• This topic has 17 replies, 11 voices, and was last updated 2 months ago by DT78.
Viewing 18 posts - 1 through 18 (of 18 total)
  • anyone know about electric gates?
  • DT78
    Free Member

    For a future phase of work I’d like electric gates. We regularly have scrots trying door handles so I’d like to stop them getting onto the drive. Its only just about a car length long so it has to be sliding. Existing gates are swing, and when the car is on the drive they have to stay open.

    I’m in the process of running the cables through the house and into ducting thats been laid.

    Builder has asked questions about the motor they use, what KWH etc.. To which I have no idea, so asking on here!

    Whats a decent system, there are lots on google. Opening will be approx 4.5m with a 2m high gate.

    Has anyone done this? what cable did you have laid? Any gotchas or things to look out for at design stage?

    Ideally I’d like to not have to dig up the drive a second time to relay the cables! (if we have to, we have to)

    dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    Surely if there is ducting in you won’t need to re-dig? That’s sort of the point. It might be worth splitting the ducting mid way and putting a service hatch/man hole etc in if its a long drive but frankly, leave it to the gate installer to sort out.

    I deal with a few companies who do gate automation, none of them would give you the same answer for any two of their own motors, let alone two different manufacturers.

    You’ll also need to account for the battery backups and the like (so likely the power consumption will be much lower than you’d expect. The two I have here run at 24V and <1A to charge the battery then motor from there.

    You’ve also the control side of the cabling to consider so it won’t just be power.

    thegeneralist
    Full Member

    Any gotchas

    Be very careful with the design. I vaguely recall reading some ghastly story about a kid getting caught and crushed at the hinge end. Huge leverages…

    timba
    Free Member

    Starter for 10: https://professional-electrician.com/technical/electrical-installations-garden/
    Beyond the gate having a manual override in the event of electrical failure, I don’t know anything about specs, etc

    dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    I vaguely recall reading some ghastly story about a kid getting caught and crushed at the hinge end.

    This is generally because people are morons and disable the safety cutouts because having a gate which refuses to close/open because there is a branch blowing across it is very annoying and is easier to unplug the sensor than cut your hedge.

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    DT78
    Free Member

    Thanks for the links. The ducting is buried just about the new water main with the warning tape over the top. When I researched I could find nothing that stated if armoured cable was a requirement if in ducting.

    The cables need to be pulled through the house to the point the ducting enters the house. Once the floor is concreted and floor coverings on bascially the ducting isn’t accessible without digging down to it. I could move the ducting outside the house as plan B and worry about it at a later stage. Then I’ve just got a bright orange ducting sticking out of the ground outside and will have a visible cable / exterior duct to it, which I would like to avoid by thinking ahead if I can.

    This is the system I’ve been looking at:
    https://gatemotors.s3.amazonaws.com/MyGateDownloads/Strike%20GB.pdf

    But no idea if this is a good system or not. It may be a little while till we actually get to the drive (probably not next year the way prices are going….maybe never!)

    dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    Then I’ve just got a bright orange ducting sticking out of the ground outside and will have a visible cable / exterior duct to it, which I would like to avoid by thinking ahead if I can.

    For my tuppence worth, I’d exit the ducting into a suitably large enclosure external to the house where you can transfer to much more flexible and cost effective cables for indoors, armoured is big cable and should be run if its buried outside, its not easy to manipulate so you want to avoid having it in the house, it’s also expensive.

    Indoors I’d be running a cat 6, along with a 4&e on a 2.5mm. I’d also pull for a car charger at the same time if you’re not. I’d probably terminate the twin externally to an IP double socket.

    This is the system I’ve been looking at:

    You’re not planning to DIY it are you?

    DT78
    Free Member

    thats a good suggestion, I’ll take a look for external enclosures.

    And good call on the cable for a car charger. Hadn’t thought that far ahead

    Why would you recommend cat6?

    I was also going to run a lighting circuit through the duct so we can fit some movement sensor lighting

    Not planning on DIY, but likely to use our builders to install to spec. However they need to know the spec, hence the research!

