M8’s had enough of expensive lights, as his £300 Lupine has lasted a year and now is as reliable as a very unreliable thing… (he is not willing to give Lupine/Zyro more money to fix it either)

I will be mentioning Trout / Luminous’s kit to him, but as I say he disillusioned, especially as my nasty Chinese lights work fine and cost **** all. So what do you think is the best of the current of “Chinese” lights currently? As much as I love my Smudge light, he’s seen it & it’s not what he’s after output wise and so P7’s are definitely off the menu too.

So off-hand I see it that the options are:
MJ-872 I’ve personally seen this and am extremely impressed by it and it’s performance (and no signs of it overheating and switching down mode).

The Inton 2x XM-L T6 or MJ-880 2x XM-L T6 units with a claim of 2000 lumens, though Neninja twin XM-L U2 version ‘sounds’ the best ‘head unit’ spec wise though not a finished looking as the new MJ-880

Or the Fluxient 4x XP-G R5, though I can’t find one for sale now (which kinda scuppers it) but ”Big_f_d_d” has sold them before now & his pictures look good, though his representation of the MJ-872 is seemingly not as good as what I’ve ‘seen’ in real life

Have I missed off any other lights worth considering?

Any experience of the twin XM-L units? As there is seemingly little feedback about them.

its a difficult call – im looking at cheaper lights mself and was torn between the smudge light and the inton 2x xml t6 on ebay. worth noting that only the light unit is under any kind of warranty with the inton in one of the ebay stores and theres nothing to cover battery or cabling. this is swaying me over to smudge…how is the performance and overall brightness / spread of light on the smudge – is it adequate in your opinion over technical night time terrain Zippy?

As long as you don’t want the sun to accompany you on your night time forays the torch that Stoner reviewed has performed admirably so far. I use not only for my bike but also mounted to my rifle (for ratting) and as an all-round torch. Bloody fantastic for the money IMO and more than rivals much more expensive models of similar lumens that I’ve compared it to. Threads are a bit scrappy but easily fixed with a squirt of silicone spray.

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/ebay-cree-xml-20-torch-out-of-the-box-pics-review%5D

well neninjas twin xml has the newer u2 driver which seems to up the output a little (and possibly allows for the ‘dimmer’ function) and it has a huge capacity battery and a uk CE approved charger. that would make it my favorite over the other 2 xm-l t6 lights. Think they all have the same reflectors and glass so no difference on beam pattern, and the photos show a good looking pattern.

the 872 seems good too….not as powerful though. take a look at torchythebatteryboy ‘s website, he has comparisons on there of loads of lights with photos of beams. He has the 872 IIRC and the inton 2x xml t6

Liking the look of the ninja lights

There was some positive feedback on the original thread for the Twin U2 light I’m selling which sadly got deleted by the mods. I’m still in the process of sorting some advertising with Matt so hopefully my post won’t incur their wrath.

An STW’er who bought one of the evaluation batch has compared the U2 side by side with T6 version of the light (as sold on Ebay) and said the U2 version was noticeably brighter.

Several of the buyers have sent personal feedback and all have been happy. The only thing people have considered improving is the O-ring mount (most have swapped them for the Hope Universal Mount).

I have alternative handlebar mounts on the way which have a QR mount with side to side swivel adjustment plus the mount can be left on the bars as the light has a plate to slide on to the handlebar mount. These will add £10 to the price of the light kit but you’ll get the O-ring mount too.

neninja – does the charger work with the cheapo XML lights from DX? And are the batteries interchangeable between the two? This would be a really useful feature it it is the case.

thanks

The MJ872’s a great light- comes with a better charger and battery than the cheaper Magicshines too. All you need really, stick it on your head and it gives good power and as good a field of vision of any light I’ve used. I wouldn’t complain if it had more power though!

The twin XML light seems like more of a bar light to me… And IMO with the power of modern lights a strong head light is far more effective. Brighter bar lights can swamp out the same area better than older bar lights but that doesn’t fix the basic aim problem- your bars aren’t always pointing where you want to go.

All IMO but I think we’re well past the point where more light = better, it’s worth losing a little power for greater function. The teeny head unit of the 872 makes it almost perfect for head mount. I haven’t used a dual XML myself but it’s a bulkier and I believe heavier unit.

neninja – does the charger work with the cheapo XML lights from DX? And are the batteries interchangeable between the two? This would be a really useful feature it it is the case.

Yes, it uses the same connectors as Magicshine etc so you can swap batteries and chargers. I have a Magicshine, LightandGo and XML that all fit the charger.

