Viewing 40 posts - 35,081 through 35,120 (of 77,140 total)
  • EU Referendum – are you in or out?
  • zokes
    Free Member

    Meanwhile business/private sector simply continues to get on with things

    Indeed. Plans to move out of the UK, and to rationalise staff numbers are forging ahead with great gusto.

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    Perhaps we are misreading THM’s advice, we should be setting up businesses to offer Brexit planning services, you know organise lots of meetings, talk a lot and write some reports that will be out of date by the time they are printed 😉

    Anyway with the DUP now putting pressure on to sack Hammond we can see that this is a tiny bunch of people pushing their agenda.

    tjagain
    Full Member

    Mike – really? The DUP will not stand for a hard exit as that means a hard border for eire / NI and Hammond is the most likely to make it a soft exit. More shooting themselves in the foot.

    mikewsmith
    Free Member


    As much as you can believe the Telegraph

    tjagain
    Full Member

    it just gets more ridiculous. without Hammond the chances of a hard leave are higher!

    mikewsmith
    Free Member
    zokes
    Free Member

    it just gets more ridiculous

    Let’s face it, there’s not been much intelligence exhibited in the rationale for Brexit as it is. I wouldn’t have thought the DUP were a place to start looking for it.

    codybrennan
    Free Member

    teamhurtmore

    Meanwhile business/private sector simply continues to get on with things. The politicians can posture as much as they like, they merely react. In contrast, business gets on with life proactively.

    We are, others should do the same.

    Is a fair point. I’ve been involved tangentially with Brexit preps for my place, albeit on a small scale, mostly working out where the costs of things we need to import and can never make in the UK are likely to go in the next few weeks/months. There’s been considerable volatility and suppliers are only happy to absorb changes so far, so we have to factor this in.

    But adopting a pragmatic attitude to business and forecasting for future trading environments is only one small part of how Brexit affects us as a nation…what’s far, far more important is what- let’s call them ‘ordinary people’- need to do, or can actually do, to offset big unexpected change.

    It’s simple, really- we have a system where politicians are elected to act in the best interests of the electorate in matters where an individual can’t directly effect an outcome. We influence them by informing them of our concerns and ask them to act on our behalf. We expect them to take a balanced view of the matter, and intercede for us.

    Brexit should be one of those matters. But Brexit being what it is, it seems to me that there’s little that ordinary people can do to now to have their concerns addressed. If the contents of these reports are true, those who can’t handle the change will suffer. How can breadliners cope with a surge in retail pricing, for example?

    As usual, those who can prepare and offset can and will do so, and those who can’t need help and interventions from their representatives. And they’re not getting that. They’re getting publicly-funded reports suppressed because they don’t fit the vision. It’s difficult to proactively plan for change when you need an elected representative to do that for you, and they in turn are attending to a different agenda.

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    How many of these so-called ordinary people decided that their interest were best served by not being members of the EU? Our representatives have a duty to respect their wishes and execture the mandate that they were given, In this case the ordinary people have asked them to withdraw our membership.

    The government is currently seeking to negotiate a deal on their behalf. They are not despite all the froth seeking a hard brexit although quite rationally they accept that this is one of a series of potential outcomes that needs to be prepared for. Plus it has to be genuinely “threatened” in order to stop the EU play is their silly games.

    So the ordinary folk are getting what they wanted. It was their choice. They can’t complain.

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    The government is currently seeking to negotiate a deal on their behalf.

    And if they fail to negotiate a deal what should be done? If the deal they negotiate will harm the UK what should they do? Shrug and go will of the people and all that or be a bit grown up and say if we continue along this path these will be the consequences.

    zokes
    Free Member

    How many of these so-called ordinary people decided that their interest were best served by not being members of the EU?

    Just over 17 million. UK population just over 66 million. So just over a quarter.

    Plus it has to be genuinely “threatened” in order to stop the EU play is their silly games.

    I’m not quite sure the EU have finished laughing at our attempts to negotiate. Let alone stopped laughing long enough to contrive to play silly games. How’s the red white and blue Brexit coming along? That sounded sooooooo sensible.

    So the ordinary folk are getting what they wanted. It was their choice. They can’t complain.

