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I heard a lot of "sooka blyat" which roughly translates to a female dog of negotiable affections, a fair bit of "huy" which I guess mean he thought they were a bunch of willies and the always useful (I had no idea this worked in Ukrainian and Polish) "kurva".
The fag got me, he’s fighting russians with the demeanor of someone building a shit brick wall.
I never saw that, just saw him firing one off, chucking the launcher, gets handed the next one, fires that and swaggers back for some more ammo.
People talk about the banality of evil but I never really thought there was such a thing as banality of heroism. It’s like a whole town made of tank guys
Honestly I'm not surprised, I've sailed with Ukrainians (and a few Russians too) and they are just mental. The sort of folk who get stuff done whilst they look like they absolutely couldn't care less, nicest guys going. That RPG guy and the women making crates of molotovs are the absolute embodiment of that. Was talking to one of my mates earlier that I was at sea with and we were both wondering if (and hoping that) all the guys we sailed with were okay.
Goddammit I loved this aircraft
https://twitter.com/christogrozev/status/1497941632209108992
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baykar_Bayraktar_TB2
Putin will have a ‘Hitler downfall’ moment… and that’s when he’ll realise that not everyone in his gang is a ‘yes’ man.
Von Staufenburgski to the Kremlin bunker, Paging Von Staufenburgski....
Anyone else get the feeling somewhat that either the Russian army is 70s old stock or the new stuff is being hidden.
Su57 fighter ect or are conscripted kids just cheap and plentiful.
Putin has played his hand now all in 100% if they don't get rid of him Russia is going to spiral into hyper inflation and suffering years of economic pain. No way the Russian people will put up with more crap and I'm not sure the world will either.
Ukraine is not going to to be a Russian puppet state I get the feeling they would burn the place down themselves than hand it over.
As for nukes it makes no difference how many each country has it only takes one to go in the air and it's game over. The look of Putin's generals today at the press conference was telling they look worried.
Who will play Brutus to Putin's Julius Caesar.
I hope the talks are genuine and it stops the bloody mess. But in the long term Putin has to be replaced
“Anyone else get the feeling somewhat that either the Russian army is 70s old stock or the new stuff is being hidden.“
Russia is just testing their enemy’s guns - by sending in the less well trained soldiers and old equipment they can get a good sense of the Ukraine’s real capabilities and the location of troops / soldiers. What will unfortunately likely follow is the elite soldiers and latest equipment.
Maybe, but if you want to win a war (sorry, de-militarisation operation), you don't mess about with the crappy stuff at the start, you strike hard, fast and brutal. Your second string troops can be used to bolster/support your gains and hold ground if you need them to.
It could be that these are the best he could put in place.
I think he thought could mass any ol shite at the border and walk in.
China might just come to our rescue and tell Putin to wind his neck in nobody wants this it's 1 man's mad fantasy
Just saw this, I know it's been doing the rounds for a while but it's a reminder of just how stupid all of this is.
Joking between each other, no aggression, just folk passing each other on the road making light of the situation.
I think and hope Willard is correct, the whole gambit here is fast and furious, you wouldn't sensibly compromise that by sending in your inferior units. Trouble is APCs aren't much use against modern anti armour weapons. When your enemy has AK47s they provide protection, when your enemy has anti armour kit supplied by the west your in trouble.
the Israeli's Merkeva tank units ran into difficulties against hezbollahs missile equipped infantry in southern lebanon in 2006.
Trouble is APCs aren’t much use against modern anti armour weapons.
Especially when it’s the spring thaw so they’re tied to roads, and there’s no fuel?
I've felt physically sick about this since Friday, seeing a headline pop up on my phone stating 'Putin orders nuclear...' nearly made me vom.
Ukraine have already made their claim for NATO membership, I can't see either party giving down and surely there's a time to come when Putin gets so annoyed with the West giving Ukraine Arms he does something massively stupid
Thing is he could step back and turn the gas off, that make most of Europe skint or freezing?
