I know a few teachers. Ever one has either stepped down from senior roles, gone part time or taken early retirement
People like teacher do it because they care. It IMO leads them to push too hard. the result is stress and burnout.
Teachers do not have hours of work
That's a bit disingenuous AA. you of all people here know that legally we do but in practical terms that's ignored because 'things need doing'. That's one problem in itself. Of course those on the leadership scale don't even have that 'luxury' of 1265 to fall back on...
As someone who has survived 25 years in state education so far (and am still enjoying it and finding it worthwhile), I wish I had the answer for teachers/leaders who feel like the OP, but it's not easy to get out of that kind of thought/work loop once you spiral into it.
Not strictly true that - there are easy answers. Learn to say no, leave the profession or find a less toxic school. All three of those obviously come with big BUTs though...
I chose the latter a few years back and it was the saving of me. Stepped back from middle leadership to 'just' teach for a couple of years in schools where I didn't find everything the SLT and (more so) the Trust did abhorrent. Reminded me why I got into this in the first place and re-energised me to go again. Now happily back as a Head Of Year and seconded to SLT with a much healthier perspective on the whole thing in a school that does genuinely care about its staff at all levels.
It's easy from the outside but OP, I'd say...
(assuming from your post that you're either outside of the UK or in a private school? So some of this might not be relevant)
Talk to anyone IRL about this you feel you can, not just us anonymous muppets here.
If you have faith in your Principal/Head/DSL, speak to them formally.
Get in touch with your GP.
Try to decide whether it's you, the job or the school that's the issue (hopefully it's not all three). The answer to that ought to give you a starting point on possible solutions.
If you want to 'talk' teacher to teacher, by all means drop me a DM. Can't promise any solutions, but I'm more than willing to listen(read)
That’s a bit disingenuous AA. you of all people here know that legally we do but in practical terms that’s ignored because ‘things need doing’
So legally we do but in practise we don't, looking from the outside it certainly seems worse in SLT
Mrs Pondo out with an old friend at Previous School (for the moment, leaving shortly) tonight, has screen-shotted a proper bridge-burning cheerio email from head of sixth, lots of Animal Farm references (the Orwell book, not the bestiality film). Reminds me they've had more than half their teaching staff leave this summer, many to other teaching jobs but not all.
Thanks everyone for the time you've taken to reply. There's lots to think about, not least the fractions of the problem that are mine, the role's and the profession's. I'm certain that I'm the creator of a significant part of the stress, but not so certain about the degree to which I can change the part of me that generates it (the part that wants to do everything 'well' and refuses to fail). I'm equally certain the role and my boss are also variables and if I had an honest conversation there would be significant efforts made to help (I've a good boss and I respect him a great deal). How to go about doing that in the context of my role, the available money and the limited number of people who could possibly take on more isn't clear.
There's much more to write, but now probably the best thing is to sleep. Thanks again, ILF.
So legally we do but in practise we don’t, looking from the outside it certainly seems worse in SLT
Based on surveys, average hours worked by UK classroom teachers each week usually comes out at around 48-50 (headteachers 60+, so I guess other SLT somewhere in the middle at around 55?).
1265 / 39 comes out at 32.5 contracted (paid) hours each week for a mainscale/UPS teacher so the vast majority of teachers do a huge amount of effectively unpaid work every week. That doesn't take into account work done during holidays...
There is no limit on hours SLT can be asked/instructed to work for their flat salary - was never quite sure how that one got past the unions at any point? I guess how much of a burden that is depends on the Head/Governors/Trust of any given school. I know ours is pretty good and where possible people are given time to fulfill their roles (or given roles that will not overfill their time). I also know that not all schools are that considerate or have the funding to do that...
Finally come back to this thread, 4 months later and reread all the contributions. Firstly, thanks again to everyone that took time to respond, it was really helpful. I was in a deep hole, deeper than I realised.
About a week after posting I was riding from work home on my motorbike far too fast (rushing back to be home for child). And I had a sort of epiphany... I didn't 'need' to do it (it being work like this). I rolled off the gas and that in itself was enough to feel differently and decide to take positive steps.
I spoke to my boss and my bosses boss. They were understanding and helpful and I'm transferring to another school that's closer and has a more defined role, which feels like an opportunity to reset and restart on a new, hopefully more sustainable, track. Ultimately it gives me a chance to try again to do something I do want to do.
Thanks again. Onwards.
Good stuff
Good for you 👍
I got to the dizzying heights of head of faculty a few years ago, started thinking about applying for SLT roles, but it all got a bit much.
Took a step sideways/backwards doing a STEM role and primary liaison work.
I'm now a couple of weeks off leaving secondary education to work in a primary.
I'm relieved (a bit saddened too) to be leaving secondary teaching. It's not the same thing I signed up for any more.
It's tough well done for being proactive.
