Hardly streamlined is it.

No but when you’re riding hundreds or thousands of miles in all weathers it all helps.

Is that not massively top-heavy?

In some circumstances yes, mainly when you’re static. Once you’re rolling it’s that example of the ease of balancing a pencil on your fingertips vs a longer pole, it can feel fine for road and easier off-road riding and it’s fine on more technical ground if you have a bit of flow. Ideal? Probably not but it’s workable.

I dont think theres anything ‘aero’ about a bike getting used for bikepacking be that panniers or whatever. Hardly streamlined is it.
And then theres the rider themselves. Hardly tucked in are we. broad chest, lid etc.

There’s more or less aero for the same load and rider though. Touring av speeds may be low but that point about wind speed over the bike is key, plus you’re often out for long days, a few days at a time so any advantages add up. I don’t think it’s worth getting triathlete about it all though.

FWIW the idea that Ian and Beth of Wildcat, Scott at Porcelain Rocket or Eric at Revelate Designs were all part of some master marketing strategy on the part of the “bike industry” is frankly hilarious.

They are good for putting some shopping in and general utility duties.

FWIW the idea that Ian and Beth of Wildcat, Scott at Porcelain Rocket or Eric at Revelate Designs were all part of some master marketing strategy on the part of the “bike industry” is frankly hilarious.

Yet now every bike can be a bikepacking bike, and specialist touring bikes have disappeared from most brand’s ranges.. Makes you think eh?

Is that not massively top-heavy?

I have a truly enormous Carradice saddle bag.

Even fully loaded with sandbags, it weighs peanuts compared to my fat arse.

Wind from the rear actually helps, so from the front the same blocking effect applies.

The wind in this country is rarely blowing harder than most peoples average speeds, and then the very small likelihood that it’s actually a proper tailwind.

But even that’s not the whole story. Drag is proportional to the wind velocity squared, so in an idealized out and back scenario it is far worse to ride out at 10mph into a 10mph headwind and then coast back at 10mph than it is to do a 10mph ride on a calm day. Or in reality if you maintained a constant power output you lose a lot more time on the headwind leg than you gain back on the tailwind.

Thanks for the replies. Really interesting.

Is that not massively top-heavy? I’ve never bikepacked so I’ve no idea, but it looks like the handling would be terrible. Do you have to be savvy about putting the heavy stuff into the frame bag?

TINAS put it very well, also the bags themselves aren’t a huge amount heavier than bar roll and seat harness, plus dry bags so the weight is basically in the same place. On the dirt and gravel roads I tend to do most of my touring on, the stability is great, and it still works ok on single-track (up to a point)

@supernova Yes, it’s a Lomo 15L tail bag, I modified the straps so it fastens to the upper and lower parts of a Jones loop bar. Really stable and actually weighs less than my bikepacking bar harness + dry bag!

Annoyed ny photos didn’t work

The same rack in 1994 and last week

[url=https://flic.kr/p/7mYw4V]america0024.jpg[/url] by John Clinch, on Flickr

[url=https://flic.kr/p/2oyJJiB]Untitled[/url] by John Clinch, on Flickr

If you want to tour round the world with a £30 synthetic 4 season sleeping bag, tent, stove, real clothes and a clean set or three, eating proper food and drinking proper wine. Then panniers are absolutely the best option.

A trailer is the best option for comfy camping.  Couple of kilos extra weight.  Much more aero and better handling  IMO IME

Yes, it’s a Lomo 15L tail bag, I modified the straps so it fastens to the upper and lower parts of a Jones loop bar. Really stable and actually weighs less than my bikepacking bar harness + dry bag!

Hi @Steezysix don’t suppose you have got any closeup pics showing what you have done? just looking at options for my loop bars (2.5rise)

Bikepacking bags don’t have to be expensive. I bought 2 Alpkit drybags in 2012 for about £20 combined that I still use now.

Got to hand it to those clever marketing folks though, getting me to part with all that money before they had even started marketing them 😆

I bought 2 Alpkit drybags in 2012 for about £20 combined that I still use now.

Got to hand it to those clever marketing folks though, getting me to part with all that money before they had even started marketing them 😆

Alpkit’s first bikepacking bag, made of old Gourdon rucksacks. I’d had it a year or so and was the second owner of the bag, it’s now with its third.

by james*o, on Flickr

Yeah, I don’t think the original Alpkit drybags I bought were intended for bikepacking, just a general purpose waterproof bag.

There used to be a thread on here called ‘sick as a dog so show me your bivvy ideas’ (or something like that) where people posted all the ideas/setups they’d cobbled together. It was great.

Edit: TJ will be along in a moment to tell you that trailers are the best option. Try not to laugh when he does.

Scotroutes wins the game of TJ bingo.

I’ve got a trailer too, it’s another great option, especially being able to unclip it and just leave it while you go for a ride, although it does introduce some handling wierdness. I really want to get my hands on a non-generic one like the topeak or a genuine BoB to see if it’s just my EBC copy that’s lost something in translation or the move to big wheels.

A trailer is the best option for comfy camping. Couple of kilos extra weight.

Ooh. What trailer weighs a couple of kilos?

Ooh. What trailer weighs a couple of kilos?

I assume he means over and above panniers and a rack since that was what he was responding to.

Correct Squrrelking

I weighed mine.  Depends on which set of panniers  but its in that region

Tinas.  The bob is better than the ebc copy i had.  Less slop in it.

I said horses for courses.