The terrifying thing is it's just one man's ego, with him out the picture there's no one stepping up to carry this on, it'd be calm down lads, let's grab a table and take a breath
For our Putineers. Pilger’s latest.
Who are these Putineers? @deadlydarcy?
Considering you nearly lost your mind over me posting one John Pilger tweet I'm suprised you are posting more!
The invasion of a sovereign state is lawless and wrong. A failure to understand the cynical forces that provoked the invasion of Ukraine insults the victims.
As for the tweet- not much to disagree with? (I haven't read the article)
I don't understand why the Chechens are helping as iirc Putin largely rose to fame during the war against Chechenya on the 90s. Politics is weird though
I think that is known as victim blaming.
Russia is just testing their enemy’s guns
Nah, that's not how it works.
Even BP have walked away from Putin.
It’s like Beetlejuice in here. Nice to know they’re keeping up with the thread. 😀
It really is unravelling for Putin now, Germany sending arms direct to a conflict zone, first time since WWII, EU financing and providing arms for another state, EU ramping up sanctions, complete ban of all Russian aircraft including private jets from EU airspace, Russian central bank getting assets frozen. SWIFT system being partial withdrawn, BP dumping a 20% share in Rosneft, world sport boycotting Russia. He's really isolated himself. Can't imagine China are too chuffed either, a quick occupation might have played well with them, a drawn out mess of a conflict bringing together many other countries is not helping them with their long term goal of taking Taiwan back. And I bet they aren't that happy with the economic fall out either, a squeeze on Western consumers is going to bite there as well.
The idea that Putin is sending in conscripts and ancient equipment in first in order to get a feel of Ukranian defences doesn't make any sense to me.
In order to work from a geopolotical perspective this needed to be a blitzkrieg and the government replaced within 48 hours at most. So why have conscripts been sent in? And why was it left to Chechen mercenaries to do the dirty work?
In answer to my own question, are the Russian Army actually doing Putin's bidding or have they organised a 'special operation' that they know won't succeed?
Was using the Chechen scumbags Putin's idea or did the army decide to deploy them because they knew Russian troops didn't have the stomach for it?
It’s like Beetlejuice in here. Nice to know they’re keeping up with the thread
Ah bless you're quite a friendly troll.
They're the best he's got, the blueprint for this was Iraq V2, drawing it out with a few feeler punches is a waste of time, money and resources.
Initial plan was military targets, now looks to be all over the place whilst trading convos with OAPs on the street at points?
I’ve felt physically sick about this since Friday, seeing a headline pop up on my phone stating ‘Putin orders nuclear…’ nearly made me vom.
I've felt similar all weekend. Hearing about the Nuclear readiness makes me fear that the next 48 hours is critical. My guess is Putin is using the nuclear threat to get his own way, stop the West supplying Ukrainian fighters and get the quick result he wants. The issue is how he responds to the further financial sanctions. I sort of hope he just turns the gas supplies off but I fear he will genuinely consider pressing the Big Red Button.
complete ban of all Russian aircraft including private jets from EU airspace,
Wonder where that leaves Kaliningrad?
it wouldnt surprise me if he threatens to use nuclear weapons if the sanctions etc arent removed.
Putin wants to make out he holds all the cards prior to ‘meeting’ Zelenskyy.
I very much doubt any meeting will be directly between those two.
Wonder where that leaves Kaliningrad?
Good question!
I guess they'll have to drive to the nearest airport
Thing is he could step back and turn the gas off, that make most of Europe skint or freezing?
Better skint and freezing than a smouldering pile of radioactive ash.
Putins given himself no room to manoeuvre. The generals didn't like happy in the nuclear press conference, the Chinese aren't backing him.
Overnight coup to remove him? 🤞
"Wonder where that leaves Kaliningrad?"
Isolated, have to catch a ferry from St Petersburg .
In order to work from a geopolotical perspective this needed to be a blitzkrieg and the government replaced within 48 hours at most. So why have conscripts been sent in? And why was it left to Chechen mercenaries to do the dirty work?