    And safety points taken on board.

    creakingdoor
    Free Member

    A 2.5mm cable SWA (4 core & E is a good call) will be ok on a 16A circuit breaker. 16A is approx 3.6Kw, depending on supply voltage vagaries, and I can’t imagine for one moment that any gate mechanism will be anywhere near that. If it is you could, on a 2.5mm, go up to a 20A breaker which is good for approx 4.6Kw. Also good advice about running a CAT6 and others for lighting, charger etc. Also pull some more nylon rope in as you’re pulling the cables in, so if you do need to pull any other cables you have the draw wire waiting; always pull something in to pull in more cables if need be.

    bentudder
    Full Member

    I help run / manage a management company for a block of flats. The developers installed a communal electric gate with remote fobs to stop the public from just driving in and using allotted spaces. The site is not secure – people can walk up an alley from the high street and into the garage, for example. It’s a right of way for the shops the face onto the high street, and goes right up some steps into the next road. People don’t like using steps – to the extent that they’ll take a big detoour to walk up the slope the cars use and wait (or not) after breaking the beam for the gates to open. If they don’t wait, they often yank the gate and smish the internals.

    It costs a lot to maintain and a lot to run, and having randoms mess with it (usually drunks wandering back from the pub late at night) is a pain.

    DT78
    Free Member

    Well hopefully as this is just our drive on a residential street I wont get the public tresspassing, I just want to make it more secure than a complete open drive. One route is manual sliding gate so it can be shut after you drive on/off the drive – a bit of a pain.

    The floors will be up in a fortnight or so to insulate, so its the perfect time to run the cable. I quite like the idea now of running all the cable to a exterior junction box with the right ratings, and having them terminated there, ready for cabling to be pulled through ducting at a later date. So that means only armoured cable is needed externally (if at all, the regs aren’t clear when the cable is inside a duct)

    something like this:
    https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/general-purpose-enclosures/8819691?cm_mmc=UK-PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-CSS_UK_EN_Enclosures_%26_Server_Racks_Whoop-_-General+Purpose+Enclosures_Whoop-_-8819691&matchtype=&pla-340755937820&cq_src=google_ads&cq_cmp=11311694822&cq_term=&cq_plac=&cq_net=g&cq_plt=gp&gclid=CjwKCAjwvsqZBhAlEiwAqAHElacKmAk7lHG_N8l_q3Teqir1pHa8NKaJQyDL_k_eZNdwkzJrprwm2RoCD2IQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

    Not pretty but could be hidden behind a bush or something. There is already a gas box in the vicinity. If the ducting starts close to this box it would be simple to then run the cabling from it.

    Anything wrong with this plan?

    WorldClassAccident
    Free Member

    If you are short on space, have you considered centre fold gates?

    https://www.theelectricgateshop.co.uk/Electric-Folding-Gates/

    I have the mechanism, but not yet the gates ad I don’t have the right set up and space for a sliding gate, if you want to look at one.

    markspark
    Free Member

    As it’s a bit vague at the moment I’d suggest pulling a 6mm twin to an ip box outside above the duct and also a cat5 to there too. If you’re thinking of lighting too take a 1.5mm twin for a feed and another from a useful switch position so you can manually override any sensors you use. Also think about another 6mm twin and cat5 to a location for a car charger

    BigJohn
    Full Member

    Any gotchas or things to look out for at design stage?

    You need to factor in the 10% Electric Gate Surcharge that everybody quoting for any work done in future will add.

    finephilly
    Free Member

    Swing gates don’t lend themselves to be electrically operated (with a motor) very well. There’s a lot of force needed to pivot them around the hinge. Sliding gates would be easier to electrify and give more reliable operation. If you have to go with swing, maybe use a piston or some kind of air ram to open them with.

    dangeourbrain
    Full Member

    Why would you recommend cat6?

    Possibly control of the gate, without the final motor spec you won’t know what’s needed, 4 core and a cat6 will do for almost every motor regardless of how its controlled you may not use it or all, you may only use two or three cores maybe all 8 but if you don’t need it:

    WiFi extender for the garden, garden office, just because…

    … Copper is “cheap”, pulling two wires instead of one is “cheap”, your floor, plaster work, making good etc are not.

    As I repeat daily to builders architects and the like, you can always not use the things that are there, you can’t use things that aren’t.
    If course they ignore me but they can charge a lot for the deviation when you change your mind next week.

    And what ever you do, don’t forget the 16A cabling a for a sex pond. [/] bbq area lighting.

    stumpyjon
    Full Member

    I wont get the public tresspassing,

    But you get lots of deliveries thrown over or go missing when white van man can’t work out how to get to your front door, you take too long to answer the intercom or just thinks it’ll be safe in the open because there’s a gate in the way.

    Edit electric gates and barriers always go wrong.

    DT78
    Free Member

    ah. I’m on corner plot with the drive on the side. front door has a differe t gate / entrance so parcel issue will be fine.

    going wrong possibly hence one of the questions was if anyone recommended a supplier!

    thanks for the tips on the cables

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