A mildly interesting question popped into my head recently, which is, why do we see excessive drinking as such a 'badge of honour'.
We applaud those who get smashed and regale their stories of pints, cocktails and shots, before getting in during the early hours. We are impressed that they are back in the pub the next night, sinking more lager.
We are in awe of people functioning whilst hung over. Giving them kudos for getting the kids to football on a Sunday morning whilst hanging out of their backsides.
Is this just a celebration of what the human body can endure? Or some weird cultural thing? As though being able to drink so much and function is akin to running a Marathon or climbing Mount Everest? Do other countries have the same thoughts?
Do you have this culture in your social circles? Am I imagining this exists? Are you the hero the next morning that didnt pass away from alcohol poisoning?
Thoughts, experiences and discussion welcome!
Nope, not a badge of Honour IME. I meetup with my mates on a Saturday night as a social thing only. When I can get there. Some drink excessively some not at all. Their choice. Same group since I was 18.
We've actually had quiet talks with those who might be drinking a little too much through the medium of pisstake. It works
why do we see excessive drinking as such a 'badge of honour'.
On the contrary, what you'll probably get is four pages of holier-than-thou 'I haven't drank in x years because I'm better everyone who does' sort of comments.
Seriously though, I don't think anyone pretends it's a badge of honour, just something many/most do to enhance social occasions, bring a little sparkle to an otherwise dreary life, or block out the horror of stuff they don't like or can't deal with, or all three.
Like many I drank heavily socially in my younger years. Like many I drink much less now. I'm not sure I ever mixed in circles where lots of drinking to the point of being paralytic was a 'badge of honour' but drinking heavily and continuing to function probably was. The lad who could sink 10 pints and still be throwing shapes and pulling birds on the dancefloor was more of a legend than the sad sack thrown out for getting abusive and having a shirt covered in vomit.
It's probably a socioeconomic and geographic thing in the UK - drinking to get drunk, especially in public is a niche sport in people over 40 and far more prevalent in certain groups and areas than in others.
What I would say is there is a generation of much much less heavy drinkers on their way. There will always be outliers but younguns are way way more body and health conscious than we were. I cba to dig up the stats but the percentage of disposable income spent on gyms and supplements against booze in the under 25s is interesting.
I'm not sure it is anymore. Historically those who could "hold their beer" were always held in high esteem, but I'm not sure that's the case anymore.
In my group at least no-one will really notice if you drink Fanta, Guinness '0' or 8% IPA's, or if you have 1 beer or 10. They'll comment if you've drunk to much and are a nob (thankfully, a very rare occurrence now), but no weight is put on the volume consumed.
Maybe that's my group getting old and sensible, but it may be a societal things too.
Impressionable youth, peer pressure. Hero stories.
YouTube keeps suggesting a video titled Why drinkers don't like non-drinkers. Haven't watched it as I wouldn't consider myself to be either.
We applaud those who get smashed and regale their stories of pints, cocktails and shots, before getting in during the early hours.
We do?
I think it's getting less of a badge of honour than it used to be - which is not a bad thing.
Personally I have never been a heavy drinker but that is because I cannot stand being full on loss of physical control drunk. My brain always remains fully lucid so when I do get it wrong I am acutely aware that mistakes were made.
In earlier years I would be called a lightweight but it was generally easy enough to turn that around into a 'cheap night'. Drawback of course is it takes much less beer to feel a bit crap the following day.
I now go out with folks who really don't care about how much (or what) each other drink. We absolutely rip the piss if someone gets stupid drunk though.
I'd say it's more a phase of life most of us go through, rather than something that is admired.
In my latter 50s now I can't recall the last time I was bladdered. And even in my local people drink of course but I don't see them stumbling out of the door wasted.
I think there's a huge mix of reasons that drinking to excess was seen as acceptable. Not so sure it is currently .
Number one reason a vast and wealthy industry is behind the production and sake of alcoholic drink.
Number two a small reward at the end of the week/month/year/ day can make life seem more bearable It's a form of social control
We should have been looking much more carefully at various things that could have bad effects on our physical and mental/emotional health. Such as sugar and even use of screens and the internet.
It was very much a thing in my youth and social circle. Part of the attraction for me back then, was that I suffered from social anxiety and awkwardness which booze alleviated to a degree, helping me to have some kind of social life. The thought of approaching a girl I fancied whilst sober was absolutely terrifying! That's not healthy or a good reason I know, but that's how it was. I think there was also an element amongst my mates of getting into "scrapes" and subsequently regaling them as a group bonding thing. Calling someone a "legend" for sticking a traffic cone on his head and puking on the kebab shop window, that kind of thing 🙄 It pretty much all boiled down to poor social skills and immaturity.
