[Closed] Road bike steel frame options

Roberts, Rourke or Colnago

As for wheels. Royce do some very special hubs and only in silver

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/felt/f4130-athena-2012-road-bike-ec032699?utm_source=froogle&utm_medium=froogle&utm_campaign=froogle
MUCH nicer looking in the flesh.Nice blend of old(steel) and new(BB30,integrated headset).There's a cheaper 105 version as well.
[img] [/img]

If you're after a nice road bike but not a racer have a look at the Surly Pacer.

Yeah that looks right.

I am sure 105 is great, but I keep getting a ringing in my ears from one of my mates dads (sadly departed) that a "bikes not a bike without a bit of Campag"....

Enigma do some nice steel frames

[img] [/img]

have a scroll through their clearance section (or buy a 'full price' one with campag) [url= http://www.enigmabikes.com/clearance1.html ]http://www.enigmabikes.com/clearance1.html[/url]

+1 on the Enigma. Failing that, depends on how deep your pockets are

Independent Fabrication
English
Singular (whatever the road bike is - can't remember)

Engima for the fancy route, quite a few ali frames look retro and can be had with Campag, like the De Rosa Milano. Worth investigating as not all frames built with the same material ride the same.

Will check out the Singular, just as I like Sam.

Swede, yeah I know what you mean.

The Condor Acciaio and Super Acciaio are very nice

excellent call on Condor, lovely bikes and a great shop

I quite liked the look of the Soma Smoothie but opted for a ubiquitous Equilibrium when the right size frameset came up.

http://www.somafab.com/archives/product/smoothie

[img] [/img]
Been going through the same quandry at the moment, so this is what i'll be getting out on very soon

The Condor Acciaio and Super Acciaio are very nice

Very stiff though (apparently), at the other end of the spectrum, the Tokyo fixed - wide open dream machine gets good reviews for being more like you'd expect a steel bike to feel.

As for Campag, have you tried it? You'r mates dad presumably existed in the days before STIs (fnarr fnarr) so the only differences were weight, looks and the shape of the hoods. On which points campag may have won (especialy looks), but I reckon shimano shifters are much nicer to use than the campag ones with the fiddly little lever that's never where you want it to be. That is unless you go for a propper retro steel bike with DT shifters.

Shimano cranks on the other hand look fugly in comparison.

There's a lovely steel Felt on offer at Wiggle.

decide if you want a heavy noodly gaspipe frame or a modern steel frame like a roberts/rourke/enigma.
modern oversize steel frames ride so much better than the archaic lugged museum pieces that are still being built.

i guess it depends if you want to look at it or ride it.

i guess it depends if you want to [s]look at it or ride it.[/s] ride a bike that looks nice and is comfortable or something that's harsher than a cheep aluminium frame and costs more than a top end carbon frame whilst weighing four times more

FTFY

p.s. you can get luggs for oversize tubing too.

p.s. you can get luggs for oversize tubing too.

aware of that fact, i was commenting on the 'retro' skinny frames made from low end steel (at a premium price) with retro decals harking back to the halcyon days of quill stems and toeclips.

FYI modern oversize frames do not weigh 4 times more than top end carbon carbon, they certainly ride differently but i wouldn't say they were inferior, "harsh"? lol.

Yeh, I'd avoid something with super thin tubes. I did have a Surly Cross Check and found it fairly flexy, now got an equilibrium and it feels stiffer. I think the bigger tubes have something to do with it.

Look at the downtube on that charge - dead small, and its got super long stays. Bet it rides like shite.

Yeh, I'd avoid something with super thin tubes. I did have a Surly Cross Check and found it fairly flexy, now got an equilibrium and it feels stiffer. I think the bigger tubes have something to do with it.

Have you seen the wall thicknesses on Alu frames?

Thin walls is one aspect of what gives steel the ride people attribute to it. If you want to ride a bike that looks like steel just buy some cheap gaspipe bike, if you want to know what the fuss is about then get something decent.

Sorry, I should have explained myself better. A small diameter tube is really what I should have written.

Condor Fratello.

Or if you want something really old school, Bob Jackson

AS mentioned already, the differences in quality of steel is massive, infact, biblical.

A gaspipe/low end (old or new) is going to suck no matter who builds it. But some proper steel will see you right.

For me I like a road bike/racer to be either decent steel or decent carbon, I find aluminium generally much harsher on lower back.

Also consider putting a carbon fork in there, handbuilt quality steel forks are often as much as the frame! vs. an off the shelf high end carbon fork will likely handle better/torsionally stiffer + absorb more shock/vibration than any steel or alu fork would = more comfort, more control and ultimately lower weight (if thats important to you).

Weight can be a factor, but my 40yr old bob jackson build (equiv of ultegra group + 27" 32c touring wheels) with modern pedals weighs just under the 10kg mark, and would be about 8.5kg with similar age sprint wheels on, which yeah its comparable to a low/mid range alu framed current gen racer, but it won't be as stiff for the same weight.

Sorry, I should have explained myself better. A small diameter tube is really what I should have written.