When you've spent a good 20 odd years surrounding yourself with yes men, silencing anyone who dares to disagree with you and believing your own hype... Gross errors of judgement based upon your own disconnection with reality are often likely! 🤷🏻♂️
As for the Chechen mercenaries... I guess he figured they'd get in amongst the general population quite quickly and easily, and their special type of intolerable violence (often centring on mental and physical torture) would weaken Ukrainians resolve quickly enough for them to welcome in negotiations and talks over territory. I guess he didn't count on drones that he'd sold to Turkey ending up in Ukrainian hands and being used against his own forces!
This was his version of a blitzkreig... I'm not sure whether to be scared of his nuclear threat any more or not. I have visions of "ACME" branded missiles that when they hit the target the nose cone pops open and a small wide eyed cartoon character pops up with a flag that says "bang" before it pops with about as much devastation as a firecracker!
Putin has spent his entire career creating a significant level of "is he/isn't he" batsht crazy mystery about his persona, and up until now he has done a very good job of keeping everyone in check by being too scared to test him... Hopefully once Russian citizens and politicians realise what is actually happening, they will start eyeing up their opportunity to take him out once and for all seeing the huge and lasting damage he is doing to his own country. I'm guessing all of the Russian Oligarchs are only loyal to Putin because of his ability to make them rich too... Remove that capability, and 3 decades worth of hard stolen assets, and Putin could suddenly have a queue of people waiting to stick the knife in! 🤔🤭
Thing is he could step back and turn the gas off, that make most of Europe skint or freezing?
Everyone gets a government issue jumper, and an electric powered oil heater... 🤷🏻♂️ Seriously though... Not only are we coming in to spring, but an over reliance on Russian gas is a miniscule problem compared to the threat of WW3 on European soil, let alone Nuclear warfare!
Overnight coup to remove him?
You can imagine that there are enough influential people queueing up to help provide the means for this to happen right now... Once Russian citizens begin to see how RT has continually pulled the wool over their eyes for decades now, telling them shit smells of rose and all because of Putins say so, you can believe there'll be a nation of people asking questions as to why he hasn't been forcibly removed already!
Ah bless you’re quite a friendly troll.
I see you’re back to gaslighting. 😀
"Overnight coup to remove him? 🤞"
binners, have you checked the odds / laid a bet yet?
Better skint and freezing than a smouldering pile of radioactive ash
I'd take that all day long!
Isolated, have to catch a ferry from St Petersburg .
Hardly seems a sustainable state of affairs.
I was out walking with Scouts and Explorers today, practising for an event we hold in March where hundreds of scouts hike 40k self supported for a weekend with incidents etc. Spent the day with happy, tired scouts bonding with each other and struggling together to achieve things they never expected to be able to do alongside 10’s of helpers, leaders and parents giving time and urging them on….humans at their best.
I have tears in my eyes right now - how did we as a species get in a situation where one man could destroy it all
Hardly seems a sustainable state of affairs.
As problems go right now... I'm not sure the citizens of Kaliningrad have featured especially highly on a list of priorities I'm afraid! 🤷🏻♂️
"As for the Chechen mercenaries… I guess he figured they’d get in amongst the general population quite quickly and easily"
Not sure about that, there were certainly Russian special forces planted into major cities in the weeks leading up but the Chechens stick out like a sore thumb, as conspicuous as a jihadi in a Jacuzzi.
Don't forget that the Chechen forces are made up of the kind of people who blew up the school in Beslan and held the Moscow theatre hostage, they are probably hated by the Russians even more than by the Ukranians.
Having the same thoughts about Putin’s ACME nukes, really think all this is showing what a crap state Russian armed forces and their kit is in.
Hardly seems a sustainable state of affairs.
Neither was the Berlin Air Lift but they managed that. Sending a ferry and ships round to Kaliningrad should be easy by comparison.
