I'm looking at getting a dog and haven't had one before. What's a manageable breed?
It's likely to be left alone for much of the day - will this make a difference?
(I was initially sceptical about how fair it is to have a dog to then leave it at home whilst you go to work, but it's better than being in a dog shelter, right?)
Why get a dog to leave it alone all day?
This is very unfair on the dog.
I say don't do it, get a cuddly one instead.
It's likely to be left alone for much of the day - will this make a difference?
It's the only reason I don't have a dog. Dogs are pack animals, the occasional solitary period might be tolerable (don't be surprised if he chews your furniture due to distress though) but regular long periods on its own is no life for a dog.
Plenty folk leave dogs at home during work.
Whether this is right appears entirely subjective. Plenty dogs like lying around sleeping.
Agree with the above- we have ours crated when we aren't there but its a few hours at the most, if you work everyday and plan on leaving the dog everyday then expect trashed furniture at best and a call from the RSPCA at worst when your neighbours report a dog howling endlessly.
Dogs are pack animals and they do not like being left on their own. They take time (a lot of time) to become used to it.
Whichever dog you get and I'd suggest getting an older dog that may be more capable of coping, rather than a puppy, that way they hopefully won't have the anxiety problems that a puppy would have.
Sounds like what you need there is a cat. HTH.
As regards 'pack' animals, would two dogs fix that problem?
If you get a dog from a shetler there are some that won't let you have one if you're going to leave it alone all day.
My mum got a dog from a shelter and it has 'issues'. If she goes out for longer than a couple of hours it eats everything...door frames, furniture...everything.
It was abandoned when it's last owners moved and I think it worries that she won't come
back wen she goes out.
Dogs from a shelter often need extra care.
Yeah, get a cat. They usually don't give a flip if you're in or not.
Dogs are pack animals and they do not like being left on their own. They take time (a lot of time) to become used to it.
Yep, a bit like humans. At first a human being will find solitary confinement unbearable and distressing, but after a few years they get used to it, and they can easily then go 30 years in solitary confinement - no problem. Just look at Nelson Mandela - he's turned out alright. And he probably loved the peace and quiet the last 20 years of his solitary confinement gave him.
I always thought it was wrong to keep a dog if you are out most of the day but am slowly changing my view s in light of my brothers experience.
Him and his wife work full time but have a rescue GREYHOUND and it works just fine for them all, the dog likes nothing more than too sleep most of the day as long as it gets a good walk first thing in the morning and is well fussed when they get home, it spends most of the day asleep even when some one is in the house with it.
The down side is that every now and again it takes great delight in bringing them a present home ... usually a chewed up hare 
Labradors/Retrievers are good easy dogs. Child friendly.
Only problem is they will eat any food and get fat if you let them
Firstly dogs are not pack animals and secondly they sleep all day anyway. Ours is quite happy being left from 8-4 in the back yard with a few chews and a kennel. Doesnt happen every day but she has had a few weeks at a time of it. She honestly behaves no different if I'm at home. Lot of crap spouted about dogs and this is a highlight. Having said that I wouldnt like to leave her in the house as she would need to pee.
I wasn't saying it was a good thing, but dogs are adaptable to peoples lifestyles, they just need the time and patience from us to become used to it.
Hands up here, my dog tends to get left at home for about four hours a day in these summer months as it's too hot to have him in my van with me, during the spring,winter and autumn, he's with me all the time, we got him from his last owners as he suffered anxiety problems when they left him and he ripped half their house down. He's never done that with us, though he will go bin surfing and pinch all the cat food
He has his own crate and he knows its his place, and when we first got him we shut it up when we left him, now he's used to it, we leave it open and he wanders in and out as pleases.
I kind of fancy a dog but it would be alone for 10 hours a day, on top of that I'm away a lot and I'm still unconvinced it would all be good for a dog.
dogs are not pack animals
Apart from owning a dog, do you have any other qualifications which would give me any reason to take your comment seriously ?