I joined the army at 16 and did a full career and drinking was absolutely embedded in the culture at all levels. I started to tire of it after marriage and kids came along but it was still hard to avoid. I am an absolute lightweight these days and sometimes think of binning it completely.
I celebrate the fact that the younger generation are more mature, confident, health conscious and wiser than we were. It has to be a good thing.
why do we see excessive drinking as such a 'badge of honour'.
Define "excessive".
We applaud those who get smashed and regale their stories of pints, cocktails and shots, before getting in during the early hours. We are impressed that they are back in the pub the next night, sinking more lager.
Who is "we"? How many people do you actually know who are down the pub getting hammered night after night?
I agree thats it's less of a thing now. But it definitely used to be.
Yesterday i watched the Xmas episode of Yes Minister where Hacker gets shitfaced, makes an arse out of himself at Humphrey's leaving drinks, drives home drunk as a lord, gets stopped by police, and gets away scot-free. It's all brushed under the carpet because the home secretary drove home even drunker and caused a motorway pile up. Tee hee!
It's kind of shocking to see now how this was just played for laughs in 1985.
I've been chatting with friends recently about the subject of alcohol consumption and how it's been almost pushed on to society for a very long time.
It went along the lines of using alcohol as the backdrop for every occasion:
If you're celebrating something-have a drink.
If you're mourning-have a drink.
If you've had a tough day-have a drink.
If you've had a good day-etc etc, you get the idea?
Most of my friends are just doing what advertising has pushed on to them for all of their lives 🙁
I was guilty of bigging up my super human drinking ability and how great I was to be at work the next morning, but I'd like to think I've matured since then, so I'll leave it for the next generation (who surprisingly seem to be more mature than I was at their age!).
So as for the OP, my 2 pence is that we're playing the game that the corporations and powers-that-be* have set, and when we're winning at it, we like to cheer!
*conspiracy theory engaged
Unless you share a common interest it is actually quite difficult for people to socialise without drinking (not necessarily to excess). It just seems part of the UK culture that meetings are in the pub particularly from 5pm onwards.
I did drink too much until my early 30's and missed out on doing more interesting things. I work with guys mostly in their 40's and 50's and drinking a lot still seems to be a thing on work nights out. I get quite annoyed when people start buying everyone shots and insisting that we drink them. I normally slip away before 10 but some people stay out until 6am.
I celebrate the fact that the younger generation are more mature, confident, health conscious and wiser than we were. It has to be a good thing.
the tales being told by (male) students returning from their first term at uni suggests that quite a few of them are over-indulging. This is often due to stupid sports society initiation events (mostly rugby and cricket it seems) where they drink till they drop. The rugby seems worse than the cricket tbh, but still OTT.
I am not sure that the ladies sports societies are behaving in the same way.
Hopefully they'll grow out of it.......
"We" do not. Some do, some don't.
I always slope away when the rugby lads get messy and don't get involved with the inevitable morning after tales that follow. My lad is the same; he finds it a bit, well, embarrassing.
Too much morning after breath testing to make it worthwhile anyway.
In my latter 50s now I can't recall the last time I was bladdered. And even in my local people drink of course but I don't see them stumbling out of the door wasted.
Also in my 50’s and I’d need to go and have a nap long before I got anywhere near bladdered.
Still love nipping in the local for a couple after work though.
Ironically, in my 20’s we never really used to drink. I’d love to say it was for health reasons, but it’s was mainly because we were all absolutely ripped to the tits on Ecstasy instead 😂
Most of my friends are just doing what advertising has pushed on to them for all of their lives
Yet, during Prohibition, there was huge pressure to not drink but people liked it so much that they turned to organized crime to get booze. People mostly drink because they like it, not because of advertising. Most people drink responsibly, some don't. If most of your friends have a drinking problem, maybe you need new friends.
The rugby seems worse than the cricket tbh, but still OTT.
Rugger buggers behaving like drunken, boorish ****s? Surely not?!!
Most of my friends are just doing what advertising has pushed on to them for all of their lives
Yet, during Prohibition, there was huge pressure to not drink but people liked it so much that they turned to organized crime to get booze. People mostly drink because they like it, not because of advertising. Most people drink responsibly, some don't. If most of your friends have a drinking problem, maybe you need new friends.
Yeah, you could be right 🙁
The advertising comment came about, since streaming services started putting adverts into their content, and most of them for my household seem to be for alcohol.
