[Closed] Chinese "Replica" Frames

I'd rather ride a plain unbranded frame than a fake branded frame (if they're both identical apart from the stickers/paint).

get a blank one and get some custom stickers?
In theory trading standards could have that on import (probably IANAL)

I'd be going down the custom stickers route, I think.

"fakevelo"

or something.

It's like wearing a fake branded shirt. You'd always know.

You'll get a load of hate on here and probably from people in your club/other clubs once they figure out what it is. However, if its cheaper and looks nicer than the normal none branded stuff I say go for it. As long as its 'safe' then who cares!

Just get a naked frame and get some decals done! You'll get a lot of stick for it, and if you don't care, why care about having Cervelo on it in the first place?

A 'fakevelo' stick is an amazing idea! 😀 Do it.

There are a couple of teams knocking about on fake Dogmas with team decals on them... It's not just a simple matter of applying vinyl stickers though, these are lacquered on my the manufacturer...

It's like wearing a fake branded shirt. You'd always know.

I have some of those Fakely glasses off DX. I 'always know' but it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

Fakevelo stickers would be quite funny, but probably more hassle than I'd be willing to go through. It would also be quite funny to see how wound up real Cervelo owners might get about it. 🙂

Personally I think this is not ethically right,In the way supporting companies who make bikes to look like bikes from companies that have spent years building reputations and design etc.When playing with complex shapes as with the above frame you need a reasonable degree of knowledge of working with carbon.
As someone asipiring to be in the industry and getting my foot in the door,selling and using counterfeit goods isnt on.

I'd go with the blank frame and custom sticker option. I reckon you could have a lot of fun designing your own "Look" (see what I did there?)

It also means you could change it whenever you got fed up of the old colour scheme.

Personally I think this is not ethically right,In the way supporting companies who make bikes to look like bikes from companies that have spent years building reputations and design etc.When playing with complex shapes as with the above frame you need a reasonable degree of knowledge of working with carbon.
As someone asipiring to be in the industry and getting my foot in the door,selling and using counterfeit goods isnt on.

Thing is Bruce, buying this frame isn't depriving Cervelo of a sale, I'm looking for a cheap race frameset that isn't going to break my heart if it gets a handlebar through the chainstays in a crash.

It's never going to be passed off as real, it's not meant to trick anyone into parting with money... It's just a cheap frame...

You have to understand, the 'real' S5 is made in China, there's no reason to believe that something like this won't be made with exactly the same level of expertise. The only difference is that if I spend £3.5k on the proper one, it would have a warranty. But even Cervelo won't replace a bike that's got smashed up in a race!

Thing is Bruce, buying this frame isn't depriving Cervelo of a sale, I'm looking for a cheap race frameset that isn't going to break my heart if it gets a handlebar through the chainstays in a crash.

It's never going to be passed off as real, it's not meant to trick anyone into parting with money... It's just a cheap frame...

Buy the non stickered one then

Although not a frame, this video showing the strength of some fake carbon bars would definitely put me off 😯

Why don't we all just get medicines from Chinese websites to?

I would personally say that buying a fake bike frame is not even close to buying an unbranded frame from a reputable framemaker. Or a cheap carbon frame from Ribble. A frame from Ribble will come with some kind of quality control, they are a reputable dealer and have responsibilities(replacement if faulty and also if it falls to pieces when you are riding).

By buying a fake bike, you by pass all the safety mechanisms and support you get with a reputable dealer. To save that 100 quid or whatever it is you forfeit everything. In addition, you are entering into a shady deal, with people who don't care about copyright and in general the law.

Do you think you can trust these people to construct a safe bicycle for you? If they cant be arsed with the law, do you think they can be arsed to ensure that the right number of CF plies have been placed in the correct positions? Do you think they can be arsed to ensure that the bike has been cured at the right temperature?

Probably not.

I'd rather get a blank frame from a reputed manufacturer than a knock-off - for safety, moral and aesthetic reasons.

I'm not particularly fussed abotu your safety or what you look like on your bike, but why do you think it's acceptable to buy a counterfeit frame?

there's no reason to believe that something like this won't be made with exactly the same level of expertise

Do you [i]really[/i] believe that?

if you like the colours get one painted like that
change the name or leave it out though

If you keep the name, it's fake and the only reason to keep the name is to make people think you are riding the original which is a bit sad imo

i'd love to know how far these frames are from the real deal in terms of construction my guess is that they are pretty close

buy it and when you are in hospital with a smashed face you may think on was it worth it.

If you cant afford a carbon fibre frame why not get a top quality aluminium frame.

We had a Chinarello in the other week for a new headset, - couldnt get one as it was all non standard and when you saw how the steerer had been made by simply gluing a tube of carbon to the fork legs then you realise why its cheap shit. not to mention how the bars snapped a week later.

but good luck to you, it's just a shame that my taxes will be paying for your dental work.

