My mum was reversing out of parking space and bumped a company van – lightly enough not to mark her car at all – hard enough to crack a light lens on the van. The van was parked outside the company’s office so she went in and fessed up – exchanged details, asked them to get a price for fixing the lens and she’s settle up. The boss wasn’t in but she was assured they’d get back to her.

A couple of weeks pass no news – then today – solicitors letter advising of a trip to hospital for whiplash treatment, for an incident that related to an empty, stationary vehicle.

I haven’t seen the letter yet so not clear whether its the company or an individual making the claim, also not sure at this stage whether is an insurance co making the claim or a no-win-no-fee bandit.

So – what are people’s experiences in similar circumstances?

Her word againt theirs and it’s up to her insurers if she’s fully comp?

so presuming as someone was injured a police presence was requested ? and the incident lodged ?

She’s fully comp so she’s batting it to them.

so presuming as someone was injured a police presence was requested ? and the incident lodged ?

seemingly not – there was not police involvement as there was nobody present, let alone hurt. They are only claiming that they were treated in hospital

so presuming as someone was injured a police presence was requested ? and the incident lodged ?

Exactly. All she needs to do is remind the company that the van was empty, which is why she went into their office to tell them about it. If someone had been injured, and if it was on the public highway, tell her insurers to demand a police reference for the incident and the H&S log of the company. And remind the company of the penalties for fraudulent insurance claims…!

Missus ran into the back of someone a few months ago, very light impact. Passenger instantly got out of the car and complained of neck pain. To which my wife’s response was “That’s handy, I’m a physio. I can assess it for you if you want” Never heard anything more about that….

so presuming as someone was injured a police presence was requested ? and the incident lodged ?

Not sure this is required for a whiplash claim, as the ‘symtoms’ can develop later (once they’ve had a chance to google them).

That is ridiculous. I would contact the company again regarding this as to why there is a whiplash claim as there was nobody in the vehicle. At same time request video footage (if they have the area covered)

She should report the false claim to the police and write to both the owner of the van and the ambulance chasers stating that a fraud has taken place and give them details of her visit to the cops. If she gets a crime number, give them that.

This is the sort of thing where it’s worth talking to someone significant at her insurance company and setting the facts straight (that the van was empty). Her insurers will want to avoid any kind of pay-out and will spend a bit of time making sure they’ve got her side of the story. This will be covered by any insurance policy, by the way, this comes under “third party”.

Tricky one, without witnesses then it does come down to her word against there’s. I take it it’s not a big company as I can’t believe anyone but a cowboy firm would risk insurance fraud.

An employee of my dads backed a company pickup truck into a stationary car and broke the door mirror. The car was occupied, details swopped, it went quiet and a whiplash claim was put in and a new door was claimed for (back before phones had cameras so no photos were taken – the only damage was to the door mirror the claim was the door had a huge dent in it) the insurers paid out, dad decided it wasn’t worth trying to counter claim.

Let her insurance company deal with it, that’s what she pays the premium for.

Tricky one, without witnesses then it does come down to her word against there’s.

Thats why I’m curious as to whether its and individual claiming or the employer claiming for the individual. Either way there are witnesses to the conversation that followed the incident so the would be being asked to lie to the police / court if there was a counter claim to support the claimant.

Let her insurance company deal with it, that’s what she pays the premium for.

No. Her insurance company will just pay out and get the money back from her in increased premiums and she will have an injury accident on her record making it wickedly expensive to get cover anywhere else.

To which my wife’s response was “That’s handy, I’m a physio. I can assess it for you if you want” Never heard anything more about that….

Because a physiotherapist at the side of a road is best placed to diagnose a genuine whipwash claim…

Can I get my 🙄 out please?

Tell her to drive off next time she hits something!

Based on my wife’s accident; her insurance co. will just pay up.

To quote them “your wife admitted liability, so we pay the claim”.

Yes, she admitted that she ran into the back of the other vehicle, but she was going so slow there was no damage whatsoever to her car…

All in about £15k
– rear door damage to other vehicle (transit)
– whiplash to passenger (surname ending in an ‘ski’)
– hire of vehicle while own off road

Let her insurance company deal with it, that’s what she pays the premium for.

No. Her insurance company will just pay out and get the money back from her in increased premiums and she will have an injury accident on her record making it wickedly expensive to get cover anywhere else.

Hmm, I would imagine that her insurance company will be very interested in the fact that a fraudulent claim is being made against them and will fight it, if necessary in court. Insurance companies REALLY don’t like paying out when they don’t have to.

Because a physiotherapist at the side of a road is best placed to diagnose a genuine whipwash claim…

Diagnosis of a genuine whiplash claim is probably best left to ambulance chasing lawyers right enough. Treatment wise – physio is probably as good a profession as any.

Treatment wise – physio is probably as good a profession as any.

No doubt – I was simply questioning the effectiveness of a roadside diagnosis by one.

