my daughter will be 16 in a few weeks. a 21 year old sniffing around her would get a slap. it seems pretty lame to me, like you can't pull anyone your own age so you go for the school kids?

Without even talking with the young man in question chief? I'd want to know what he was like and he certainly wouldn't get a slap if I felt she'd chosen wisely. Your daughter might just know what's good for her better than you do and giving the guy a slap would do more to convince her she has an unworthy thug of a father than put her off the suitor.

To even compare paedophillia and speeding in the same thread, regardless of the context, shows just how far we've come on the moral evolutionary ladder. As a teacher I've been privy to the aftermath of teenagers' (of both genders) sexual exploitation by adults. It's very much a humour killer…

I'm with barnsleymitch on this one. The legal age of consent in this country is to protect minors. I don't debate the fact that there are plenty of underage teenagers out there mature enough to engage in sexual relationships; merely that said maturity should be used to respect the legalities of the issue…

I'm in now way condoning what the guy did – he broke the law and the law is there for a reason, but this is a very grey area. In some western countries this would be legal. In fact, up until 150 years ago (roughly) this would have been legal here too.

And as for the argument about 21 year olds and 16 year olds, a (female) friend of mine met her husband – 12 years her senior – when she was 18. 22 years and 3 kids later, it seems to have worked out OK!

it was a virtual slap. i stand by what i say tho', it suggests an immature bloke lacking self esteem

I think there's some great potential for the Friday A&A thread…y'know, it's been dull lately. It could be livened up.

A 21 year old going for a 16 year old seems a pretty sad sack to me.

Surely there are 21 year old girls around.

shudders….

Edukator – Member
Fashion parade or youngsters expressing their personalities? It makes life easy for teachers: hoody chav = hoody chav, tart = tart, clean cut youth = clean cut youth, anorak = anorak. No error possible. Leading a group of French school girls through a German shopping mall proved interesting – I saw guys stop walking and follow their arses drop jawed. The hottest was wearing black tights, white mini-shorts and a cling-fit cashmere sweater.

Edukator – Member
Happily I don't work for a local education authority, besides, there's nothing to report, leering is legal.

Keep digging edukator, I've got a spare shovel for when you wear that one out…

Now, I'll probably get abuse for saying this, but some girls who are lets say 15, or just turned 16 can look older, say 18/19. And they will often get into lets say a nightclub where they should be 18. In this circumstance how would you know? AS for whether a 25 year old should crack onto a girl who looked 18 is another story

sod it, I'll be honest, a few years ago when i was ( just) 21, i ended up going on a date with a girl working in my local outdoor shop. I thought she was 18, 19 and she acted like she was. It turned out that she 16, but i didnt know this at first. SHe really did look older. We ended up together for 9 months, and then broke up At first i felt bad cause she was 4.5 years younger. She was definitely mature enough to know what a relationship was about, and i ended up caring for her very much. She ended up hurting me quite alot, but that is another story.

If i'd known how old she was at first, I would not have gone out with her, and I certainly wouldnt go out with an 18 year old now I am 23.

I dont know what my point is but just thought I'd point out that 16 year old girls are'nt all innocent…

my daughter will be 16 in a few weeks. a 21 year old sniffing around her would get a slap. it seems pretty lame to me, like you can't pull anyone your own age so you go for the school kids?

+1

A 21 year old going for a 16 year old seems a pretty sad sack to me.

Surely there are 21 year old girls around.

shudders….

+1

This lad is actually 25.

Plus as I said before- a 15yr old **** another 15yr is par the course. At school it happened all the time. Its part of growing up.

So what do you have issues with in my posts Mitch? And why would they constitute digging? I observe what I see and report it here. I smell lots of hypocrisy on this thread. Red-blooded males trying to pretend they don't find young women beautiful and even (God forbid) attractive.

You need your fingers in lie detectors before typing "shudders" and "WRONG" rather than "wow". A woman doesn't suddenly become beautiful and desirable at a certain age – nature decides that. The law decides at what point we have to look but not touch and up to what age we protect children both from others and themselves. I think 16 is an unrealistic level to enforce frankly but won't be breaking the law.

At 18 nobody questions whether you should find a woman attractive no matter how young she might look or act and you all go wow on the fit and athletic threads. Now if it turned out that the woman was really 14 would she suddenly be unattractive? – No. It's just that you'd have to revise your ambitions or be patient.

15-year-old girls are not interested in 15-year-old guys. 18 with a car maybe.

Would it have gone as far as it has if the families of the victims had no chance of financial gain?

Are they gaining financially?

He is 22, an international athlete which implies a certain amount of life experience.

Ok, he's 25 but does that really mean he has 'life experience'? It could be that he has lived in a 'training bubble' for years and is relatively immature and inexperienced himself.