I just stepped up for a 12 week acting up to faculty head role but it already looks like it'll be 6 months add into that losing 3 staff gaining 2.5 new staff and possibly losing one more. I've been in position 6 weeks and come June I will have redone the faculty timetable 8 times trying to limit disruption to pupils as much as I can.
That's before the day job.
To be honest I will step down in August unless they massively make it worth the extra stress
Sounds like really positive changes, well done and good luck.
I’ve said it many times on these threads… the most important word in your work vocabulary is “no”. You do what can be done in the time allotted
This is easy to say and difficult to implement for two reasons:
1) people need to give meaning to their work. The idea of spending so much of our short lives on a bullshit job is unbearable for most people. It's more damaging to admit that our jobs don't matter than it is to work the longer hours - for many people
2) some people, like the OP, have jobs that actually mean something. If they clock off and head to the pub at 4.30pm, no-one will ever pick up the slack. It doesn't mean that the Q2 TPS report for WIP overages won't be complete for divisional HQ - it means that little Amelia or Ali won't learn to ****ing read.
Saying JuSt WoRk LeSs, YoU iDiOt isn't helpful
Well done i_like_food.
I had a similar thing a couple of years ago. I’d left a job at a school that I was quite well respected at to go into SEND teaching. I’d got pretty good at realising what stuff I was being asked to do that had no impact on a child’s learning/wellbeing or that of a teacher. I’d be the a*se in meetings who would just ask the question, “Why and who are we doing this for?”
Anyway, I started at the SEND school. I absolutely loved the teaching. The kids were amazing. It turns out the SLT were just desperate to do anything that would lead to a positive OFSTED inspection/rating. They’d got used to no one questioning decisions or policies because half the teaching staff were HLTAs and not teachers. It led to a member of SLT (who wasn’t a qualified teacher) threatening to put me on a support plan because my feedback wasn’t obvious in the children’s books. I provided her with some recent peer reviewed articles on best practice in giving feedback, showed her the DfEs document on reducing teacher workload and also handed in my notice at the same time.
I looked around for other teaching jobs locally. Every job description just looked like I’d be jumping from the frying pan into the fire. I ended up looking at international jobs almost as a laugh. Trouble is I found one that I genuinely liked the look of! Applied for it and got it. It’s the best thing I’ve ever done. None of the pressure of OFSTED. We still have inspections but they’re supportive. I have a long school day, but I get a decent amount of PPA time. One of the big positives was that I volunteered to write the feedback policy so I left out any mention of a need for written feedback and any need for how much or how often.
I was very lucky to have a supportive OH who was happy for me to make the move. I probably would never have applied had she not said to go for it. She’s still not here but comes regularly and will be making the move soon. The boy is now grown up although he’s stayed out here for months at a time.
Maybe have a look at teaching abroad if that becomes an option and things don’t improve massively with your new role. Good luck with it all.
it means that little Amelia or Ali won’t learn to **** read.
It doesn't mean that though doesn't it? In fact the whole problem for lots of teachers is that they've convinced themselves or been convinced that statements like this are true. If little Amelia doesn't learn to read it's due to a whole string of failings from her parents, through the school, all the way up to government level. It's not because a teacher decided to finish at a regular time or work their contracted hours.
Sometimes there are time critical things to deal with in schools like child protection issues but more usually the things that stop teachers going home at 4.30 are bits of admin or this misguided notion that them working an extra few hours will save little Amelia.
some people, like the OP, have jobs that actually mean something. If they clock off and head to the pub at 4.30pm, no-one will ever pick up the slack. It doesn’t mean that the Q2 TPS report for WIP overages won’t be complete for divisional HQ – it means that little Amelia or Ali won’t learn to **** read.
Even when in senior nursing roles ( the biggest I had 80 odd staff reporting to me ) I still did this. Identified the priorities and did them first and when I ran out of time the nonsense stuff didn't get done. when asked why not I pointed out that I had run out of time and asked those senior to me to set my priorities. It didn't make me popular at all but I protected my core work so the equivalent of little Amelia did get taught to read and the quarterly reports were not done.
Its not easy to do it a culture of presenteism and "must get the job done" You have to break that mindset and be strong
it also helped me of course in that I could use the code of conduct to back up my stance. One senior job COO tried to tell me my primary loyalty was to the organisation. ( a housing association) I was able to use the code of conduct to tell them that actually it was first to my patients, second to the regulatory body, 3rd to my staff and only then to the organisiation. that made me very popular as you can imagine but it was legally watertight. I was under the regulatory bodies code of conduct correct. I could legally ignore instructions from above that put me in conflict with my duties under the code.
the other thing I did was always make sure I took a break and actually left the building for a short while. This is essential to good working hence why the breaks are legally mandated as you are actually more efficient. You achieve more in 7.5 hours with a proper break than you do in 8 hours without one.
