20" kids bikes - any good ones or good 'projects'? - Singletrack World Magazine August 7, 2017

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This topic has 58 replies, 26 voices, and was last updated 6 years ago by gwurk.

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20" kids bikes – any good ones or good 'projects'?
scotia
Free Member

standard ones seem to weigh about 10-11kg??

thought to buy a 2nd hand one and upgrade it but cant find 20″ rigid forks with 1 1/8 steerer..

Posted 6 years ago

ads678
Full Member

Carbon cycles used to do 20″ carbon forks.

These: http://www.carboncycles.cc/index.php?p=587&

Orbea mx 20 is a good bike, my kids loved theirs.

Posted 6 years ago

scotia
Free Member

ok thanks.
hes got an early rider 16 which he loves but he needs gears to do the forest rides and not die!

Posted 6 years ago

FGF 701 The Hydrate Or Die Edition

monkeychild
Free Member

Not exactly boutique but the Carrera Blast is a great 20″ bike. My 6 year old lad loves his.

Posted 6 years ago

scotia
Free Member

i’ll have to see whats available here in switzerland.. wasnt going to go boutique but 10-11kgs is taking the mickey..

Posted 6 years ago

nicolaisam
Free Member

Orbea do really nice kids bikes.

https://www.orbea.com/gb-en/bicycles/kids/mx-kids

Posted 6 years ago

Speeder
Full Member

You can buy a Frog fork for about £30-35 – just ask your local dealer to get you one. They’re nicely made, very light and available in any colour Frog do.

I got a Frog 60 MTB cheap off eBay but it came with a steel suspension fork that nearly weighed as much as the rest of the bike so that’s gone in the bin (well in the loft) and the nice rigid fork has gone on with a set of decent Maxxis Maxx Daddys and a very short stem. Now suits him pretty well and is a much better bike. Just a shame about the gripshift & freewheel but they’ll get replaced in time.

Orbea MX20 does look the best on paper – much better specced, better looking and far cheaper than an Islabike though the residuals* are probably not quite as good.

*How much of a middle class T*** does that make me sound?! 😳

Posted 6 years ago

nicolaisam
Free Member

The other thing i liked with the Orbea was the trigger shifter, rather than a crappy twistgrip that no kid can use..

Posted 6 years ago

daern
Free Member

Orbea MX20 does look the best on paper – much better specced, better looking and far cheaper than an Islabike though the residuals* are probably not quite as good.

*How much of a middle class T*** does that make me sound?!
Meh. Kids bikes are not bought like an adult bike – they are bought in the full knowledge that in a couple of years, they will be sold again. As a result, residuals matter.

One good thing about this is that kids bikes depreciate really heavily (** Islabikes excluded) so if you can pick up a s/h off-brand bike, you’ll certainly be quids in and can throw a few quid at a few choice (and probably weight-saving) upgrades.

If you do choose to buy a used Islabike, I’ve tended to look for the ones that need a bit of work – they’re surprisingly cheap to get parts for and you can nearly always turn that tired looking example from Facebook into a mint, perfect bike with a very modest expenditure. And of course, when you sell it on, you’ll be asking top dollar (quite fairly) for a really good, refurbished model. I reckon there’s a few quid to be made here on Islabike resale!

Even things like the updated saddle (which always marks the older bikes from the newer ones) are only £15 from Islabikes. (Well worth the investment too as they are much comfier!) In fact, my son’s running one on his entirely non-Islabike as it’s cheap, reasonably light and perfectly sized for him.

Posted 6 years ago

daern
Free Member

The other thing i liked with the Orbea was the trigger shifter, rather than a crappy twistgrip that no kid can use..

Absolutely. Frog use them too. In fact, only Islabikes remain stubbornly attached to these god-awful 90s throwbacks :-/

Posted 6 years ago

poah
Free Member

nicolaisam – Member

The other thing i liked with the Orbea was the trigger shifter, rather than a crappy twistgrip that no kid can use..

not used a recent one then, my wee boy had no issue using the grip shift on his riprock 20.

Posted 6 years ago

nicolaisam
Free Member

poah – Member

nicolaisam – Member

not used a recent one then, my wee boy had no issue using the grip shift on his riprock 20.

More than most people to be honest

Posted 6 years ago

scotia
Free Member

found that trek do a superfly 20… 8kg..

cant find a frame/fork that i can then build up.. crazy

Posted 6 years ago

akira
Full Member

Hoy bonaly with upgrades is pretty light and capable.

Posted 6 years ago

mattsccm
Free Member

There’s a alloy Saracen frame and seat post with disc mounts plus a pair of rim brake wheels in my garage. No forks. Maybe other bits. 20 quid plus however they get to you?

Posted 6 years ago

Goldigger
Free Member

Commencal Ramones 20 €329 9.9kg

Theres a disc version for a shocking €649
Does look nice though

Posted 6 years ago

dirkpitt74
Full Member

My 6yo Daughter has no issues with the grip shift on her Carrera Luna – it’s a decent SRAM one.