Zippy, what’s up with your mates Lupine light? If it is battery related please send it to me to look at , if light send it to Troutie.

I have compatible connectors that can be used for both the light and battery if it may be a connector problem.

Smudge

Mark, I emailed you about replacing his battery but seemingly his charger is faulty too, so without being rude the price of a battery and charger is nearly the price of a new light above… so he’s looking at all the options… and still has no idea what to do.
To confuse things further, the LBS reset his lupine head unit and on last nights ride, it lasted an hour on full beam, now he simply doesn’t know whether to spend more money on it or get another unit..
I’m going to try and see if my my brother can locate his old lupine battery and charger (another dead edison 5), and see what goes on from that… it’s a nightmare

As for the comments about lights above…
Teasel – another m8 literally got his ‘Stoner’ XM-L torch yesterday and was out with us last night, and for £18 it’s amazing. So were well aware of this option.

Neninja’s light would be my choice if deciding between these lights but as there not much feedback on them (for good reason), and I’ve simply not seen one, so I can’t just say to him “buy this”. That and I like experiment with new lights, he’s a bit more conservative.

Northwind.. yep MJ-872’s are great lights and one I definitely recommend (and have done) but for a little more money the twin XM-L might be significantly better. Also this is to be his bar light as he has a Exposure Diablo on his helmet, so were not worried about size/weight.

and finally Stinkerbell, my Smudge XM-L is a great unit but I’ve simply never had to use it in anger on it’s own, as have lots of other torches I’ve collected over the years. I’ve had it since June and not had a single issue with it or any complaint I could raise. I find it quite concentrated compared to my P7’s and Trout Mini but that no real comparison, and the reach is significantly better than both of those. Simply as a helmet light I don’t believe you would be worried about riding fast, consider we been using less powerful P7’s for the last two years… The main alternative as I see it is the MJ-872, but with Smudge unit you get a huge “piece of mind” bonus (as well as being cheaper), I’ve been deal with him over the last 3 years for different bit and piece and a more helpful guy would be hard to find. See his post above…

On ONe have some twin XML lights as well.

I am happy with a Trouted Hope 2 on the bars and a £30 DealXtreme XML on my lid. Did my fine last night over Parkamoor, Moor Lane and back down to High Nibthwaite.

Mate had a new HopeR4 last night and it is dinky – like a posh version of the magicshine 4x XPG lamp but with Hope back up and service.

Another mate had bought a magic shine 4x XPG and it lasted a week before it went back for dodgy battery, flickering connections. 2 weeks later and still no joy.

Tomaso, that a risk you take, & a risk I’m aware of and am happy with. Personally I’ve 4 different MS or clone lights and only had a issue with one which was 12months old & was easily fixed (with Mark/Smudges assistance). I know directly of 12 other units of one sort or another than have all been fine, I think the risk more than acceptable.

z1ppy – Member

Also this is to be his bar light as he has a Exposure Diablo on his helmet, so were not worried about size/weight.

TBH the Diablo’s going to be massively outgunned by whatever he puts on the bars, even on full power (with subsequent feeble burntime). I’d go the other way- new helmet light, keep the diablo as a spare/infill light.

I ran a slightly more powerful light than the Diablo on the head with the 872 on the bars, thinking they’d compliment each other but the second light proved to be pretty useless for me, I got better results from one light. YMMV of course.

tomaso – Member

Another mate had bought a magic shine 4x XPG and it lasted a week before it went back for dodgy battery, flickering connections.

If it’s any consolation, my mate’s Joystick charger blew up the first time he used it, and it took another mate a month to get his Seca fixed when the wire loosened in the head unit. In other words, stuff breaks.

can recommend neinjas one – top top light (actually too bright if you’re following someone, very glad you can turn it down!!)

Has anyone run the dual XML on the head? Curious about that…

MJ872 gets my vote. Bought mainly out of curiosity to see what all the fuss was about. Although the construction is somewhat Michael Mouse, in terms of light output it’s up there with my Lumicycle XPG in an uncontrolled nuclear explosion kindof way.

No problems with it despite frequent intense neglect, careless charging etc.

TBH the Diablo’s going to be massively outgunned by whatever he puts on the bars

This is not my experience, the lad with the MJ-872 in our group is using his old MS P7 bike light on his helmet, and is happy as Larry. Also the ‘potential buyer’ has already been using his Wilma on the bars with the Diablo on his head, and is very happy with this setup. I know a lot of ppl recommend using a helmet light over a bar light, but I disagree and prefer a powerful bar light any day. If it’s bolstered by a less powerful head light, all the better in my book. I put this down to the contrast you get with bar lights (shadows), that is washed out by a powerful headlight.

