Should Theresa May resign?

Mike if it’s not May it will be more pro Leave Brexiteer. That’s the reality, Remainers here wanting her gone need to be careful what they are wishing for. That’s been pointed out by Binners and others earlier in this thread.

True but with a spirited defence like that does she hold any power or authority any more? Leadership challenge etc has a fair chance of ending this minority government then we the real fight begins.

Corbyn wanted to trigger A50 on June 24th, 2016.

Good for him. As he’s not in power, nor is he the subject of this thread, I’d suggest that’s an irrelevant fact (and I use the term in the Trump sense of the word), even by your standards.

Interested that the argument above (that TM should simply have lied) gets such positive responses. Says a lot.

Who gave a positive response to that particular facet?

What happened to the days when politicians had the good grace to resign? They all seem to brass it out as long as possible, even when their position is untenable. She looks like a trapped ghost.

How long can May go on repeating variations of the same sentence. What next appearances in Greggs, Strictly or a royal family style docu-soap (at home with Mrs May, walking the dogs that kind of thing) to appeal to your average British pleb with an attention span measured in picoseconds. TBH she’s doing more of an Obama hide and seek, stage managed appearances kept to a bare minimum.

Lets have a proper Tory **** in charge, one that will really show their teeth 😈

Corbyn wanted to trigger A50 on June 24th, 2016. I think you’d find we’d be in a trickier place now had he done so certainly if you are a Soft Brexiteer / Remainer

Keir Starmer. That is all.

Maybot is flying out to Brussels to try and urge on the talks.

I can only assume that she’s hoping that she will be pitied enough that the EU will give her a break.

An interesting technique for a PM, still could be worse, can you imagine what they’d say to Johnson, or Mogg, or Give, or Leadsome…..

It’s almost like they don’t really want to do it and are just continuing with the pretense because they’re more scared of the fall out from disappointing the Brexiteers than the Remainers

Andrew Rawnsley sums up her pathetic weakness and the damage its doing in Yesterdays Observer and hits the nail on the head, as usual

Who is to blame for this stalemate? The answer you get depends on where you put the question. From EU capitals, you hear the understandable contention that it is extremely hard to negotiate with Britain when its riven government hasn’t finished negotiating with itself. It doesn’t help that Mrs May is desperately weak. Recent events have compounded the impression that she is a lame duck, one crisis away from having the last crutch kicked from under her.

Key European players ask why they should spend any of their political capital trying to progress the negotiations when they can’t be confident that Mrs May will still be sitting on the other side of the table come Christmas.

I find myself in the weird position of wanting her to stay. Because the next PM will be chosen by the doddering, senile, backward-gazing, Mail reading racists that constitute the Tory Party membership. So who gets anointed by that shower of ****s doesn’t bear thinking about

We know who the obvious options are – though I can’t help thinking that it would end up being somebody we don’t expect.

She’s a bit like Donny though – she might be incompetent, but she’s ineffective and incompetent unlike some of the alternatives.

Actually a bigger problem is the lack of reasonable candidates. Remember last time the MPs whittled themselves down to a single candidate, no need for a members vote.

Maybot is flying out to Brussels to try and urge on the talks.

It’s all a bit odd this negotiating stuff I thought you just hired a hall somewhere abroad and made a speech.

Perhaps she should have been like there.

I don’t believe Mrs T would have arsed about like this bunch(nope she’s not my hero)

It’s all a bit odd this negotiating stuff I thought you just hired a hall somewhere abroad and made a speech.

No, no no! You turn up, bit of chit chat, have some photos taken with you grinning like a simpleton, then simply hop on the plane back home. Sorted!

The brilliant bit about that is there’s no need to encumber yourself with any notes or other documents. Maybe just a little black book for your PA to keep track of your assignations.

Maybe just a little black book for your PA to keep track of your assignations.

Who is leaning back hoping not to be noticed?

He’s got the grin of a man who thinks he’s getting away with it.

We’ve all been in meeting with him, he tries to bluster around the content and at the end does a ‘summary’ and then walks away with no intention to do anything until the next meeting.

