Scott eGenius 720 Plus
1st ride, 1st Impressions

Location and Conditions
A 45 minute ride around Lordswood and Southampton Sports Centre.
Despite the Thursday Night Riders assuring me the trails were dusty, dry and smooth I found them to be deeply muddy, rooty and very slippery.

First Impressions – Ignoring the Electric bit
I must be the right shape for Scott bikes as I was immediately comfortable. Always a nice start.

The 650b Plus tyres roll over things a lot more easily that the 26″ ones I am used to.

The Nobbly Nics don’t appear to have any more lateral grip in the Lordswood flavoured mud and roots so lots of slip sliding.

The remote twin lock-out was useful. You can push the lever part way to shorten and stiffen the front and rear suspension or push it all the way to fully lock it out. The part way setting is fine for the short road ride to the woods and fully unlocked for the woods. I guess locked out is an option for longer road sections.

I need to get a dropper post. I had one for a few rides before my last bike was stolen and it makes such a difference. I would put it up with disc brakes for the benefit it gives.

First Impressions – The Electric bit
The bike has four electric settings each gradually increasing the amount of assistance.

For what I was riding setting 1 was fine and just felt like riding a normal bike but on better terrain than I was actually riding. I also used setting 2 for quite a lot of the ride as it is the first ride I have done for a year. Both of these settings felt quite natural although the slight delay between pedaling and the motor engaging was disconcerting to begin with.

Settings 3 and especially 4 were fun but it felt a bit like an electric moped at times. I think I will be keeping them for properly steep climbs and Strava KOM attempts. Where they were effective was when I reached the mud swamps as I could change into a low gear and max to boost and then spin away through the mud which worked well unless you stopped pedaling for a second and then the magic power disappeared and didn’t return for half a pedal stroke or more accurately didn’t return in time so I sank up to my ankle in stinking mud. It is not a foolproof system, at least not for this fool.

I am presently really pleased with the way the electric part of the bike is integrated into the bike as a whole and in the lower two settings you are not massively aware of it, you just feel like a slightly fitter rider. You do still need to use the gears and even after the short ride, as I haven’t ridden for so long I can feel it in my thighs so there is some hope I can get fit using this bike.

The down sides are the cost – £700 more than a non-electric Genius 720 Plus – and the fact it doesn’t make you an instant riding God. I actually am quite pleased about the second point as I was a little worried the enjoyment of cycling would be lost but it really isn’t. I just need to re-learn how and when to use gears, how to ride over roots, how to clear fallen logs…

…basically all the stuff that anyone else has to learn. I might update this thread from time to time as I find out new stuff.

Feel free to ask questions.

Our local e-bike dealer has an e-fatbike. I can sort of see the appeal in that. Can you de-restrict it?

Awesome. Out on Thurs then?

you ever take it off any sweet jumps?

Can you derestrict it – yes and the results are somewhere between 35-48mph depending on gearing. It is a removable dongle as it is illegal in England except on private land with the land owners permission. So remember to unplug the dongle even though it cannot be seen.

Out Thursday – Damn right!!

Sweet jumps – not really, too scared and too slippy. The few little jumps / drops weren’t as bad as feared on a bike weighing slightly more than I do. Just felt like a normal bike really. When I start clearing the 40 foot table top at the Southampton Bike Park I will update you.

Which will lead to another “so I just broke…..” thread

How did you find the extra heft, over a normal bike, on the non assisted bits of trail?

Use it for strava KOMs ? I hope that is a joke, young man 🙂

the results are somewhere between 35-48mph depending on gearing.

😯

To answer the other thread then, your next accident is likely to be wrapping yourself around a tree motorbike style.

Getting up for 50 mph must annihilate the battery, Shirley?

You don’t ride the bike unassisted, well perhaps downhill, because of the weight. Yet to really hit trails fast enough to see what it is like in the air but for a first pootling ride you didn’t really notice it.

I haven’t chipped mine so assistance runs out at 12mph as you will notice if you see my Strava trails

Electric KOM? Those who matter don’t care, those who care don’t matter 😉

Battery life – the bigger battery for 2016 should give between 40 and 120 miles with the unchippedc motor. I guess you can at least half that when chipped, probably even more but even quartering it gives you 10 miles and you won’t be on full boost at all times

haven’t chipped mine so assistance runs out at 12mph as you will notice if you see my Strava trails

Should be 16mph/25kph. That’s the euro limit.

Do not de restrict your e-bikes!

