Forum menu
I didn’t say all city dwellers are oiks. I used the term to refer to selfish, badly behaved people with no common sense. People like the Rangers fans yesterday for example.
The majority of city dwellers could probably be relied on to show some restraint and take sensible precautions without needing extreme restrictions.
I referred to the inner city because there are more people there in a small space. In the country there are fewer people. Transmission is therefore lower. Hence lower infection rates. Lower risk. That’s hardly controversial.
Not all areas are the same, yet the rules are the same for everyone. They will therefore inevitably be overly restrictive on those in some areas.
If you live in a sparsely populated area with only one case in 1,000 square miles, the risk is not really very high is it?
It’s easy to poke holes in a brief comment on a forum, especially when you have preconceived hostility towards the poster. But you know as well as I do that even the most cautious of you on here would be even more cautious if you lived in Bombay.
An MP in Bolton this morning (Mark Logan), continually ignoring the question - did the Government leave it too late to put India on the 'Red' list. Arrrgghhh.
For all you lovely people here who are not bending the rules, are coming across as slightly over cautious (I'm proud to be one), please continue to do so, because its because of you and others that this country isn't suffering the trauma that India is atm.
Many of us on here have elderly parents and do not want to put them at risk.
I do not know one single person who doesn't want this mini nightmare to be over, but in life you have to put something 'in' (adhering to the rules) to get something 'out'(our freedoms and lives back to a new normal).
I for one (being one of those dreadful cautious people) will not be hugging, staying over at peoples houses. I will be wearing my mask, keeping a distance and washing hands properly. These small steps will protect my 81 yr old mother and my 78 yr old father in law.
These small steps will protect my 81 yr old mother and my 78 yr old father in law
No, they will probably/most likely protect them. You or they could just be unlucky.
Got my second jab tomorrow but I feel under the weather with a cold.
Should I still have it?
Hancock saying over 35s to be jabbed next week. stoked! Although it does mean I lose my £10 bet with the girlfriend.
Zippy - they will ask you questions about if you are well and make a decision. Realistically they are looking for Covid symptoms not a cold.
I for one (being one of those dreadful cautious people) will not be hugging, staying over at peoples houses. I will be wearing my mask, keeping a distance and washing hands properly. These small steps will protect my 81 yr old mother and my 78 yr old father in law.
This seems odd to me. Presumably both them and you have been vaccinated so are at very little risk from Covid? What will it take for you to go back to normal? My parents are in their 70's and when we meet things are basically back to normal as we present minimal risk to each other.
This seems odd to me. Presumably both them and you have been vaccinated so are at very little risk from Covid? What will it take for you to go back to normal? My parents are in their 70’s and when we meet things are basically back to normal as we present minimal risk to each other.
As I said several pages ago there's a level of mass trauma in people that has been perpetuated by the media over 12 months, some people literally won't be able to go back to normal without therapy. However I got shot down for suggesting it was a genuine issue that needed some real healthcare action to resolve.
Also, people can spread it to ANY other person. Caution helps to protect everyone.
Looks like local lockdowns are back on the table then. Did anyone really fall for the June 21st date being upheld?
Roadmap was a pointless waste of time.
Roadmap was a pointless waste of time.
They had to produce one to placate those who were whining about lockdown.
Roadmap was a pointless waste of time.
Are you saying the whole concept of a roadmap is a waste of time or just the milestones they had? Clearly they needed a roadmap / plan.
Presumably both them and you have been vaccinated so are at very little risk from Covid?
Maybe @Gribs is looking out for his neighbours who may not yet be vaccinated. I would not be happy if my actions caused the spread to my neighbours who haven't been vaccinated. (I have a 30's child in the house who doesn't have a date for a first jab yet, we need to be cautious until she has been fully vaccinated).
I accept that there may well be a need for counselling for a lot of us to get back to a more normal social interaction.
None of the vaccines are 100% effective at protecting someone from infection or disease.
Thankfully with the numbers of cases in most of the country this protection should put you at a low risk of being exposed and infected. Where disease is more common then the risk is clearly higher
encouraging news that the vaccines seem to be effective against the Indian variant too....still too early to say for sure and caution still advised, but I'm more positive today than I was Friday and yesterday
Blimey some of you are so pedantic - possible, probably, hopefully I will help some elderly close relatives. No we aren't locked in a cellar with a years worth of food rations.
No we're not in a 'mass trauma' in our household. We are following simple rules from scientists, not the government.
No we have not been fully vaccinated (both waiting for our second jabs).
We live in the NW where there is a greater risk of catching C19. I also have very close friends who have caught this and one of whom is suffering from long covid and believe me you don't want to end up with that.
