Europe have done what they can to stop importing gas from Russia
Yes, because Russia is using that income to finance an illegal war, raze cities, torture, rape, murder, etc, not to mention the death and destruction to Russians.
Hence Putin’s reported claim that “Russia has not stopped gas exports, it is Europe that doesn’t want them” is not without some merit
It's a partial-truth.
Russia stopped NS1. NS2 was never certified to pump gas.
Russia was represented at the United Nations COP26 conference (Cornwall) where climate change, renewables, fossil fuel's bad, etc were all discussed.
Russia has 20% of the world's forests and signed a global pledge to stop deforestation by 2030. Was that the fault of Europe for not wanting their trees?
Russia didn't present their climate change strategy as required at COP21 (Paris), didn't commit to renewables, will increase coal production, etc, etc.
Will nobody wanting Russia's increased coal production also be blamed on Europe?
Russia is out of step with the world everywhere that you look
Yes, because Russia is using that income to finance an illegal war, raze cities, torture, rape, murder, etc, not to mention the death and destruction to Russians.
Of course. What makes you think I’m not aware of that?
Russia stopped NS1. NS2 was never certified to pump gas.
Why was that?
Russia was represented at the United Nations COP26 conference (Cornwall) where climate change, renewables, fossil fuel’s bad, etc were all discussed.
Russia has 20% of the world’s forests and signed a global pledge to stop deforestation by 2030. Was that the fault of Europe for not wanting their trees?
Russia didn’t present their climate change strategy as required at COP21 (Paris), didn’t commit to renewables, will increase coal production, etc, etc.
Will nobody wanting Russia’s increased coal production also be blamed on Europe?
Russia is out of step with the world everywhere that you look
What on earth is the point you are trying to make with this little shopping list?
Silvio Berlusconi is winding up even before the Italian Elections next week, "ROME, Sept 23 (Reuters) - Russian President Vladimir Putin was "pushed" into invading Ukraine and wanted to put "decent people" in charge of Kyiv" and,
"Centrist leader Carlo Calenda, another election contender, said on Radio24 said Berlusconi had spoken "like a Putin general""
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/putin-was-pushed-into-ukraine-war-says-italys-berlusconi-2022-09-23/
We'll see if other EU leaders who maintain close links with Russia fall into step should Italy's right-wing coalition win next week
What on earth is the point you are trying to make with this little shopping list?
Russia is out of step with the world everywhere that you look. It was in the same post
I don't like to shut down a debate, but I'm going to on this occasion
Russia is out of step with the world everywhere that you look. It was in the same post
I don’t like to shut down a debate, but I’m going to on this occasion
Thank heavens for that! It was getting tiring reading your responses to arguments that nobody ever made.
I don't really understand why this is such a bone of contention. Essentially Europeans said "ooh crikey, we don't want to be so reliant on Russian gas as a long-term strategy, and we should probably try not to be pumping too much money Russia's way in the short term."
Russia then essentially said "well screw you then, you can't have any at all", in an attempt to persuade Europeans that being so hostile to Russia would cost.
I don't really blame Russia for that play - it kind of makes sense. *That's* not my issue with what Russia have been doing...
Both parties have consciously and deliberately played a part in the whole turning off of the taps. So what? The root cause of it all is greed and paranoid ****wittery from one direction. (And no, that doesn't imply that there isn't also an abundance of those characteristics in the West too, but right now, the blame for the invasion and killy stuff is pretty one-sided.)
Both parties have consciously and deliberately played a part in the whole turning off of the taps. So what?
The point is that Kremlin propaganda keeps blaming other countries for provoking Russia when the blame for all of this comes back to Putin, and Putin's apologists in the West keep repeating the Russian propaganda without caring that it's misinformation. As far as the gas supply thing goes, Russia thought it could blackmail Europe into allowing it to invade Ukraine, then it threw a tantrum when that didn't work so it turned off the pipeline, and now it's lying about turning off the pipeline.
I don’t really understand why this is such a bone of contention.
Nor me, but apparently if you don't want to be labelled a "Putin apologist", if he says grass is green you have to insist that it's red.
While good practice, where this is taking place seems to lean on Russia...