I see overwhelming evidence that dogs have strict social hierarchies and have evolved to hunt in packs. Indeed one of the greatest clues to this are a dog's teeth and jaws. Unlike cats, dogs have very large and powerful teeth and jaws which they have evolved to break and crush the bones of animals far larger than themselves. The only way dogs would be able to bring down and eat prey that large, would be through highly coordinated hunting by a pack. Otherwise if dogs had evolved to eat small prey such as birds or rabbits, they would have small teeth and fragile jaws such as cats and foxes. Dogs are pack animals which in human society regard themselves as part of the human pack. Feral dogs will almost always form packs, further proof of the fact that dogs are naturally pack animals.
Exactly how many hours is 'much of the day'? Some dogs are perfectly happy alone in a kennel outside or with the run of downstairs in a house.
I honestly wouldnt bother with a rescue animal for your first dog as it may have 'issues' that you arent experienced enough to deal with.
Steer clear of 'bull terrier' types.
Any 'working gundog' breed will probably be best, they have well rounded temperaments, intelligence and also a lot of athletic ability which is good if you want to ride your bike with it. With most being bred outside they wont mind being kennelled outside in the day either.
Dogs are pack animals, you are its pack!
+1 for retired/rescued greyhounds. They sleep most of the day and don't need that much exercise. My sister has three, when I take them long walks they are knackered at the end. Speed, not endurance, is their forte. They are very placid dogs and also great with kids.
We "invested" in a labradoodle (cue the laughter) but absolutely brilliant breed. Being an A1 to a miniature poodle means she's about beagle size, with the Labs temperament and love of water / running etc. Moults very little and low-allergenic.
Regards leaving at home, i'd say no longer than 3-4 hours max. When both me and the wife are working through the day she goes for a run in the morning, then we have either a dog walker come round at lunchtime to take her out, or our neighbours who work from home take her out with them (lately she has been adopted by them through the day as well ... spoilt !). Neighbourhood kids can always be roped in for a few quid to take them out for a bit.
Im also lucky in that I can take her to work on quieter days.
They are a commitment though, holidays etc are always booked with the idea of bringing the dog (drives to France are now the norm). And they are not cheap !!!
Wouldn't be without one though.
anagallis_arvensis - MemberFirstly dogs are not pack animals and secondly they sleep all day anyway. Ours is quite happy being left from 8-4 in the back yard with a few chews and a kennel. Doesnt happen every day but she has had a few weeks at a time of it. She honestly behaves no different if I'm at home. Lot of crap spouted about dogs and this is a highlight. Having said that I wouldnt like to leave her in the house as she would need to pee.
You know how someone has to be on the left hand side of the bell curve? I present to you anagallis_arvensis.
Anyone know what a dog's concepts of time is like? I.e. how good are they perceiving the difference between 2 hours of elapsed time and 4 hours?
well ours certainly knows to the minute when everyone is due home ... and duly takes her place on the back of the sofa on window watch. I swear to god she must have swallowed a rolex at some point !
Not to mention meal times ...
So i'd say pretty good, but then its also relative, if they are stressed then 10 minutes no doubt feels like three weeks, whereas a 10 minute run around feels like 2 minutes.
Not really sure about this pack thing or the awareness of time either. If I go out for a few hours I get a big welcome on return, exactly the samre if I go out for 10 mins.
When I'm out she's on her own, when I'm in she's generally in the garden on her own.
http://www.animalsandsociety.com/assets/library/205_s15327604jaws07047.pdf
http://www.jeandonaldson.com/jeans-blog-mainmenu-51/64-are-dogs-pack-animals
Significant populations of free-ranging domestic dogs exist in sub-Saharan Africa, South America, India, Mexico, Tasmania (Cook Island Dogs), Hawaii, Bangkok and, in a situation paralleling that of Romania, in Moscow. Pariah dogs on the Indian subcontinent are thought to be the longest-running continuous population of feral dogs - on the order of 14,000 years, nearly as long as archaeological evidence has existed for domestic dogs.There are cases of dogs buddying up with one or more dogs for days at a time, and dogs being drawn into proximity to each other by food sources, however none of the above populations form packs the way wolves do
and its a normal distribution not a bell curve
98% wolf.
My collie is 98% idiot.
LOL at some of the replies in this thread. Our Ted has no problem being home alone 5 days a week. I come home every lunch time to let him out for a whizz. He has two good hour long walks EVERY day with lots of play to simulate a working lurcher's life. It took him a week to settle in to this routine when we got him.