Only issue is the 7sp freewheel – but changing it to a wide range one helps slightly with the steeper stuff.

Posted 6 years ago

Speeder
Full Member

Goldigger – Member
Theres a disc version for a shocking €649
Does look nice though

The Commencal Meta is lovely and the geo is much the best that I’ve found so far (no 15″ rear end like an Isla) and certainly the looks most like a bike I’d like to ride myself. The price isn’t that outrageous when you cost it out especially when the qty of material is the only thing separating it from an adult bike ie the labour time is the same no matter what size the bike is and these are built in much smaller qtys so the scale is against you. Do you think you could build that for approx £150-200? Commencal will need to to make any profit.

Anyway, how cool does this look?

Posted 6 years ago

garryfmacdonald
Free Member

I’ve just got my son a BMC 20inch bike. Frame is great and everything on it is quality. It has a sealed shimano bottom bracket. BMC being Swiss you should be bike to find one around.

Posted 6 years ago

Bream
Free Member

looking for new 20″ wheel bike options for my daugther at the mo.
Must admist the Canyon Offspring 20 looks really nice, but it comes with a heavy price tag 😯

Posted 6 years ago

sssimon
Free Member

We went with a singlespeed ramones 20 about 2 1/2 years ago, it’s been jumped, skidded and dropped, raced, raked and generally abused, but loved more than any other bike. Loved so much we are building a 24!

Don’t think he ever got this kids style though

Posted 6 years ago

Goldigger
Free Member

Any decent light 20inch wheels that will take a 10spd cassette?

Posted 6 years ago

BearBack
Free Member

I had to build a wheelset to get something light.
240 hubs, alienation deviant rims. 1.5mm spokes, ghetto tubeless set up on schwalbe Moe joes.

Posted 6 years ago

stevextc
Free Member

The price isn’t that outrageous when you cost it out especially when the qty of material is the only thing separating it from an adult bike

The difference is I wouldn’t put that kit on it…. (if buying separately)

However the whole weight price thing is what it is…. the frame isn’t where the weight comes from (it’s just not big enough to make a real difference) but most the rest of the stuff is the same as an adult (and the bits that aren’t like rims are only marginal on the weight saving)

By that I mean a M6x50 is what it is…. etc. (unless you go exotic)… and a rear mech or shifter weighs the same regardless of the bike…. I had a similar discussion on forks for the RST F1rst and why is it so heavy at 1670g… (other than the 120g of canto mounts) … the answer is the steerer weighs the same, the drop outs etc. and really the parts that are actually smaller don’t weigh much anyway….

Sure a SID WC is lighter (and the 1″ difference from 24/26)…. but then its £1000 vs £150 … even a new standard SID CSU is twice the price… and 90% of the weight

Commencal do really well offering frame only… (at least on the 24.).. and its amazingly cheap but if I was buying a 20 today I’d probably get the Orbea as a made up bike… or the Commencal frame only

Posted 6 years ago

sssimon
Free Member

Have to agree on the kids v adults weighweenie game, there are very few kid specific products out there so other than the frame being a few grams lighter due to shorter tubes (but al the main sub assemblies being the same) and the rims and tyres saving a bit due to the smaller circumference there’s not a lot else to skimp on without spending crazy money.

The Orbea, Commencal and Hoy full builds are such a step away from the heavy brutes that we see so often, It’s not a bad old time to be a kid with a bike savvy parent.

Posted 6 years ago

shindiggy
Free Member

Hoy bonnaly 20inch, comes in at 8.8kg. Just bought one for my youngest after being impressed with my eldest’s Hoy 24inch.

Posted 6 years ago

jameswilliams54
Free Member

Saracen mantra looks like a good sorted kids bike also

Posted 6 years ago

Goldigger
Free Member

Looks like you could just swap the 20″ wheels for 24″ on the Kona Shred 20, when the time is right…?

Posted 6 years ago

kimbers
Full Member

My 6 year old is loving his Hoy bonally.

Posted 6 years ago

yossarian
Free Member

ebay all the way.

Picked up a genesis caribou jnr a while ago for £185. Upgraded the stem and bars for peanuts (25.4 thomson & Easton carbon monkeylites). Weighs a shade over 23lb and goes up or down anything. 2.4″ creepy crawlers at 6psi are draggy for sure but it’s his go to bike unless he’s bmx racing.

Posted 6 years ago

sssimon
Free Member

Looks like you could just swap the 20″ wheels for 24″ on the Kona Shred 20, when the time is right…?

Two totally different frames? No way the 20’will take 24 inch wheels

Posted 6 years ago

Goldigger
Free Member

Two totally different frames? No way the 20’will take 24 inch wheels

Look at the difference in space in the rear triangle and how far the tyre is from the top of the bridge on the fork..
The 20″ looks like it has the same spacing between the front and rear axles.
I might have to investigate, if I can just buy some 24″ wheels (longer crank) in 18 months rather than another bike…

Posted 6 years ago

stevextc
Free Member

Look at the difference in space in the rear triangle and how far the tyre is from the top of the bridge on the fork..