Why?
Because then it’s a motorbike and you need licence plate, insurance, helmet etc.
It only takes a couple of accidents and people getting found out to get these things outlawed on the road, and on public paths, and that could kill the e-bike industry in the UK before it’s really got off the ground, and that industry could be paying my wages. It’s irresponsible and unnecessary. 16mph everywhere is plenty.
Also (and I’m trained on this) we CAN tell it’s been done even if you remove it, that a ebike has been tampered with with a fairly simple look into its software. And that’s your warranty up the spout. Just don’t do it.

That said, I love ebikes. I’ve ridden all the different Bosch motors and Shimano Steps, including one linked to a di2 Alfine with automatic shifting and it’s ace! I will get one one day, for sure.

Pete – I have no plans to chip mine and agree with what you say. Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should. Plus with my record it is the first thing they will check.

16mph everywhere is plenty.

Is it really though?

Firstly , well done Nick for getting an Ebike and using it , I have ridden a hybrid and thought it was hilarious fun and really quite quick.

But , 16mph is not fast enough on the tarmac to be a viable alternative to comuting by fossil fuel powered transport. A good road rider is faster , hey I am a shit road rider and I average more than that.
16mph in a car is painfull. If it was say , as an example ,20mph then It would actually be a tool that would make commuting by bike quick , easy , fast and OK its still fossil fuelled as ‘leccy just don’t flow out the plug but its more economical than 1.3Ton of steel moving at low speed in stop start traffic.

I agree that 16mph with minimal effort is more than enough.

But , 16mph is not fast enough on the tarmac to be a viable alternative to comuting by fossil fuel powered transport. A good road rider is faster

Very true. But that’s not who ebikes are aimed at. It’s plenty for everyone else. You can go a lot faster than 16mph, you just use your legs. And I’ve commuted by ebike, so I know how it’s done, and trust me, it’s a lot faster over my usual route and it would be over yours. 🙂

But that’s not the point. The point is that there’s plenty of people, including many cyclists, that are very anti ebike. And we mustn’t fuel their argument. Also, speaking now as a motorcyclist, if you want to go faster, get something with an engine in it. A 50cc scooter can only do 30mph, and that’s your step up, not illegally modify in an ebike.

And I’ve commuted by ebike, so I know how it’s done, and trust me, it’s a lot faster over my usual route and it would be over yours

My e-bike is considerably slower on my 28 mile (each way) commute than on a normal bike on a nice day. When it’s wet & windy and I’m tired it’s about the same speed or a little bit faster.

For reference

My usual commute home by ebike
https://www.strava.com/activities/444262681

And on my CdF a couple of days beforehand
https://www.strava.com/activities/442726898

Lots faster by ebike overall, but the biggest difference is up hill, unsurprisingly! The first half is mostly climbing, and mostlY personal records as I could hold 16mph all the way up, rather than my usual 12ish.

Simon, I’m interested, is your route fairly flat? On the flat I found it slower due to the type of bike (suspension hybrid vs my usual CdF) I think more than the weight. Uphill the ebike was waaaaay faster and downhill it was the same or slightly quicker.

Ok
For a Johny Moped I would need
Helmet , Licence , Insurance as a minimum, Then a CBT ? Dunno not a moped rider . Optional are safety clothing , full licence after 2 years? iirc.
Then it will only do 30mph . Plus they are cheap though, then an MOT and RFL I guess.
Then somewhere secure and dry to keep my lovely Homda melody step through , away from theiving kids ( same as my Eracer)
Who comes up with the 16mph limit? Europe ? Well thats my vote swayed. Bug out of the EC and everyone can rag around on 24mph Eracers. awesome.

Guys – I have no intention of commuting (Southampton to Stevengae !!!)

I don’t care about road speed, my car has a speed restrictor too (330kph because of the tyres).

You can do more than 16mph downhill obviously…

..but you can potentially do 16mph up hill too.

For general mountain biking it is great (based on 45 minutes of riding) as it allows an unfit cripple to ride at the kind of speeds he used to be able to achieve.

All the fun without having to spend 6-12 months building up the muscle to be able to ride like a slow version of the previous me.

Speeds higher than 16mph might be great for the road (I think they are so buy a car) but off road you can still go as fast as your legs will take you. It is assistance, not dictatorship.

Now lets smile, relax and contemplate the profound beauty of ladies breasts.

Night all

r a Johny Moped I would need
Helmet , Licence , Insurance as a minimum

Exactly. Why should it be different for an ebike? In Europe you can get “fast ebikes” which have all that, a proper high/low dipped headlight, brake light, registration etc. (I imagine that’s possible here too.)

