Need a new bike – Superfly has died. Problem I’m having is a market full of 1x bikes and frames – not to my taste.

So question is what frames or bike out there are still 2x capable? 100mm or slightly more travel FS bike with a cross country leaning. Budget not relevant I just want a good tool for the job.

The reasoning; Superfly came with a 1×11 SRAM drivetrain in 2015 and I didn’t like it. Insufficient range at the top (fast) end and large jumps between gears. Noisy at extremes of the cassette.

I do multi bike tours and long day rides with luggage. Often joining up off road sections with roads, mainly in the highlands. 1x cant cope with this in my opinion – particularly the road sections!

Sure it gets you the range you need??

What do these numbers mean and why are they important?
The percentage figures refer to the gear range of the cassette, or the difference between the highest and lowest available gears.

To work out the range of a cassette, you simply divide the largest sprocket by the smallest and then multiply this by one hundred (50 ÷ 10 = 5 x 100 = 500%). Since the two cassettes mentioned are dedicated 1x, the figure also represents the drivetrain as a whole.

What about double-ring drivetrains?
You can also calculate gear range for a 2x drivetrain, but you do this by dividing the biggest chainring by the smallest and multiplying that by the cassette calculation.

For example, an 11-36t cassette combined with a 36/24t chainset has a gear range of 491% (36 ÷ 24) 1.5 x (36 ÷ 11) 3.27 x 100 = 491%.

Range AND smaller jumps on the cassette Mike, thanks. There is no firm argument that 2x doesn’t help gain range and aid smaller jumps between sprockets on a cassette. I don’t mind other folks opinions or even hard nosed facts but I am buying a bike or frame with 2x because that’s what I want!

I think you might struggle to be honest (none spring to mind).   To get the short chainstays and big tire clearance that are on trend means no front mech.  12spd is more range than 11spd?

I seem to recall reading that 2x is still big in Germany so maybe something designed there?

Maybe something like a Scott Spark? Still 2x compatible and seems to tick your boxes. Looks like only one in range comes equipped 2x (970) but others take a direct mount mech.

Ha, I’ve been thinking for ages that eventually my old Anthem is going to fall apart, and I was preparing myself mentally to have to change to 2x at some point. I just had a wee look the current Anthems after reading your post and I’m realising that I may have missed that boat completely!
I also like having a decent top end gear for cruising road sections or fast tracks, and big gear steps are horrible if you like being in just the right gear for the conditions.

I’m sure you’ve already pondered the idea op but worth keeping an eye out for a used bike/frame from a few years back that would tick all the boxes?

That said,I do understand the frustration of wanting to buy something shiny and new but finding no-one wants your money as such!

Anthem looks like it will take one. There’s a mounting point with a blanking plate in the pics on the giant site. My trance is the same. It might come as 1x but it will take a direct mount mech.

I got one of these (from here in fact). Should fit the bill. 2×11 gearing. I run mine now with 29 inch wheels and 2.3 tyres as I prefer the slightly higher BB and faster rolling on tarmac sections. I still bang the plus wheels back in for trail centres. Medium and Large still there.

https://www.westbrookcycles.co.uk/scott-spark-710-full-suspension-mountain-bike-2018-p329320

Radon Skeen range at Bike Discount? Bit more trail bike-y than Xc though.

Ta some good replies all options open including NOS etc. Looking on Bike Discount at the moment.

Fuel EX too much travel?

KTM Scarp maybe?

https://www.ktm-bikes.at/nc/en/bikedetail/singlebike/scarp-294-22.html

Welshfarmer – I’m 5 foot 10 so right on the boundary of medium or large for that Scott Spark 710. Very tempted. Any thoughts on sizing / what height are you and what size is your bike etc.?….thanks.

I’m a gnats chuff shy of 6 foot with longish arms and have a large. Fits me fine. I wouldn’t want it any smaller for sure. One thing to note is that there is plenty of seat post free and about 25mm of spacers under the stem, so that if you like a longer bike then it would be easy to make it fit someone a bit shorter. Compared to many current “long low slack” models out there the large would probably be sold as a medium.