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/british-frigate-and-aircraft-obliterate-former-us-warship/
Shocked Pikachu face....
Lambs to the ...............
I hope there is a special place reserved in hell for Putin and Lavrov.
Part of me isn't surprised, part of me is telling myself that it's propaganda to lull the Ukrainians into a false sense of security, as a country swimming in AKs must have better ones than that. Then I remember the crowdfunding for radios and missing body armour...
Are these videos of rusty AK47s for real? Here's another one:
https://twitter.com/SanderRegter/status/1573607741423292417?t=2mYmKlP5y9mq14rrep14Iw&s=19
a country swimming in AKs must have better ones than that.
According to Google, decent condition used AK47s sell for several hundred dollars. The good ones have probably been stolen and sold on the black market.
I expect the better AK's have been sold off to the many tin pot dictators in Africa.
Interesting opinion.
https://twitter.com/olga_chyzh/status/1573307447716069377?t=DwIM6-yhxRVbZe2A3hSAOA&s=19
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-63021117
Vladimir Putin has fired the general charged with managing the Russian military's faltering logistics operations in Ukraine
Vladimir Putin has fired the general charged with managing the Russian military’s faltering logistics operations in Ukraine
The general better not go near any stairs for a while...
It's <possible> that the rusty weapons there are just for basic training- drilling, marching, that sort of thing. Given that there'll be a bunch of unwilling "recruits" there that have never held a gun or that might be a bit keen to shoot people they shouldn't.
(though the second vid wsa clearly someone that knew how to operate it)
Those rifles (AKMs not AK-47s - sorry, spotter alert) will probably still work fine. The AK series of rifles are notoriously tolerant of of abuse and neglect, by design. A lot of that rust is on the stamped metal top cover which isn't essential for functioning, though not ideal, they would still work without it in place. Elsewhere it is cosmetic and unlikely to affect function. Internally loose tolerances, chrome lined barrels, chamber, gas cylinder and over engineered parts everywhere all mean they will likely still shoot. Mikhail Kalashnikov designed the very definition of the 'squaddie proof' rifle.
It's still evidence of extremely poor maintenance and logistics planning mind, not to mention being extremely bad for morale! It's also worth noting that they are a different calibre to the more modern rifles issued to regulars, exacerbating logistic supply issues (7.62x39mm as opposed to 5.45x39mm).
@Northwind - I thought the same. 'Dads army' style recruits were often given wooden guns for this reason, but propaganda probably dictates that they need 'real' guns in case they are videoed/photographed and become a laughing stock
The mobilisation is of reservists who have military experience so will not doubt be able to give them a bit of a clean up
The mobilisation is of reservists who have military experience so will not doubt be able to give them a bit of a clean up
Indeed. A bit of Scotchbrite or wire wool and 3-in-1 oil (or the Russian equivalent) and they'll be reet. Unfortunately.
The mobilisation is of reservists who have military experience
It's supposed to be, but they seem to be conscripting people with no experience.
While there's been no major thrusts fighting definitely ongoing
What's noticeable is that Russia have apparently lost 3 bombers & 2 attack helicopters in the last few days, which seems to be an uptick in losses
But they are also using & losing the new drones Iran is supplying
https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1573754691116318720?t=214QoMe1QaHqK9EadT8moQ&s=19
https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1573762334702682112?t=t8eq2-w65V7JnHgOMirPDg&s=19
https://twitter.com/KpsZSU/status/1573748089348816897?t=1xVbrNZlOCjzeIQrKFPraQ&s=19
https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1573726469355962372?t=FHv57-Nin0x92wnYVaF16Q&s=19
https://twitter.com/Diplomacy140/status/1573151416415571968?t=9xewGwNWEouIpHrSXb4Jcw&s=19
Apparently the German supplied Gepards have been very busy
The mobilisation is of reservists who have military experience
It’s supposed to be, but they seem to be conscripting people with no experience.
Theory is that the recruiters have quotas to meet so they just round up anyone they can to meet quota. The non-eligible ones will be sent back (if they're lucky), but that lets the recruiters pass the quota problem on to somebody else.
