[Closed] Woodburnerists; how much did you do yourself/cost.

Never. Did the lot. I built my house from scratch myself though. I did once get a man in to lay one carpet but that was because it came with free fitting. 🙂

Not dead yet

Professionals did mine for the previous owner according to the certs stapled to the wall in the leccy cupboard.

Found too many regulatiom contraventions to list.

Most dangerous being distance from fixed combustables and a modified coal skuttle with the bottom cut out and welded to a plate for a register plate./flue adaptor.

So i ripped it out , and refitted as per regs with the help of my dad and grandad.. Infact we ripped it out again this year and fitted a new stove.

Choose your installer carefully

Supply/fit liner and stove, inc hetas certificate will be around £1200 - £1500 for the 904/904 grade liner. This would include the plate above the stove etc.

No professional fitting here, just installed as per the regs by me and my father in law.

Liner, register plate, micafil insulation, cowel & fitting = £1100ish for us. Normal terrace in Kent.
Got 3 quotes and all around that price.

I've done 2 stoves in our house. The first one was in the lounge so needed about 12m of liner and rockwool surround. With the register plate, cowl and vitreous pipe it was around £1k plus stove. I rather stupidly fitted the liner myself which involved 2 slings around the chimney, me standing on top of the chimney to feed the liner in and my wife belaying me.

The second time i took advantage of the scaffolding we had up whilst redoing the roof to install the liner into the upstairs bedroom. That was FAR easier... i do recommend scaffolding...

I rather stupidly fitted the liner myself which involved 2 slings around the chimney, me standing on top of the chimney to feed the liner in and my wife belaying me.

It's easier to pull the liner up from the bottom....

The bad news - Failure to get a HETAS Certificate of Compliance signing off the installation can lead to a £5K fine. Also you won't be able to provide this if you ever want to sell your house.

You can do the work yourself and then get it signed off by a HETAS engineer (if you can pursued one) but when I checked this route engineer wanted £500. TBH I would just get the professionals in which would be around £1200 ish round here in Gloucestershire. It's tempting to try and reduce cost of installation but remember a badly fitted stove can kill!

And if you repeat that often enough tony folks will believe it .

You can also have your stove signed off by local building control provided you have followed due process and called them out at the correct points in the install.

It's tempting to try and reduce cost of installation but remember a badly fitted stove can kill!

Willing to bet more folk die from misuse of log burners than from bad instalation ill be honest.

Slumbering the stove for extended periods dreaming of overnight burns just to save a few seconds relighting in the morning and not sweeping the chimney regularly.

Also stuart read up on the scottish building regulations ( not the english ones that get quoted on here) there are subtle differences to what you can and cant do.

Certificate of Compliance http://www.hetas.co.uk/consumer/certificate-of-compliance/

yep know you can go via BC but takes forever and cost is high

Injury related to Carbon Monoxide

Injury related to Carbon Monoxide

you need really to have heatas certification if you ever sell the house, I also expect if your house burns down, insurance co will check for installation certification or not pay out

I've just had log burner installed

register plate added, chimney tested, co2 detector, soot door installed and logburner (I supplied) installed

cost £580 with certificate by heatas registered installer, fully compliant

some of you are paying over the odds !!

the heatas fitters are told NOT to sign off others work, as they become liable, its not worth the risk for them

Did the lot myself to local regs for about 1100e. My insurance costs me about 30e a year more as it wasn't done by a registered professional.

This may help. http://www.stovefittersmanual.co.uk

I'll be doing this in my new house in a month or so. Get building control to sign it off.

I will se if I can get a quote from a local Hetas fitter first. If there's only a couple of hundred quid difference I'll let them do it.

"you need really to have heatas certification if you ever sell the house"

And this applys to scotland does it .... Strange how they never once brought it up when i bought my house.....

Or when my friend bought his house.....

Did mine myself which included having to put in a concrete hearth at the base of the chimney. Cost me £240 to get building control to sign it off who were very helpful and came out quickly. Once when I'd fitted the liner and concreted the hearth and then once when I'd finished.
Would definitely use scaffolding if I were to do it again though.
I also used the Stove Fitters Manual.

I also expect if your house burns down, insurance co will check for installation certification or not pay out

If your house burns down I would expect any paperwork you had would be turned into ash.....

yep know you can go via BC but takes forever and cost is high

They normally turn up same day if you phone first thing, the way they work is pretty short notice, e.g. if you need footings inspected prior to concrete pour, you're not going to wait 3 days. I've never waited more than a few hours for an inspection.