I sometimes feel guilty about it, but I've watched him on a webcam and his day is exactly the same as when we're around all day. That is, sleeping the sleep of the dead. He simply doesn't move, and once he was still for so long I thought he'd died in his sleep and was about to rush home when he got up, turned round and literally fell back to sleep.
It can be done, with the right dog, and the right routine.
There are cases of dogs buddying up with one or more dogs for days at a time, and dogs being drawn into proximity to each other by food sources, however none of the above populations form packs the way wolves do
I'm liking the scientific term "buddying up". There is plenty of evidence of feral dogs forming packs, if there is also evidence of feral dogs living solitary lives, then that is highly likely to be the effect of human influence, ie, humans are unlikely to allow dogs to form hunting packs in the same way as wolves do. Therefore for survival purposes it is perfectly feasible that dogs which return to the wild live a solitary life. An example of how human behaviour affects the lives of wild carnivores which immediately comes to my mind is the example of foxes. Many people assume that foxes are nocturnal animals when they are actually in fact very much diurnal. The reason a lot of people assume that foxes are nocturnal is because they only see them at night. And yet the reason for that is actually because foxes tend to try to avoid humans when they live in close proximity to them. In areas where fixes live far from humans they live very diurnal lives. Examples of this can also be seen in towns, eg foxes will often sunbathe, play, and generally socialise, in the middle of the day by railway embankments, they are able to do this because they generally feel secure from inference by humans in such places. Humans can have a profound affect on the behaviour of wild animals. Having said all that, solitary wolves are far from unknown, hence the common reference to the "lone wolf" by the indigenous people's of the Americas. Therefore the solitary v pack argument is never that clear-cut and straightforward, but there is no doubt at all that wolves/dogs have highly complex social lives, and they are also highly social animals .... imho.
As far as scientific evidence is concerned, it is hardly surprising if you manage to dig up an opposing scientific argument. There are plenty of opposing scientific POVs for most things. Here is one on the widely accepted theory of evolution :
After more than a decade of effort the Discovery Institute proudly announced in 2007 that it had got some 700 doctoral-level scientists and engineers to sign "A Scientific Dissent from Darwinism."
I am not however going to reject the Darwinism theory of evolution because of it, any more than I am going to accept that dogs are not highly sociable animals because some scientist in America or wherever, says so. If you have to regularly leave a dog the best part of the day on its own, then my and most people's opinion is, don't bother getting one.
There is plenty of evidence of feral dogs forming packs
present some then?
the behaviour of foxes and crazy creationists seems irrelevant to me
Firstly dogs are not pack animals and secondly they sleep all day anyway.
Inspirational. What depth of knowledge and clarity possessed by man can rival yours?
INITIATE FACEPALM OVER_RIDE: type//error
EDIT -
crazy creationists
Jesus. Tell me you're trolling...
crazy creationistsJesus. Tell me you're trolling...
eh? So the fact that some people think Darwin was wrong is relevant to this argument as someone above suggested is it?
Many people assume that foxes are nocturnal animals when they are actually in fact very much diurnal. The reason a lot of people assume that foxes are nocturnal is because they only see them at night.
What lights for fox hunting? I don't think I've ever seen a fox at night, only ever during the day. Isn't this a case of ernie assumes that many people assume...?
If you have to regularly leave a dog the best part of the day on its own, then myand most people'sopinion is, don't bother getting one.
present some then?
I'm really not going to get into a pointless argument with you, specially if you are determined to delude yourself and soothe your own guilt concerning leaving your dog all day on its own, you can do your own googling. But here's just one example from National Geographic News for you to be getting on with :
Quote :
Some are abandoned pets; others were born on the streets. In order to survive, these social creatures form packs, scavenging garbage or killing livestock in teams.
A survey by the National Agricultural Statistics Service in 1999 found that feral dogs were partly responsible for killing cows, sheep, and goats worth about U.S. 37 million dollars.
Note "killing cows" ....... that requires several animals working as a team.
There are plenty of examples of feral dogs forming packs, whether you like it or not. And I guessing you don't.
eh? So the fact that some people think Darwin was wrong is relevant to this argument as someone above suggested is it?
Not at all. I'm a scientist and I totally agree with the above statement.
crazy creationists
But only an clown would seek to undermine his own argument by displaying his inherent bias so blatantly.
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