Where abouts are you? Youwould be welcome to have a go on mine if you’re anywhere near south Wales/FOD

Lots of Cube short travel trail and XC bikes are still 2x. They may fit the bill.

As stated above 2x, still popular with German brands.

You buy what you want.

trek fuel ex5 comes with 2 x Shimano. 130mm of travel and is a great XC/trail bike

My 29er Fuel is running 2x – with 140mm Pikes ATM (originally 130mm) but would probably get away with 120mm

If you want to build I have a little used Devinci Atlas carbon frame that would work
It’s large

norco optic? loads of the canyon range

I’d second the KTM Scarp, all of them come with the mount for a direct mount front mech plus the cable routing, none of the top end ones are equipped with a double from the factory, but itd just be a case of getting a mech, shifter and chain ring to complete it.

You would need a large BTW

@Waderider – Even as a 1x fan I must say that I agree with you. I’ve always felt it to be short sighted for frame designs to be 1x only: ooh! 1x is getting popular => we can shorten the chainstays and … => Oops! Can’t use 2x anymore.

As @sweaman2 says a lot is down to current trends of short chainstays and wide tyres, there’s a legal minimum of 6mm between chain and tyre required in design. That could be sidestepped by using a wider bottom bracket (sorry new standard alert!) such as used on fat bikes which can still take 2x systems.

Can’t help with any specific 2x compatible model due to my opening statement.

Depends what sort of bike you are after. The likes of Surly etc do this sort of thing I think, no? Also Brother cycles Big Brother.

Both the Top Fuel and Procaliber are available as 2x. I guess these would be most similar to your Superfly so sizing would be easy and you know the brand. Not sure whether you’d have to go down the Project One route to get them or whether they’re available off the shelf.

That scale 710 does it definitely fit 29 wheels? I thought only the plusmodels did?

Only thing putting me off Scott is their warranty is not lifetime and requires the bike to be serviced by service centres to stretch to 5 years. Rubbish compared to giant / specialised

Lots of Cube short travel trail and XC bikes are still 2x. They may fit the bill.

Maybe have a look at bike-discount.de
Dirt cheap frames and lots which are prepared for front mech.

Others: Orbea Occam? At least the 2018 versions are available with front mech?

But correct – 2x will get more and more rare…
Sad so. I love my Deore 2×10 (M6000) drivetrains. Have three bikes with them…

Canyon Neuron will fit your bill.

I have a the old version (Nerve) which is 110mm travel.

Neuron is still 2x / short travel 29er – I think they might have upped it to 120mm now though.

Some of the Canyon neuron range are x2. 130mm travel but still X/C-trail.
https://www.canyon.com/en-gb/mountain-bikes/trail-bikes/neuron/neuron-cf-9.0/2069.html?dwvar_2069_pv_rahmenfarbe=BK%2FGY&dwvar_2069_pv_rahmengroesse=XS

I’m planning on 2×11 for the Salsa whilst I still can.

Hmm, just run the numbers comparing a 1x to a 2x which I’ve not done since moving from a 3×9 on a 26″ bike to 1×10 on a 29er some years ago.

I compared a 1×11 30T with 11-42T Sunrace cassette to 36/22 chainset with 11-36T Shimano cassette.

At the top end on the 1x 30/11 gives a ratio of 2.73, the 2x has ratios of 2.77 and 3.27 better than that.

At the bottom end the 1x has 30/42 = 0.71 whereas the 2x has 0.69 and 0.61 lower.

I’m not sure about you but I don’t think I’d be able to tell the difference between 2.73 & 2.77 which on a 29er are 79.17 and 80.33 gear inches so really there’s one extra gear at the top end. At the bottom end the difference between 0.71 and 0.69 ratios is 3%, gear inches of 20.59 and 20 respectfully. So here there’s one extra gear.