If you live in a sparsely populated area with only one case in 1,000 square miles, the risk is not really very high is it?
But for those of us who have known people who have died before their time because of this, or work with people who have lost 2 or 3 members of their family because of this, we have a different perspective. Those of us who live in the countryside who saw our village pubs having to employ security for the first time ever to control the numbers and behaviour of the virus infected oiks travelling out of the nearby towns when the beer gardens opened, we have a different perspective on this. Those of us with a son who has two weeks to go at college, before he then sets off on his DofE Gold expedition that has been delayed by 12 months and stopped him finishing other awards that he has worked on for 2-3 years have a different perspective on this.
But this week I will hug my parents for the first time in 5 months. They have both had their jabs, I've had my first, and I'm continuing to minimise contact with anyone else to make sure I'm keeping them as safe as they can be. Because not hugging them will do more damage to their wellbeing than the risk of hugging them. But that's our choice, and I respect others who have made other choices to reflect their own circumstances within what the rules allow.
The roadmap was absolutely vital and important for planning and preparation for huge numbers of individuals and businesses. Whether it's implementation is still being driven by data and not dates is a separate matter
Roadmap was a pointless waste of time.
No, it wasn’t. Having an “earliest possible date” for each removal of restrictions has helped businesses and families make plans.
If you live in a sparsely populated area with only one case in 1,000 square miles…
But, of course, the geographical catchment areas for secondary schools, and even more so sixth form colleges, is much larger in such areas. Remember, the distance between houses is almost irrelevant, it is people gathering in shared indoor spaces that matter, hence us keeping masks and distancing in supermarkets etc, even if you live in the sticks. We should be doing the same for teens in schools and colleges as well. Delaying the return to cinemas etc by a few weeks, while we see what the latest variant of concern does, would seem wise to me as well.
Interesting viewpoint article: what will those that really understand the virus and the risks be doing on Monday and in June
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57069293
I do not know one single person who doesn’t want this mini nightmare to be over, but in life you have to put something ‘in’ (adhering to the rules) to get something ‘out'(our freedoms and lives back to a new normal).
FYI this nightmare is never going away. You'll have to learn to live with it.
It won’t be as it is now long term, that is the point. The current position we are in is far better than at the end of last year, and we’ll be a far better position still by the end of this year. No one has to “learn to live” with things as they are now, they just need a bit more patience and be prepared to listen to those scientists that have urged caution in the past, and been proven right time and time again. Every time the government presses on against the advice given, it results in more drastic and longer lasting measures having to be in place. The government got the vaccine rollout so right, they just needed to time the introduction of measures to make the most of that. They need to listen to their experts more, and stop creating situations were only long and draconian periods of restriction can get us out of a mess of their own making.
No one has to “learn to live” with things as they are now, they just need a bit more patience and be prepared to listen to those scientists that have urged caution in the past, and been proven right time and time again. Every time the government presses on against the advice given, it results in more drastic and longer lasting measures having to be in place.
Well put - every time the government has ignored advice and acted too late, the lockdowns have been longer, stricter and more damaging than they probably needed to be. You'd think the government - and those opposed to lockdowns - would have made the connection by now. Just because we can doesn't mean that we should.
If - and it's a big IF - everyone sticks with the guidance on masks, and distancing, and hand washing, and limited cautious hugging, we will hopefully get away with this weeks lockdowns and the vaccination programme will hopefully keep us one step ahead of the virus seriously impacting the NHS yet again. I doubt 21st June date will be going ahead on schedule.
The chances of enough people doing that inside pubs with a few beers inside them and meeting up with long missed friends is the key factor. I'll be doing a bit more than I have been doing, but I don't want to be the one that gives me, my unvaccinated kids or my 80 year old parents long covid, even if they are unlikely to have anything more serious now due to youth or vaccination. When we get to September, and nearly all adults, and maybe some school kids have been vaccinated, then I'll see what the experts are saying at that point ahead of any potential "Winter Wave". Remember, Spanish Flu lasted two years, we aren't there yet.
Local lockdowns seem a bit silly to me. A bit like reinforcing the damaged bits of aeroplanes that made it back from sorties in wars, rather than strengthening the bits that cause the others to fail. Northern areas were kept locked down last time, but we didn't have a national lockdown until the Kent variant had been spread around by the free of the South. If the India variant is more transmissible, it's already in most areas in all likelihood. It's a bit naive or maybe political to pretend otherwise.
Is there any advice about having extra vaccination doses?
