I’ve been banging on and on about how much fun I’ve been having on my Genesis Day Cross, but seem to be spending more and more time farting around with the chain just trying to make it stop dropping.

I’ve got some new chaintugs but the frame design is such that they won’t fit without mega filing, and they only just ‘catch’ the end of the axle so I’m not sure how much use they’ll be.

I’ve a nasty suspicion that the frame might just be too flexy for me to really sprint on steep stuff, but it didn’t drop so much before.

Are certain chains better than others for this? Any chainrings with taller teeth than my new Renthal?

I’m replacing the Sram PC-1 chain anyway as it seems to stretch at an unbelievable rate. Suddenly beginning to think horizontal drops aren’t such a great idea after all, they seem to depend on everything being precisely ‘in tolerance’ with no wobbles or kinks…

The track-ends look fairly standard to me. Which chain tugs do you have?

Something is not right as I very very rarely drop a chain, even on one that has quite a slack chain with a magic ratio on a standard drop-out. Is your chainline ok and how worn is your freewheel?

KMC chains are very good value

See, I have never had the chain come off once on my day one cross. I dont use the chain tug things right enough, just pull the wheel bak until the chain is tight, tighten that side, centre the wheel and tighten the other side. Still on original chain, but when that wears out it’ll be a kmc bmx chain.

It’s your thighs Ian.

you need to turn down the gigarad-o-meter to below 5.

PC-1s are terrible for stretching. Give one of the KMC anti-stretch ones a try before you try anything else.

kmc 510 is a beast of a chain i run them on all my bikes and never have problems(also comes in funky colours) they do the 510sl with hollowed plates and pins whitch will be my next offering for the ss

+1 for kmc single speed chains. Cost peanuts too.

Good, thanks, I notice the old chain was KMC and I didn’t have any issues with it, I should have been able to figure that one out myself.

Chainline is bang on and all components are very new.

How much does the chain move at rest?

just checked and I use the KMC Z610 HX (3/32 version of the Z510 mentioned above). Either are £8.99.

I have never had much luck with SRAM on a SS. Definitely go KMC.

I’ve been thinking of changing to something a bit cheaper than the Rohloff chains I use now on my Rohloff and single speed.
KMC Z610 seems to get good reviews, so I’ll go for that.
I’ve always riveted my chains as I feel it is more secure than using a power link or similar.
What do people recommend for the KMC ?
Rivet it on permanently or use a joining link ?
If I’m going to use a joining link, I’d want to carry a couple of spares. Would it be the 8 speed one here ? http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=25439

The joining links on my KMC chains look like this and work fine: http://www.kmcchain.eu/?en/products/connectors/uni_connectors/2/

Obviously get the correct size, 3/32″ or 1/8″

Have never had any problems with chain slippage on either of my bikes and they’re both horizontal drop out. 1×1 is running a Surly Tugnut. Standard Cotic tensioner / gear hanger jobbie on the roadrat.

I’d say that if the chainline and tension is correct, and there’s plenty of wear in the chainring and cog then there is no way you should be dropping so much.

Is there a chance that chainline may be an issue if you’ve recently fitted a new chainring?

If tension is a problem, are you running standard QRs? If so, consider swapping to a nutted axle or ones with an allen key bolt.

Interesting to see recent comments on this and other threads about the SRAM PC-1 stretching – Has the design changed recently or something?

I’ve swore by them for years – the same one has been on my 1×1 for donkeys and been really punished but it’s been fine barring an initial few adjustments during the first “bedding in”.

Thanks, offthebrakes.
I’m trying to understand this, but they don’t make it easy.
The Z610 is described as a 6 speed 3/32 chain.
The one you linked to is for 1/8 chain, they don’t list a 3/32 uni connector, so I take it I would need the non reusable 3/32 snap on connector ?

CRC only list a power link type connector at £3.96 each for an 8 speed. http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=25439
Would an 8 speed connector fit a 6 speed chain ?