Fun fact: you’re more aero with a seatpack than without

But all the cool kids are using baskets now 😉
https://bikepacking.com/tag/basketpacking/

We did a short hostel trip at the weekend so used what was easy and took minimal packing faff. Big panniers on my bike as they’re easy for things in and out, jackets, etc, small panniers on wifes bike, front roll on eldest’s bike and the youngest put a box of coco pops and small rucksack with waterproof and all important chocolate mice in her basket. A longer trip would have been better packed and more planned but run what you brung works too.

@rootes1 I don’t, but I will try to take some and pm them to you!

Problem with trailers TJ is that if there’s two of you you cannot draft each other, they also work best on gentle off road, if you need to get off and push they are a nightmare. I still use mine when heading off with my boy so I can carry the most weight.

steezysix
Free Member

@rootes1 I don’t, but I will try to take some and pm them to you!

Me too please!

AA – I never said use them for gnarly offroad – tho I have done so.  I said for comfy touring.  I find it easier to push than a similar weight in panniers due to the better balance

I only use it when the weight is above 7 or 8 kg of kit.  Otherwise its bike packing bags

In some ways better on singletrack than panniers – less weight on the wheel and better handling

I did ride down this for example.  I wouldn’t have done with the same weight in panniers probably.  As ever the photo flattens it – it was steep and the drops were up to a foot high

[url=https://poemsonly.com/category/friendship]sad friend poems that make you cry[/url]

but again – horses for courses.  superlight camping  singletrack riding  – bike packing bag

comfy touring without much singletrack – trailer

Lots of urban riding or using trains – panniers

the trailer is NOT an alternative to bikepacking bags – its a different purpose

Every setup has advantages and disadvantages

I can see that bike packing bikes can be aero. Until you start strapping things to your forks. Strapping a 2 litre bag to each fork leg must surely be the worst storage capacity to drag ratio of any option

IANABP. Just a commuter. I don’t like panniers. Too much additional weight over rear wheel causes balance issues for any type of more excitable riding and how the bike then behaves feels horrible. I need at least part of my commute home to be fun.

On my commuter hybrid I use a bike packing dry bag on a rear rack to transport clothing, and frame bag for lunch pump keys etc. Works for me.

Cycling about does a good video on the aero dynamics of bike packing bags and panniers.

But having just done the badger divide I was either going 5 mph up hill, 12mph on the flat or 30mph downhill and very little in between.

The standard default answer to “what panniers” is always ortlieb but I think the rear classics weigh 950g each but I’d still take mine for road touring but wouldn’t want to ruin them off roading.

I’ve been using frane bags, saddle bags, bar bags for bike packing for around ten years, I even make my own gear or modify gear.

This last trip used an omm rear rack and Robert axle on my scandal. I strapped alpkit dry bags to it. So almost a hybrid approach. I’d have lost all my panniers coming down some of those descents at those speeds

***Pros***

The bike doesn’t sway with the weight

I can fit more gear on the bike

No rucksack

I took a dropper for the first time

Its easier to get to your gear

***Cons***

It weighs more

I can fit more gear on the bike

The bags are closer to the wheel and get wet

The bags do wear holes in them from friction.

Its harder to push as the side pannier is in the way.

The shape varies as you use your supplies.

Overall I liked it, made me consider spending more money on a tailfin. I need to repair the bags and improve the design and add a mudguard.

Hybrid rack/bags on the left versus standard saddle bag on the right

AA – I never said use them for gnarly offroad – tho I have done so. I said for comfy touring.

I wasn’t trying to suggest you did, just adding my perspective

I find it easier to push than a similar weight in panniers due to the better balance

You may be right, never used a full pannier set up.
The trailer was get 20 years ago when my kit wouldn’t have fitted in bikepacking bags even if they had existed.

<<@rootes1 I don’t, but I will try to take some and pm them to you!>>

ta much appreciated

I use small Ortlieb panniers and a frame bag for ‘bikepacking’ and it works fine for me. I have ridden all kinds of singletrack and stuff with panniers. I like them because they are quicker to pack, easy to fit and take off the bike, don’t leave you with a massive swaying thing sticking out the back of your bike, allow you space for extra food after a resupply, help avoid a massive load on the handlebars, and so on. With a few extra straps around them they don’t rattle. A Tubus rack is bombproof and won’t break under normal off road conditions. I often ride with people with a more purist bikepacking setup but can’t see any disadvantages to my arrangement.

@rootes and @supernova – doesn’t seem possible to send images through the pm system, so I thought I’d post them here, other people may find it useful too. Hopefully it works…

Not much required to make the bag work with the bars, just some 20mm g-hooks, a couple of lengths of webbing and a couple of ratchet hooks. These I got from a pair of old ski boots, but boating/auto shops might have something similar.

Hopefully the pics are self explanatory, the four straps on the side of the bag clip around the loop section. The thick webbing strap goes over the bag and through the top of the loop to lift it off the front wheel (this one does most of the weight bearing). The thinner webbing goes underneath and around the fork crown to stop the bag bouncing too much.

I’m pretty happy with the result, it’s pretty light, fully waterproof and simple to attach/remove. It’s worth putting some frame protection tape on the bike headtube as it can rub the paint!

Cheers!

Watching this with interest as there’s a bit of a bike ride coming up in June!

As for drafting with both bikes pulling trailers I’ll get back to you 😉

I’m currently shopping for carrying equipment and there’s not much in it cost wise for panniers (Ortlieb), rack (Tubus) and bar bag (Restrap) compared to BOB style single wheel trailer.