Although it did teach me the difference between "too" and "to"

Touche, but you didn't notice that I had spelt sort wrong, I blame an old laptop with worn keyboard, nothing to do with being taught by the headteacher occasionally!

A PA to a CEO does more than look pretty, plus how many foreign trips, meetings and life problems (arranging car, house, cat/dog, children, bills) etc does a head teachers PA look after whilst the Head teacher is in America with suppliers etc?

In addition. Why the **** does a Head teacher need a PA? Wont a Secretary suffice.

What next, Head Teachers on double the Prime Minister salary as 'educational authorities' are classing pupil numbers as similar to 'employee numbers'? So a company employs 1,000 people- what would a PA need to be paid if this was 1,000 children?

What next? A Marketing Manager for the school when they send out spring harvest info to parents?

Autism is rife on this forum isnt it?

but you didn't notice that I had spelt sort wrong

Oh but I did. I forgave you for that………we all drop letters occasionally.

But a grammatical mistake ? ……………dear oh dear 😐

but you didn't notice that I had spelt sort wrong

Tut tut. It's 'spelded'. 🙄

My headmaster knew me. I spent a lot of time waiting outside his office.

[/quote]Really?? I am struggling to believe that!

Yep it's true. Well almost. The data is a little skewed as the article below states, but the likely error from not sampling people not paying tax via PAYE is unlikey to skew the data too far.

What is a big salary?

£32-38k would put you somewhere between the 75th percentile and the 85th percentile.

This smacks of a consultancy looking at structures and advising that a head master is similar to a CEO of a big (1,000 employee+) company so needs the same sort of perks etc.

The ickle difference is the 1,000 employees are employed to each bring in some sort of added value or £££ to the business. Children are consumers of a state budget allocated to the school to spend wisely and…within budget.

Wonder if this particular school has rinsed through playing fields and other assets in the past…

Wasteful ****.

Oh but I did. I forgave you for that

Thank you, so kind 😀

Wasteful ****.

So people have no value? The education of children not as important as profit?

The education of children not as important as profit?

Totally agree. So why not be wise with your budget and spend it on the education of the children 🙄

I think that's what they are doing, Hora,

The job is in a school… 🙄

I couldnt believe it when we went to look at a primary school for our eldest. Small Church School with about 120 pupils. We were introduced to the "business manager". Now of course she wasnt really some high flying big cheese in a shiny suit, she was just a secratary, but I got the impression that Schools have to be seen to be a modern businesses these days.

I can imagine that PA to the head of a big modern scondary is quite a key role, & a good one probably is worth that salary. Right or wrong, Heads are about more than school these days.

of course its too much. The public sector is stuffed to the brim with people doing waste of space jobs and getting too much for doing it. E.G. the head of Suffolk County Council on £250,000. FFS!

Its not the teachers, road sweepers, librarians and so on, its the endless pet projects, overlapping duties, short hours and final salary pensions. I'd love to have a chance to clear them out. I'd make the Tories £6billion cuts look like chicken feed. The waste is immoral.

I'd love to have a chance to clear them out I'd make the Tories £6billion cuts look like chicken feed. The waste is immoral.

Stand for election ? 💡

……..or wouldn't anyone agree with you ?

of course its too much. The public sector is stuffed to the brim with people doing waste of space jobs and getting too much for doing it.

Whereas every single job in the Private Sector is valuable and essential for the smooth running of society….

You've called yourself 'hh45'. I wouldn't entrust you with making me a bacon sarnie, far less with sorting out Public Sector overspending.

I'd consider voting for him.

There you go hh45 …….you've got your first supporter 8)

Not bad in just three minutes.

Regardless of the salary, I find it hard to believe that a head teacher can require a PA.

Fair enough they have plenty of meetings and arrangements to make – but perhaps the real problem is that the education board approval system is unnecessarily inefficient; rather than allowing schools to get on with actually teaching?

But that is the way of the public sector. There are not – and never will be – enough worthwhile jobs to keep a full population employed so the government has to find ways of fitting people in somewhere.

I understand why the pay is so high.

I think the role is in Milton Keynes

hth.