Don’t forget that the Chechen forces are made up of the kind of people who blew up the school in Beslan and held the Moscow theatre hostage
Maybe the same mentality but definitely a different side, these guys are loyal to the pro-Russian leader. Let's also not forget who did what in Moscow:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_theater_hostage_crisis#Chemical_attack
(not excusing either side here, just presenting facts in as much as I can)
I think he thought what with all the f-ups in Iraq/ Afghanistan etc and the appearance of Trump/ Brexit and other divisions in democracy, that the West would not be able to respond in a co-ordinated fashion. Couple that with his military’s apparent success in Syria and other places, and I think he genuinely thought he’d be in charge right across Ukraine by now.
Russian media is starting to report casualties, but no numbers yet. There’s is going to be a hell of a backlash when the body bags start coming home. And they haven’t even started the hard yards yet. Conquering empty fields is the easy bit. However, we do have to hope the Ukrainians don’t run out of ammo before they get resupplied.
The nuclear readiness reaction really is the act of a mad man and it will not be going unnoticed in China and many other countries who are staying as neutral as possible to be on Russia's side.
It's weird that he's even mentioned this, as he cannot stop the west sanctioning Russia, and i doubt he'll ever have enough backing to 'nuke' anyone, so it's a bit of a no win bluff.
It's a bit worrying posting the "piss" taking vids on twitter etc.... putin and his generals might not get the joke.
It’s a bit worrying posting the “piss” taking vids on twitter etc…. putin and his generals might not get the joke.
They won't be be able to - they've blocked it...
Just having a chuckle when I heard about captured Russian soldiers being surprised to find that they aren't taking part in a training exercise. In fact, some of them weren't even aware they were in Ukraine.
There's definitely some future Tory MPs there, I'm sure.
Just having a chuckle when I heard about captured Russian soldiers being surprised to find that they aren’t taking part in a training exercise. In fact, some of them weren’t even aware they were in Ukraine.
Sauce?
The mayor of Kyiv saying they are surrounded.
On AP - https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-kyiv-europe-e9cd115540b398be26dfcaf472ec1621
China and many other countries who are staying as neutral as possible
So if Russia start chucking nukes at NATO countries and starts the whole MAD ball rolling, I assume all the countries not in NATO or Russia are not bought into it and just carry on as before ? Or do we have stuff pointed at China etc and will bring them into it just because we can ?
After reading his 2018 speech about Russians being Martyrs and going to heaven in the event of a Nuclear strike , then I wouldn’t be so sure he wouldn’t go all out, especially if his own days are numbered.
Does anyone know if the whole of Peaky Blinders last season will be on iPlayer, would be good to see the conclusion before the above
This thread is full of some pretty bizarre speculation based on very little and lots of unrestrained spaffing over military hardware. It’s quite a tough read at times.
This...and the comment earlier about Reddit being full of frothing 14 year olds...my irony meter broke.
Quite honestly after the last few days I’d be more worried about being a Russian soldier than a citizen of Kiev (very glad I’m neither). They are at the very end of their supply lines facing a highly motivated and ruthless enemy, with who knows how many more anti tank weapons. They don’t appear to have large infantry forces to support them, and nor do they have air superiority. If they do get into Kyiv tonight it will be exceptionally costly for them.
I suppose the other option opposed to discussing the facts on the ground is to have a wee cry about it?
The nuclear threat is just posturing, most interesting though is its a definite sign of desperation from Putin.
Just talked to my lad who has a 2 year old son, Noah.
I told him that Putin wants wealth, prestige and power. So do the oligarchs that support him. China also wants to be a dominant world power.
Non of that counts for a damn if you are dead or are a dominant power in a dead world. Putin's days are numbered.
I feel pretty relaxed about the nuclear situation to be honest and I'm a natural worrier.
(Anyway, Putin is only threatening the nukes because of NATO, it's all NATO's fault. Bastards.😉 Sorry can't resist.)
It does seem Zelensky et al are winning the information war. Which must be disappointing for our Putineers. They seemed to believe everything that was fired their way by Russian bots last week.
China could come out of this very well indeed. They just need to keep a calm head, point out to Putin that he has underestimated what is at stake and appear as the intermediaries of peace.
scotroutes
Full Member
China could come out of this very well indeed. They just need to keep a calm head, point out to Putin that he has underestimated what is at stake and appear as the intermediaries of peace.