What is an S-Pedelec ?

Edit
Not legal here at all, I’ve just found out. Only in the Netherlands and Germany, both of which have massive ebike markets.

Just a thought, but I’ve met the average ebike buyer and it’s not the average cyclist. I wouldn’t want them to be able to get on a bike that can do 28mph on the flat. It would be carnage.

Simon, I’m interested, is your route fairly flat?

Yeah, it is sadly. I have several routes between 40 and 50km but none can be described as hilly.

Normal bike (42.2km, 30.7kph average)
https://www.strava.com/activities/9224488

E-bike (45.1km, 23.8kph average)
https://www.strava.com/activities/386742957

Simon, yeah, that makes sense. I did actually beat that ebike time, but I had a following wind, luck with the lights and I was absolutely blowing out of my arse when I got home! I was utterly flat out for 8 miles!
On my way in on the ebike it was blowing a gale and drizzly. It was a lot more pleasurable with some assistance, I know that.

I don’t know how to post my Strava times up here but there was a noticeable pattern.

Most places I was riding between 10-13mph as my old speeds when I was fit and healthy of 8-12mph.

When I cranked up full boost on two Tarmac sections I did PB of about 20 mph.

Not sure if this helps the debate but the big thing I noticed off road was that it took a lot less time to get up to normal riding speed after stopping, crashing or hitting deep mud. I think this was the big reason for the speed difference, plus the boost hiding the fact I am unfit.

It appears my comfortable speed around lordswood is about 10-12mph on a bike whether boosted or not.

Chip the bugger, pull wheelies 😀

Well done WCA, welcome to the ebike club, 😀

I’d like to offer a different opinion on the current speed restriction for full motor cut-off from my perspective as a cripple 😉 i find the 15.5mph cut off point to be somewhat frustrating at times. Eight odd years ago whilst riding a normal bike/non motor assist i was able to hit 20+mph through the singletrack on my trails with ease and i had no trouble getting upwards of 30mph+ on the downhill sections – at no point in the past 25+years when riding my bike (when my legs worked) did i ride like a dick, i was always courteous to other users, i always slowed down to a walking pace when passing other trail users and more often than not i came to a stop and exchanged a greeting with whomever i met whether that be on my local trails that i’ve built/cleared/maintained for everyone to use or out n’ about around the country on biking roadtrips.

Comparing my current gps data with my saved data from years ago i am still substantially slower on the ebike vs my normal bikes.

These days I’d love to go that little bit faster than 15mph, unfortunately my crap legs cannot offer any input whatsoever when the motor cuts off – any resistance that i try and force through the cranks is met with a big fat computer says no response from my spinal cord which is quite annoying.

Don’t get me wrong – i absolutely love/adore my Scott E-Genius big tyred monster truck and it has brought an unquantifiable amount of pleasure to my life over the past 7 weeks (i should have bought one years ago) – just thinking about my old trails that i managed to ride at the weekend for the first time in years has brought me out in a shit-kicking-goofy deliriously satisfied grin but i’d like the choice to ride my trails at the speed i choose rather than be restricted to an arbitrary eu regulated 15mph.

If i didn’t ride like a dick for a given offroad condition beforehand then why can’t i have the ability to decide how fast i ride for a given offroad condition now?, if we take that further then why is a fit n’ abled rider allowed to ride as fast as he likes? – to play the opposing side of the argument i do see a need for a somewhat regulated speed restriction for on-road use as a free for all as-fast-as-you-like when on public roads would be somewhat foolhardy.

I do have the speed derestriction kit bought from ebiketuning for my specific Bosch motor yet i have not fitted it and i may not fit it as it will obviously decrease the battery life and range, from a personal perspective i would like the ability to decide for myself as to the speed i ride off road (and continue to not ride like a dick).

Not many folk on here (if any at all) will agree with me and i’m perfectly fine with that but unless you have been in the situation i’ve experienced over the past 8years then i reserve the right to make that judgement for myself.

I absolutely understand your view on this Soma and please take lots of detailed pictures when you do fit the kit. As I said, it is a simple plug in bit of kit so you obviously unplug whilst on the roads. The trails around Lordswood don’t really need the extra speed and fortunately I am only a partial raspberry ripple so can put some power down myself so not such an issue for me.