I know I need a liner and a flue pipe, at what point did you lot get the experts in?

I'm a HETAS reg fitter. I fairly regularly just do the reg plate, liner and connecting up of the stove. The customer will do the 'building' part themselves to save some cash. Digging out, lining the hole, hearth etc.
I can then check the work is all okay and give guidance on clearance to combustibles should they be planning a mantle/surround.

HETAS in Scotland technically doesn't apply but is coming in through the back door. It's being demanded more and more by insurance companies, letting agencies, developers and even BC themselves are palming it off when there's a stove in a new build. Good luck getting them to check anything. They appear to be well understaffed and the staff they do have are not exactly pushing themselves. (by their own admission I should add!)

Back on topic - don't buy the cheapest liner you can find.
- Don't be shy about asking to look at recent work the fitter has done, I'd be quite happy to do this. Most of the really, really bad work I've had to fix is not DIY but by 'proper' fitters.
- Burn dry wood
- Burn dry wood
- Get a moisture meter, check your wood is dry before burning.

Two stoves here, freestanding one I did myself and had the inset fitted by a registered installer. Paid £1000 - £550 for the poujoulat liner and £450 for two people to install it.

The bad news - Failure to get a HETAS Certificate of Compliance signing off the installation can lead to a £5K fine. Also you won't be able to provide this if you ever want to sell your house.

don't buy the cheapest liner you can find.

How do you know what's good and what's not besides the different grades of alu?

i've done both the burners in my house myself, no liners. but then my father in law is a sweep so i know the chimneys are sound and the installation is good.

i have one burner in another place that we paid to have installed because we rent it out, and lets just say i went to a supposedly reputable and indeed large company, paid a lot of money, it was signed off, then had to get down to the threat of legal action to have the flue installed not only correctly but safely.

so if you do get a pro in, make sure you thoroughly inspect everything yourself.

grades of alu

Stainless steel or enameled steel please.

Sorry on drunk holiday autopilot mode, different grades of stainless..

Heras is coming next year. I would like to do as much as possible myself( ex plaster so hearth/fireplace etc all no worries. I don't want to pay a fortune for jobs I can do myself, but if I get it done afore hetas I will obviously save on having to pay £500 to have something I will have taken a lot of care over rubber stamped.

I have a strange one. Had 3 quotes for fitting, all Hetas. The first two said we need a liner. The last chap said no way do we and they were just trying it on. It's a 1970s detached one off build, open living space on the 1st floor as we are on a valley. Who do I believe??

You might not "need" a liner but your stove will draw better with one, the chimney will run hotter and need less cleaning, and you thus reduce the risk of chimney fire. Do you want a liner? Probably.

Depends if your staying put, HETAS certificate required and must comply with building regs which may flag up if selling in the future.

Breaking into chimney breast to make connections, be ready for a lot of mess 😀

Not sure where your based but in the NE wales area there was a guy going round purporting to be a registered installer which we nearly used, "No need for a liner", when we spoke to our stove supplier he got straight onto trading standards!

Tang, 2v1...... 1970's house would have been built with a liner, probably clay, probably the worst material to build a chimney with. To conform to regs, no, you don't "need" a liner, but you would probably want one if you want a problem free installation.
Ask the chap who said the others were trying it on if he has a digital flue draft meter and get him to explain the difference in readings from different chimney construction, including flexible liners with and without insulation.

"No need for a liner", when we spoke to our stove supplier he got straight onto trading standards!

As stated above , our house 79/80 build class one flue with open fire with clay liners, when we tried installing the stainless steel, cant remember if 5 or 6",liner it caught on the cement joints as we were pulling it through, had to break into chimney from outside to knock out restriction as it is we are detached, would be areal mess if semi with flue on the partition wall
As i said need to use people who know what they're doing

Thanks guys, good advice.

I walked into our local shop, and asked the friendly guy there for some prices. Wowsers. Talk about overpriced. He reckoned for the double wall flue alone I'd be looking at £2k, plus the cost of the burner (cheapest in there was £800). This excluded fitting. I laughed and walked out.
Needless to say I'll be doing this myself with the help of the father in law.

It's easier to pull the liner up from the bottom....

You think? Pull from top down every time

Don't put the liner in upside down, bodge it builders favorite trick.

The cost of materials out of our quote of £1100 would have been around £450-500, so if you're prepared to do it yourself yes you would save a fair bit.
Having seen the guy standing on the chimney stack wrestling with the liner bouncing it down the chimney, I was happy to pay the extra.
Plus if you pay building control to sign it off the savings would be less.