Potentially,for sure.
However...
They are probably annoyed that they publicly supported Putin (based on his assurances of a quick victory no doubt) just before an invasion that has solidified the West in a way they really could have done without.
I suspect the people of Taiwan are sleeping a little bit better tonight.
Plenty seem to be doing that, they might want to consider taking an internet break and consider some talking therapy.
As for the spaffing, zero ****s, I'm personally and professionally interested in military hardware etc. I'll spaff all I like thanks.
I suppose the other option opposed to discussing the facts on the ground is to have a wee cry about it?
When you’ve spent a good 20 odd years surrounding yourself with yes men
It was one of the interesting things about the Webb telescope project that they deliberately invited sceptical and dissenting voices to comment on what they were doing so they could actually comment on and disprove some of the suggestions. You do sometimes wonder what would happen if we ran civil society in the same way we ran the successful but super risky science
I'm with you poopscoop, Putin is doing his best rocketman impersonation.
@leffeboy Couldn't hurt to deliberately employ and embrace some disruptors/challengers in government, doubt it would make things any less inspiring!
inkster
Free Member
I’m with you poopscoop, Putin is doing his best rocketman impersonation.
I suspect he's having some poor sap taste all his food and drink at the moment...
I'd say it's a bit premature to think the Russians might not achieve their objective. They're getting a very warm reception but I think Putin will grind out the "victory". He's ****ed if he loses.
Ignore - totally mis-read
Not sure about that, there were certainly Russian special forces planted into major cities in the weeks leading up but the Chechens stick out like a sore thumb, as conspicuous as a jihadi in a Jacuzzi.
When I said "get amongst" the civilians... I didn't mean that the Chechens would be doing it in a particularly sly way... I meant it more in a "we're here to rape your wives, kill your children and force you to watch" kind of way, marching in in literal barbarian hordes. The absolute opposite of what you thought I meant! Obviously, Putin overestimated their ability of course...
I think he thought what with all the f-ups in Iraq/ Afghanistan etc and the appearance of Trump/ Brexit and other divisions in democracy, that the West would not be able to respond in a co-ordinated fashion. Couple that with his military’s apparent success in Syria and other places, and I think he genuinely thought he’d be in charge right across Ukraine by now.
This...
Russian media is starting to report casualties, but no numbers yet. There’s is going to be a hell of a backlash when the body bags start coming home. And they haven’t even started the hard yards yet. Conquering empty fields is the easy bit. However, we do have to hope the Ukrainians don’t run out of ammo before they get resupplied.
There's going to start to be some significant backlash as soon as people stop watching RT, and start watching the global media...
As for Ukraine running out of ammunition...? 😂 Have you been watching the news?!?! Christ... I'm more worried how the EU/UN/NATO is going to get all the excess of weapons back out of Ukraine once the conflict is over, lest the largest ammo dump in Europe remain inside a particularly angry and motivated country after this is all over! 🤫
Quite honestly after the last few days I’d be more worried about being a Russian soldier than a citizen of Kiev (very glad I’m neither). They are at the very end of their supply lines facing a highly motivated and ruthless enemy, with who knows how many more anti tank weapons. They don’t appear to have large infantry forces to support them, and nor do they have air superiority. If they do get into Kyiv tonight it will be exceptionally costly for them.
Also this... Given the situation, I would MUCH rather be oversupplied and under trained than well trained and poorly equipped!
A bunch of young recruits, mostly sent in to fight a war that they won't believe in let alone been given all the full facts about, with poor equipment, fighting an extremely motivated and incredibly resourceful army with a seemingly unending supply of weapons... Reminding anyone of Russia's ineptitude on Afghanistan anyone? 🤷🏻♂️
It does seem Zelensky et al are winning the information war. Which must be disappointing for our Putineers. They seemed to believe everything that was fired their way by Russian bots last week.
Its funny how telling the truth wins out over an orchestrated web of lies when the shit hits the fan eh!?!? 🤔
"You do sometimes wonder what would happen if we ran civil society in the same way we ran the successful but super risky science"
It's not perfect but that's essentially what democracy is. Where the model (system) gets tested every few years when it becomes subjected to public evaluation.
