Just been having a skim thru a bike catalogue and spotted a Specialized ground control 4.7inch tyre for £90!!! How can the price be that high? I paid £105 for a Goodyear Eagle F1 assymetric 2 225/45/17 fitted and balanced to my car yesterday :O
No puling skids on fat bikes boys!

How many of that car tyre do Goodyear sell? How many fat bike tyres get sold?

It’s economies of scale, innit.

Buy a schwalbe or maxxis at full price and you won’t get much change from 40-50 quid, fat tyres are about twice the size and cost twice as much. Unless you buy cheap from on one or go to one of the boutique brands where tyres are well over the 100 mark.

fat tyres are like enduro stuff…..total rip off because it is new and fashionable, regardless of what the bike industry folk think.

It’s probably because a tyre mold costs the same for fat tyres and normal mtb tyres, but they sell far fewer fat tyres, so they have to charge more to recoup that cost.

Like a lot of things produced, the cost of materials is insignificant compared to the production and marketing costs.

most, if not all bike tyres will be made by the cheng shin rubber company.
to produce a new size tyre will cost absolute nits. the importers will be the ones who whack up the price.

Have a looke at ridewill.it and get some cheap kenda jugganaughts and other fat goodness that is not on these shores yet for silly money even with postage

Just think how rich you could get if you designed and made a fat bike tyre then. Oh, wait….

to produce a new tyre size will cost absolute nits

Well go on then.

You take the time and effort to design a new tyre, suck up the cost of prototypes, and the time taken to test them (or perhaps pay someone else to, so you can continue with your normal job.)
You’ll have to find a manufacturer who can produce the quantity you need, in a reasonable timescale, but chances are you’ll have to place a minimum order with the factory. The more you produce, the cheaper they get, but as we know, its still a pretty small market. The more you produce, the greater the risk that you’ll bot sell them, so probably best to produce a small(er) run, and pay a higher price to begin with.

Having them shipped over to you in the UK, shouldn’t cost much, right? Having them come all that way from the far east only costs pennies, surely.
So once they’re over here, where are you gonna keep them? That minimum order from the factory probably wont fit in your shed, so you may need to rent some storage space (but that’s only a fiver a month, right?)
Then you’re going to need to let people know about your tyres, and how tremendously good value they are. Magazine ads aren’t free, and neither is banner space on sites like STW, so you’re going to have to pay for that.
Once the orders start coming in, you’ll need to take time to package and ship them. Or alternatively you can sell them to bike shops and have them do this for you. They’re going to want a cut though (bike shops aren’t charities after all)
Of course, to get the word to these shops, you’re going to need to take time to go round and speak to them, or pay someone else to.
How about the cost of warranties? as invariably there will be some defects, so you’re going to need to factor in this cost to make sure you’ve got enough money set aside to take the hit on that. How about tyres that get lost en route to the customer? Couriers who will offer insurance on items sent cost more than normal, but its not ok to charge shipping to your customers, so you’ll need to take the hit on that. Alternatively send with a cheap courier, or royal mail, but accept that you’ll have to suck up the cost of any items lost by them, and send out replacements FOC.

All of that sounds pretty simple and cheap. All in I reckon you could develop, produce and bring to market a new, amazing fatbike tyre with an SRP of £20, with enough margin to discount by 50% when people call it a rip off, with absolutely no basis or reasoning.
[/sarcasm]

In all seriousness, just because something’s expensive doesn’t make it a rip off.
Surely you accept that when something is still a niche industry/product, it’s going to be expensive, right? Surely you weigh up these things when deciding to buy a fatbike, knowing full well that spares and kit are specific to the bikes, and not widely available.

This argument has been done to death on this forum. Maybe there should be a new sticky thread, explaining fundamental economics, entitled “why things cost money”

^’Like’

£29.99

Off topic – Isn’t listing them at 1800 grams doing them a disservice? Mine were around 1400.

As for price, the floaters are a great deal even at £49

Oh those cynical marketing corporate types. It must be them again.

Well said pinetree.

It’s like at work where everyone values their own time/expertise but expects the rest of us to do our ‘thing’ (which they can’t do) for buttons.

How many times have I heard “it’s only a 5 min job”, when work is directed our way.

Floaters are as said above, nowhere near 1800g, and are ace. And not just cos they’re cheap, they are actually bloody good, roll really well and perfect for British winter riding IMO. If only they could do a 29+ floater for even 40 quid, they’d sell shed loads.

IME, standard (black) Floaters are in the 1400-1500 gram range. I think that they are great tires, especially for the price.

I’ve heard that the colored (white, pink, green, orange) Folaters are heaver than the plain black ones, but I haven’t seen any myself so can’t be sure.

You take the time and effort to design a new tyre, suck up the cost of prototypes, and the time taken to test them (or perhaps pay someone else to, so you can continue with your normal job.)
You’ll have to find a manufacturer who can produce the quantity you need, in a reasonable timescale, but chances are you’ll have to place a minimum order with the factory. The more you produce, the cheaper they get, but as we know, its still a pretty small market. The more you produce, the greater the risk that you’ll bot sell them, so probably best to produce a small(er) run, and pay a higher price to begin with.

all this tosh is irrelevant, cheng shin own maxxis. they make tyres hence they make then theirselves. no minimum order is needed.

companies like on one/planetx manage to sell tyres/goods at far cheaper than companies selling fashionable must have items………i wonder how such small companies like this survive? they make a little less profit maybe?…… ❓

Its specialized. They love **** the customer.

I’ve heard that the colored (white, pink, green, orange) Folaters are heaver than the plain black ones,

only until they start cracking and bits fall off.