I'm assuming the teaching profession has a similar code of conduct. without one its harder to do this. My senior management could not touch me for this because of the code of conduct.
more usually the things that stop teachers going home at 4.30 are bits of admin
This is, to be Frank, bollocks.
Any thoughts of becoming an Academic at a University - Education side of things. You'd be snapped up with a PhD and SLT experience ? Uni's are short of good staff at the moment.
This is, to be Frank, bollocks.
When are you doing your admin tasks then? During the school day? Seriously, the teaching profession needs to give itself a bit of tough love and actually start applying the sort of professional standards TJ is talking about, i.e. being realistic about what is achievable, focusing on the core tasks and not giving in to the relentless treadmill of asking ever more of teachers and teachers doing it in the hope of saving some poor little mite.
I don’t think that there is an equivalent in education. In my experience I if the leadership team want you gone you are on your way unless your incredibly talented and resilient
Buy TJ I do appreciate your contributions to these threads
...and not giving in to the relentless treadmill of asking ever more of teachers and teachers doing it in the hope of saving some poor little mite.
Yes, yes, a 100 times yes!
The current wheeze in our school is timed round-robins done on Google docs. Asking teachers for info on students for Sen, ADHD or ASD assessments.
You click on the link, are presented with 10+ boxes to be filled in, and a timer starts counting down from 30 minutes - the form probably takes 15-20mins to do if filled out properly.
If you close it it doesn't restart, just carries on counting down, and if not filled in or finished you get shitty emails.
Maybe fine if you're a core subject teacher. But if you teach 50% of KS3 + GCSE classes (about 400 students in total) then like me you're getting loads of these each week. Where am I meant to magic an extra 4 or 5 hours from?
Proper bullshit!
* Edit...if you're wondering why I'm posting during the day, I'm off sick today with severe sinusitis.
Made worse by forcing myself into school for the last 2 weeks, even though I've been ill and feeling like crap the whole time.
A big issue for teachers is that it's often 'easier' to go into school sick, than it is to set cover, sort out resources remotely, and then deal with the fallout of being away from school.
If little Amelia doesn’t learn to read it’s due to a whole string of failings
Of course that's true. The difference is that that failure is meaningful (unlike a lot of bullshit private sector jobs), and that the teacher doesn't want to be the last link in the chain to fail - even if they've been set up for failure and they're trying to compensate for that by chucking a whole load of their personal time at the problem.
unless teaching has changed radically in the last ten+ years since my wife left, it seems to be a 'industry' that exploits and is entirely reliant on the goodwill of the type of person who chooses education.
there isn't enough, there isn't finished and if you don't break yourself trying, you haven't tried hard enough.
I don't miss it, and I didn't even work there...
There is a general teaching council with a code of conduct and government standards. I cannot open it and do not know enough about teaching to suggest how to use it
https://www.gtce.org.uk/teachers/thecode/index.html
For nursing the one I used was " always put the needs of the patients first" or something similar. So if I was being told to do some bureaucratic exercise that had no or little value to patient care but took up time I could use for patient care I would refuse and cite the code of conduct to back me up. When I was asked why had I not done this thing or attended that meeting and I used this to the consternation of my bosses and it really amused me to watch them flounder.
It tough to do this sort of thing on your own - especially for teaching I guess and concerted action would help.
it seems to be a ‘industry’ that exploits and is entirely reliant on the goodwill of the type of person who chooses education.
It is a profession primed for burnout in that it attracts committed individuals who want to make a differance and then heaps ever more on them. Almost every thing teachers are asked to do is justifiable in some way so every extra thing gets passed through and hardly anything ever gets taken away.
There is a general teaching council with a code of conduct and government standards.
In Scotland, every school has a Working Time Agreement. Basic time figures are set but the detail is agreed between the school management and the union reps.
It is an incredibly powerful mechanism for managing workload provided the reps are worth their salt and the management abide by it. Even if they don't abide by it, the fact that it exists can be used to force their hand. Unfortunately it doesn't really work for people in promoted posts. I'm not sue if there is anything similar in England, from the sound of it I would think not.
I know a couple of people who jumped from teaching into the civil service by getting jobs at the Department for Education.
Keep looking here and see if anything pops up that might take your fancy
https://www.civilservicejobs.service.gov.uk/csr/index.cgi
@blackflag thanks, very interesting... Think I might have a punt at the Governor of Gibraltar vacancy! Got to be in it to win it.
Oh, I'm glad I caught the updates to this thread! 🙂 Well done OP, all the best. 🙂
Was chatting to Mrs Pondo about the workload she had back in Srptember just this week - she had three frees over two weeks, plus a form group. How the hell you're supposed to plan and mark, plus your meetings, parent queries, parent evenings, random incidents, interventions, etc etc etc, I've no idea. And she's experienced - how the hell do NQTs cope?
She's off to do some supply at a 6th form college shortly, a non-commital toe back in the water. I hope she gets on ok, as she loves teaching, but whatever she does I've got her back. 🙂