[Closed] Shimano 10 v 11 speed - worth the extra

My default position is that if you have working 10sp kit then unless you see a benefit in cadence control of closer ratios then it’s difficult to justify 11sp as an ‘upgrade’, but it makes the most sense if you’re buying from scratch.

I’d consider Shimano if I was trying to keep costs as low as possible, but SRAM is the more mature system and will give a better spread of benefits.  The XD hub is good going forward to 12sp plus. Shimano will almost certainly need to change their freehub to move beyond 11sp.  There is the option of a massive 11-50 Sunrace on Shimano 11sp which is a sort of in-between solution in every respect.

Sram 11 yes, the gx was certainly a worthwhile upgrade for me,

You need to decide what range and what ratios you want.  That's personal.

I could get by on a 1x10, but the 1x11 on my new bike meant I could climb steeper hills and still not pedal out on the flats.  Also not using an exteneder meant the gaps between cogs were not so pronounced.

If you take your cycling seriously then spend the extra.  Its not that much to spend on your favourite hobby really.

I've done three 1x10 setups, the first used an extender cog as wide range 10spd cassettes weren't available back then but the other two have been 11-40/42 cassettes. The last build was 1x11 mainly to get the range with reasonable gaps between ratios, I just couldn't make a wide range 10spd work for me. I went with 11-42 XT as the 11-46 Sunrace has some big gaps in the middle of the block and the 11-46 XT felt like the bottom gear was really just a get out. Personal preference though.

Use gear-calculator.com you can select common cassettes and compare two setups. If you are just comparing between two setups for the same bike then you don't need to bother about wheel size unless you wish to work out what speed you'll be doing at a specific cadence.

Thanks for the comments all. I seem to get on ok with the 1x10 42t & 30t combination I have - the lack of granny ring seems ok to me. I think I might therefore go for the 1x 11, as the cost of 1x10 plus rad cage and the associated faff make it less attractive to do that again.

I have seen mixed reviews on Shimano, stuff but generally I have always found it works fine.

I have had the occasional sore knees recently, but think it is more down to higher mileage this year and my riding position on my current bike, rather than anything gearing related, so will check the bike fit first before letting that affect gear choice (unless someone points out the error of my ways).

I have seen mixed reviews on Shimano, stuff but generally I have always found it works fine.

The mixed reviews are mostly saying the 11sp is not the same as the 10sp which people mostly found worked fine

GX11sp is a compelling price and performance level

Thanks all. I have used th Gear calculator and also have done more research on GXP. Tempted to spend then extra, as 12 speed only looks to be £40 more for a groupset and the ratios look a lot wider. That does ninth take into account the XD driver though.

if anyone know any good places to get bargains, please let me know. Evans have got 12 sp GXP for £345 I think.

THanks for your comments mike.

Having a bike that pedals nicely is worth more than simple money.

I have one bike with 10 speed (Shimano- Saint shifter, XT mech) and one with 11 (XT shifting and SRAM gucci cassette) , tbh they both work extremely well. I think the wider ratio of the 10-42 cassette is the only real benefit I feel from 11 speed over 10 day to day though- and it can be quite a big deal, it let me add higher gearing to the big bike.

(I don't like the 11 speed Shimano shifter at all, it's a little vague and it's just plain badly built, the 2 levers collide together sometimes while shifting, I wish I'd gone full SRAM but never mind)

Considering the price of 12 speed GX right now (£225) I'd throw that in as an option too. Or possibly instead of 11 speed?

Trimix - ‘Having a bike that pedals nicely is worth more than simple money.‘ This has always been my problem, buy cheap and buy twice .

I totally agree that when everything works as it should, it isn’t something you can really put a price on. Am doing some more research...

Thanks Northwind - helpful feedback. Is that price mentioned including cranks, or without? I need the lot so was going to get a GXP crank as part of the package if I could.