The mobilisation is of reservists who have military experience
That's what President Putin announced, "I repeat, we are talking only about partial mobilization. That is, only those citizens who are in the reserve and, above all, those who served in the armed forces, have certain military specialties and relevant experience, will be subject to conscription." ( https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-news/russia-ukraine-war-news-09-21-22/h_7666f140f0a451c554d0f2011058de69)
It’s supposed to be, but they seem to be conscripting people with no experience
Political analyst Ekaterina Shulman writes, "According to such a text, anyone can be called up except for employees of the military-industrial complex who have a delay for the period of work,"
Yet again, the words and deeds are very different. The numbers-to-be-conscripted paragraph in the decree is redacted, so it could be 300,000 and it might not be
above all, those who served in the armed forces, have certain military specialties and relevant experience, will be subject to conscription.
Is drinking vodka for breakfast a military speciality?
https://twitter.com/officejjsmart/status/1573680449460871168
article on the BBC about the UK prisoner released and their treatment. can't imagine how awful that must have been.
maybe we aren't seeing as many Russians surrender because they are expecting to be treated the same by the Ukrainians
reports of arrests from protests and men trying to flee the draft seem to be overegged when you think of the numbers of people in russia.
looks like most are accepting it and preparing themselves for the front line. possibly by drinking truck loads of vodka, tbh if I was about to sent to a front line with a high chance of being blown up by the enemy or shot by my own side I think I'd have a drink or seven
https://twitter.com/MrKovalenko/status/1573894540917964802?s=20&t=QMIwA_lAC56JmKk3IvI_2Q
15% turnout
15% turnout
I am surprised. I thought it would be higher than that.
I guess the short notice meant they couldnt stuff the envelopes in advance.
most pro Ukrainians will either have fled, are fighting or have been intimidated/relocated/ disappeared.
even if the turnout was massively higher its such a sham its entirely pointless
Seen a few reports today suggesting the Ukrainians are very close to taking Lyman and that if they do so it could precipitate another Ukr breakout.
This would explain why so many Russian air assets were being put in harms way in that area yesterday as they tried to prevent this.
Time will tell but losing that many non-replaceable aircraft in one day does suggest desperate measures.
Luckily he was no match for the super intellect of Jacob Rees Mogg, who realised that the perfect way to reduce our dependence on gas is to …. Licence more gas drilling and kill off renewables.
Why would he do that? Oh…
https://bylinetimes.com/2022/09/22/fracking-minister-funded-by-fossil-fuel-investor/
Beyond my flippant comment about JRM, the article is worth a read as regards Crispin Odey and the money he made from Russian fossil fuel interests.
I think this is an actual Prime Minister using NAFO to troll... sumply by getting a Fella profile pic
https://twitter.com/kajakallas?t=Uhp-vFdBObsgMolY3Mca-w&s=09
https://twitter.com/kajakallas/status/1574028336879308803?t=0ajCWUm7B9DeBCIl8POMoQ&s=19
dissonance
Full MemberI am surprised. I thought it would be higher than that.
I was expecting 100%, of whom 113% would vote to join russia
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/sep/25/us-russia-ukraine-war-nuclear-weapons-jake-sullivan
“We have communicated directly, privately and at very high levels to the Kremlin that any use of nuclear weapons will be met with catastrophic consequences for Russia, that the US and our allies will respond decisively, and we have been clear and specific about what that will entail,” Sullivan told CBS’s Face The Nation.
Seen a few reports today suggesting the Ukrainians are very close to taking Lyman
In fairness, reports of this ilk have been repeating for best part of two weeks now. A series of frontal assaults and/or flanking attacks seem to have been repelled. Given Lyman's strategic importance as the site of a major railway junction, its access to important rail a key and road bridges over the Siverskyy Donets River and a key road in the other direction into Luhansk, it seems the Russians are pouring soldiers - and indeed air assets - into defending it.
It does however seem as if the UA has broken through North of the city and heading East has taken a swathe of territory which means Lyman is in real-time danger of being encircled. And if (when) that happens it will surely fall. At that point the UA will be able to use it as a staging post to either head north to engage RF forces in Luhansk via Svatove (a major logistics hub for the RA) or East, to attack RF forces in and around Severodonestk.