There are not – and never will be – enough worthwhile jobs to keep a full population employed so the government has to find ways of fitting people in somewhere.

What a damning indictment of the private sector.

Regardless of the salary, I find it hard to believe that a head teacher can require a PA.

Then either you are somewhat hard of thinking or you have no idea what goes on in a school. Having said that I'd be peed off if I was a teacher in that school.

I'd also like to hear what a Teacher in that school would say about that pay scale. Its on-par with a qualified/experienced high School teacher isnt it?

I'm impressed that people are able to discern the appropriateness of a PA for the headmaster without knowing the organisational structure that the school employs – or is everyone here a business consultant?

I worked as the head of department in a HE college until recently – we chose to restructure our staffing and employ a PA for me so that I could spend more time teaching and developing programmes of study, rather than doing all the jobs a PA would be better qualified to do. It made much more effective use of the people and skills available to improve the educational experience for the students.

Perhaps they're looking to do the same thing.

This one's for all the consultants out there…

so that I could spend more time teaching and developing programmes of study

Headmasters now teach?

Headmasters now teach?

I think we've already covered that earlier in the thread.

The point I was trying to make was that it makes more effective use of the money spent on employing a head teacher if you allow them the time and space to think strategically about the development of the school as an effective educational experience for the pupils, rather than fritter away the resource having them carry out tasks a good PA could do better than them for less money.

I think everyone can/could get their head (no pun intended) around the idea of a head teacher having a PA; that's not the stretch. It's the amount they are being paid that is the stretch. They are after all a secretary, it's an organising role in a school and while that is an important job I would struggle to believe that it is so complex and demanding as to command a salary that high. For example, that is either on par with or more than a police sergeant makes; as has been pointed out here, more than Heads of Department make and it’s more than a nursing sister makes. All three of these roles are in the public sector and have significant managerial and leadership responsibility, not to mention the responsibility for people’s lives. These roles should be paid more than a PA based on their responsibility and job profile.

If it were in the private sector, then you can argue that it’s market driven, but it’s not (and that’s one of the big failings of the public sector IMO. There is no efficiency mechanism innate to the system) so someone somewhere has made an arbitrary decision that this is the value of the role and frankly I think it’s overblown by around 20%

Yeah, but none of your opinions are based on any knowledge of what the job entails, so how can you pass judgement on it, and say stuff like " think it’s overblown by around 20%"?

What's your job? What if I think it's overpaid, without having any idea what it is you actually do? Is that fair?

Put it into context, that PA vacancy salary is higher than some BA waitresses cabin crew earn!!!

If it were in the private sector, then you can argue that it’s market driven, but it’s not (and that’s one of the big failings of the public sector IMO. There is no efficiency mechanism innate to the system)

I know, and know-of, a large number of people in not-for-profit and public sector jobs who earn more (some significantly so) than £50K a year -in the provinces, not in that London. In fact, the highest paid people I know work in the public sector…

The annual pay scale increment rises for everyone have just kept on coming over the years and various re-structuring exercises seem to create higher and higher paid managerial positions for professional meeting attendees who appear to be on a stratospheric promotion trajectory.

If anybody so much as looks at an employee the wrong way, offence is taken, 'grievances' are lodged and the unions kick up a fuss. There is no need to get out the braziers and donkey jackets though. Suspension on full-pay before reinstatement is now the way to deal with it -This is 2010, not 1976.

To add some context, the headteacher of a medium-large school could be earning £100K+

Seems very high to me, certainly more than PAs are paid where I work and we're an order of magnitude bigger than a school in terms of budgets and operational complexity (and we even have an office in MK).

And it's absolute bollocks that head teachers are like CEOs of multi-million pound businesses. They may have a multi-million pound budget but that's a far cry from dealing with trying to increase revenues, managing shareholders and providing strategic direction in a highly competitive business. Spending money is a frick of a lot easier than making it.

Hell the spend going through my team was close to 1 million last year and it's a team of 5 people, I don't have a PA and in fact I'm paid less than the top rate offered for that PA job and I'd guess I work longer hours and probably have less holiday.