I've had one AZ so far but have just been offered the one-shot Moderna (or possibly Johnson and Johnson) here in the USA.
Should I take them up on it or wait until the appointment for my second AZ dose in June?
Think that's the J&J as Modena is a two shot
FYI this nightmare is never going away. You’ll have to learn to live with it.
One of the NERVTAG members has basically said the same. And I agree. The question people have not posed (well I have) is despite multiple importations, why has the South Africa variant (which appears to escape immunity) not spread? We know that the vaccines are less effective against this variant, but it is definitely not taking off. So the B.1.1.7 plus vaccination must have provided a means of keeping out other strains.
Now here comes a new importation from India (three actually), with a different non-immune escape binding domain. There is no doubt that it spreads faster than B.1.1.7 UK variant, since it is replacing it at about the same rate as B.1.1.7 replaced the wild type before Christmas. So far, however, there does not appear to be evidence of rising hospitalisations (in Bolton anyway). They have stalled and are now flat, but are not yet doubling every four days or so. Vaccination, together with past infection and a younger susceptible population hopefully means 'we've got this'. THIS is what an endemic disease with strain replacement looks like.
Personally I think it is too early to say what will happen in June. Two weeks is a long time in an epidemic. I can't see another lockdown unless a new strain COMPLETELY escapes immunity and vaccination, whilst inducing much higher morbidity and mortality. I don't think that this is that strain. I don't know when there will be one. But that is the battle we have waged with influenza for many years. There will be one, but hopefully we will have updated vaccines, passive vaccination (AZ trial reads out very soon) and antiviral pills (favipiravir has the UK Government's interest).
[tl:dr] Too early to call on the Indian variant escaping protection from vaccines. IF there is no increase in hospitalisations in Bolton and Blackburn & Derwent in the next week, it will be good news.
PS just out and worth a read (Figure 7 for Indian variant of interest)
A LOT of people are working very hard on this.
There is a big trial of 'mix and matching' going on in the UK, not involving J&J. Some suggestion of more mild and moderate side effects, and no clear data yet on whether mixing offers similar (or better) levels of protection. Put it this way, I might be tempted to get the J&J if offered, but I'd probably have the 2nd AZ as well.
I’m really quite excited about tomorrow. This is the big one for me (except the hugging, that and handshaking can stay away forever please).
Dinner with my parents. Possibly a visit to a pub. An overnight stay away from home. Very normal parts of my life until just over a year ago.
I think with the exception of foreign travel I will be allowed to do anything that I would want to do. 21st of June doesn’t really hold much allure for me, and I’ll be mask wearing and avoiding large crowds for as long as it’s even vaguely socially acceptable.
A LOT of people are working very hard on this.
I think for the anxious and cautious amongst this bears repeating and restating. It’s very easy to sit at home and worry about media sound bites, forgetting there’s a whole army of National and International scientists working to help.
Are you saying the whole concept of a roadmap is a waste of time or just the milestones they had? Clearly they needed a roadmap / plan.
I *think* what is being said is creating a roadmap that ignores the science merely to pretend you are going to follow it is a waste of time.
Even the dimmest in society are catching on that the government is lying but the current government don't really know any other way.
Each lie is created with short term goals and an attitude of dealing with the fallout when it comes up because that is just how they operate and so long as they make irreversible decisions (including. failure to act) they will just blame some part of society later.
forgetting there’s a whole army of National and International scientists working to help
Except the government is abjectly ignoring them or picking its own soundbites.
If government advice was given in a court then the government would be treating national scientists as hostile witnesses and international scientists as people with no legal standing to be in the witness box.
Anyone got any idea what's going on with the accelerated 2nd dose for over 50s. Me and all my similarly aged buddies booked 12 week 2nd dose at same time as first. Do we think 2nd doses appointments will be rebooked. No indication on gov.uk site yet but I guess it was only announced late Friday afternoon
My second dose comes up on the 26th May. I logged back on to the central site and it has this message:
We'll be contacting some people directly to bring forward their appointment for the 2nd dose of the COVID-19 vaccine.
This is so people at greater risk of getting seriously ill due to coronavirus can get maximum protection earlier.
Please wait to be contacted if you think you're in this group.
Cheers Murray
The NHS App has been updated to show the full details of your vaccination status, and a QR code of your Covid Status.
Just updated the app to the latest version … no sign of that yet.
The NHS App has been updated to show the full details of your vaccination status, and a QR code of your Covid Status.
Unless you had your vaccines in a trial🤷🏼♂️
Re second doses I heard a colleague’s husband has had his rescheduled already (mass vaccination centre)
Just updated the app to the latest version … no sign of that yet.