    Ah, Tory compassion at its finest. And you wonder why anyone with an ounce of moral fibre loathes your sort.

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    We know thwe consequences broadly. Yes, they have a mandate to deliver. They need to do it to the best of their ability. It’s not easy for sure but farting about and moaning endlessly does get anyone anywhere.

    thejesmonddingo
    Full Member

    Why are you wasting your time on here,then THM ?

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    Charming Zokes but your attempt to design the issue along party political lines instead of accepting reality is the reason why anyone capable of thinking got one moment, “loathes your sort” your opinions can be dismissed so readily.

    Feel free to ignore what these people want and impose you minority views on them. You know best after all and bugger them and their wishes and interest. But shouldn’t you be more worried about the bursting of the Aussie debt bubble?

    (How many of use voted to remain BTW?)

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    It’s Sunday and finished ride so needed some fun to read. Will so some more work later 😉

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    We know thwe consequences broadly. Yes, they have a mandate to deliver. They need to do it to the best of their ability.

    Well good job the sent the A team, trying ones best is not good enough if it fails.

    It’s not easy for sure but farting about and moaning endlessly does get anyone anywhere.

    The loudest moans are coming from the Pro Brexit Press about how terribly unfair it is the UK isn’t getting what it wants. Day by day the dreams and claims before the referendum are evaporating.

    Given the best anyone seems to manage is to say Bespoke Deal (c) and Best Interests (c) blah blah blah no you can’t see the report it doesn’t exist it’s not looking like a good deal is anywhere near

    zokes
    Free Member

    Feel free to ignore what these people want and impose you minority views on them

    I’ll happily ignore the views of just over 25% of the population if it benefits the other 75%. Maths not your strongpoint, tmh?

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    Not really, day by day we are inching towards compromise. Both sides have said as much. The issue is the glacial pace.

    tjagain
    Full Member

    thejesmonddingo – Member

    Why are you wasting your time on here,then THM ?

    I don’t think he understands that nowadays he is either blocked or have folk laughing at him. His attempts to patronise and sneer enough to antagonise folk is no longer working. Why he is allowed to stay on here I don’t know

    zokes
    Free Member

    But shouldn’t you be more worried about the bursting of the Aussie debt bubble?

    Why?

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    lol I assume he hasn’t worked out people can multi-worry.
    Given the negotiations have inched onwards to still not have the 3 starting conditions met at this stage makes any hope of a decent outcome slim to say the least, it’s not like there is a fixed deadline or anything to worry about.

    zokes
    Free Member

    lol I assume he hasn’t worked out people can multi-worry.

    Well, as a non home owner but having an almost complete 20% deposit, if we’re honest, that bubble bursting would be quite good for me. And I doubt I’ll shed too many tears for the over-invested landlords who were able to buy their sixth property having their risks subsidised by my taxes through negative gearing.

    Edukator
    Free Member

    Not really, day by day we are inching towards compromise. Both sides have said as much.

    Barnier is talking about a “dead end” not compromise. There is no compromise possible on NI (it’s a catch 22), the British refuse point blank to guarantee the rights of EU citizens in the UK will be maintained and the financial negociations are so far apart a compromise is not even near. If “we are inching towards compromise” then there a kms still left to cover and there’s no chance of getting there before the death of all parites concerned.

    https://www.la-croix.com/Brexit-Barnier-espere-avancees-deux-mois-2017-10-12-1300883708

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    Very true, the impact on the UK’s housing market of a recession would be troubling, guess that on is in a Top Secret document somewhere too. But I’m sure the poorest will be resolute when they work out it’s all being done to teach them a good lesson.

    Junkyard
    Free Member

    Why are you wasting your time on here,then THM ?

    Where else could he condescend folk, patronise them and be so rude to them but here?

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    Zokes – I thought you lived in Aus? But the debt bubble is going to burst at some point.

    Great comments TJ from a guy who loves to shout “nonsense” at some of the more sensible and informed posters here and then bully people into submission by posting stuff that is patently untrue. The laughs are genuine but you are missing the source.

    And the truth – Barnier hinting at moving towards trade negotiations. Germans stalling, others wanting to proceed.

