it turns out I was being generous when I said there was 2½ inches of screw in the wall - this was one of the longer screws. The 4 screws holding the supporting brackets underneath had 1¾ inches of screw in the wall:
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Anyone know of any online resources which give recommended load limits for different kinds of fixings?
Ask for details of their liability insurance as you'll be needing it.
Go to NHBC and make a report, take plenty of pictures. As said probably won't do anything but worth a try. That is shocking. Think ive got a spec somewhere for fixing bolt on canopies. Will have a look
If you don't get anywhere then the local/national press would be very interested I would imagine.
I've just been to the sales centre. The woman in there was with a customer and really couldn't get me out of the door quick enough.
I'll bet she bloody couldnt!
I think I'd be camped outside the sales centre with the remnants of the porch and the tiles in a big heap on the floor for all their potential customers to see until I was satisfied they were going to something about it 👿
I am a bit reticent about going round all the neighbours and stirring anything up until I've given the builder (Bellway by the way) a chance to deal with the issue.
Why ? You owe the builder no favours - this is a potentially extremely dangerous fault. You can expect the odd door which might need easing after 5 years, but for the porch to fall off the front of the house is a ****ing disgrace. There is no justification for feeling charitable towards the builder or in any way helping them with a cover-up.
And I don't know why so many people appear to have so little faith in the British legal system. Irrespective of if the NHBC will be willing to honour their contractual commitment, they have a clear legal obligation to do so - they have no choice in the matter. This is without the slightest doubt whatsoever a major defect within 10 years.