I had a Lupine Edison 4 for years. 900 lumens of Bi-Xenon Awesomeness. After the 2nd bulb blew I decided not to spend another £110 on getting it replaced. Economics and 2 kids forced me to buy a £150 MagicShite MJ808e instead. 1000lumens and 5+hours on max is claimed. The beam angle is more spread so it doesn’t seem as bright as the Luppie but the extra capacity means I can stay out much longer. Win some, lose some.

In an ideal world I would have bought a Troutie.

TRH +1, both my brother and I have had Edison 5’s that dies in no time, mine had two bulbs one grudgingly from Lupine and one from a very embarrassed LBS when Lupine refused to supply anymore under warranty.
After mine died the final time, I gave up with it & any thought of using the mainstream manufacturers again.
I did get a trout Mini though…

I know it taken a while, but last nights ride where the Lupine lasted all of 5 minutes on full beam broke the camels back for him. It had worked for well over an hour on the last ride, after his LBS reset the unit.
He’s asked me to order one of the option above for him.. any thoughts new on these lights or alternatives?
[He’s decided on Neninja’s units off-hand]

What about these?
http://nitelightsuk.myshopify.com/

Just another positive review on Neninja’s light. Really good, I got a hope mount for it as I didn’t really trust the o-ring on really rocky stuff. I’ve found that I can angle it up to give me a really good long view a head and there is still enough “bleed”, if that’s the right word, to have the occasional glance down at the front wheel. I certainly wouldn’t want to spend anymore than that on a bar mounted light.

Don’t you get 2 years warranty on lupine lights , excluding the battery which is a few months IIRC . Send it back .

When i was home at christmas my old LBS was raving on about the MyTinySun lights from here

http://www.magicshineuk.co.uk/categories/Front-Bike-Lights

he was saying that a number of his customers have them and are very happy, I notice they also have Lupine compatable connectors which may appeal to your mate if he has batteries and stuff already.

Noticed the Fluxient Fluxient 4x XP-G R5 mentioned above by Z1ppy is now for sale on Ebay from Big_f_d_d (Torchy the Battery Boy). His blog makes the beam look much better than MJ872 but then he is selling them…

FWIW I use an MJ872 on the bars and a Stoner torch on my lid and it’s a superb combo. Easily equals or betters mates’ Exposure, Hope, Lupine, etc

Just bought one of these from eBay. The seller seems to know lots about the product. Exchanged a lot of emails in which they have given lots of details and tips. Seems to also give realistic output in the ad. I’ll post back once I’ve received it and used it.
Cree XML torch

i had a problem with my Troutie liberator not charging

troutie sent me a new charger, didn’t fix the problem

smudge had the battery to test,which was ok, but to save time he sent me a brand new battery.

smudge sent me a new battery, didn’t solve the problem

troutie had light, charger and battery back to check, turns out there were two duff chargers

troutie sent me new charger, new battery bag (and the battery had already been replaced, this all took place over christmas, in about 1 week, absolutely amazing service, something you wouldn’t get from the big boys
i can’t recommend Troutlites and MTB Batteries enough
troutie and smudge are riders like us and bend over backwards to help

OK, cheers for the replies but…

Cupra – Those are just more of the same already discussed, so nothing new with no reviews/recommendation to sell them, and a premium price.

Ramsey Neil – No idea but his dealer made no mention of it. Though mainly as replacement battery (which is undoubtedly part of the issue) from Lupine is going to cost as much one of the above lights, what’s the point?

Cheezey – Where? I looked through his items yesterday and today and can’t see them. Also I totally agree on his website making them look “much” better than the MJ-872, when my personal experience of the MJ-872 is, they provide a lot more light than in his photo.

Muggo – It was considered, especially as his m8 bought a similar light, but it’s not the solution my friend wants.

RD – Yes totally agree, I’ve had nothing but good thing to say about Chris and Mark services, I use a Trout Mini and an XML from Mark myself. The Trout & Luminous lights were thrown in for consideration, he decided against them.

… anyway one of Neninja’s Inton unit’s was ordered yesterday.

muggomagic – Ive got one of them, the only drawback, as such, is that the beam is not adjustable, but I use it in conjunction with another cree torch which is adjustable for a widersweep and Ive pretty much got daylight, I can ride as fast off road as I can in the day – other than startled rabbits running out!

It does have a very good beam pattern though and is very very bright…

I’m using the same torch as Mugomagic recommends. in fact, I’ve bought six of them so far from DX, pair each for me and the GF and a pair for a mate. Fantastic as a bar / head combo, seem well made (although you need the end screwed on tight) and so far have outlasted the rides we’ve done (although only about 90 mins max to date so I’d hope so).

