[Closed] Why no SNP candidates in England ?

Dunblane, city...

LMFAO

Makes Midsomer look like Mega City One in comparison. And yes, we did have a manned station at the time, usually looking in my schools direction.

Of course you need a few armed officers spread about the place, so they can respond to any potential incident. To not have them would open themselves up to massive criticism should the worst happen and they were not able to respond for an extended length of time, vs virtually no downside of having them, save the hand wringing of a minority of worried whingers...

No one was saying we shouldn't have armed officers, just that there's not need to have cops walking around with rifles in Aviemore or Castle Douglas.

Defo a roll, and not very good yins at that.

Some proper rolls
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whatnobeer - Member

No one was saying we shouldn't have armed officers, just that there's not need to have cops walking around with rifles in Aviemore or Castle Douglas.

The change in the rules didn't mean that we should have more armed officers- the difference is basically should armed officers be routinely armed or should they only be armed when there's a specific need for it. Or in other words, do you want your armed officers to be slower to respond because they're kept operationally ready or unready. I really don't like it tbh but it's a bit nuanced.

The other issue was the sending of said armed officers to non-armed-response calls. Which again, controversial but did amount to "well it's either that or they spend most of their time eating doughnuts." I think if you need a copper in a hurry, you'd rather get one fast and possibly they have a gun, rather than waiting longer for an unarmed one because the nearest one was an armed unit.

One of those things where I know what I'd like the answer to be but I don't know if I'm right...

Basically the numbers of beat officers has dropped, to keep the number of officers visible some you wouldn't normally see had to respond to normal calls.
The question becomes do you, as a trained and competent officer, leaving a live weapon in locked car or take it with you? What are the consequences of someone getting the weapon out of the car?
So a trained fire arms officer responds to a speeding call and had his weapon with him because he perceives that as the lesser of two evils.

Ooh, check me out, I live in a city, Dahlings.

Ooh, check me out, I live in a city, Dahlings.

Sadly having a cathedral does not automatically mean that a place is a city - and in this case it doesn't - very sorry to rain on your parade, time is a great healer!

One of those things that happens in England, IIUC, is that armed officers are out and about responding to normal calls. The serious kit is in a safe in their car. It's become a political hot potato in N Scotland and the media are all over it. I think this tells you more about the media than policing.

They could be sat in their base with a bored expression waiting for the phone to ring.

Has anyone seen cops walking round with rifles in Aviemore? I'm not up with the news.

nemesis - Member
Which chance was that mt?

To vote for an independent Scotland.

I think it was holstered sidearms that people were complaining of rather than rifles etc.

Apparently the number of beat officers in Scotland is actually rising- though number of officers doesn't neccesarily mean more time spent out and about/available.

Ah, right mt. I see then that the self styled "45" are still behaving in the way that ensured they didn't win then. Nice work.

I'd call it a roll.

A friend of mine had a young cousin from america staying with him - he was sent down the shops to get 'half a dozen rolls'. He was too shy to say he wasn't sure what a 'roll' was out of any other context. So he went to the shop that seemed to sell the most different things and tentatively asked for 'half a dozen rolls' whilst still not really knowing what he was buying or even if he was in the right shop to buy them in. The shop keeper replied 'Would you like a wee poke' - he didn't know if he was being threatened or propositioned.

Brechin also qualifies for city status if "cathedralgate" is true. It should also qualify for armed police...all of them...all the time..

I don't get the point odf an anti-westminster but pro-europe SNP.

Brechin also qualifies for city status if "cathedralgate" is true. It should also qualify for armed police...all of them...all the time..

As does Elgin, but officially none of them are for Government purposes.

I don't get the point odf an anti-westminster but pro-europe SNP.

or to put it another way I like bikes but it does not mean I like them all

I don't get the point odf an anti-westminster but pro-europe SNP.

Don't get me and THM started, dozens and dozens of pages of this on the Referendum thread. An independent Scotland using the £ and not setting it's own interest rates or able to support it's own banks (assuming it had any). Or using the euro and having all that Greek liability.