FWIW, my wife still suffers badly after her whiplash experience almost six years ago (and regularly visits her osteopath for treatment still) – the £2.5k seemed a nice bonus at the time but she would rather be pain free – and what looks like a lifetime of treatment will use up all the money she got as well.

solicitors letter advising of a trip to hospital for whiplash treatment

What, for the van?

If there is a driver claiming to be in the vehicle, she should start saying it was his fault. Then it’s knock-for-knock and no additional claims will be entertained.

they’ll be claiming because they will have been advised that the industry has a standard practice of £1500 without a medical nowadays, it’s the insurance industries attempt to reduce the bill.

@IHN – trouble is how are they going to fight it? Unless a witness can give evidence that the shows the claim is fraudulent then they’re more likely just to pay out rather than risk a much more expensive day in court. Sure they hate paying out if they can wriggle out due to T&C’s but a single pay-out whiplash case with no witnesses is much more likely to be paid out.

johndoh – maybe try a different healthcare professional for her if osteopath is not getting any long term benefits without regular treatment.

BTW, my brother was once involved in an accident where the other party started to make injury claims and claimed my brother was at fault. His insurance company wanted to just pay out but he refused and took it to a tribunal – it didn’t take them long to decide the other party had no claim as he couldn’t even lie consistently during questioning and couldn’t remember the road conditions – saying rubbish like ‘I think it was raining’ whereas my brother was more detailed, saying things like ‘It had been raining but it had stopped. The roads were still wet but drying’.

ohndoh – maybe try a different healthcare professional for her if osteopath is not getting any long term benefits without regular treatment.

This has been discussed but she is normally very happy with the treatment (she also has a history of back problems which are normally eased through the same treatment).

So your mum went into the front of the other car?

Get her to change her story to ‘the other car drove into the back of me’. Then SHE can claim for injuries too!

Fraud is still a criminal offence. If the whiplash claim is rubbish and fraudulent, then the police should be involved immediately and a crime number included with any response to the insurers.

If the insurance company pays the claim, then it’s just paying off criminals and perpetuating a criminal activity yes?

Unless a witness can give evidence that the shows the claim is fraudulent then they’re more likely just to pay out rather than risk a much more expensive day in court.

Surely, looking at it the other way, unless there’s a witness to say that there was someone in the van then will the other party risk a criminal conviction for fraud? It’s one thing claiming for ‘convenient’ whiplash when you’re in a vehicle that’s hit, it’s quite another claiming it when the vehicle was unnoccupied.

Either way, I’d be turning it all over to the insurance company and making it very clear that there was no-one in the other vehicle when the incident occured, and by saying otherwise the other party is attempting a clear fraud.

Could she see into the back of the van ? Could have been various workmen in the back 😀

and what willard said

Were things better back in the 80s..? I had a non-fault head on with a car (crossed into my lane) and my then girlfriend got pretty bad whiplash and neck pains for a couple of years. Never occurred to us to sue for injury claims. Let alone try to defraud an insurance company (scum that they are)

I think some people are confusing how it should be with how it is…

my then girlfriend got pretty bad whiplash and neck pains for a couple of years

Thing is, there are lots of people who make *genuine* claims for an injury that can plague them for life. Unfortunately (as in the OP) this gets abused.

Well having chatted with her further – the claim is coming from the individual – not the employer. But the mention of the H&S / accident book above is an interesting one. So she’s suggesting to her insurer they ask to see the employers log of the accident as it happened on their time and apparently resulted in a hospital visit. At least to give the no-win-no-fee folk a bit of exercise.

Up to this point it seems the employer is not involved or perhaps even aware of the claim – its not coming from them or their insurer and relates to injury only and not any damage to the vehicle. So might as well be sure his boss and colleagues know what he’s up to, eh.

Does the company involved have a facebook/twitter presence? If so set up a new clean account on FB and post the whole story on there, see how they like them apples.

Hi mate, I used to be a claimant lawyer dealing with RTA claims and now work on the other side for an insurer looking into fraud.

All claims for compensation are lodged with the Department of Work and Pensions, they will say whether he actually attended hospital, if he did then the insurer pays the bill for his visit.

If she is insistent that he was not in the vehicle, then she need sto raise this from the off with her insurers, some are a lot better than others in actually looking into it though.

They need to do the following:
– Get both vehicles inspected by an independent forensic engineer looking for discrepancies in the level of damage.
– Get them to look into the claimant himself, all insurers have a database (called CUE) that shows how many claims a person has made, is he a serial claimant?
– If they get a medical report from him stating he was injured, get them to send the engineering evidence to the doctor and ask questions about how he could be injured if no damage to the vehicles involved?
– Get here to take photographs of her vehicle and send them to her insurers.
– If they provide a repair invoice for more damage than there actually was, get them to investigate the garage and solicitors, there is a list of suspicious organisations whose names crop up repeatedly in these matters.

Finally the insurers should dispute if what you say is correct, we call them LVI or Low Velocity Incidents, in addition if there was actually no-one in the vehicle it is called an Occupancy dispute, both are very much on the rise and insurers are doing all they can to fight both

johndoh – maybe try a different healthcare professional for her if osteopath is not getting any long term benefits without regular treatment.

FIFY