Having said that if we lived in a bungalow and wanted to fit a twinwall flue I would do it myself and get it signed off. Helped a mate do his and all was easy.

Sorry to hijack but this thread got me looking again...

We've got a plastered over fireplace in our lounge at present with an intact chimney running right up through the centre of the house.

My Missus has said she wants it renovating and a "Fire" putting in, her idea of a Fire is one that runs on Gas or leccy with pretend fire, I grew up with a proper fire that me and my Dad put in (mostly my Dad TBH).
Unfortunately the SO is adamant that a wood/coal burning fire would kill our children to death...

I'm really just not keen on increasing our gas or leccy bill just to have a pretend fire...

Anyway I went off reading the interwebs after seeing this thread and ended up looking at boiler stoves, which to me seem ideal.

It's not an open fire so should help alay her fears a bit, but most importantly we could plumb a stove boiler into the houses Heating circuit apparently, and still have the wasteful (but convenient) Gas boiler (and even the barely ever used imersion heater in the tank upstairs should we ever really need it) so we are covered for many eventualities...

I've explained and proposed this to her, and didn't get a total refusal to consider it...

By my count We've got seven Rads (of various sizes) around the house at present, one of which would need to be turned into a "Heatsink" rad for the Stove boiler (Either the kitchen or the lounge downstairs I reckon), quite how this all affects sizing the Stove/boiler I'm not sure yet, but other than that I can't see too many major blockers... just yet.

Anyone running a Stove boiler? care to advise? pitfalls, ease of operation, maintainablilty, cost of installation (DIY or professional), etc?

are you running your stove almost every day almost all day .....

if not you will be heating alot of excess water(in the water jacket) everytime your boiler fires up --- or every time you light your stove for the evening.

i looked into it - seemed like alot of hassle and expense if your not there to keep the stove running all winter.

how bigs your house ? my stove with the eco fan keeps my house more than warm enough.

It's a three bed semi with far too much glass and poor insulation that probably needs addressing first...
There's normally someone home, though I doubt my Wife or MIL would keep the fire going TBH, so realistically it would be me lighting and maintaining fires every evening and over the weekends...

And of course we'd keep the Gas boiler, my idea would be more to retain the convenience of the Gas boiler, but add the stove as an extra heat source to contribute to the heating and reduce total Gas use.

I did read about installs where a Stove boiler is plumbed to a well insulated (and appropriately sized) hot water tank to use as a heat store and provide hot water for both Heating and taps, but is seemed like more faff than simply adding it to the Heating system, although the layout of the house might suit this sort of setup...

"but add the stove as an extra heat source to contribute to the heating and reduce total Gas use."

which it will do a better job of for the usage you describe if you do not fit a boiler stove with water jacket. +reduced costas stove is cheaper and less fitting faff.

the set up you describe makes sense if you work from home and can keep heat in the system during the winter.

the increase in water will mean that you actually pay more in gas to heat up the water jacket fluids thermal mass each time your boiler fires.

In answer to the OP...we're getting a wood burning stove fitted in the living room in our new gaff. We haven't moved in yet, as it needs a fair amount of work...one thing I did at the weekend was remove the plastered over fireplace to reveal the builders opening.

That's pretty much all I'm going to do myself other than the hearth...I'll get a fitter to install the stove and flue.

I've heard stories of the stoves not being fitted correctly so will research regs etc so I can check it over.

I'm going to order a rough cut black slate hearth (possible tiles) from a local quarry - I need to check the depth required though, as I think it's changes recently

I'm going to order a rough cut black slate hearth (possible tiles) from a local quarry

DOH

Am thinking of changing the open fire at home to a stove. There's a big slate hearth already there to stand it on and a modern clay pipe lining in the chimney. The chimney is in an internal wall that was once a gable end, built of sandstone blocks with lime mortar. Placing the stove out onto the hearth in front of the existing iron fire surround would require a horizontal or sloping flue, turning the corner up into the chimney.
Above the fireplace and overhanging it by about 20cm is a heavy oak mantelpiece, which would therefore be about 50cm above the rear of a fitted stove. Does anyone know, would this represent a (combustible) problem?

HETAS are a joke.

The whole stove installation thing is a mess. HETAS talk up the complexity of the installation to generate business.

The hardest part of my installation was installing a twin wall flue and only because of the roofing work to make it weathertight afterwards. I got my builder to do it. I have heard a lot of stories of botched jobs.

The regs are very straight forward and there is some excellent guidance on line.

My stove was installed to the regs but the building officer refused to get involved at all. I was considering putting a formal complaint in, as I felt the Council were not doing their job but reckoned that if he was forced to become involved he would just be a complete arsehole and I could never win.