I certainly wouldn't attempt to defend or condone his actions without all the facts and by the same time token wouldn't like to hang him quite yet.

Just to put this in perspective and show how attitudes vary throughout the world, the following is an extract from Marriage Laws in the USA – and it's not some deep southern state it's…………. New York

New York: If you are 16 or 17 years of age, you will need to have a completed parental consent form filled out by both parents. If you are either 14 or 15 years of age, you will need to show the written consent of both parents and a justice of the Supreme Court or a judge of the local Family Court.

I'm not too sure where to go with your posts Edukator.

I think I'll just bug out and concede that we all have different values and opinions.

I chatted to a girl in a nightclub, arranged to see her again at her house, with her mum and dad there, and she then told me she was 15. I was 22, so I made my excuses and left.

It's a simple moral choice, and an even simpler legal one.

In this case then yes, it's a simple choice. But what would you have done had she said she was 18?

If he were 18 and bedded a 15y.o. girl thinking she was 17, it'd be morally different.
If I discovered a 25 year old bloke so much as wanting to touch my daughter when she's 15, he'd learn the pain spd shoes bring when connecting with the balls. No flipping way will I ever accept it. If she was 20, fair play to him but not at such a young age.

It wouldn't be illegal if he lived in a civilised country.

Aren't you a teacher?

I've read a few reports of responsible adults justifying their actions when abusing impressionable children. I always find it worrying that these people get into these positions…

In this case then yes, it's a simple choice. But what would you have done had she said she was 18?

Honestly? I'd have spent more time getting to know her before doing anything. But then I'm old, and from a generation that didn't see sex as something you 'just do'…

As Edukator is (oddly) pointing out, there is a big grey area surrounding sexual activity and age, and there is a considerable amount of hypocrisy when we consider our approaches towards nubile young women.

However, that's what the law is for; it removes any need for debate and simply states that this is wrong.

We all know it, we can all understand why the law says this, and we should all adhere to it.

..and as a Dad, if any 25 year old had messed with my daughter at 15, I'd have pointed out the error of his ways too.

..and I'd rather that she thought she had a father who was there to protect her, than one who stood by and took a limited interest in her future.

I have been a teacher amongst other things. I've also stated and will repeat that I've never had sex with anyone under the age of 18. These are observations and opinions.

I have been a teacher amongst other things

As a father and uncle, I find your somewhat "liberal" views a little worrying especially given your enhanced levels of access. I trust you are trolling on this thread?

Given that teaching is a vocational path, is there a specific reason that you are no longer pursuing it?

Honestly? I'd have spent more time getting to know her before doing anything. But then I'm old, and from a generation that didn't see sex as something you 'just do'………………..However, that's what the law is for; it removes any need for debate and simply states that this is wrong.

Crikey……… err Crikey, I don't know how old you are but that was straight from a "Terry and June' script. What about the pre-aids 70/80's, 'free love' in the sixties, the 'roaring twenties' etc. etc. Sex, as something you 'just do'is not exactly a modern innovation.

As for the law removing any need for debate, there are a few lawyers who would dispute that.

t®ibal©hief – Member
my daughter will be 16 in a few weeks. a 21 year old sniffing around her would get a slap. it seems pretty lame to me, like you can't pull anyone your own age so you go for the school kids?

So the fact that we have now been together for 13 years have 2 kids married etc means tha just because she was 16 years old then she wasn't able to decied that she like some one only 5 years loder than her.

There are plenty of people on here that go 'coor look at her i wouldn't mind a bit of that' when the age gap is so much larger.

Glad to see that so many think that they know what is best for there kids with out even consulting them.

And yes i have 2 daughters and when they get old enough to engage in sexual relations ships i would rather that they did it with the person that they wanted to rather than the person i thought good enough.

As a father and uncle,

Reminds me of the Bill Bailey skit "Speaking as a mother"

Anyway, he says right here:

I think 16 is an unrealistic level to enforce frankly but won't be breaking the law

He wont be breaking the law, and has pointed out that he hasnt fiddled around with anyone under the age of 18. I think he's a peado free zone.

Dear me, now they've implying I must be a paedophile because I'm questioning whether 16 as a hard and fast age of consent is realistic and dare to say young women can be attractive (on a look don't touch basis). If you are implying that the "specific reason" is any kind of issue relating to my behaviour with students Coyote, you are wrong.

Crikey……… err Crikey, I don't know how old you are but that was straight from a "Terry and June' script. What about the pre-aids 70/80's, 'free love' in the sixties, the 'roaring twenties' etc. etc. Sex, as something you 'just do'is not exactly a modern innovation.

Oh no! I've turned into my dad!

