Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 40 total)
  • 456 or P7 ?
  • justablur
    Free Member

    I've narrowed my new bike search down to two bikes, the On-One 456 and Orange P7. The bike will get used for general xc stuff, I've also got a singlespeed 29er for fast flat stuff (Thetford) and a 6" full suss for full-on stuff (Wales), so everything between those.

    Anyone owned (or at least ridden) both of these bikes that can give me any opinion one way or the other?

    ScottChegg
    Free Member

    If you are concerned about price, go On One. If you want an off the peg bike the Orange is unbeatable.

    I'd go with what fits you best, or which colour you prefer.

    soobalias
    Free Member

    having not owned or ridden either, i feel im fully qualifies to say

    P7

    I_Ache
    Free Member

    Is this XXXC? If so get the on one if not and it is just xc or even xxc (note the use of the lower case) then get the P7.

    HTH 😛

    piemann
    Free Member

    I've not ridden a 456, but I've got an Inbred and a P7. The P7 wins hands down. It puts such a smile on my face, that I would happily recommend it to anyone who'll listen.

    Get one, I doubt you'll regret it.

    billyboy
    Free Member

    I own two 456's, Ti and steel. I recently got an unexpected pay out from HMG which was enough to buy several spangly new bikes and still have change left over but I didn't bother. Maybe I'm just "biked out" but I think it is more that I'm happy with what I've got…………… still tinker though…. gonna try Carnegie bars in the near future and might change forks again. The front ends on the bigger models do come out low and they are quite long.
    I've never ridden an Orange any distance to give a comparison. I can say I prefer even the steel 456 to my Pace 303 despite the fact that it isn't as much fun as the Pace on the downs.

    takisawa2
    Full Member

    I'd have a P7.

    sax_widby
    Free Member

    p7, no doubt

    Dekerf853
    Full Member

    Genesis Altitude??

    I am in a similar position, and the Altitude is the one I am leaning towards.

    ……….Jim.

    Trekster
    Full Member

    Ragley Blue Pig 😆

    justablur
    Free Member

    The P7 is looking like my favourite at the moment.

    Anyone had any problems with the sliding dropouts?

    MulletusMaximus
    Free Member

    Dekerf853 – Member

    Genesis Altitude love mine.
    R8?

    ScottChegg
    Free Member

    Nope.

    New 2010 model has an extra bolt and it looks rock solid. Just got one myself today. Very nice. I'll be right out on it when it stops raining!

    stevenmenmuir
    Free Member

    Get an on-one and splash out the savings on some better forks/wheels or whatever. Both good bikes, not sure the p7 is worth the difference in price.

    poppa
    Free Member

    What kit have you got to put on it, or are you buying a complete bike? A P7 is going to be higher quality most likely. But more expensive. I wouldn't be surprised if the differenced in ride quality is not 'night and day' though.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Are you going for a whole bike or just the frame? The complete P7s are fine but the frame alone is pisstakingly overpriced, £450 for a nearly 5 and a half pound 631 frame? No thanks. Very expensive stickers obviously.

    The 456 costs 1/3rd as much but actually weighs less, and handles very nicely. An Altitude is almost a pound less and costs £50 less. And then there's the Soul, £470 and 4.2lbs and so much nicer on the trail to boot.

    ratadog
    Full Member

    I'll be right out on it when if it stops raining!

    Rorschach
    Free Member

    17" P7 clocked in at a portly 6.3lbs on the workshop scales of ultimate justice!!!

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Really? My word. The stickers are heavy as well as expensive 🙂

    TODDYBIGWEDNESDAY
    Free Member

    My mate had his 456 stolen and the insurance replaced it with a p7. He reckons the 456 was much better. i and two of my mates are riding 456 as winter bikes and we love them :D.

    Rorschach
    Free Member

    Filing cabinets AND scaffold pole ;0)

    PhilO
    Free Member

    I own both… The P7 is set up as a singlespeed for commuting and winter evenings (when I can't be a***ed to clean the bike afterwards) and the 456 is fully-geared up. Both running 120mm Marzocchi forks.

    Personally, I'd go for the 456, even if they were identically priced. That's primarily because the P7 has a low BB and I get irritated by frequent pedal-strike. If that that doesn't bother you, then you may prefer the Orange, of course. 🙂

    mccann.ben
    Free Member

    Having riden both I find the P7 does clang the pedals once or twice but you get used to it. The key is that the lower BB offers more stability when it gets sketchy. Better reach on the P7 too.
    No probs with the sliding BB.
    The Hope hubs are better on the P7 and you can upgrade different bits if you want like forks ( I upgraded to TALAS for unltimate climbeing versatility ) and finishing kit. (Thomson, Gobi and Monkey bars) Check thier website.
    Would defo ride both if you have a friend with a 456.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Yeah, but to get all that you need to start from the Pro at £1500, which would buy you a hell of a lot of 456.

    Frinstance, if you go right through the 456 frameset option, you end up at £900 but you need wheels, mechs and shifters. And I guess cables. But all that with the Thor 140 maxle is £915, so you could throw on a set of blingy wheels like Traversees and still just be at about the same price as a completely standard Pro.

    genesis
    Free Member

    P7, despite the weight they've picked up having to go through CEN testing they are still a superb trail bike.

    br1zz
    Free Member

    I recently got a P7 (S).

    Hated it at first, brakes constantly binding with a piston in each caliper siezed and the system full of air; v. annoying slipping seatpost; headset rusted up solid after a couple of wet rides…

    Happily I have sorted each of the above (spent another £60 in the process – on a brand new bike !), and now I can honestly say I would not change it for anything else.

    Fantastic grip and handling on singletrack – it can just keep going quicker until you can't pedal any faster – it never seems to reach a speed where it feels ready to let go.