TBH the above surprised me, I thought there’d be at least two effective gear ratios extra at either end.

Gaps between gears? If you stay in the same chainring then the percentage difference between cogs is the same (I just happened to choose two cassettes with the same bottom ten cogs, the 11spd simply adds the 42T cog) so you only get the smaller changes if you change chainring at the same time. Then you get changes of 1%, 11%, 2%, 12%. I don’t know about you but I’d probably not notice those small ones especially off-road. There’s only one pair of absolutely identical ratios BTW 22/17 & 36/28. There’s a run of four ratios at either end where you don’t need to change chainring but once you are in the middle of the range then all but one ratio change requires you to change both front and rear.

The one thing that 1x cannot do is match the single massive step you get when switching chainrings.

I’m sure if you picked two different cassettes and chainsets you’d get different figures but other than the massive spread of the Sram Eagle cassettes I don’t think they’d be much different.

Thanks for the responses. Think I’m going to order a Scott Spark. Just building up the courage….hate big purchases! In Fort William Welshfarmer, so a bit far for a test ride…thanks.

My Saracen Traverse is 1x but has routing and a mount for a front mech. Really fun bike. You’d be a large – I’m a teeny bit smaller than you and ride a large. Off Beat could sort you out with one.

Pivot Mach429SL. 100mm travel, rides like a fast trail bike, can be built silly light, has a fr mech mount.

Yeti ascr if you can find one..100 mm travel, xc orientated, takes a double.

Cracking bike (I have one)

Yeti ascr if you can find one..100 mm travel, xc orientated, takes a double.

Cracking bike (I have one)

*snigger* see what you did there…

I run 2×11 on a trek top fuel, trek sell an adapter to mount the front mech.

Currently running with 26-38 chainrings and a 11spd road cassette (11-32)

Newer Giant Anthems still have the ability to fit a direct mount front mech.

I really don’t see the point of 2x when the likes of Eagle is out there.

All 2x adds is weight and redundant gears.

Advantages of 2x

1) Closer ratios
2) Less cranking of the shifter for big gear changes
3) It’s not Eagle
4) You can get a cassette for £45

My ‘adventure’ MTB needs wide gear range because it does road as well as steep off-road, and I’d consider Eagle if I were building new. I like the fact that 1x seems to stay a lot cleaner around the BB area and gather less mud. However, because the bike already exists and I cannot change the freehub, an upgrade to 2×11 is much cheaper for me given the silly prices of XT.

TBH the above surprised me, I thought there’d be at least two effective gear ratios extra at either end.

You can use 11-40 or 11-42 with 2×11 XT I think?. I think I’ll get 11-42 and 36/26 front rings for proper winch gear for the end of a long loaded day.

@molgrips – to actually make use of those “closer” ratios you have to jump through some hoops. So with the standard 11-36 cassette and a 22-36 chainset these are the shifts you have to make to move through the gears (L->S means large to small chainring) from easiest to hardest gear:

Start in small ring and largest cog, S36 (0.61), figure in parentheses is the ratio of that gear.
36->32 (0.69)
32->28 (0.79)
28->24 (0.92)
S->L, 24->28, 28->32, 32->36 (1.0)
L-S, 36->32, 32->28, 28->24, 24->21 (1.05)
S->L, 21->24, 24->28, 28->32 (1.13)
L->S, 32->28, 28->24, 24->21, 21->19 (1.16)
19->17 (1.29)
17->15 (1.47)
S->L, 15->17, 17->19, 19->21, 21->24 (1.5)
Etc.

I think that proves that a “simple” choose the next largest gear, well, isn’t simple and you’d be hard pushed to remember all that just to get to a gear that is a couple of percent harder/easier than the one you are in.

Your point #2 is one I’ve already made and is one that 1x can’t do unless you are on Di2 and have programmed a long press to drop three or four cogs.