I was thinking of some modest off roadtrips CTC, Chalke Way. Work get's in the way of longer stuff.
Question; What are the options carrying stuff. I can't carry much weight on my back. Do panniers catch on everything?
Bike Forum
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Carry stuff off road touring
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Posted 1 year ago #
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depends on how much you need to carry, dry bag on top of rack, dry bag strapped to bars etc
google bikepacking or hang out on the Welsh Ride Thing thread.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I don't find panniers catch on stuff
Posted 1 year ago # -
It depends how rough it is, I've used both a trailer and panniers, if it's rough I prefer panniers, I didn't find they caught on things. I was using blackburn rack on the back and old man mountain on the front. Will post some pictures later.
NickPosted 1 year ago # -
I prefer panniers. Don't find they catch too much, although they upset the balance of the bike a bit.
Posted 1 year ago # -
narrow low sitting rucksack for offroad touring.
carrying a bare minimum of stuff.
me and pals do a week offroad tour every september following this approach.Posted 1 year ago # -
Panniers are good (not used trailers or frame bags though).
You do have to be aware of them going through restrictions but you get used to it. Fine for off-road sections of CTC, assuming thye have a good mount. Also useful for loads of other stuff as well.
Posted 1 year ago # -
As mentioned above, here is a link to some photos of my setups.
link to photosPosted 1 year ago # -
Bar Bag plus Carradice SQR Trax will give you approx 20-25l neat up out of the way..
Posted 1 year ago # -
Having tried both paniers and a bob trailer, I'm a convert to trailers the bike feels nicer to ride.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Thanks guys.I'm hoping to take very little. I can't carry much weight on my back I get really bad back ache. Drybag strapped to rack sounds possible.
Any pics. How much can be carried without upsetting the handling. We're talking proper off road............
Posted 1 year ago # -
Any additional weight WILL affect the handling of the bike. At the end of the day, it's always a compromise. I do think that using a rucksack keeps the bike handling better, but can be more tiring for you (and possibly painful).
Posted 1 year ago # -
I could easily razz it around a trail centre with this set up even with 3 days food! Bikepacking set up
But frame bags arnt cheap (but a great investment) and you cant shoulder the bike for Highland mad stuff...
apart from that this set up for me is ideal and all in probably cost about £400 which has already paid for itself
Posted 1 year ago # -
CK, That's really good. I'll hopefully be buying food en route. But I like the front end and bike bag. Who makes the frame bags?
Posted 1 year ago # -
Heres the new kid on the block for frame bags, I've got an early prototype which I can't recommend highly enough,
http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/the-2011-welsh-ride-thing-is-go?replies=80#post-2177254
Posted 1 year ago # -
flashes - Member
.Any pics. How much can be carried without upsetting the handling. We're talking proper off road...........
druidh - Member
Any additional weight WILL affect the handling of the bike. At the end of the day, it's always a compromise. I do think that using a rucksack keeps the bike handling better, but can be more tiring for you (and possibly painful).
The conclusion I have come is that you do one or the other. If you want to carry camping gear then forget having fun on the singletrack. Carry enough kit so the camping is comfortable then the bike riding is spoilt. Strip your camping kit to the minimum and the cycling is still compromised (if not so much) but the camping is uncomfortable. So nowadays I stick to the easier offroad stuff if I want to camp
It helps to distribute the weight around the bike, frame bags, tent poles along frame tubes - that sort of thing. I agree with druidh about rucksacks tho - I find it very tiring and painful to ride with one.
You can still manage to ride rough singletrack with luggage - it requires a different technique - you cannot move the bike around underneath you so easily and you need to try to maintain momentum.
A lot of folk swear by trailers and they don't upset the handling of the bike as much - but you do have a good few additional kilos to get up0 hills and when the hikabike starts they can be a real pain.
You takes your choice you make your compromises. For me I have simply given up attempting to take camping gear down the rough singletrack. Its simply spoilt.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I've got an early prototype which I can't recommend highly enough
Thanks
We'll have some pics of our newest creations fairly soon, and we've made a number of refinements to early prototypes tooIn general though, frame bags make a lot of sense for carrying heavier items closest to the centre of gravity of the bike. This has the least effect on how the bike feels and allows for capable handling on technical stuff. We've tested our stuff on some very technical and rocky terrain in Wales over the winter and they've been fine.