    Loads of scope for adjustment to the ride position with the u-turn forks and the lock-out is a god-send for tarmac to/from trails. Sliding drop-outs are rock-solid so far. I have to agree with the BB being slightly low, I have clipped the odd pedal here and there, but I guess that's also a big part of the whole grip and handling thing.

    A great all-round bike which is exactly what I wanted, but if you have other rides available, ultimately the weight might be a big negative for dedicated xc use. You don't feel it when you're on it, but it is incredibly heavy, and the laws of physics imply that you are dragging all that weight around everywhere you ride.

    Nice colour though !

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Nah, sorry but CEN's a poor excuse, the Ragley Blue Pig is CEN tested too and weighs well under 6lbs, and is much cheaper (and rated for a lot more fork to boot, which means it has to be stronger) . I've no idea if the 456s are yet, but the Soul is, and though it's a little more expensive it's only 2/3ds the weight. Likewise the BFe for that matter, though it's only a little lighter it's stronger and it's a chunk cheaper.

    Sure, it's a great trailbike but there's no shortage of those.

    brant
    Free Member

    17" P7 clocked in at a portly 6.3lbs on the workshop scales of ultimate justice!!!

    Is that the current, new one, made in 631?

    ampthill
    Full Member

    Interesting thread as both are options for my next bike

    when I get a moment I'll see if you can build a 456 frame up for less than a p7s. It seems to me that self builds always work out pricey

    Mackem
    Full Member

    Never ridden a 456 – I have a P7 – I dont notice the weight when riding, it's as adjustable as a very adjustable thing, it's just a damn good, solid, do anything you want bike.

    s8tannorm
    Free Member

    Are PA's out of favour at present? I love mine, gets used all the time for training and guiding duties and I can't fault it. Also have a 456 but haven't done much riding on it yet so can't say too much.

    The Orange does look quite expensive when you consider what you could build a nice 456 for IMHO.

    Scienceofficer
    Free Member

    I've got a 456 and its been used in geared and currently SS guise. Its a very versatile frame with sorted geometry. Its ranged from 30lbs to its current 25lbs. It may not be the best of type in the market, but its not very far behind at all and is very much cheaper.

    My wife has a lovely 2000 P7, but that's a very different animal from the current P7.

    As far as I can see they're both aimed at the same place in the market, but one is ridiculously overpriced.

    As has been pointed out, the 456 is lighter, cheaper and can take a longer fork. With the extra money in the pot you'll get a much nicer build.

    Whilst its nice to have the cachet of the orange brand, you'd get a much better overall build if you got the 456 and took advantage of the frame build deals on the on-one website.

    mwleeds
    Full Member

    P7, despite the weight they've picked up having to go through CEN testing they are still a superb trail bike.

    Glad they've made it stronger I broke an 07 frame a couple of months ago, folded the top and down tubes close to head tube. I think a few have died this way.

    Are PA's out of favour at present?

    I would suggest thats it's just because they're out of stock (of 18" frames anyway). But then so are the other bikes on my short list (new soul and blue pig)

    brant
    Free Member

    We have some blue pigs just in finishing right now, ready for airfreighting (ouch $$$). We're sucking up the cost on this one, just to keep things rolling.

    YoungDaveriley
    Free Member

    I've got a P7 and I'm very happy with it,but how do Orange and Cotic justify the price of Taiwanese,steel hard tail frames??
    The only problem I've had with my P7 .is the seat post slipping,despite it being a 2010 model and not requiring a shim.

    ampthill
    Full Member

    I think the simple answer to the high price of the P7 is that Orange really want to sell bikes not frames. However there is demand to buy a frame only so they sell them a a premuim. If they were banging them out cheap then they would be loosing out on component choices. They also sell Orange stuff in shops who take roughly 1/3 of what you pay

    As for Cotic it harder to say. I suspect volumes are small so costs of trips and CN testing are shared by less company. I also think that an 853 badge doesn't denote a frame quality, its a tube quality. Cotic may feel that they are charging you for things like a wider range of colours consistent alignment/quality. Cotic also run a full demo programme. I don't think that Cotic prices are outrages

    Als,o having just seen that frames are only 5% of ON-Ones business I suspect that they are a lost leader, mainly serving as a marketing tool to direct traffic to on online omponent store. That isn't meant to be cynical. Its a compay set up to make money its upto them how they do it

    igm
    Full Member

    Wonder how much the carbon 456 will be? Given the road frames are £399, around £450-500 maybe? Might be an interesting choice. I've got a steel 456 frame and gears hung on the wall at the moment (due to a slot drop out getting built up last year) – brilliant ride, it actually replaced a late 90s P7, but that was a different bike really. There's no way I'm getting shot 'cos it will be built up again – unless that carbon 456 drills a hole in my wallet.

    cullen-bay
    Free Member

    I've tried a firends Altitude, and its an amazing frame, seriously beautiful piece of metal that rides very nicely indeed.

    when I come to sell off my current bikes I will probably replace one of them with an altitude.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Young Dave Riley wrote, "I've got a P7 and I'm very happy with it,but how do Orange and Cotic justify the price of Taiwanese,steel hard tail frames??"

    Cotic, well, you're getting an 853 frame which pushes the cost up a lot, first class finish, and a very well made frame, so there's some justification. It's more expensive than an Altitude 853 but then again, the Altitude's finish isn't as good, and has a slightly simpler and so easier to make design. (and IMO, doesn't ride as well but that's personal taste) So, sure, they're expensive but it's not just a daft price.

    The P7, like I say, is just too expensive. But it's still good.

    fwokinfwok
    Free Member

    Shops wanting their 40% margin won't help the price

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