Re: "hating the English" the SNP are smart enough to speak of Westminster as anything else is tantamount to racism but a big part of their support is very much anti-English. They certainly want "our" money as a mansion tax and 50p tax rate will be paid largely by those in England

As the SNP policy is for full fiscal autonomy [ and has been for some time] its quite hard to argue they want "your" taxes. Clearly they want independence from "your taxes".
Not this again 🙄

English nationality and based residents ranting about the SNP hating them [ whilst freely admitting how much they hate the SNP] and accusing them of being racist .
Of the irony and the hypocrisy of it all.

a big part of their support is very much anti-English

Lets not do all this all over again with the same lazy thinking

but a big part of their support is very much anti-English

And yet the terms like "sweaty", "jock", "braveheart wannabies shouting freedom"(Ernies,can't remember the exact wording)all came from English posters on the indy thread.

I don't get the point odf an anti-westminster but pro-europe SNP.

SNP believe that union with Westminster (well, the UK) sees Scotland treated badly but believes that union with Europe would see them treated well.

It's not that complex is it?

They certainly want "our" money as a mansion tax and 50p tax rate will be paid largely by those in England

When you say "they" I'm assuming you mean the Scots generally rather than the SNP - given what you've described there is what Labour in Scotland having been saying, rather than the SNP?

oliverd1981 - Member

I don't get the point odf an anti-westminster but pro-europe SNP.

Do you understand pro-UK but anti-Europe arguments?

It's not that complex is it?

Still they have some mud to fling in response

Epicsteve beat me to it. Unless Jim Murphy has given up and applied to join the SNP
" but a big part of their support is very much anti-English. "

Any evidence for your sweeping statement Jambalaya?

I suppose that unfortunately they can't see beyond the braveheart type (because yes, of course they exist (see above) just not in the numbers that some would claim) just wanting complete freedom from any outsiders. To suppose that all scots are that way inclined (even the ones who apparently were brave enough to vote 'Yes') just shows up ignorance. Plus ca change.

Indeed but the small number of posters like that are matched by the small number of anti scottish english.
IMHO its just a really lazy claim made by the hard of thinking
Jam and THM do not hate the SNP because they are Scottish and it would be as daft to claim that as it is to claim the SNP hate the english.
Give it a rest will you and discuss the issue rather than shout racist

SNP and Labour in Scotland have in effect said they want 50% tax bracket, mansion tax and bankers bonus tax all of which disproportionately effect the SE.

Also love the way SNP want more money for the Wales but not at Scotland's expense, so really it's not about need and fair redistribution. But that is no surprise for a party that doesn't believe in the UK.

The tax rate and mansion tax is being promoted by several parties. SNP aren't going to bring all funds raised to Edinburgh. It's seen, rightly or wrongly, as a money raising method to benefit all parts of the UK. The only people who at the moment seem to want to break up the union are UKIP, with their, geographically incorrect, Hadrians wall and us And them rhetoric.

SNP and Labour in Scotland have in effect said they want 50% tax bracket, mansion tax and bankers bonus tax all of which disproportionately effect the SE

Imposing or proposing?

Perfectly logical to be anti-Westminster (or more accurately pro devolved power) and pro-EU (in its original form). Indeed that is the most logical position.

I am a strong advocate of devolved power within a union - the best solution for all. But I am strongly against the blatant deceit and lies that YS/SNP used in order to deliver independence and still use now. They took/take political subterfuge to its most extreme conclusion and ultimately the lies over the currency were the main reason why the open goal was missed. If you put too much hot air into the ball, it will go over the bar even from the short range.

The one lesson that Labour should remember is that for the SNP its all about the end game. The end justifies the means whatever they are including lying, threatening (technical) default, endangering UK security just as global geopolitics are taking a very dangerous turn, lying about austerity and fiscal responsibility etc

Both the Labour party and the Tories are playing a dangerous game with an opponent who is single minded in their aim whatever the current "soft-focus" might suggest. Like matches, need to be handled with care or else you will get badly burnt.

THM - you dont half talk some amount of shite.

The one lesson that Labour should remember is that for the SNP its all about the end game. The end justifies the means whatever they are including lying, threatening (technical) default, endangering UK security just as global geopolitics are taking a very dangerous turn, lying about austerity and fiscal responsibility etc

Both the Labour party and the Tories are playing a dangerous game with an opponent who is single minded in their aim whatever the current "soft-focus" might suggest. Like matches, need to be handled with care or else you will get badly burnt.