The point PP makes is valid too about rules, insurance etc. The rules are put there so people know what is expected in shared areas. Unfortunately like so many rules they are very general blanket bans. This means they punish those who can use their judgement about what is safe and acceptable and are ignored by those who can’t. The more they get ignored, the angrier the law makers get and the more draconian their response.

There go my koms…..sounds a great laugh. I’d be interested in a fat ebike as the main thing that puts me off is the weight and slow ride compared to my scale

Well said Somafunk.

I’ve been thinking about an e-bike a fair bit recently. My injury prevents me from putting down any power while seated and my lack of fitness prevents me from standing up everywhere. I can still go for a gentle ride on my own as long as it’s flat but i can’t go with my riding buddies in the hills as i’d ruin their ride.

There are a few things preventing me from taking the plunge.

Price is one. It’s a lot of money for a bike but i’ve kinda got this covered as i’ve two half decent bikes in the shed that aren’t getting used. I’ll not get that much for them but it’s annoying a **** not being able to use them.

Another issue is how they jump. I know most ebikerz aren’t into the gnar but i am and would love to know how they jump (not wee pissy jumps, bigish ones). Can’t find anyone who has jumped them though. I’m not bothered about the extra weight, i think i could handle that, i just don’t want it to break (because price). Maybe i should stop jumping and that would put that issue to bed? Easier said than done though. I heart flying through the air.

Lastly is the speed. 15-16mph isn’t fast enough for me. Swoon away if that makes you happy but, like Somafunk, i think i’m more than capable of deciding how fast i want to go at a given time. I’m an experience road/offroad motorbiker so i don’t think a few more mph is going to scare me or make me wrap myself round a tree.

And even more last…they are a bit ‘special’ looking aren’t they? The Spesh one looks decent but is dearer still.

my car has a speed restrictor too (330kph because of the tyres)

Wish my car was restricted to 200+mph 😀

I’m an ebike fan, our club has some riders and it’s great to see folk not usually out, having a great time with everyone else.

I’m with soma and his approach here, with a bit of Peterpoddy in the background…

£5,000!!!

£4800!!

£3700!

Nice review and good to see the technology is moving along.

I think these bikes have their place for sure, you are a perfect example of that. Hopefully it gets you out in the countryside and enjoying cycling that you wouldn’t otherwise have been able to do.

€4450

Belt drive, Alfine hub, Bluto Fatbike.

Bees Bikes

Just been out for a quick (or not so quick as it turns out) blast around Southampton Common so here is the feedback.

The non-electric bit
I forgot to wear gloves so my hands froze.
I haven’t ridden for 12 months so my backside was a bit tender from yesterdays ride.
There are lots of people walking around the common carrying bags of dogs crap.
There are lots of 4 legged crap factories walking around the common keeping the plastic bag companies going since the carrier bag charge I guess
Riding on road/tarmac is DULL

The Electric bit
The boost, any boost between 1 – 4, is great to get you up to speed but even with my weak legs it is fairly easy to maintain the speed higher than the boost range.

This means that I only use level 1 and ride just a little bit faster than the boost speed.

It is hard work to go much faster than that because the bike weighs so much and you run out of gears quite quickly.

15mph is not very fast on tarmac and even around the Common I was overtaken by several bikes.

Summary
Electric bikes don’t make tarmac fun but then I am not sure what would.
They are too slow if you can’t pedal properly and too heavy if you can.
They make steep uphills easier but that is about it in terms of benefits.
I will be using mine mostly off road.

I probably won’t bother writing up after the Thursday Night ride unless there are new revelations but I will try to get out to the New Forest over the weekend and see what it is like on simple flowing trails. I suspect that is where the 15mph frustrations will kick in.

I won’t be doing any big jumps yet but maybe in the summer – I will let you know how it flies.

Electric bikes don’t make tarmac fun but then I am not sure what would.

De-restricted, obvs 🙂

I spoke to a chap in Germany who was fitting a motor to a fully faired recumbent. It was a 500W motor.

It’ll be interesting to see what it’s like on things like No Dabs where you need to be in a relatively low gear and get short bursts of power down in between the rooty bits. Reckon it will be pretty good on the second half of Dave’s trail too where there are lots of tight corners, acellerating out of them should be easier.

I am sure there will be attempts to borrow it for sections on thursday

Nice one.

The potential for these things just amazes me:

Broken bikers back on the trail, lots of uses in rehab and it could replace so many car journeys.
16mph seems fair to me, plenty for most urban cyclepaths and trails.

The current legislation seems pretty fair.

A twin wheel front end, like the Piaggio Mp3 would be fun.
🙂