I'm a business/sales consultant in the HR industry. I have had exposure to the recruitment, learning & development, assessment and general consulting industries. I know a fair bit about how businesses structure and manage their people including pay scales so I have something of an informed view on this.

As for re-evaluating my ‘worth’ well I can speak with some experience of that. The industry I work in was hit pretty damn hard by the recession. The firm I worked for went bust, I lost my job, was out for 8 months and have made it back recently with a 20% reduction in basic pay. I am not alone in the private sector with having borne the full effects of the recession. The public sector is going to be next and I can almost guarantee that this PA role, being paid £38k, is going to be a prime target because it sure as hell shouldn’t be teachers, police officers and nurses.

Why are you comparing this job to that in a 'business'??? A school is far more complex; you have children to manage, all with particular needs which must be addressed effectively and appropriately. Etc.

Ye Gods…

🙄

If you think it's such an easy, cushy job, why aren't you all applying for jobs in the Public Sector?

Schools are run to incredibly well defined practices set out by the government. In fact many teachers think it's too prescriptive thus making their role far too administrative and stifling their ability to think and act creatively and freely. I agree that there is a heavy administrative burden, but I don’t agree they are more complex because everything they have to do is laid out for them. Their challenge is a delivery one (and I agree it is a big challenge)

In a business, no one is telling you what to do, you have to figure it out on your own and you have to compete in what is often a crowded and complex market place. You’ve no way of knowing whether the decisions you make are right or wrong and if you get it wrong you’re out of a job.

If you think it's such an easy, cushy job, why aren't you all applying for jobs in the Public Sector?

Funnily enough I did apply for a front line role in the PS that would have meant a £50k drop in earnings and I would have bitten their hand off for that role. In the end there were reasons beyond my control as to why they couldn't give me the job.

Besides, we're going to loose perhaps 20% of the public sector over the next few years and I've had my fill of insecurity.

I don’t agree they are more complex because everything they have to do is laid out for them.

You've never taught in a school, have you?

Some of the responses on this thread are simply about individual jealousy and bitterness, rather than giving informed, valid opinions. None of us know exactly what this job entails, so aren't qualified to comment on the 'value' of this position.

In addition. Why the **** does a Head teacher need a PA? Wont a Secretary suffice.

Jesus Christ Hora; it IS a bloody secretaryI It's just a posh name for it, that's all! 😆

GT1972; so you earn shitloads more, and you're moaning about what someone else might get? Don't you think that's pretty bloody selfish? What is it that you do? How valuable to society are you? Come on; you're so quick to condemn others, let's see if you can defend your position.

To add some context, the headteacher of a medium-large school could be earning £100K+

Judas Priest! I thought you entered teaching as a vocation, a passionate (oi) for children.

talkemada – the money has all gone, are you in the public sector?

Well first off I pay rather a lot of tax and it looks like I am going to be paying quite a bit more as well in the future. So that's my first contribution to society.
Second, my work aims to make people's experience of work better, help them be better at their jobs, help them make better decisions about which jobs to take, where their strengths are, where their development needs are etc. In doing that I help make businesses more efficient and so they pay more tax.
I have in the past taken a lot of time outside of my working hours to help people in tough situations, mostly people in redundancy or in a role they are unhappy with. I believe strongly in giving back to society and I make a point of trying to help people wherever I can so I have given many free hours of my time in support of that. I also spent a 10 years doing voluntary work in the London Borough of Southwalk, working with disadvantaged kids teaching them Karate in my spare time before I became a parent myself.

Talkemada you're right to question me as you do and yes I haven't taught in a school before but I have had a good deal of experience with organisational development and design and my opinion is that £38k for a school PA to the head teacher is a lot when compared to other front line, managerial roles like police sergeants, nursing sisters and heads of departments in the same school.

don't have a PA and in fact I'm paid less than the top rate offered for that PA job and I'd guess I work longer hours and probably have less holiday.

You sound quite bitter. Have you thought about retraining as a PA? Apparrently the money's great and the job is so easy a 5 year old could do it 🙂

RichPenny, I'd do it however I'm not sure I could comply when the boss asks me to get up all freaky on the desk for him. 😐