😀

I try my best - its all about positioning as wee Nicola know only too well. 😉

Bon appetit

@epic actually you could say that for both Labour and the SNP as those taxes would impact the SE where neither has a great deal of support (ex inner London) so politically expedient. As we've seen with non-doms Labour are prepared to see a reduction in taxes to score politcal points. They don't care if non-dom taxes fall they just just put the top rate up to 60% instead, ditto the SNP

As stated I don't despise the SNP for being Scottish, just for the lies they tell and the fact that a break up of the UK is bad for both the Scots and for the rest of the UK

Many would consider your claim re hatred of the english to be nothing less than a lie You got called out on it by numerous posters and have made no comment on this since

As we've seen with non-doms Labour are prepared to see a reduction in taxes to score politcal points.

As stated I don't despise the SNP for being Scottish, just for the lies they tell

The dislike you and THM have for the SNP is rather amusing and the "spin" you will both use to justify it whilst calling the SNP liars and deceivers is at satirical levels.
They are no different form any other party in this area of truth and deception and the only difference is, for reasons that remain unclear, they elicit a very strong emotional reaction in some English loving unionists that makes debate difficult.

Called out ? What are you talking about ? Deeply ingrained hatred of the English visible in Scotland and in the SNP.

The BS and lies from the SNP are at a whole different level vs most politicians

teamhurtmore - Member

the open goal

Gently raises eyebrow. But if anyone still doubts how divorced you are from reality on the subject...

What are you talking about ?

Deeply ingrained hatred of the English visible in Scotland and in the SNP.

The BS and lies from the SNP are at a whole different level vs most politicians

* in fairness to THM he accepts he is biased towards them as i would accept I am biased against Tories [ not intended as a dig to be very clear]

Divorced and in the shit - now there is an apt analogy for one near miss!

"braveheart wannabies shouting freedom"(Ernies,can't remember the exact wording)all came from English posters on the indy thread.

Actually it was "saltire-waving mel gibson wannabies", I'm disappointed that you can't remember.

And firstly Duckman I'm not English, in fact as a Scotsman you probably have more in common the English than me. And secondly I recall you making anti-English comments on that thread, as an example according to you the English like to interfere in other people's countries, in contrast if it was left to peace-loving Scots no wars would occur, apparently.

e8Q

😉

And firstly Duckman I'm not English, in fact as a Scotsman you probably have more in common the English than me. And secondly I recall you making anti-English comments on that thread, as an example according to you the English like to interfere in other people's countries, in contrast if it was left to peace-loving Scots no wars would occur, apparently

1) Don't care where you are from. I judge people on how they act,not their background...unlike you as evidenced with your opinion of anything to do with the SNP. [b]Started any threads on how Alex Salmond giving his salary to charity is in some way a bad thing recently?[/b] Nothing personal there eh?

2) Nope,I didn't say any of that. Unless you are referring to me stating that Scots didn't want trident of course,in that case guilty as charged.Likewise an independent Scotland wouldn't have had the resources to get involved in steaming into Iraq,also a fantastic thing as unlike some...We don't GAS about being a world power or a perm seat on the UN security council.And the polls would suggest my fellow scots would agree that there are more important things than subs. If that is evidence of anti English comments or hatred then you must be scared to leave the house. Got anything better?
You two and Zulu tipped you true colours when you had a collective hissy fit about the mineral resources of the UK and where they were located. Hatred of the SNP who might take all that away from you eh? To quote THM "And they say this doesn't concern all of us."

Alasdair Darling is chipping in now SNP coalitions, pointing out they make no sense for Labour and that the SNP wouild be unlikely to vote down a Labour minority government as the risk of a Tory win would cost them dearly as it did with Callahan/Thatcher in 1979

[url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2015/11551763/Alistair-Darling-pressures-Ed-Miliband-to-reject-SNP-deal.html ]LINK: Darling presses Milliband to reject any deal with the SNP[/url]

I was questioning the phrase "called me out", yes I read the posts and people where disagreeing, that's perfectly fine of course. There is no logic to Scottish independence in my view other than a hatred of the English as Scotland would be a lot worse off and a small country with no influence politically or economically begging to join the EU - but we have been there done that debate ad nauseum already. Just explaining my thinking.

Agreed its a pointless debate so I won't mention it again here.

There is no logic to Scottish independence in my view other than a hatred of the English as Scotland

Just explaining my thinking.

you had a collective hissy fit about the mineral resources of the UK and where they were located

You have completely lost the plot duckman, I have never made any comment regarding "the mineral resources of the UK and where they were located". You are either confusing me with someone else or you've just made that up.