I would personally say that buying a fake bike frame is not even close to buying an unbranded frame from a reputable framemaker. Or a cheap carbon frame from Ribble.

I'd say it's exactly the same! Ribble don't test individual bikes, and it's widely known which frames Ribble buy - you can buy the exact same frames, unbranded, direct from exactly the same manufacturer.

You're judging these manufacturers on the basis that they must be wrong 'uns because they're counterfeiting. Look at the Chinese economy, and their laws regarding copyright, intellectual properties etc and you'll see they are completely different to ours. Therefore, the values of individuals are different to ours.

Yea.. these chinese factories do no testing whatsoever

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hongfu_bikes/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hongfu_bikes/6906385520/

I think Hongfu are in a different league to the OP's frame suggestion, heard many good things.

People are kidding themselves if they think the clone/fakes are the same as the real bikes. Even if they do share the same mould it's highly unlikely they'll be using the same quality carbon or resin so even if they used the same lay-up (again unlikely) then the frame isn't as it was designed so may have new weak points.
I'm not against cheap import carbon frames per se (personally wouldn't trust one or the wheels though) but the ones stickered up as though they were the real thing do harm even if not denying a sale. It harms exclusivity, finish might not be up to scratch so someone interested in buying the real thing might be put off (after assuming yours was the real deal) and if it does break then it harms the big brands image as well (people seem a snapped frame Cervelo frame in a crit and it's unlikely they're going to assume it's a fake).

There is a world apart between the knock off fake companies making copied moulds of frames and the companies manufacturing unbranded frames or frames for other companies.

But It boils my piss that people think it's acceptable to buy counterfit goods, would the OP mind if I reported him to the police for fraud if he buys a counterfit frame, it's like people selling fake rolex watches and fake perfume it's all just fraud and illegal.

[url= http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/FRPXSLTAV2/planet_x_team_alu_frame_mk2 ]This...[/url] and spend the money you save on tubs....

There is a world apart between the knock off fake companies making copied moulds of frames and the companies manufacturing unbranded frames or frames for other companies.

Rubbish! The same companies make them all, Mirage (IIRC) make the S5 replica and they're highly reputable - their blank frames are resold by many manufacturers and are highly regarded.

But It boils my piss that people think it's acceptable to buy counterfit goods, would the OP mind if I reported him to the police for fraud if he buys a counterfit frame, it's like people selling fake rolex watches and fake perfume it's all just fraud and illegal.

I have 3 pairs of Fakelys... As well as about 6 pairs of real Oakleys, do you want to report me for that? I buy proper ones for road biking and the cheap clones for mountain biking as it doesn't matter if they get scratched. If the Fakelys weren't available, I'd be using cheap Bollé safety glasses. So again, I'm not depriving Oakley of a sale.

I find it rather amusing that I'm making your piss boil... Never has trolling been so easy! 😉

You believe that on the frames then you are a mug,
i see these frames in for repairs and see the difference in quality and it is black and white.
but feel free, if youre racing crits and your forks break it will be the other riders that you take down that will have my sympathy not you.

the fake frames are nothing like the same

and as you seem to be very free and easy with knock off goods maybe you might want to open a market stall or just stick to buying from street traders.

I had a slash earlier and its not boiling any more, now I can see you for what you are.

Shib you can come and have a look at mine if you want. If your using Keo cleats you can have a go too 🙂 I've done a fair few thousand miles and it's not exploded on me yet!

I had a slash earlier and its not boiling any more, now I can see you for what you are.

So given that he owns several pairs of genuine Oakleys as well as fakes, is he:

A) a valued customer
B) a despicable thieving scumbag?

I had a nosey at yours when you first built it up Ben... Which manufacturer did you get it from?

And yep, I ride Keo (genuine ones too!!) so I might take you up on that offer! We need to get out for a ride sometime...

So given that he owns several pairs of genuine Oakleys as well as fakes, is he:

I also own a genuine top-end Cervelo race bike, bought from an authorised dealer with full warranty.

I don't think anyone is doubting Hong Fu but then they're not in the business of marketing knock off frames.

Mr Shibboleth,

I am now wondering what the reason for your post is. At first it appeared that you were asking advice or for opinions. Now rather than listen to these opinions you are disagreeing with the ones that don't suit your purpose. It seems to me that you have already made up your mind and discount the perfectly good advice that you have in fact asked for.

At the same time you also display a worrying level of naivety:

there's no reason to believe that something like this won't be made with exactly the same level of expertise

Would you perhaps like to buy some magic beans?