Agreed, the very small diameter frame tubes, can be a bit flexy, particularly in bigger frame sizes with stronger riders. Don't think many such bikes exist anymore, could be wrong, something that tended to disappear early 90's when OS tubes became easily available.

Look at the downtube on that charge - dead small, and its got super long stays. Bet it rides like shite.

My one of those (its a Charge Juicer) rode very nicely, it's no lightweight of course but a perfectly decent trainer / all day bike and not noticeably flexier than the PX SL Pro Carbon I'm riding now.

After lots of umming and ahhing, a friend of mine is getting a Condor Acciaio built up for her at the moment.

She's very excited, as is right and proper!

As regards comfort, don't be put off by aluminium.
My alu Langster with a skinny carbon post (with zertz insert) is more comfortable than my ti Lynskey Cooper.

Then again, the alu BMC hardtail i had was brutally stiff for general xc work and i got shot of it pretty quickly.

Cannondales Caad frames are supposed to be quite comfy, but still super efficient.

Yeh, I'd avoid something with super thin tubes. I did have a Surly Cross Check and found it fairly flexy, now got an equilibrium and it feels stiffer. I think the bigger tubes have something to do with it.

Look at the downtube on that charge - dead small, and its got super long stays. Bet it rides like shite.

The wrong kind of flex is a concern, I really want it to ride like a modern bike but just look a bit nicer (in my opinion).

I had a Ti MTB and though it was a lovely thing to behold, when it got knicked I had limited funds and bought the ALU version of the same thing, was the same weight, about the same in comfort, but the ALU had a lot less BB flex... And I am no power god.

honourablegeorge - Member
There's a lovely steel Felt on offer at Wiggle

MMMMMM, the black one at £720 with 105 kit, its certainly a great price for that level of kit..

Just wondering where my pompino would fit in on the road bike steel qualityspectrum. I imagine 4130 is somewhere in the middle, it's butted according to the blurb. However when it comes to the 'ping' test using the fingernail it sounds nice on the downtube.

a pompino is close to gas-pipe, 4130 is basic cro-mo, the question i would ask is what are the stays made of. Cro-mo or hi-ten.

Nothing wrong per-say but nothing special, no where near 953/EOM/Life etc

The De Rosa Neo Primato is fabulous (and a 50/05 chance of it being built by the man himself), [s]fondled[/s] carefully inspected one at the road bike show.

Depending on budget, I'd look above Genesis and Charge, unless it says 853 on the tubeset.

Roberts if you can wait
[url= http://paulusquiros.co.uk/#/bike-detail/4552743759 ]Paulus Quiros[/url] for something that will turn heads (esp. 953)

Just wondering where my pompino would fit in on the road bike steel qualityspectrum

somewhere near that pile of stuff chucked out back.
i wouldn't even call it a road bike 'commuter hack' maybe?

I built this:

[img] [/img]

Cheapish Guerciotti Record frame from Planet X, Campag Veloce group, Pro-lite Wheels.

think it would look nicer with some shallower rims,

I had enough trouble finding completely silver/almost logo free wheels as it was!

I didn't even consider the rim depth, but you're probably right.

[img] [/img]

excuse the mtb pedals, but here is the steel one I use. Very comfy even with the silly stiff wheels.

Edit: it's a rebranded salsa primero, salsa couldn't sell them all so the company that made them sprayed them white and sold them as their in house brand, fastrax (not the Saracen one!). If you can find one they are a bargain at £400 for the frame and forks rather than the original list price of £1600 for the frame..... Imported mine from the USA.

Mercian for exotic lugged 853 .As far as skinny steel goes my Ishiwata 017 tubed timetrial frame is very light and stiff enough with my 16 stone on it

My mate has 3 Indy Fabs ,a hardtail ,a single speed and a carbon and Ti fixed wheel road bike

brian rourke, made to measure, and painted to your whim thats what I got

Or for under £200 get the real thing, old as the hills but goes like stink.
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[url= http://www.ifbikes.com/OurBikes/Road/Factory_Lightweight/ ]have you got deep pockets ?[/url]

well you lot have got me thinking into getting my 20 year old Argos 531c bike back on the road with full campag 9speed all the bits are in my shed

It always handled realy nicely far better than the litespeed that replaced it and got sold on

Any ideas to where I can get some 1" stronglight roller bearings from

beej that is a crackin build

ok Pegoretti

http://www.pegoretticicli.com/frames/type/love-3?page=1

he built frames for Indurain and Pantani, they take ages to build but that's not because of the waiting list nor that he can't be bothrered but there isn't enough tube produced fast enough

There is nothing wrong with low end steel. 4130 double butted/531 tubesetsmaybe low end and is not that light (my 59x59cm is nearly 5lbs in weight) but the ride is fantastic. It is by far the most comfortable bike I have ever riden. The whole bike may weighs in at 22.6lbs and with mudguards, full bottle, saddle bag and computor it is 25lbs but I really don't care as it so nice to ride.

The frame I use is a Traitor Exile. http://www.traitorcycles.com/Bikes_Exile.cfm

I have it built up with Cmapag Veloce, Thompsen post, Cinelli bars and stem, miche hubs, rigida Chrina rims, Sapim spokes, Sella Itali C2 saddle.