And I have absolutely no idea whatsoever what this is about :

Started any threads on how Alex Salmond giving his salary to charity is in some way a bad thing recently? Nothing personal there eh?

Again, are you confusing me with someone else? I have no idea what you're talking about. I have never commented on Alex Salmond's salary or what he gives to charity. I know nothing about his personal financial arrangements, nor do I care.

And as for, quote : [i]"unlike you as evidenced with your opinion of anything to do with the SNP"[/i] and : [i]"Hatred of the SNP"[/i] I have repeatedly said on here when discussing the general election that I hope Labour are wiped out in Scotland by the SNP. I have actually praised the SNP's commitment to social policies and their anti-austerity stance, although I am critical of their economic policies, eg taxation. (on this thread in fact I think)

If I was living in Scotland I would more than likely vote SNP this coming general election (although they are a little right-wing for me), I would need to see the complete list of local candidates before making a final decision. None of that suggests "hatred" of the SNP which falsely allege.

And finally, my comment concerning "saltire-waving mel gibson wannabies" was very clearly aimed at specific separatists who are motivated imo by primitive petty nationalism. It was [u]not[/u] a reference to Scots, although you want to pretend that it was. There was [u]no[/u] anti-Scottish sentiments behind the remark, although you want to pretend that there was.

In exactly the same way that despite me personally being strongly opposed to continued EU membership I regularly dismiss UKIP as a bunch of fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists, when asked to support them. But that comment in no logical way makes me anti-English.

I'm not comparing UKIP with the SNP btw, before you level that at me.

So, Ernie, tell us about your hatred for the English...

It goes back to the Battle of Agincourt nemesis.

Just imagine how much I hate myself then since presumably I'm half the same as you, half English and so totally conflicted in hating myself from both sides and then apparently also hating and loving the Scots simultaneously...

Because entire nations of people think the same way, don't they...

presumably I'm half the same as you

"Ethnically" I'm seven eighths French and one eighth Italian (Genoese). Not a drop of English or British blood in me.

I say ethically but I was born in France, have French nationality, was conscripted into the French armed forces for compulsory military service, and I learnt my trade in France, so a tad more than just ethically, although not much more - I'm a fairly typical South Londoner in every other respect.

Not a drop of English or British blood in me.

+1 well, only by living here which I suppose is a debate in itself... Mind you, also a South Londoner...

Bloody foreigners, coming over here, taking our (your) jobs!

Bloody foreigners, coming over here, taking over our arguments

Why are there any SNP candidates in Scotland? I would have thought they would all have retired or gone into hiding given the thrashing they received in the indy ref.

Sorry Ernie,I thought that was from Jambalaya,as it was him I had pointed to out that the offensive terms, including yours, came from your side of the wall.Your context obviously wasn't clear enough at the time as I wasn't the only person that mentioned it.

Ernie, I've read this somewhere but can't find the book. Was it Azincourt where the French knights rode over their mercenary Genoese crossbowmen? I'm fairly sure it was a battle in that series.

Sorry if this introduces an inner conflict.

Slowoldgit - that was the battle of Crecy. The Genoese were caught in a rain shower* & where as longbows can be quickly unstrung, crossbows cannot. Bowstrings stretch when wet so lose power.
The bolts of the Genoese were falling short & being mercenaries the French suspected they had been bought off by the English forces.

*allegedly.

So was it reported like that,or did the wandering minstrals go from town to town putting a state sponsored spin on it?

Why are there any SNP candidates in Scotland? I would have thought they would all have retired or gone into hiding given the thrashing they received in the indy ref.

Losing a battle doesn't mean losing the war.

Sorry Ernie,I thought that was from Jambalaya,as it was him I had pointed to out that the offensive terms, including yours, came from your side of the wall.Your context obviously wasn't clear enough at the time as I wasn't the only person that mentioned it.

Jambalaya's hatred for the SNP is so rabid I've given up reading his posts.

Sadly that's true - although Chinese water torture might be more appropriate.

Never mind the means, we will get there in th......

No Slowoldgit I didn't know about that. And yes I feel a torturous inner conflict now. I blame the English. Elderberry smelling sons of hamsters.

[img] [/img]

Just seen this :

Sorry Ernie,I thought that was from Jambalaya

No worries, but ffs don't confuse me with Jambalaya 🙁

@ernie_lynch - I can almost see that battlement from my house 🙂