However, most of my big drinking friends and family tell me that they do enjoy it and that it isn't subliminal persuasion.
Seriously though, I don't think anyone pretends it's a badge of honour,
This. Most people understand what it's like to drink a lot, so if you've had a skinful, and you're upright and moving about the following morning, most folks understand what that feels like and can appreciate the effort.
i am known amongst my family and friends as someone who like a drink. always have, always will.
sport plays a big part of it. play rugby, beer after. ride my bike, stop for a beer.
however, i hardly ever just go out for a drink. my mindset is i have got to kind of earn it.
do some sport/exercise then have a drink.
never drank in excess tho.
+1 to the 'It isn't? / We don't?' comments.
People who treat it as some kind of badge of honour or a test are odd. Mind you that happens with bike rides and distances, it's more healthy or positive but probably equally boring.
when people start buying everyone shots and insisting that we drink them
Guaranteed that's the point of an evening where I make my excuses.. No-one who isn't either a teenager or simply too far gone buys shots*.
*A Scotch or bourbon isn't a shot.
Alcohol consumption in the UK is on the decline. Not only affected by the cost, but it's generally not as "cool" as it once was.
I joined the army at 16 and did a full career and drinking was absolutely embedded in the culture at all levels. I started to tire of it after marriage and kids came along but it was still hard to avoid. I am an absolute lightweight these days and sometimes think of binning it completely.
Similar. 18 for me, Germany as first posting, fully explored alcohol dependency for many years. Now I'd rather a nice meal and a social drink with friends, that may or may not be alcoholic.
Aren't we 8 days early for this thread?
It's kind of shocking to see now how this was just played for laughs in 1985.
Oh come on, it's just funny. Laughing at Yes Minister hardly constitutes support for drink-driving.
It went along the lines of using alcohol as the backdrop for every occasion:
That's because alcohol is a drug which enhances/enables socialising. Hardly a surprise it's used at social occasions.
Alcohol consumption in the UK is on the decline. Not only affected by the cost, but it's generally not as "cool" as it once was.
Would be good to see the demographic breakdown - I bet that the STW generation (45-65 if i remember Mark's poll) are going to be higher consumers compared to younger generations.....
I suspect that for those who have over done it in the past and felt dog sick, embarrassed themselves, spent far too much etc, feel ashamed and therefore celebrate others doing it - ahh thank god it's shared shame and he/she is worse than me.
It's definitely changing and I don't think it's just the prohibitive cost.
It's no longer is a badge of honour. Drinking too much is unhealthy, expensive and irresponsible or dangerous. Seems much less drinking to excesd among my friends as we've got older, and most of our kids are more careful than we were at their age.
was talking to my lad about drinking recently. told me most of his mate, and a lot of lads he know no longer drink much.
white nose powder is now the weekend go to.
Laughing at Yes Minister hardly constitutes support for drink-driving.
You're arguing against a point that nobody made. Perhaps you're hungover 😉
The reason i found it startling - as someone who doesn't really remember 1985 - is that it was socially acceptable to joke about, and thus illustrates changing cultural attitudes to getting ratarsed.
Its on the decline according to this... price certainly must play a large part... I know the beer I drink at my local is £6 a pint, so what might have been 5 or 6 pints is now only 3 or 4 as its really hard to justify the price, plus at my age the hangovers are just too much to cope with if I over do it!
A relaxed pub lunch with a couple of drinks is more my lane these days, rather than going out on the 'sesh' I guess that's partly an age thing and I also don't really go to the pub friday and saturday nights, at all, as its noo noisy and hectic!
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/alcohol-decline-pubs-christmas-health-b2889494.html
I guess the same reason why so many people in open relationships treat it as a badge of honour, they find it fun. Does that mean everyone should be into swinging? Well no, the same that not everyone should be into drinking. Each to their own!
Plus it's expensive now, gone are the days when I started going out in the late 00's and a pint down my local was £1.40, youngn's round my way are saying why spend 40 quid on 6 pints when they can spend 20 quid on a of bag of weed and get stoned all week
I do enjoy beer though
I always just took it as the accepted method of relaxation. Though more state sponsored, in that everyone, from a very young age is directed towards alcohol.
Maybe once upon a time, but these days there are those who cannot drink for religious reasons* but will smoke weed instead.
* As with many religions, it is not about drinking per se, but rather drinking too much to the detriment of yourself, your family and their wider community
in the late 00's and a pint down my local was £1.40
Bloody hell, where was that?
I remember a discussion/group whinge with my mates when a pint (of kronenbourg/Stella) tipped past £2.50, which was 2003ish in Manchester.