The space under the handlebar is another good place to put bulky items like, for instance a sleeping bag. We're developing a harness system that allows quick and secure attachment for this kind of thing with minimal interference with the bike. This method is also more compatible with suspension forks, which front panniers obviously aren't.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Good stuff wildcat - but you can put front panniers on suspension forks - tubus swing rack for example.
However if you have so much stuff that you need front panniers then your offroading will be compromised greatly.
Posted 1 year ago # -
TJ is right - if you are riding with camping kit then you've got to change your expectations. You can still ride singletrack and steep stuff and have a great time of course.
I've only off toured with panniers. I think I quite like having some weight up front. Am aiming for some lightweight bivvi trips with less stuff & strapped to bars & rack top etc.
Where does one get those frame packs?..I wasn't convinced until I saw how wide they are & how much can go in them. I take it they will be bespoke and not swappable between different frames?
Posted 1 year ago # -
cynic-al - you can email me if you want to discuss some options?
They are bespoke so I'd recommend one for a frame you were planning on keeping for a good while. However, if you had two similar sized or proportioned frames, there is a degree of interchangeability. We managed to fit bag for a medium 29er frame into the frame of a medium 26" bike, as the 26" bike was slightly smaller. The straps were sufficient to pull it tight enough. Wouldn't work as well the other way around though.
@TJ - yes, had forgotten about the Tubus swing rack, though the panniers ride higher and affect the handling a bit more than low riding panniers on a rigid fork would. But either way, I quite a agree that select kit to the comfort level you require, work out suitable method to attach to bike and select trails accordingly.
Posted 1 year ago # -
There are these guys too but i've never seen them in stock for over a year now and they cost £91 each PLUS postage from NZ
Posted 1 year ago # -
select kit to the comfort level you require, work out suitable method to attach to bike and select trails accordingly.
That puts it very nicely
Posted 1 year ago # -
i'm a real believer in loading the front first. i have done some riding with only a drybag on the front which worked really well.
I've ridden with only a drybag (on a rack) out back and it means that the front wants to lift on the climbs and it feels like the front doesn't have much traction on the downhills.
balancing would be best ( small amount at both ends)
Posted 1 year ago # -
The conclusion I have come is that you do one or the other. If you want to carry camping gear then forget having fun on the singletrack. Carry enough kit so the camping is comfortable then the bike riding is spoilt. Strip your camping kit to the minimum and the cycling is still compromised (if not so much) but the camping is uncomfortable. So nowadays I stick to the easier offroad stuff if I want to camp
I’m sorry I don’t believe that at all, with careful selection of the right lightweight kit, and the correct spread of weight over the rider and bike (I currently use a frame bag and lightweight OMM rucsack). Then you can attack and enjoy the trails as much as you can without the kit on a ‘normal’ ride.
I have all my kit down to a weight of around ~5kg this includes, everything to sleep, shelter, eat (hot cooked food) drink and relax.
It would ruin the riding experience for me if I could not ride the trails fast and include all the usual drops and technical riding.In the Peak camping that includes trails like the Beast, Potato Alley and Jacobs Ladder ridden at the same speed as I would on a normal ride.
I have used my new Revelate Designs seat pack yet but this can only help in the even distribution of weight between rider and bike.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I have all my kit down to a weight of around ~5kg this includes, everything to sleep, shelter, eat (hot cooked food) drink and relax.
5 kg? Even if you are close to that then the camping will not be comfy
Lets hear the list of equipment and weights. Don't forget the weight of the bags, a full set of waterproofs, water etc
I have done this a lot. Thats my opinion from many trips camping.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Very comfy Infact that includes whiskey and a camping chair.
