Hello,

Has anyone got one of the new Hope Vision R4 lights? Looking at the results of the WMB test they didn’t seem to like it that much….

Any info?

Cheers

Butty

+ Bright, well made, if it goes wrong Hope are good, battery seems to be lasting well.

– No visual indicator when its running low. The battery rattles a bit on the stem.

I use mine with an Exposure Joystick but have used it fine on its own, the joystick is useful on tight singletrack and opening and closing gates.

Cheers Domino, have you used any of the Exposure offerings? particularly interested in how it compares to the Maxx-d or new (mk2/3) Toro

Butty

what did well in the WMB test by the way?

Yep, the Exposure joystick is great. Mrdomino got a Maxx-D last week and we rode at Gisburn, it is brighter than the Hope but I find the it perfectly adequate. Mrdomino does like the Maxx-D a lot though, he likes the low battery indicator and the fact the battery and light are all one unit. Minus point is 17 hours to charge from empty.

Best on test (4.5/5 stars)

Ay Up Ultra Lite, £134
Lumicycle LED3 XPG ATL Elite 26, £250
Ay Up V4 Adventure set, £272

4 stars

Magicshine MJ-816, £95
Electron Terra 2, £100
Magicshine MJ872, £120
Exposure Diablo, £200
Lupine Piko, £275
Troute Liberator Mk2, £295
Exposure MaXx-D, £325
Lumicycle Twin XPG 3 Pro 52, £450

3.5 stars

One23 Extreme Bright 3, £115
Niterider MiNewt Mini Cordless 600, £135
Exposure Joystick, £165
Exposure Toro, £275

3 stars

Lezyne Superdrive, £100
L&M Stella 300, £225
Moon X-Power 1000, £225
Hope R4 Epic, £295
Niterider Pro 1500 Race, £325
Full Beam Night Nemesis, £590
Niterider Pro 3000 LED, £700

2.5 stars

Topeak Whitelight HP 10W Mega, £300
Lupine Piko TL Max, £350

2 stars

Cateye Sumo 2, £300
L&M Seca 700, £350
Lupine Betty 12, £850

i’ve just bought one. try it out later.

On paper the Hope R4 should be brighter than the Maxx-d – looks like the lumens stated as ‘generated’ aren’t the same as the lumens stated by Exposure.

i.e. The R4 is supposed to generate 1446 lumens, whereas the new Maxx-d outputs 1200 lumens. But, if you use the ‘measured’ lumens of 1000 from the R4, then that would ring true.

wbss – I’d be interested to hear your thoughts 🙂

the new Maxx-D is quoted at 1285. Don’t know if that is ‘measured’ or not but it is very bright!

It’s interesting that Hope have the two different measures of Lumens, whereas everyone else seems to use just one… The important number to consumers is the one that is comparable to other manufacturers.

Look for their pdf light brochure (available through their site), it explains their approach.

To paraphrase – most figures are BS because they’re theoretical, we measure the actual, which is more honest, but we’ll tell you the “theoretical” figure that most others use as well to avoid knowingly underselling ourselves.

Not Hope’s fault Magicshine et al seem to go for the immediately more impressive theoretical figures on theior kit. People being as they are that’s the figure they’ll probably get compared with.

IIRC a number of other folks who seem to know more about lights (Smudge, Trout et al) than me seem to think actual is a better reflection of a light than theoretical. Statment of the bloody obvious there 😎

Don’t think Hope can really be criticised for quoting both. To be honest hats off to them for a bit of transparency.

Seeing as we have that nice person Chriswilks on here that has the facility to measure the lights we can get an unbiased reading on out the front lumens for our lights so the likes of Luminous / myself as far as I know do use Chris`s services

so say the Liberator it has a theoretical lumen count of 2760 lumens
chris has measured it at 1700 lumens .

the good old Bastid quoted 900 lumens actual 550
those Lux figures in the reviews mean nothing really as a high lux at the centre of the beam could be crap on the edges .

Page 3 of this http://www.hopetech.com/webtop/modules/_repository/documents/HOPE-VISION-Email.pdf.

plus if you use the R4 as a head torch the battery indicator is irrelevant anyway

Thanks for the comments everyone, I think from Domino’s comments she has the older Vision 4, not the R4.

Given that it’s only been out a couple of weeks the comment about the battery lasting well seems to be out of place. This could explain why the Maxx-d her mister has is brighter – which it will be if she has the vision 4.

Thanks for the explanation too, does anyone know what figure Exposure use for their lights? measured or generated? Given both the R4 and the Maxx-d use the same Cree R5s I’d assume they would be pushing out a very similar amount of lumens.

Yes, sorry about that – I hadn’t realised there was a newer version, looks good and I like the new mounting bracket thing on it. By lasting well I meant holds its charge.