It looks that way from the side but if you look from the top I can almost guarantee there will be the cross piece stopping you….

Even if you could then what does that say for the bike geometry ???

My kids XC Cannondale 24 had the same chain stay length as my T-130 …. (to the mm)
It looks like you should be able to fit a bigger wheel… but you can’t… its all blocked…
It’s JUST possible to fit a very very skinny 26 road/indoor tyre on the back to stick it on the turbo trainer…. but tolerances are so close you couldn’t ride it except perhaps on the trainer… however from the side view there would seem to be the possibility of sticking a 27.5 with a 2.4 tyre on….

20-24 vs 24-26 …. its 4″ vs 2″ (and a bigger difference as a ratio) and 2″ is huge …

Posted 6 years ago

sssimon
Free Member

Your child out grows the frame not the wheels

Posted 6 years ago

Rich_s
Full Member

It looks that way from the side but if you look from the top I can almost guarantee there will be the cross piece stopping you….

Just cut it out…

Posted 6 years ago

stevextc
Free Member

But WHY would you want to keep the frame ????
Commencal sell the 24″ frame for 99 Euro’s

Out of the supplied what would you POSSIBLY want to keep…. the bike is specced with trash… not even worth putting in the spares bin or trying to sell. (You can’t really sell something that costs as much to ship as buy new which applies to the tourney stuff… )

Weirdly the only part you’d possibly want to keep are the cranks which are sized for a 24er… ….

They are all £5-6 for shifters, mechs etc. so its not a great expense so much as ruins the ride… they are pretty much made of plastic and mild steel… and according to shimano not made for off road use but simply to look like MTB kit… (at least they are honest)

The Spinner Grind …I can’t really say…. we just stuck rigid for the 9 months Jnr was stuck on a 20er….
You can buy a SLX group set pretty cheap and sell the cranks as new… but I honestly think by the time they fit onto a 24er you will be really pleased to get rid of the 20!
(For us the time from just fitting a 20 with the saddle slammed to just fitting a 24 with the saddle slammed was 9 months) Yep I know a lot happens in 9 months … that’s how we get the little buggers…

Buy a USED 20…. use it and sell it when you can move up……

Specifically Kona, they are not known for making light kids frames… the Stinky is a tank… and by all accounts a great DH rig and I never heard of one being damaged… but it can’t even be pedalled on the flat… as its incredibly heavy…. (but then its a DH bike)

Frame and Forks
Frame: Kona 6061 Aluminium Butted
Fork: Spinner Grind 1 Coil Spring 65mm
Rear Shock: N/A

Drivetrain
Front Derailleur: N/A
Rear Derailleur: Shimano Tourney 6-speed
Cassette: Shimano Tourney 14-28T 6-speed
Chain: KMC Z50
Crankset: FSA Alloy 140mm arms
Bottom Bracket: CH-52 Square Taper

Braking/Shifting
Shifters: Shimano Revoshift 1×6-speed
Brakes: Tektro Novela Mechanical Disc (F+R) 160mm Rotors
Brake Levers: Tektro Novela Alloy

Wheels
Rims: 20” Alloy Double Walled, CNC Brake Surface
Hubs: KT Alloy, 10x135mm (R) / 10x100mm (F)
Spokes: Steel
Tyres: Schwalbe Little Joe 20×1.4” (F+R)

Finishing Kit
Handlebar: Kona OB Alloy
Headset: FSA Press-in
Grips: Kona DJ, Jr.
Stem: Kona OB Alloy
Seatpost: Kona Alloy 31.8mm
Saddle: Kona DJ
Pedals: Nylon Platform

Posted 6 years ago

Goldigger
Free Member

I’ve already shown my oldest the Ramones 20, to which he commented.. “it’s the same as mine, ohhh it’s got suspension”.
He has the Ramones 16.

That’s the one he will get (20), it will pass down to our youngest when he’s old enough along with both his balance bikes and the 16.

Posted 6 years ago

sssimon
Free Member

That’s how it worked here, showed him the 24 and he thought brilliant its a big version of what I’ve already got and love, the joy of him ready Chris Hoy flying Fergus books is he knows about disc brakes and nice tyres so that’s on the list too!

Posted 6 years ago

Goldigger
Free Member

Commencal have some 2018 bikes up on their site now.
RAMONES 20+ SHINY RED 2018

Might go for this new model, doesn’t have the crap suntour suspension forks, but the 2.6 tyres should overcome that..

Posted 6 years ago

TiRed
Full Member

Used Trek MT60. Fabulous bike, very adjustable with twin crank drilling. First alloy children’s bike. I’ve bought about half a dozen now for family and friends.

Ours was handed down twice before being sold and sold again!

Posted 6 years ago