I have the links for the DX equivalent to the eBay link if anyone wants them?

is it possible to buy the lupine compatible connectors?

can’t seem to find them online

Anyone tried the dual-XML on the noggin out of cuiosity? Or got a head unit weight?

Cheezpleez – Member
Noticed the Fluxient Fluxient 4x XP-G R5 mentioned above by Z1ppy is now for sale on Ebay from Big_f_d_d (Torchy the Battery Boy). His blog makes the beam look much better than MJ872 but then he is selling them…

Torchy’s beam pics seem honest, but are of an older 872 with the cloudy front glass (diffusor?)- any you buy now should have the revised clear one, which works better. Whether it makes the light as bright as the Fluxient, I don’t know but it will at least close the gap.

That said, the Fluxient looks great value, I think I’d be inclined to go that way if I was buying now.

Well we got one of Neninja’s dual XML, and though have yet to do anything but fire it up in the back garden (huge amount of light), before I had to hand it over to the owner… will hopefully see it in action on Wednesday night. Hopefully the rider with the MJ-872 will be out too, so a direct comparison will be possible (to see if it’s worth the extra £20/25)

Just holding the head unit, I’d say I’d not rush to attach one to my helmet as it seemed pretty heavy, and I used a P7 ‘torch’ quite happily for a few years on my helmet. TBH I’d suggest the MJ-872 is the most powerful (DX clone) head unit I put on my helmet, though even these I think are too big/high on there std mount (catch too many branchs).

EDIT: D0ugal, email Mark @ MTB Batteries or Troutie, as they have both done work for me on lupine units. Mark replaced my lupine battery and then later troutie converted a trout mini to work with that battery. Though they may have used my own ‘old’ leads I canne remember. Either way they’ll have more idea that most. Otherwise I’ve heard it suggested before that buying a lupine extension lead is an option.

EDIT 2: NW, what can I say, he regularly slags MS units including the MJ-872, then promotes his own stuff & his beam of the MJ-872 simply does not match my real world experience. I have nothing to gain by being honest… he does. Anyway I’ve yet to see him stock the Fluxient 4xXPG units, since his original batch, so it’s seemingly irrelevant.

A rather late reply to the original point, but irrespective of the warranty, I’d be looking for a repair or replacement under your statutory rights.

They’re required to be “sufficiently durable” and at £300 a go, I think a reasonable person would expect rather more than 12 months usage out of them.

[PDW, try reading the whole thread and see several experiences with Lupine/Zyro and there warranty, or lack of..he like me has learnt his lesson and simply won’t be buying anything off them again]

Well we were out last night with the Inton dual XML unit and our simple impression of it is “WOW”, that’s a fricken lot of light for the money.
Only the owner and me out, so no direct comparison with the MJ-872 unfortunately, only my single XML unit. Off-hand I’d guess it seemingly put out 3 times the amount of light my XML does, and my XML is not exactly under powered (the newer U2 XML LED is definitely worth holding out for). Lot and lots of light, everywhere.. the beam has the obvious XML punch/throw you’d expect (which the MJ-872 lacks) and a huge wide centre spot with loads of spill around it. Though where-as the spill on a single XML unit is overawed by the central spot, this is more gradual & so a lot more usable. Off-hand the beam main centred beam/spot coned(?) out from the unit and down the trail, around this the over spill was more than enough to light the surrounding area’s.
Only rode for 2 hrs, and as we don’t tend to night ride for much longer, I can’t tell you much about battery life, other than it definitely lasts 2hrs on full beam.
What I can say from those 2hrs, is that even though it was a very warm evening, the unit showed no signs of overheating in the slightest. I’d expected it to be at least “to hot to hold” at the end of the ride, this was not the case it was merely warm (a definite advantage over the MJ-872).

We had a few minor queries, with fitting the battery pack and his dislike of the fader (more to go wrong in his book), but nothing world ending, basically the owner thoroughly pleased with this purchase.
One thing is for sure, he won’t be putting this on his helmet, it’s far to heavy for that, but even run as a single light on your bars, you won’t struggle for enough light.

On ONe have some twin XML lights as well.

I was at the factory today. Very very very cool. CNC, own drive board manufacturing, nice clean place, owner is a rider… I am going to talk to Mr Trout about whether we can relight a production idea I had at my previous place.

dougal,

I have a stock of compatible Lupine connectors. Please email me if your still after one.

Smudge

Interesting thread MJ-808 seems to be on the way out, well the battery does, buy now or wait till autumn, decisions decisions.