It's working for me.
Note it's not the test and trace app, it's in the NHS app
The "access services" app? So not in the app the says "COVID-19" in its name and logo... another one? Installing to have a look... seems a bit arse about face though.
No, the actual NHS App. This has aways had personal medical details on and has more levels of security.
The NHS Covid one is a Track & Trace app.
I’ve given up at the taking a photo of your passport stage. I’ll come back to it at the weekend. The extra security is understandable if it’s for accessing so much more than just the Covid19 stuff… although I’m not really interested in any of that myself.
On android its just called the NHS app.
Here https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.nhs.online.nhsonline
I didn't have to take any photos of my passport, just created an account using my email address, and gave it my name, dob and postcode.took less than 5 minutes.
NHS App requires you to be registered with a GP practice in England.
How does it work for Wales then? I can't get it to recognise my NHS number and everything on the app mentions being registered with them in England?
I just managed to book my covid jab, but my second appointment is more than 12 weeks away anyone else have this, its at 13.5 weeks? Im guessing they will bring it forwards.
I didn’t have to take any photos of my passport, just created an account using my email address, and gave it my name, dob and postcode.took less than 5 minutes.
And that let you see and display your own vaccination status, did it? Or just read some info that you can read on the NHS website?
And that let you see and display your own vaccination status, did it?
why the snarky attitude?
Yes exactly that,the number of doses I have reiceved, the date, vaccine manufacturer, type of vaccine I had received, batch number, and a qr code containing all this,
If I could easily post a screenshot I would, blurring out the sensitive stuff of course.
It also let's you download it as a pdf or have it emailed to your email address.
You can get your vaccine passports by calling 119.
Unless you volunteered in a trial. They don’t seem to have collected that data in with the others. I expect it will happen and personally I’m in no rush. No foreign holidays this year but trips to FOD. And Laggan wolftrax instead. I’ll take that.
Thats odd, mine demanded a photo ID and won't release any records until its been verified. Anyway, that took 5 mins, all records including Vaccinations are there. Great PSA, thanks @danstw13
Comedy gold that 🙂
We went onto the NHS booking website yesterday and rebooked for our second jab for today at Sheffield Arena. Both over 50.
https://www.nhsapp.service.nhs.uk from any PC browser works too. Can see my 1st dose. Assume it will show the QR code after I've had the 2nd tomorrow 👍🏻
My second jab would have been the first week in June, I went online and booked one for this morning, 50 yrs old.
I get the same using that web service Jamze…
You will need 1 of the following types of photo I.D:
- passport
- UK driving licence (full or provisional)
- European driving licence (full)
- European national identity card
The security before accessing medical records makes sense. Not sure what you’re supposed to do if you have none of the above though.
Thinking about it, that it’s not accessible in the “NHS COVID-19 App” makes sense as well, as you use that anonymously… and you can’t have someone accessing medical records anonymously.
Assume it will show the QR code after I’ve had the 2nd tomorrow 👍🏻
1st dose of AZ only and it shows me a QR code.
think I had to take a photo of my driving licence and then do a face scan thing through the iOS app.
Good stuff. Just logged into the NHS app and all my jab details were there together with the QR code. No need for an id pic or anything.
I have no use of it at the moment but handy to know about.👍
I'll warn you now the face scan is a bit psychedelic to say the least.
The security before accessing medical records makes sense. Not sure what you’re supposed to do if you have none of the above though.
If you have no ID then you will need to provide details from your local GP surgery.
1st dose of AZ only and it shows me a QR code.
Found the QR code 🙂 Hadn't noticed the 'share covid status' option earlier. We've used the app for a couple of years as our GP was keen to get everyone using it, so did all the ID checks back then.
For those of you that had 2 appointments booked (been given 2 dates from the start), have you had to cancel your second jab date to get something nearer to 8 weeks (not 12)?
My second jab date is next week, so I'm loath to cancel in case I end up with a date further away.
Thank you
I’ll warn you now the face scan is a bit psychedelic to say the least.
it was a bit 90's sci-fi, 'lets show we are doing something geeky'.
@bunnyhop - my wife had a text from the surgery offering her a slot this weekend. She didn't need to do anything. Not sure what the situation is if you booked direct with a vaccination centre...
For those of you that had 2 appointments booked (been given 2 dates from the start), have you had to cancel your second jab date to get something nearer to 8 weeks (not 12)?
My second jab date is next week, so I’m loath to cancel in case I end up with a date further away.
Anecdotally that seems to be the case. Also, if you log onto the national booking site there's a notice that says:
Important: Important
We'll be contacting some people directly to bring forward their appointment for the 2nd dose of the COVID-19 vaccine.