And no-one’s fooled in the slightest.

So May makes a phonecall to Merkel

and the next day her allies start briefing against Johnson

has May suddenly learnt how to play the game or do we think merkel threw her a bone out of pity?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-talks-theresa-may-boris-johnson-angela-merkel-eu-germany-michael-fuchs-cdu-a8004366.html

has May suddenly learnt how to play the game or do we think merkel threw her a bone out of pity?

or kicking Borris into a now or never move.

It would be interesting to actually find out how many diehard cliff-edge Brexiteer tory MPs there are compared to moderates like Hammond. I suspect this is the real reason Boris has bottled the last two opportunities to make his move.

Boris Johnson is universally loathed throughout the corridors of power in Europe. This goes back to his time as a journalist (prior to being sacked for making stuff up) where he would spend his time making up anti-EU stories about bendy/non-bendy bananas, and other such crap.

European leaders were incredulous that she appointed him foreign secretary. As were the rest of us.

She should have sacked him weeks ago. She’s going to end up having to at some point, where he will go on to pursue his chosen role as Brexit Martyr fighting for freedom from EU Dictatorship/Scheming self-absorbed, narcissistic Lying POS (delete as applicable)

He’s no chance of the leadership now though, under the existing rules. He has to get through the MPs before he can get to the vote by the senile old racists of the Tory membership, who love him. And if he had a sniff of that before (unlikely), its completely gone after his antics of the last few weeks

Interested that the argument above (that TM should simply have lied) gets such positive responses. Says a lot.

that’s not what anyone said though, is it? what was said was ‘she can’t even lie’, not ‘she should have lied’. it is you who accuses others of making stuff up on that ‘other thread’, isn’t it?

personally i would have thought a simple ‘i was in the remain camp, and campaigned for us to stay in the EU, but now here we are, and i have to deliver a solution for the country that makes the best of things’ would have done the job well enough.

it’s not ‘she should have lied’, it’s ‘can’t think quick enough on her feet to deflect even a simple question when you spot the follow up’.

i suppose if we’re going to be generous we could give her 1 point for spotting the obvious next question. 🙄
not feeling generous.

she’s apparently the best we’ve got and she’s a clot.

I would really like to know what she promised Merkel in that phone call,

but I suppose thats between the PM, Merkel & the CIA monitoring team

I wonder if May promised to deliver Brexit by offering up the £60bn ish divorce bill at the very last, knowing that it would cost her the PM job as the brexies & RW press would throw a shitfit

leaving her successor to come in and lead the Tories elated from their last minute save of the talks, even if ‘ May’s giveaway ‘ left a bad taste

all aslong as Merkel made sure Johnson wasnt that successor

or is that all to devious for someone as naive as May?

Tory power is only sustained by cruel confidence tricks…

Frankie Boyle

Does seem viable way out for her paying the 60billion then falling on her sword for the good of the Tory party.

I very much doubt she promised Merkel anything – and certainly not the 60 billion

regarding the alleged leak yesterday

its the line about her shaking with laughter that makes it ring true

Yesterday the German journalist Thomas Gutschker stirred things up admirably when he published an article in Frankfurter Allgemeine Sonntagszeitung (FAZ) with a vivid, “insider” account of Theresa May’s dinner last week with Jean-Claude Juncker. As this passage (from Nina Schick’s translation) shows, it did not reflect well on May.

Theresa May seemed anxious to the president of the commission, despondent and discouraged. A woman who hardly dares trust anybody, but is not ready for an act of liberation either. May’s facial expressions and appearance spoke volumes — that’s how Juncker later described it to his colleagues. Everyone can see it: the prime minister is drawn from the struggle within her own party. She has deep circles under her eyes. She looks like someone who does not sleep for nights on end. She rarely laughs, though clearly, she has to for the photographers. But it looks forced. Previously, May could literally pour out laughter — her whole body shaking. Now she has to use her utmost strength to avoid losing her composure.

Jean-Claude Juncker, the European commission president, said the report was not true.