What I mean is that I've never really gone for that one night stand quick shag stuff, and being brought up by my mum has, for better or for worse, made me respect women.

Glad to see that so many think that they know what is best for there kids with out even consulting them.

You know what? I do know what's best for my kids without consulting them, and have done ever since they were born.

It's called being a parent.

When they are old enough to begin to make choices they are smart enough not to need me to help out, but one of the things I know is that 25 year olds who sleep with a number of under age girls are not likely to be welcomed into my house.

If you are implying that the "specific reason" is any kind of issues relating to my behaviour with students Coyote, you are wrong.

Good. And to be honest I never meant to imply this. Just asking a question.

However there is something slightly unsavoury about guys 25+ sniffing after school age children. Owenfrackenell would seem to be a notable expection but I would suggest that his motivation was based more around love than lust.

And yes i have 2 daughters and when they get old enough to engage in sexual relations ships i would rather that they did it with the person that they wanted to rather than the person i thought good enough.

Agreed, but it's nice if you can have both.

If my daughter had taken home a 21 year old when she was 16 the age difference wouldn't have been an issue. I would have considered him as a person rather than an age and trusted that my daughter had enough sense to know what she was doing.

Tribal@hief = admirable that you want to 'protect' your daughter but all that an action like that will achieve is to alienate your daughter who will then lie and see him anyway 😐

I've never really gone for that one night stand quick shag stuff,

Nah, it's just that you never met attractive women that were determined to get a one-night stand with you.

Nah, it's just that you never met attractive women that were determined to get a one-night stand with you.

Au contraire, mon ami, au contraire…. 😉

his motivation was based more around love than lust.

Now as I remember it lust tends to come first and love doesn't always follow.

"Don't stand so close to me", Sting.

On se connait?

Oui, peut etre…

Donc, il faut me souvenir d'un papa poule qui suit ce qui se passe dans le peloton pro, habite dans le nord, a au moins une fille et fait des paragraphes de deux lignes.

Wham bang mon chat 'Splash' gite sur mon lit a bouffe
Sa langue en buvant trop mon whysky Quand a moi peu dormi vide brime
J'ai du dormir dans la goutiere
Oil j'ai un flash

Plastic Bertrand

"So what do you have issues with in my posts Mitch? And why would they constitute digging? I observe what I see and report it here. I smell lots of hypocrisy on this thread. Red-blooded males trying to pretend they don't find young women beautiful and even (God forbid) attractive."

What I meant was this – the more responses you post, the more reprehensible you appear. You are, or have been, working with young girls (I recall you said 14 – 15 year olds, but I could be wrong), and appear to have no awareness of how it comes across when you make statements like 'leering is not a crime' or describe in detail what one of them was wearing (I think you described it as skin tight or figure hugging). As a nurse, I have to follow a fairly strict code of conduct, as well as undergoing the usual CRB checks, etc. I would presume that you also have similar guidelines in place. If I'm to be totally up front, I wouldnt want my kid's teachers posting opinions like this. Clear enough for you?

A 21 year old going for a 16 year old seems a pretty sad sack to me.

Surely there are 21 year old girls around.

shudders….

Yes there are, they are mostly with 28 year olds with better jobs/cars.

15-year-old girls are not interested in 15-year-old guys. 18 with a car maybe.

True – in my day it was an XR2 or maybe an XR3i

If not i'd of loved to of grown up in the utopia that you did! 😆

On a pseudo serious note i'm wondering how many or you with your arms raised in horror at what this bloke did ever had a grope with a girl under the age of 16 (when you were also that age. I know I did. If you didn't then bad luck, you missed out on a lot of the fun part of growing up, maybe you just made Airfix and were in Sea Scouts.

The point is that I can come down of my high horse for long enough to realise that as soon as I turned 16 I didn't stop finding the same girls attractive. Did you lot never fancy anyone until you were 16, then only girls older than you when you did?

I'm not saying what he did was right, but i am saying that what he did was pretty wrong and above all dumb & he might just be really really REALLY stupid (yes cyclist can be pretty damn stupid, think Tom Party Boy Boonen).

shoefiti – I think pretty much everyone was saying people roughly the same age is different to what this bloke did.

My mistake – it's all ok then, carry on! 😀

barnsleymitch – Member
"OK techncally he's a paedophile, but surely there's a distinction between sexual activity with kids of say 8 and 15, and perps ought to be treated differently?"
There's no technically about it, as a lawyer you know that perfectly well. Morally, I fail to see the difference – girls at 15 may well be physically developed, but do we therefore assume that they're capable of making adult choices and decisions? Remember, this isnt about two teenage kids sha**ing, the guy is an adult, the girl(s) he had sex with were minors.

And all of that changes on her 16th birthday?

Jesus wept.