Worth noting the new Deore 10spd cassette is available in dinner plate now as standard

Northwind - your shifter has a bent paddle then. They don’t collide normally (I’ve got one XT and two XTR). Seen one like that where the downshift paddle had hit the top tube, but they aren’t/shouldn’t be like that from new.

have a chat with Bird bikes - they were doing a deal on new 12 speed GX eagle, though they may have run out by now

<div class="bbp-reply-author">"Northwind – your shifter has a bent paddle then"</div>
<div></div>
<div>Nah, I've had 2 from new and found the same on other bikes. There's enough movement in the levers for them to rub.</div>

I think all the new stuff comes with heat mould lever positions

Odd - not my experience.

Thanks for the advice all. After a bit of red wine and some frantic google searching, I found GXP 12 speed online (on Amazon). Not a bad deal so have ordered the full set.

I have just need to sort the XD driver and axle conversion for the rear wheel (have a Hope Pro 2 hub). This is all going on a bike with 26 in wheels - so like trying to make a tape player bluetooth.

Having got over excited about the idea of 12 speed, I wonder if I should have gone for 11 speed SRAM or stayed with Shimano 10 speed. THere is a thread on  here about 12 speed GXP rear mech reliability being really bad...

While I am currently content with 1x10 shimano I am eying up SRAM 1x11 possibly with a sunrace cassette so I don't need a new FH body (also cheapest option?), keeping the same old cranks/chainring, so really just a cassette/mech/shifter/chain swap rather than the full group... Just for the extra climbing range and sensible increments...

The tales of 12 speed woe thread has put me off eagle at least until the "beta testing on early adopers" phase is finished...

Or should I be sticking to shimano for 11 speed? The interweb seems to be saying they've fallen off their game a bit...

gribble

I have just need to sort the XD driver and axle conversion for the rear wheel (have a Hope Pro 2 hub).

Hopefully a typo, you do have the evo hub don't you as I don't think the XD hub is available for the Pro 2 NON Evo??

Hi Poopscoop, it certainly was a typo (or me just being lazy). I double checked that’s I do have the Evo model. Thanks.

Hi cook - have received the 12 speed bits and whilst they look very nice nice, I think I am going to send them back and get the cheaper GX11, rather than Eagle. I would rather have the reliability rather than the increased range.

Should have done more research, but got a bit over excited during looking at different bits and bobs.

it’s difficult to justify 11sp as an ‘upgrade’, but it makes the most sense if you’re buying from scratch.

this is my experience though I have a 1x9 and a 1x11 [was 10 but donated to my kids]

I get better steps on the lower gears over the 9 and 10 - because i used an extender at the rear so had 6 teeth gap to the lowest gear]

Dont think I would have upgraded except for the fact 10 or 11 cost the same then again i feel that about 9 tbh. two more gears - and no real increase in range- is not much of an upgarde IME. Its not a game changer. its not even very useful like a dropper.

YMMV

Gribble, if you’re going XD on Hope, there are a couple of crucial points that will cause workstand headscratching.

The drive side endcap/ adapter is different than one for Shimano - it’s slightly shorter. Using the Shimano length one will lead to a bike that doesn’t freewheel a bit like if you leave the washer out when swapping freehub.

You must fit the cassette before the endcap. You can’t get the cassette tool to engage enough to properly fit if the endcap is in place. This is a bit of a PITA to be honest.

Thanks Vince. Noted and will make sure I check on that before ordering.

I am still struggling to decide which groupset to buy, but am leaning towards a GX 11 speed and then sending the Eagle 12 speed back.

Many happy 12 speed bikers. But too many which have trouble with it. One day mud biking and one hour readjusting the thing...?

Loving my Sunrace MX 11-46 10sp cassette. Close ratios and smooth shifting, no drop back-pedaling. Meant I could keep my smooth Saint 10sp shifter too, although I needed a M8000 GS rear mech.

There's always SRAM NX. Got a good review here on singletrack. I've got it on a new buold, coming from Deore 10spd the shifting etc seems fine. My only niggle is the shifter position, that I can't seem to get quite right. Either seems too close to the grip or too far away.

Worth noting the new Deore 10spd cassette is available in dinner plate now as standard

Worth repeating.

I have spare XD drivers and end caps for Pro2 evo if anyone is looking for one.