So I have perfectly safe, not "signed off", woodburner.

50cm above the rear of a fitted stove. Does anyone know, would this represent a (combustible) problem?

Although you have a clay liner flue do not be tempted to do without a steel liner - I've heard from a number of sources that you can easily end up with goo falling down out of the flue and ruining the fireplace.

Above the fireplace and overhanging it by about 20cm is a heavy oak mantelpiece, which would therefore be about 50cm above the rear of a fitted stove. Does anyone know, would this represent a (combustible) problem?

From memory I think combustibles should be >600mm away according to the regs, I think that was the case 3 years ago......might be wrong though!

"you can easily end up with goo falling down out of the flue and ruining the fireplace."

how does it get round the sealed in adaptor plate ?

fwiw - 5 ft of single wall flue into an adaptor into a clay liner.

the only time we have had tar drip back was what caused us to rip the whole long out in the first place and found the coal scuttle used as an adaptor.

Stoves are not ash-free and I'd be wary of installing slate - especially if it had a rough surface. You will need to wipe around the stove every now and then and a smooth/polished surface would be better for that.

hmmm...maybe I need to have a rethink.

I prefer the rough cut look over a smooth finish...maybe I need to have a look at some different cuts of slate.

how does it get round the sealed in adaptor plate ?

I believe Twinw4ll will back me up on this one.

You will need to wipe around the stove every now and then and a smooth/polished surface would be better for that.

Ours is polished slate and it scruffs and scratches really easily - I'd go for rough slate if I was doing it again....

Mines rough slate - looks fine after 3 years 3 sweeps (stove out sweep) and a change of stove.

TR you might find the odd installation into clay liners that are fine, there are more problems with clay liined flue than any other. Clay is a poor insulator and commonly installed in late 60's and 70's houses with no insulation around them, resulting in too much heat loss from the flue gases and condensation. Sump adaptors work better but are not guaranteed.
Highlandman, distance above an appliance is not typically mentioned. As a rule of thumb then the distance from the side to a combustible material would apply to the top, some are 460mm, some are more, some are less. Some specify the projection of the beam as a consideration. Check the instructions.
gobuchal. Building control are obliged to sign off installations under a building notice. In my experience some LA's are more helpful than others but it is the law. There is a procedure to follow though.

Installing stoves is not rocket science, if you are familiar with the regs, and follow best practice you won't go far wrong and can save some money.
Some installations are easy, some are a complete nightmare! Some installers are great, some aren't worth a wink 😉 Choose your battles wisely.

Oh, and some liners go up, most go down, depends on the situation.

As timer says some installs are easy some are a nightmare , every job is different in some way or another.
Always refer to manufacturers instructions and guidelines and if in doubt don't be afraid of ringing them up, most good manufacturers only too happy to keep you right, some not so though.

Anyone running a Stove boiler? care to advise? pitfalls, ease of operation, maintainablilty, cost of installation (DIY or professional), etc?

have run, don't currently

pros:
* you get a nice fire that heats the whole house which is all nice and jolly on christmas day when you're half cut and half asleep etc

cons:
* It's [b]expensive [/b]to link up properly with a gas boiler, and a load of plumbing work.
* You'll have very little control over where the heat leak rad goes, they have to work from gravity flow which dictates your heat leak location.
* You'll never, ever, ever, pay back the "savings" you get by burning wood.
* Woodstove style backboiler stoves can be a "little bit" hit and miss over what heat you get into the house
* 15 or 20kw equates to a frankly scary amount of wood, prepare to be constantly feeding it
* running the whole house on wood for a whole winter? you'll need four or five tipper loads of wood and that means a massive log store.

if you forget wood and run a stove on coal, you can load up in the morning and it'll go until evening, when you'd need to de-ash/re-load for overnight, it's certainly possible to get a good routine going for this even if you're out most of the day.

the increase in water will mean that you actually pay more in gas to heat up the water jacket fluids thermal mass each time your boiler fires

if linked up right they should be plenty separated when the fire is out (note "if" and "should")

OK, I think I might need to change my ambitions and perhaps it would be a good idea to try a smaller wood burner project first just to get my eye in.

My Garage is going through a bit of a general renewal at present so a small stove in there might be perfect for me...
separate from the house (but in a block) Concrete floor, Block walls, the new roof is a (non-asbestos) corrugated fibre board could/should I go straight up through that or should I take the flue out through the wall? and ultimately, what level and types of building Regs will apply to an out building / workshop Vs house