Paypal gift of course.

mikewsmith - Member

In theory trading standards could have that on import (probably IANAL)

Customs confiscated my EBay fake Oakleys.

At the same time you also display a worrying level of naivety:

Having seen a couple of Chinarello Dogmas, the build quality and finish is superb - easily comparable to the real deal.

It's widely accepted that these bikes tend to be built from Toray T700 rather than the more expensive T1000 that is used for the top end branded bikes, but I've been riding a T700 frame for the past 3 years and it's more than adequate for my Cat3/4 power outputs!

You have to remember Chief, these manufacturers are building reputations of their own, so it's not good for business to send sub standard crap out. And when you start to scratch the surface, there are literally millions of pages devoted to discussions about the quality of these frames, and very few of those devoted to failures. From my own experience, I've seen as many photos of genuine snapped Treks, Cervelos, giants, Specializeds etc as I have of Chinese bikes.

http://www.actionfraud.police.uk/fraud_protection/counterfeit_goods

Counterfeits are illegal to import, even if they are bought online. Cheap designer or branded goods could be counterfeit and as such are worthless, dangerous fakes and could be seized.

The dangers of fake goods

Making or selling fake goods is against the law. Sellers of fake goods can be fined or can even go to jail.

If you buy fake goods you could be:

harming your health
committing a crime. If you buy fake goods abroad, you could receive a fine. It’s also illegal to buy or download pirated material like songs and films
helping fund crime.

So up to you really, just be aware that it is illegal to import the goods

Mines a Hong Fu, as are the wheels. It now has my own branding on it 0_O. FWIW my Cleats are genuine too 😉

To the OP... you wanted our opinions...If your racing and have that budget get a frame from a manufacturer with Uk contact or one like hongfu,otherwise stick to alloy.. I understand you're not taking a sale away from cervelo but if its not about it being a cervelo why not get a nude frame?

At the end of the day you're welcome to do you please,however dental work is a lot more expensive than a carbon frame replacement....

stay safe all

I think those who feel the need to use fake goods come across as pathetic and needy.

Someone will always spot it's a fake.
Strikes me as a sign of being untrustworthy & overly obsessed with status.

Get a plain one.

I understand the arguments against these bikes, but I wouldn't be buying this instead of genuine Cervelo, I'd be buying it instead of an unbranded version of the same sort of thing.

I don't get this at all, The whole I'm not robbing a sale from Cervelo.

Well technically by keeping the fraudsters in business you are,

A good alloy frame will ride better and you won't look as much of a tool.

Having seen a couple of Chinarello Dogmas, the build quality and finish is superb - easily comparable to the real deal.

Having said that, there's an ex pro round my way who has one, he uses it for training... reckons it rides fine.

Resin to fibre ratio is crucial as is lay up...New kinesis coming out this month..

Having seen a couple of Chinarello Dogmas, the build quality and finish is superb - easily comparable to the real deal.

Rubbish, They may look with beer goggles from a distance but in reality its:

We had a Chinarello in the other week for a new headset, - couldnt get one as it was all non standard and when you saw how the steerer had been made by simply gluing a tube of carbon to the fork legs then you realise why its cheap shit. not to mention how the bars snapped a week later.

If it fools you, then go a head. Just hope I'm not following you down a hill.

Strikes me as a sign of being untrustworthy & overly obsessed with status.

Just to clarify, I'm looking for a cheap bike that I can thrash and crash without worrying. I don't care what it says on it, as I clearly stated in my first post, these are available for the same money as a 'nude' frame and invited thoughts.

To be honest, it's provoked an interesting discussion, and I'm absolutely AMAZED that people are ADAMANT that frames are poor quality and dangerous just because they have a counterfeit name on the side, whereas bikes from the same manufacturers are being sold for upwards of £1000 after being "branded" by British bike companies.

Yes, there are some poor quality manufacturers in China, but there's enough information online to form an accurate opinion on who's worth buying from if you're prepared to take a bit of time. If I bought ANY bike from the Far East, I'd be doing my homework first!

It's certainly interesting that our very English sense of fair play and values sways people's judgment of people who work within a completely different set of laws values, and indeed, a different culture...

(and for the record, it's [i]highly[/i] unlikely I would go for one of these,just interested in peoples' thoughts)

Actually, you're ignoring half the thread that it saying, "if it doesn't matter, why not just get the nude one?"

Counterfeit goods are typically the tip of the iceberg, people behind these products can also be linked to human and drug traffiking, do you really want to be putting money in these peoples hands just because you want a cheap bike.

Other risks to consider; trading standards can conficate and destroy your bike (part sand all), as could customs if you take it away.

Finally the build quality is less so do you really want to be flying down a hill at 35mph to discover the bonding process was short cut and as you lie in a bloodied heap, who's picking up the tab for your cheap bike now?