This looks to be the same thing at Wiggle at £2.86 for two, so less than half the price.
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/kmc-chain-links/
Again,only in 8 or 9 speed.

As I mentioned before, I’ve always riveted my chains.
Is there any reason why I can’t do that with a Z610 ? It would save all this confusion.

MTG – sorry, I must admit I don’t personally know about the 3/32″ chains as I use the Z510HX, which is the 1/8″ version. I assumed the connector would be a similar design but quite possibly it isn’t.

Charliethebikemonger sells them (both sizes), maybe he’ll see this and let us know

Not tried riveting either, so I’d better not comment on that.

Although hey, its the internet – I could just guess 😉

Having said all that, KMC’s US website shows the same kind of link for the 610.

Url doesn’t seem to want to work here but google “Z610HX-CL” and take the link to KMC’s website.

By the way, are you involved in organising the Gorrick Trailtrax series? Looking forward to it 🙂

Hmmm, it does doesn’t it.
Charlie the bikemonger’s site shows the chain with that type of link as well.

I’ve got no connection with Gorrick Trailtrax, although I think they have put on MTQ events as well as their own series.

One thing to bear in mind – the KMC connectors are sturdy but a little wider than the chain itself. My girlfriend uses an tensioner and has to be careful that the connector doesn’t rub against the guide plates.

I use an EBB so don’t have the same problem.

Echoing what other people have said – get a proper chain. SRAM and Shimano are shite.

Ive used Taya (its okay, noisy and stretches fast), shimano (snapped very fast), KMC (good, noisey and not a non-stretch one) and finally wipperman which blows the rest away. If you keep an 808 cleaned after every muddy ride and wiped/lubed after not so muddy rides it lasts a huge distance, doesnt rust and doesnt mangle your other components.

edit: also the wipperman quicklinks are awesome and reusable!

KMC connectors have also been known to come apart in use offroad.

Chris Hoy runs track ends BTW.
Your frame would have to be very flexy for this to cause a problem.

More likely chain line, worn out chain.

Like others I’ve run exceedingly slack chains on SS and fixys with very little problems.

Chainline is bang on

Is that by eye or have you measured it? By eye it can be very decieving.

EBB on the SS and sliding dropouts on the Rohloff, so not a problem for me either.

Anyone using a Z610 want to comment on whether it’s easy to rivet the chain to do away with a joining link or which joining link I should carry as an extra spare ?

I use the KMC 610 HX but I’ve never tried riveting one – I just use the standard joining link that comes with the chain and carry another couple(saved from replaced chains) and a short section of chain in case of brakeage I’ve never needed to use these to date though.

MTG – the 610 chain comes with a power link. All KMC chains seem to come with one.

Chainline is bang on

Is that by eye or have you measured it? By eye it can be very decieving.

haha, well, thats the trick isn’t it? By eye it looks fine, but ‘by eye’ it looked fine when it was actually a good ~1cm out.

I’ve measured it by sitting the bike parallel to a wall, making sure the centre line of both tyres from the wall was the same, and then measuring to the centre of each cog. Best I could get was within 1-2mm (although I had to do it so much I’m beginning to suspect the walls in this flat might not be entirely straight!)

Anyone using a Z610 want to comment on whether it’s easy to rivet the chain to do away with a joining link

I’ve always used joining links but the cheapo K710 Kool Chains I got from on-one a couple of years or so didn’t come with any. Finally got around to fitting one recently, just joined it with a chain tool. Working fine.

I use 1/8″ SRAM PC-7X with joining link similar to the KMC one above, never had any problems SS or fixed.

Check your chainline with a metre rule held against the chainring. It should just touch the rear sprocket. Rotate the chainring a few times and try in different positions. Then hold it flat against the sprocket and see if that’s in line.

Well I’m delighted to report that after ditching the SRAM PC-1 and fitting a KMC equivalent I had a brilliant sprint for a couple of hours, roots rocks and all, and not one dropped chain. Its even running slightly slacker than my PC-1 was.