Five units (not drinks) would be a heavy session for me. I like the taste of nice wines and beers, but alcohol has negative effects on my GI before the positive effects kick in. Loss of smell means red wine now sadly has limited taste too. But in my circles, nobody cares what I drink. And that includes a post club ride Guinness Zero as other will finish off three pints (or more).
My kids, however, seem to be able to drink like fish when the drink is provided!
It’s an age old long social brag, not sure why but it doesn’t seem to be much of a thing with the younger generation. I could and still can drink large amounts, but it turns out it’s like I’ve said before I was a functioning alcoholic. My youngest daughter doesn’t drink, she has no interest in it, her last drink was Christmas Eve last year. She went out with me and was wrongly encouraged by me to have a little more than normal. Good thing is though it confirmed she doesn’t like alcohol.
In my experience with younger colleagues from work, it's either "don't drink" or "get absolutely smashed". I'll choose the non-drinkers if I want to have a good time.
We applaud those who get smashed and regale their stories of pints, cocktails and shots, before getting in during the early hours.
We do?
What I was thinking. As others have said, once upon a time, when teenagers and early twenties, but there’s really only the hardened drinkers who seem to think it’s something they need to keep doing or lose face amongst their peers.
What was it, Dazh? Haven't drunk in Xyears and only idiots would pay a shed load of tax to **** up their health, live hiungover or pissed, and end up dependant just to please their mates, or something like that.
If a social group doesn't like me ordering coffee it's not my kind of group, Very rare in these parts which is moe café culture but does happen.
Edit was that holier than thou enough ?
It's no longer is a badge of honour. Drinking too much is unhealthy, expensive and irresponsible or dangerous.
Maybe it's an age / culture thing but I remember working in offices and labs after uni where Monday morning would be full of "yeah, I got smashed on Friday night..." stories and a bit of banter around it all.
If that happened in the office I'm in now, it'd result in quiet disapproval. And it's a very mixed office, men and women with an age range right from graduates to near retirement! No one would dream of claiming some sort of alpha status for turning up to work with a hangover!
Probably only one person at work who goes for it seemingly every weekend. He's never going to win dad of the year. Plus a few functioning alcoholics but that's a very different thing. Just doesn't happen any more these days.
But was a big part of my life up until about 30. Plenty of regrets about the amount of time I spent inebriated but don't think I'd change much, well apart from that one time......
By and large was great fun. Nobody died. And I look at the life a lot of young people seem to have these days and certainly don't envy them. Give me an all dayer over the gym, Instagram and coffee any day.
Went in a pub in town last night that back in the day would have been rammed with hundreds of people, you'd literally have to push through the crowd to get to the bar. There were 10 people at most in there last night.
Times are very different, going out and getting smashed every weekend was just what "everyone" did. And that was backed up by how busy everywhere would be. It was actively encouraged by the pricing, double or triple your money on the door, free shots or ten shooters for a quid. We lapped it up. Now, most people have grown out of it, it would be way too expensive and everything you got up to would be presented back to you and the world on someone's Instagram.
Comment up there that "no-one died." Sadly not true, the drinking culture in the local towns round here has left a trail of hardened boozers who still prop up some of the bars and plenty who have died from ALD and related problems over the years.
For some reason, this guy keeps popping up on my YT.....
https://youtube.com/shorts/l6JwGrClPxM?si=deyzu4dfUR18m1YX
So there's definitely some people out there knocking it back like it's still 1999
If the drink was coffee, it certainly would be a badge of honour here 😉 😜
With coffee my guts find it more honourable to dial it back. Not used the espresso machine for months now. Espresso refers to the effects!
Well. I love getting shit faced.
Not bothered it you don't, though.
Casual drinkers that occasionally binge = stupid.
Being proud of how much you can drink? = stupid.
Anyone who drinks and drives/rides = stupid and selfish.
Anyone who pressurises others to drink = stupid
Struggling to control how much you drink? Get help now before its too late.
I've seen alcohol destroy lives; two family members are/were alcoholics. One didn't make it to 40. The other causing chaos to those around them and probably wont last that long either. I don't touch alcohol anymore and cant stand being around anyone who does.
Comment up there that "no-one died."
Yeh, that feels painfully ironic to me having lost a friend who stupidly drank and drove, then wrapped his car around a tree. Or another I used to drink with who died when his organs gave in but his drinking problem didn't.
I'm certainly not alone on this forum in having seen people around me die as a direct effect of alcohol.
In some ways, I'm glad my constitution is so pitiful at handling alcohol. Hard to develop a problem if it's more unpleasant than rewarding.