But in the Times (paywall) today Rachel Sylvester describes May in similar terms. Sylvester’s column includes this astonishing anecdote.

Those who have seen Mrs May privately in recent weeks describe her as stricken and stunned. On one occasion she sat in silence for almost ten minutes while the visitor she had invited to see her waited for her to lead the conversation. He left the meeting deciding she no longer wanted to be prime minister. The internal contradiction of her position must be taking an emotional as well as a political toll.

this version of Theresa May seems to have dissapeared

firmware update.

Good.
I hope she suffers every minute of the day.

+1 Zippy

I do feel sorry for her, insofar as I am capable of showing empathy for someone who thinks that a 55p per minute helpline for people claiming benefits is morally acceptable.

The lack of empathy displayed by Conservative Party MPs is astounding. Every day that the current party split between the right and the hard right continues damages their long term prospects even further.

PJM1974 – Member
I do feel sorry for her, insofar as I am capable of showing empathy for someone who thinks that a 55p per minute helpline for people claiming benefits is morally acceptable.

But

The lack of empathy displayed by Conservative Party MPs is astounding.

Really?? The lack of empathy is normal and expected, it’s not astounding it’s what the tories are all about.

Said it before and confirmed by the old Tory grandees- they are literally dying, with a party membership of sub 100k that is dying off at 10% per annum.

They have no one capable of capturing the younger (sub 50) vote, this group compromised of the younger element, remainers and old school labour will not vote for a Boris or a Gove or a Fox. They are a zombie political party and they know it.

And the old party members will give it the final blow when they vote a Boris in. Let them crack on we need this hard rain to wash away these dinosaurs

Really?? The lack of empathy is normal and expected, it’s not astounding it’s what the tories are all about.

Let me qualify that.

It’s a given that any Tory government is going to be a bunch of complete and utter bastards, but since the referendum there’s been a wholesale and noticeable swing further in that general direction. All of a sudden, folk like Bernard Jenkin, Priti Patel and John Redwood are being taken seriously. We’ve even seen the Prime Minister’s pet newspaper (until she botched the election at any rate) endorse the French National Front candidate on their own front page.

John Major’s government is positively fluffy and cuddly in comparison.

John Major’s government is positively fluffy and cuddly in comparison.

How long till Thatcher is denounced as a socialist!

The fact is those of us who voted remain need to sit back and let this catastrophe unfold, if we fight to stop Brexit we will be blamed for every piece of shit that happens for the next 50 years.

I am old enough and have been on the receiving end of enough crap to understand that sometimes you have to let the full consequences take effect and then and only then can you go about fixing it.

Step away, don’t engage, don’t support, look after you and yours.

oldmanmtb – Member
The fact is those of us who voted remain need to sit back and let this catastrophe unfold, if we fight to stop Brexit we will be blamed for every piece of shit that happens for the next 50 years.

Why, what good would come with it? I’d rather be blamed for the supposed problems from a bunch of soon to be dead right wingers than cause it.

I am old enough and have been on the receiving end of enough crap to understand that sometimes you have to let the full consequences take effect and then and only then can you go about fixing it.

Even of this sets the UK back 20 years, triggers a full recession and kills industry? What are you prepared to sacrifice? Your pension? A retirement? 20, 30, 40% from your investments??

Step away, don’t engage, don’t support, look after you and yours.

What if looking after yourself is to look after the greater good?

The fact is those of us who voted remain need to sit back and let this catastrophe unfold, if we fight to stop Brexit we will be blamed for every piece of shit that happens for the next 50 years.

I just hope that one day we stop protecting those who’ve been responsible for the current shambles and make them accountable to a court of inquiry.

Or string the **** up.

Or string the **** up.

While I sympathise with any sentiment to the ends of removing the “bastards” from positions of authority, the very last thing this country needs is another Robespierre. The very best outcome is that the far right becomes a political irrelevance and those who’ve provided the wealth to fund the lobbying platform which is driving greater inequality and who’ve funded the campaign of “alternative facts” are made accountable and forcibly separated from their assets.