Will sort list soon but it's in excel so will have to convert
Posted 1 year ago # -
Bag
Omm Jirisica – 600g
Frame Bag – 100gTarp (loads of room for 1 and kit and storm worthy)
GoLite Lair 1 – 300g
Easton Carbon FX Poles (118/78cm) + Brace Pole – 90g
Alpkit Ti Pegs (10x 6g) - 60g
Ground Sheet -90gCooking
Snow peak ti stove – 80g
Snow peak ti pot (foil lid) – 110g
Pour and Go Food Bag - 5
Foldable Spork – 16g
100g 40/60 Butane/Propane – 200g
Dried fruits/nuts/super noodles/cup a soup – 500g
Chilli/garlic oil/ salt/pepper/tea/milk – 100g
Hipflask (lexan) - Nice strong Whiskey – 350g
Water + Bag - 1l water + Platiplus flexible bag – 1025gSleeping
Pacific Outdoors Ether Elite 6 - full length mat – 400g
Rab Quantum Top – 400g
Silk Liner – 100g
Big Agnes Cyclone Chair Kit – 165gClothing
Waterproof - Omm Cypher Event Smock – 240g
Insulation - Rab Xenon – 300g
Merino Baselayer – 100g
Silk Leggings – 100g
Buff – 10g
Merino Beanie – 60gOther
Bog Paper – 5g
Chewing gum – 5gThat little lot comes to 5.5kg and includes the weight of the bags your carrying it in too.
If I want to take a 1 man tent add another 400g.
2-3 Days - just add a spare pair of lycra shorts, restock food at a shopPosted 1 year ago # -
That makes interesting reading Rik! I'd definitely want a tent to get away from the beasties, and the food you're carrying might stretch the definition of 'comfortable' a bit (where's the chocolate, pouch of tobacco, book and personal stereo?). Does that food really cover three days of 50-60k riding and pushing offroad? And if you're being honest, surely you need to include all your bike tools in that list too, and if its a serious trip, spare pads/length of chain/derailleur hanger.
I have enjoyed myself immensely riding trails with lots of camping gear on/and or a trailer but as already mentioned, your expectations/riding style have to change.
Posted 1 year ago # -
what do you use for a ground sheet rik?
Posted 1 year ago # -
1L of water for a day would be optimistic for me at best. You'll need 300ml for the super noodles too
I prefer a proper tent too, but everyones definition of 'comfy' is different.. can't get a hot tub on the rack!
Posted 1 year ago # -
Impressive Rik but not much food there, looks a bit light for even one days worth. I know even at only 5 kg that would effect my riding, although obviously less than 10 kg, but to have no effect is impossible.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Interesting list that.
Quantum top bag isn't everyone's idea of a sleeping bag though
Buff's also weigh more than 10g. I've weighed one
I don't have the list to hand, but my justenoughforthirtysixhours kit list for Polaris was around 4kg before tools and water, both of which went on the bike. That included a tent ~ 1kg, and I remember all my food was also 1kg, so Rik you don't each much!
Anyway, my conclusion ultimately that there was too much discomfort for general use but it was tolerable for a race/event where less weight roughly translated to more speed.
Posted 1 year ago # -
That list covers the kit needed to live outdoors over night. So tools would be on top.
That food doesnt get me through 50-70km of riding your right, that is an evening meal and a brew in the morning. I've never encountered a situation that you don't go past a shop or bakery on a long ride for day food (yes I know in the sticks of north Scotland it might happen but it has yet to for me). Same as calling into the pub for an evening pint before setting up camp on the fells.Ground sheet is a home made bathtub one made from spinaker. I hate bivi bags so the fitted tarp is bigger and more comfortable.
Lightweight can be comfortable, just a different comfortable to car camping. It is about the riding and camping for me.
Posted 1 year ago # -
1l of water is again not for a day, refilled plenty of times from pubs, campsites, shops etc. People are friendly if you ask. Just make sure I have 1l with me at the end of the day.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Ta rik
Water can be topped up where I ride no problems - I actually carry only 1/2 a litre as I know I can get more
No sleeping bag or have I missed it? No tools? No waterproofs? no maps? No phone? No first aid kit? 500 g of food?
Its an impressive list but no way comes anywhere near comfy to me. What do you do when it rains? Is that enough for down to sub zero( I have had frost just about every month camping )
Posted 1 year ago #
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