£90 isn’t that expensive for fatbike tyres. Check out Husker Dus, Dillingers etc. Of course, they’re from cool kids QBP, home of Salsa and Surly.

ton – Member

companies like on one/planetx manage to sell tyres/goods at far cheaper than companies selling fashionable must have items………i wonder how such small companies like this survive? they make a little less profit maybe?……

They have lower prices due in large part to their direct to consumer model. Most mainstream brands have another 2 levels in their distribution chain, and those costs are (and need to be) passed on tho the consumer.

For Example

Floater Tire
Vee Rubber (mfr) -> On-One -> Consumer

Mainstream Brand Tire
Vee Rubber (mfr) -> Brand Name -> Importer/Wholesaler -> LBS/Retailer -> Consumer

Its all a tradeoff, though. The Floaters are cheaper. But a tire that I buy from the LBS has sales and warranty support from them, not from On-One USA that is the whole way on the other side of the continent from me (and a week’s time ground shipping).

I was running a pair of Vee Rubber V8s – they cost me £35 each

Utter sh*te – side walls ripped our far too quick. They just were not strong enough to be run at low pressures

Currently running some Surely Nates – brilliant tyres – but cost 3 times as much as the V8s

You get what you pay for!

Recently bought some Maxxis Mammoths – cost me £60 each, which is broadly in line with high end tyres on my other bike – first ride on them tomorrow

‘Fat Tax’ i’m afraid – the more ’boutique’ the more tax we pay

It’s coming down though ::)

running a pair of Vee Rubber V8s – they cost me £35 each

Can you send me pics and installation notes please.
Pressure. Rim size Etc.

I’m doing some work with Vee Rubber.

Assume with with performance level you will be returning to supplier anyhow?

Ton, mate, honestly you are talking shit on every level. You think importers are driving rollers?*

Maxxis can order small runs of tyres because they are owned by Chen Shing?

Some of us have worked in manufacturing and importing, you have not. Stop your end-user-whining posting, you haven’t a clue.

*(SWIDT?)

All you people claiming Floaters are ace.
Have you tried any other fat tyres?
I personaly find the floater okish for a rear tyre buy complete pants on the front.

Some of us have worked in manufacturing and importing, you have not. Stop your end-user-whining posting, you haven’t a clue.

Al

1st thing, you are wrong, i still do.
2nd we import from china
3rd there for i do have a clue

we sell four brands that are made in the same factory in china. my md and company owner went to said factory 6 years ago.
we now get all the kit we bought from the four companys, made under our own brand name. therefore we get it at the same price the four get it.
we know make a shed load more cash selling it on to the end user.

like i said, the tyres and other stuff a expensive because they are in fashion at present.

All you people claiming Floaters are ace.
Have you tried any other fat tyres?
I personaly find the floater okish for a rear tyre buy complete pants on the front.

I’ve only tried nates, and they were like dragging jabba the **** hut behind your already heavy bastard fat bike.

boltonjon – Member

I was running a pair of Vee Rubber V8s – they cost me £35 each

Utter sh*te – side walls ripped our far too quick. They just were not strong enough to be run at low pressures

Similar experience with V8s. Running at 8psi sidewalls ripped after 17 rides / 310 miles (140 of those on beaches). Normaly if a new tyre rips I’d put it down to bad luck, but both failed in quick succession. First time I have ever returned a pair of tyres as not fit for purpose

Nobeer.
So the self steer thing and lack of grip for a 4 inch tyre doesn’t bother you then…

You can’t apply you’re local trail conditions to mine, much as you’d like to. There are many different types of sub soils and rock types in the UK, live with it. They roll well, grip well and shed mud, on MY local trails.

Ridden floaters all the year. Bought hates but took them off as they were so expensive I didn’t want to wear them out Si I am keeping them for snow.

My floaters (orange ones), have cracked sidewalks. OO sent another pair which are after about 800 km, unused and still running… And will continue to until spectacular wall failure.

Also have some fatbike slicks but they will need dry summer trails ..

They roll well, grip well and shed mud, on MY local trails.

and self steer on any kind of hard surface. 😉

I’ll take your word for it.

Maxxis can order small runs of tyres because they are owned by Chen Shing?

Nope.

I’ll take your word for it.

so you’re running them in double digit pressures then. 😉

we sell four brands that are made in the same factory in china. my md and company owner went to said factory 6 years ago.
we now get all the kit we bought from the four companys, made under our own brand name. therefore we get it at the same price the four get it.
we know make a shed load more cash selling it on to the end user.

I’m afraid your example doesn’t really transfer over to the high-end bicycle tyre supply chain, allow me to explain.

Thing is the people who develop the tyres and pay to have the moulds made then own those moulds and any factory with any scruples will only use that mold to make tyres for the original brand that designed them. Ensuring that those who sank time and money into the R&D get to reap the rewards.

The three major high-end Far Eastern contract tyre manufacturers (Vee-rubber, Kenda & CST/Maxxis) stick to this arrangement as if any one of them started making own branded tyres using their clients’ moulds the ‘Premium’ brands would cease to trust them with their designs and they’d hemorrhage contact business to their competitors.

This is why you can’t just buy a Surly or 45′ North tyre with a CST label on the side. You can buy something very similar and some basic tyres are ‘open mould’ and labelled by various budget brands but the premium designs remain unique.

So it’s not just a case that On-One or other discount brand can just ring up and order X x Surly Fat bike tyres with On-One logos on the side. They either had to use an existing ‘open mould design’ that the factory offers to anyone or get their own molds made.

It should also be noted that manufacturing expertise doesn’t automatically equal design excellence, otherwise we’d all be riding Meridas.

So Ton, it’s ok for you to make some money but not the tyre guys?

so you’re running them in double digit pressures then.

Nope. Keep digging.

😆
Seriously do you not find they self steer on the front when you get a bit of speed up?