Since when has 531 been low end ? it may have been superceeded but its not low end .How many tour de France winners rode 531?

Since when has 531 been low end ? it may have been superceeded but its not low end .How many tour de France winners rode 531?

it was introduced in 1934, it's way out of date.

a steel like columbus spirit with it's .5- .38 butted oversize tubes, 853 or deda eom etc are all far superior in strength, weight and available tube dimensions.

ok Pegoretti

i would say they are o.k. too 8)

I know the others are better and lighter but its still not low end tubing .It was the benchmark for about 50 years .Its not made now but it still rides really nice

That the point I was making. "low end" tubing still rides well. I say 531 is "low end" because it is not made anymore but it equivelents produced by other manufacturers is and this "531" equivelent used in the Traitor Exile frame for example.

A steel frame does not need to be made from R853 or its equivelents for it to be a good frame. The strength and fatique resistance provided by lower grade tubing is quite sufficent if the frame is well made.

I have riden a few 531 frames and love them.

But

"low end" tubing still rides well

it is not what it is made of it is how well it is put together, look at [b]On Ones[/b] they may be made of gas pipes but they ride well

Just because a bike has 853 sticker on the tubes it can still be a dog

it is not what it is made of it is how well it is put together, look at On Ones they may be made of gas pipes but they ride well

No its both, take a well put together high end tube set and a well put together cheap tube set and the difference is noticeable. The details matter, what are the stays made of? that is the sort of question to ask.

Here's my old 1981 steel road bike (built from NOS bits)

[img] [/img]

If I was going to buy new I'd go for one of these

[img] [/img]

Why not buy second hand. You can get some nice 531 or Columbus equivilant for under 200 quid. Half that if you want to paint it. Try Hilary Stone. I would suggest that a 531 frame will be nicer than any modern chrome moly thing eg my Kaffenback or Cotic X. A generalisation I know but on the whole if a tubing isn't identified as a recognised brand it won't be 1st rate. Forks will be hefty.

Well thanks for all the input, and some lovely looking bike pics too.

Its not just the ride I am after, its probably a bike I will have around for a long long time, I had it in my head that I didn't want a budget carbon racer, tour lookalike type bike, but one that would still look nice in 10 years time.

That Felt at Wiggle is a steel, steal. Cant see much that can match that even at the right price it was fair, now if I could just find the Campag equipped one with a similar huge discount!

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/fs-kona-honky-tonk-like-new-450

😉

Cheap bike that Kona, too big for me...

On that note, having never bought a road bike before at 5ft 9" with a 32" leg, I rekon I need a 54cm...

Is that about right?

(well I did buy one but it was a fiver from the tip, Raleigh Pursuit, my nephew is still riding it)

PEople forget that as far as stiffness goes, steel is steel. The difference in ride quality comes about mostly from tube gauge (wall thickness having much less effect).

853 is no stiffer than the steel used in a Pompino (which rides well IMO, esp at the price), but is oversized and thinner gauge, making it stiffer (which isn't for everyone, I hated my Mojo) and lighter.

531 rides well too, an old 531frame with ahead forks is a performance/price high point IMO.

Kona do make good road bikes. My Kona Kapu below. Rutand Cycles have a new old stock 2010 Kona Haole in a 53cm.It was listed on Ebay recently at a reduced price- also a very nice road bike.

[url= http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2790/4450188518_64fee59010_b.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2790/4450188518_64fee59010_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/46775575@N05/4450188518/ ]039[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/46775575@N05/ ]Bikes2010[/url], on Flickr

[i]Its not just the ride I am after, its probably a bike I will have around for a long long time, I had it in my head that I didn't want a budget carbon racer, tour lookalike type bike, but one that would still look nice in 10 years time.[/i]

Like my carbon road bike, 10 years old this year?

Gunnar Roadie gives a good ride, and handles well.

That Kona is lovely. And I need a 56 🙁

Like my carbon road bike, 10 years old this year?

7 for mine, and no obvious reason to change a single thing about it (except the rider).

Gunnar Roadie gives a good ride, and handles well

The Gunnars and the S3 Waterford didn't jump out at me at the Bristol show, but on closer inspection they looked wonderful. Subtle but beautifully made with good tube size selection.

The thing is (and Al's right) that a road frame at £300 can have 90% of the ride feel of a top-end steel frame, it's all about tube dimensions and you don't really need teh strength of the super-steels unless you're going really thin on walls or diameter, not always a good idea imo. I've ridden 520 and 953 frames of the same tube ODs and very similar geo back-to-back enough to say that I notice the weight most (+/- 10oz I think) and that's not really so noticeable anyway, a minor, subtle improvement in feel (a bit smoother / flexier in a good way) too - but it really is diminishing returns if the cheaper frame is a good one. Cheap steel frames can be very good, 'basic' 4130 steel is nice stuff and not expensive.

Would I still spend £1000-odd on a Waterford S3, £1600 on a Rourke 953, or silly £ on a Master X-lite build? Yes if I had the cash, but not for the gain in ride quality really, mainly for the fact that there's no bike as lovely as a nice steel road bike.

Those Cinelli frames make me go week at the knee's