    Wherelse can the bullies suppress debat and drive forumites away? There is probably only one leaver left who is prepared to post on here. But then suppression of debate and indoctrination with false facts is a well-abused tactic of certain groups thru history. No change there….

    igm
    Full Member

    That those Germans who 6 months ago were going to force the rest of the EU into a U.K. friendly compromise?

    The future is a strange place I think.

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    They know who will be picking up the tab IGM. They have always been driven by self interest – with refugees being one notable and commendable exception for which Merkel was widely derided – no wonder Schauble is already talking about letting the UK back in!!

    How are you? You have been quite this week

    igm
    Full Member

    I was out in Salt Lake City doing some stuff with our American cousins. Brutal trip as always. People hear about jetting off places and imagine a wonderful glamorous lifestyle. Airports, taxis and hotels are not glamorous.

    I don’t doubt your logic on the Germans, though I have no view either way myself as all the Germans I’ve met are splendid people but governments sometimes aren’t. I was just reflecting on any number of Brexies telling us that we would get an excellent free trade deal with Europe because we buy German cars.

    igm
    Full Member

    Also, nothing much has happened worth commenting on this last week.
    Few interesting things that may or may not become worth reflecting on in a week or two.
    Opinion polls at 47:41 remain are not as one offs interesting (ok it’s not quite one offs but…) however if it gets to say 50:40 and stays consistent around that level, then politically the Brexies (and those like the Tories they are relying on) have a problem.
    Funny old game politics.

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    Inside source on German money demands. Auto industry public knowledge. Budget concerns simply obvious. The last thing the Germans want is to be the main guys on the hook for unfunded pensions.

    Germans are acting in their self interest. And many here applaud that. We act in our self interests and the opposite. As you say funny old game politics

    Talking of funny old politics poor old JMcD had a rough ride from Marr this morning. He makes some of the nutters look like heavyweights. Sad bloody bunch all round

    tjagain
    Full Member

    igm – bar the fact the talks have pretty much collapsed, the lies of the 3 amigos are now pretty much completely exposed and the fact that a cross party consensus has emerged to stop a hard brexit that has meant the tories are so scared of losing votes they have had to delay the committee stages of the bill?

    In other words the tory strategy has now collapsed

    mattjg
    Free Member

    FAO any Brexiteers playing the “make Britain great again” card …

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/14/defence-spending-mod-cuts-brexit

    pondo
    Full Member

    There was a strategy? 🙂

    teamhurtmore
    Free Member

    And the more honest assessment – even from the guardian

    Here are the main points from the press conference with David Davis, the Brexit secretary, and Michel Barnier, the EU’s chief Brexit negotiator. Not for the first time, Barnier arrived with a headline-friendly phrase conveying doom. But he also hinted at the possibility of progress by the end of this year. That would be much later than the UK government originally wanted, and it would still leave precious little time to agree a transition deal before British businesses start to hit the panic button, but it does give Davis a sliver of good news to cling to

    DrJ
    Full Member

    Talking of funny old politics poor old JMcD had a rough ride from Marr this morning.

    Must have been watching different programmes. Marr asked him some obvious questions. McD gave some obvious answers. No drama.

    igm
    Full Member

    THM – that makes Davis sound like a fish being brought in by an angler. (Oops, almost a pun.) Not great, however…

    …Turning to TJ’s comment, I think the talks and the mood in parliament sounds about where I’d expect around now.

    There is an inflection point coming, but which way it goes… well we’ll see I guess.

    tjagain
    Full Member

    IGM – about what is expected? Perhaps but it makes awful news for the tory boys on here hence their continual attempts to divert, mock. scorn etc

    metalheart
    Free Member

    I heard a programme on radio 4 on my to/back the supermarket:

    We are exactly where we want to be re negotiations as the only traction we have left is cash. We walk away the EU has a large funding gap to bridge…

    So basically we are playing a game of chicken (and who will blink first).

    Waaay, go us…

    tjagain
    Full Member

    It won’t be the EU thats for sure. Exactly where we want to be? Only if you are a far right zealot

Viewing 40 posts - 35,081 through 35,120 (of 77,140 total)

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