This is so people at greater risk of getting seriously ill due to coronavirus can get maximum protection earlier.
Please wait to be contacted if you think you're in this group.
That's what I'm doing, waiting that is. Of course there'd be less confusion if Johnson hadn't just thrown out a vague soundbite about bringing forward second jabs for over-50s and vulnerable groups without any sort of qualification about how it would work. But then he 'doesn't do detail'. If you think it through, if you're going to start shifting second jab appointments for a huge number of people using a system that's not really designed to work like that, it's going to be very difficult.
My guess is that there's a lot of scrabbling around behind the scenes trying to translate the intention into a feasible process.
But anyway, in your position, I'd be waiting a week rather than messing about playing appointment bingo with the booking system.
^^ Agreed.
For those of you that had 2 appointments booked (been given 2 dates from the start), have you had to cancel your second jab date to get something nearer to 8 weeks (not 12)?
My second jab date is next week, so I’m loath to cancel in case I end up with a date further away.
My bro had to cancel his 2nd jab appointment then book a new one... 2 hours later than the original 2nd jab was scheduled. But at least it's at a pharmacy he can walk to rather than 15 min drive.
We had to cancel one to rebook but not the other, so we looked at all the dates available for the one that didn't need cancelling and their were so many times for yesterday that we cancelled the other and rebooked it straight away for yesterday. We got the same times at the same place so it was a no brainer for us.
Both jabs now showing on the NHS app along with the barcode. Had no side effects and still cant tell I've had them, lucky me
Thanks everyone.
I have decided to stay with the original second date. Too close to mess around now.
If you are in the group that will have a 2nd vaccine moved closer to 8 weeks rather than 12...Could I ask that you try to resist the urge to call your GP?
If your vaccine is being administered via your local GP network, Your GP will know who you are, they can see when your 2nd vaccine is due, they'll send you out a text inviting you to make a new 2nd appt.
If you've booked through the national service...yeah, good luck with that.
If you’ve booked through the national service…yeah, good luck with that.
What do you mean, that they're unlikely to be able to sort it. I'm 2.5 weeks away from my second dose, low risk from both health and 'must go to pub!!' perspective so I'm inclined that waiting and not disrupting the system is better overall? Or should I cancel and rebook to be (by the time I find a suitable booking slot) a week or 10 days earlier?
nickc
If your vaccine is being administered via your local GP network, Your GP will know who you are, they can see when your 2nd vaccine is due, they’ll send you out a text inviting you to make a new 2nd appt.
Can't you even keep to the same story ?
I thought that these lists were handled by admin staff not GP's?
I thought the text comes from a third party?
Can’t you even keep to the same story ?
I thought that these lists were handled by admin staff not GP’s?
I thought the text comes from a third party?Let's not have the literal English argument again please. You didn't come out of it looking too clever last time. Badgering someone whose job is to help get people vaccinated and maintain healthcare provision to everyone else is neither big nor clever.
Indeed
A bit uncalled for
If you've booked via the national system its either cancel online and rebook, or call 119 to do the same. If you struggled to get a convenient appointment last time I'd stick with what you've got.
Just for info, my 2nd appointment was set for 5th July via the central NHS website (1st appointment was 15 april). I cancelled and rebooked hoping to get an earlier appintment. I was able to bring it forward to 1st July, a whole 4 days earlier. You might be luckier, or you may cancel and then find there's nothing until later than your original appoinetment...
What do you mean,
Sorry, flippant, I hear some right stories from our patients about the national vaccine centers (and from colleagues roped in to man them) . FWIW i think they're in an unenviable position, and coping as best they can. I don't know what their system is like for re-booking the 2nd dose of vaccine.
AIUI 12 weeks seems better from an overall immunity perspective than less time between jabs. The initial month was due to the trials only being a month between jabs and that was due to the urgency of completing the trials not clinical concerns. The government did the wrong thing when they extended it to 12 weeks, they had no idea if it would work, we were lucky and it appears the extended time between jabs improves long term protection (could have easily gone the other way).
For me having had my first jab, the level of protection a single jab gives and the fact I'm not rushing to the pub or any other super spreader event I quite happy to wait for my 2nd jab as scheduled if that means younger people get their first jab sooner and I get better long term protection.
Not sure where the panicked change of strategy came from, the existing one (more through luck than judgement) seemed to be working well.
Change of strategy is just to be “seen to be doing something” in the face of the news about new variants. Just keeping original 2nd jab dates unless offered a new one seems the best response for most of us.