Good good, well… I’ve got my R4 now – so I’ll post up a review and some photos of beam shots.

I’ll compare to a Mk2 Maxx-d too.

I do like Hope kit, and as said before the customer service is tremendous – the fact you speak to an engineer when you call through is tip top.

Butt Scratcher?

Heh Heh 😆

I’d say its good. Tiny compared to a vision 4.
Loads of light. New clamp thing is good.
No idea about battery life as I’ve not yet done an all night ride with it yet..

Yep – just picked mine up and seen it’s proper small! the head strap is a good idea too, would make a great headtorch for night running with an endurance battery.

Any photos, night shots or battery life review?

Right then… been out for 2 hours with the light.

First off… it’s bloody awesome. Incredibly bright. Compared next to a Maxx-d on full (970 lumens one), with the Hope on the second brightest setting, it looks like two or three Maxx-ds strapped together.

The beam is very wide, the throw is very long, and there is no hot spot at all.

I haven’t seen the WMTB review, but I’m guessing their issue and why they gave it 3/5 was because of a few things – which all dont bother me.

1) If you put the light on full (1446 lumens) it lasts about a minute before switching to low. But you can put it back on the second brightest setting and it’ll stay there the whole time.

I put this down to that the highest setting is for occasional use, and the unit gets very hot while on this setting. The setting down looks just as bright as the highest too.

2) The mount isn’t adjustable side to side, which may be an issue if you have a very odd sweep on your bars.

3) There is no battery indicator, but as I’m colourblind I dont get any use out of the one on my Exposure lights

4) There’s a separate battery, but the epic version – that gives 4 hours on the second highest setting – is pretty small, and fits easily on a 80mm stem.

5) There’s no fancy soft case 🙁 that would have been really nice.

All in all, its an amazing little light, it’s so much smaller than it ;looks in photos – about the size of the diablo, but about 3cm in depth – think a £2 coin, but 4 of them stacked together.

Anyone who’s thinking of buying one – I wouldn’t hesitate based on the initial ride with it, light is much better than the mk2 Maxx-d I’ve got, and being able to carry an extra battery for me is a bonus.

Beam shots here, these reflect my experience:

http://www.bikeradar.com/gallery/article/tested-30-mountain-bike-lights-28195

Ah – and the battery takes only 3 hours to charge from empty 🙂

Does it realy only last a min on full burn & does it come with a helmet mount included in price ?

It comes with:

– A bar mount
– A helmet mount
– A Head strap (so you can use it as a normal head torch)

Well, it didn’t last very long on full – but take that with a pinch of salt, as to be honest it’s very hard to see any difference between the full setting and the second highest setting. I believe Hope also recommend that the highest setting is only for short bursts anyway, to be used as a boost for when descending very technical ground.

I used the light on the second highest setting all night without any issues at all – and that is about twice as bright as the Maxx-d we had out last night.

Also worth noting is that it was very warm last night, probably warmer than any night this year – and considering most of my night rides are a bit chilly, I’d have thought this would stop the light overheating on full.

Does anyone know what WMTB scored the light down on?

Cheers Buttscratcher, would also like to know why the crap review score !

I’ve gone for the Maxx D MK4, buddy I ride with has the hope R4, my thoughts below:

– Side by side the Maxx D has a wider brighter beam than the R4, fuel gauge is nice as is the all in one design. Very long charge time could be a problem however 3 hour burn time on max may compensate for this.
– the hope unit is tiny and can be head mounted, numerous brightness settings are overkill, no side to side angle adjustment will cause issue for oncoming traffic. Bang for buck probably better value for money

Both are great lights, I paid £260 for my Maxx D Mk4 and would buy again over the R4, although I’m sure my mate would buy the R4 over the Maxx D

Are you sure the beam was wider and brighter on the maxxd? It shouldn’t be… check out the beam shots here

http://www.bikeradar.com/gallery/article/tested-30-mountain-bike-lights-28195

Not saying you’re wrong, but his r4 really should have a considerably wider and brighter beam.

Does he have the brand new 2011 vision r4 OR the older Vision 4?

Yes – absolutely sure the Maxx D seemed brighter and wider, clearly our test wasn’t scientific with measuring equipment etc instead it just involved a country lane and some telegraph poles in the dark.

I don’t doubt the quality of the photos and level of care taken to ensure fairness / accuracy but there is no subsititute for seeing the actual performance with your own eyes ( I know that is stating the obvious)

It is the R4, personally I think both are great lights however as I previously said the lack of left / right adjustment on the bars would deter me from recommending the R4 as I tend to point my light slightly into the verge to avoid blinding on coming traffic (even on the lowest beam setting it dazzles drivers)