One might hope that the Russian soldiers, given their youth, are the very generation with a much bigger grasp on global opiniOn via social media than their illustrious leaders
I’d say it’s a bit premature to think the Russians might not achieve their objective. They’re getting a very warm reception but I think Putin will grind out the “victory”. He’s **** if he loses.
Why do you think he's threatening Nukes after only 4 days?!?! 🤷🏻♂️😂
On the chart of "how well things are going" for Putin, this is somewhere between "hadn't even been considered we could be doing this badly" and "oh ****!"...
"Grind out a victory"?!?! 😂😂😂 There's nothing going to be ground out here... Putin is quickly realising his only weapon of any real threat left is that of the nuclear deterrent. And the more he talks about it, the less people are scared of his threats any more.
It wouldn't surprise me if Putin goes out on his own terms before too long. A budding Hitler he may be, a master of espionage for sure and he has proven his patience time and again. A superb military tactician he is not though!
The Channel 4 documentary "Putin: a Russian Spy Story" makes interesting viewing, some good (tho necessarily one-sided) history of how he came to power.
Wonder how much the rouble will crash by when the markets open tomorrow morning.
I think we are all just dealing with this in our own way. Some people are 'spaffing' over the MBLN4s and the XTALFJS5s.
Others are having a bit of a cry because of the very real threat that we're going to end up watching our kids die of radiation poisoning (pah, snowflakes).
I don't think there's a wrong way to discuss this unless we want to split up into multiple Ukraine threads.
Personally, my most recent contribution was saying how I chuckled at something I heard on a YT news channel. The idea of Russian soldiers claiming they didn't even know they were in Ukraine just made me think about partygate and Boris Johnson getting hauled out of a tank on the outskirts of Kyiv and attempting to explain to Ukranian soldiers that he thought he had been in a Taxi and how he wasn't sure if he was currently in Ukraine or not and, well, yes, of course, it is a tank and I am in Ukraine but I think most people would agree that it's not really a big deal and really, you could consider the tank a workplace.
Anyway, I got asked to provide my source which just made me start laughing again.
And then start crying.
Vitali Klitschko saying roads out of Kyiv are blocked; Russians reported to be bringing up heavy artillery including thermobaric weapons.
Against that backdrop the discussions scheduled for tomorrow either may not happen or could be nothing more than window dressing.
Good to see FIFA have done pretty much nothing, bar Russia can't have their flag or anthem at their matches, it's times like this that you get to see the real side of some organisations, companies and people, FIFA have told the world what really matters, corrupt to the core and how normal football hasn't moved away from this shambolic organisation is beyond me.
How could Putin bow out? Without being a head of state, he is going to get arrested for crimes against humanity in most of the world. Maybe Syria would take him in if he has hidden his dosh well enough and can pay. If he stays in Russia... maybe that monstrosity he is building on the Black Sea is actually the prison he is going to have to spend the rest of his life in?
I think the only way he goes is feet-first.
Gotcha mboy!
The Chechens were sent in to be a modern day einsatzgruppen, (Nazi death squad).
Good to see FIFA have done pretty much nothing, bar Russia can’t have their flag or anthem at their matches,
This is the sort of appeasement crap that emboldened Russia in the first place; a cop out with the IOC and state sponsored doping, the apparatus of the state murdering people in the UK and nothing happens. If you get away with everything you’re not going to stop.
Tinkoff is currently offering something like 170 roubles to the dollar when the pre-sanctions rate was 83 or something. With BP and now Norway divesting and the sanction in place, tomorrow the market is going to royally screw Russian business.
Putin has already lost. He can't do anything now, even if he flattens Kyiv and parades Zelensky and Klitchko in front of the TV. He's out of SWIFT (or as good as), Switzerland is (probably) freezing his money, Russians can't leave the country or move their money and the ones outside soon may not be able to use their mobiles. he's even blocked FaceBook in Russia. Threatening nukes is all he's got left and China may have words to say about that.