Mike has been pretty prescient so far on this conflict so if he thinks Ukraine are on the verge of pulling another blinder then I'm inclined to be optimistic.
Yup, lots of corrobatory stuff out there regarding this. Seems as if an armoured column broke through Russian lines North of Lyman a couple of days ago and motored East. Held up around Karpivka and Ridkodub originally, but seems that they have now secured them and carried on through to Nove.
Interestingly, it seems that the footage of various RF air assets going bump was related to this fight. They obviously knew the danger that this breakthrough represented and threw everything at it to try to throw them back.
Lyman now in real danger. Terrain heading south to Lyman is open farmland and the RF have no established defensive lines. RF in Lyman in real danger of being encircled and forced into a humiliating surrender (they're hardly going to fight to the end). Or try to retreat on roads that the Ukrainian artillery will be zeroed in on. Lose/lose.
Interestingly the fall of Lyman puts the final, definitive nail in the coffin of any Russian aspirations to encircle and take Sloviansk and Kramatorsk (which was plan C for the encirclement of at least some Ukrainian troops in the Donbas, after it became apparent that the larger kettling strategies of plans A (the whole Donbas and a bit more) and B weren't going to happen). So in effect Putin is facing the reality that not only will he never be able to take the Donbas, he won't even be able to deliver on the vastly reduced goal of the vastly reduced goal of the original goal (after the Kiev plan had been kicked into touch). A bad day all round
The above would seem to be the up to date situation (though there are reports coming in that the UA have now moved South and taken Shandryholove, further pressuring Lyman).
Anyone else see some similarities (a massive, engorged similarity some might say) with maps from the early stages of the UA counteroffensive in Kharkiv?
Looks like the US is going to sign of $12 billion in thr next aid package
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-congress-negotiators-set-12-bln-new-ukraine-aid-2022-09-26/
Hard to see what Russia has left to counter this.
Do we think they will resort to nukes? Have bio or chemical weapons been kind of downgraded by the US make sure clear threats if nukes are used?
Don’t they have form for chemical weapons in Syria?
UN Human Rights update on Ukraine
Investigating cases related to sexual and gender-based violence present specific challenges. The Commission has found that some Russian Federation soldiers committed such crimes. These acts amounted to different types of violations of rights, including sexual violence, torture, and cruel and inhuman treatment. There are examples of cases where relatives were forced to witness the crimes. In the cases we have investigated, the age of victims of sexual and gendered-based violence ranged from four to 82 years.The Commission has documented cases in which children have been raped, tortured, and unlawfully confined. Children have also been killed and injured in indiscriminate attacks with explosive weapons. The exposure to repeated explosions, crimes, forced displacement and separation from family members deeply affected their well-being and mental health.
A swing south east above Nove down to the river, coupled with a push up from south of Lyman would trap any RF forces left
The river forms a natural barrier to the east. Bet there is a huge amount of hardware within that area.
Take days to safely clear any pockets of resistance and harvest any apc, tanks or ammo thats left behind.
Hard to see what Russia has left to counter this.
Do we think they will resort to nukes? Have bio or chemical weapons been kind of downgraded by the US make sure clear threats if nukes are used?
Don’t they have form for chemical weapons in Syria?
Posted 36 minutes ago
I doubt Russia will resort to nukes or chemical weapons as they'll not win the war for Russia, would certainly lose all support Russia has from any allies and would probably result in Nato countries if not Nato itself actively getting involved.
I've read somewhere that the US/Nato have been talking via back channels with Russia about retaliation if Russia uses nukes and that they're left the threats purposely ambiguous. I've also read, on twitter so it could be pure lies, that Nato has threatened to sink the Black Sea fleet and destroy Russia's navy bases using Nato air power if Russia use nukes.
Link for that here @wheeliedirtyhttps://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/sep/25/us-russia-ukraine-war-nuclear-weapons-jake-sullivan
Jake Sullivan is the current National Security Advisor to Joe Biden
This conscription office shooting in Ust-limsk is so sad. "We will all go home now". Just a normal person faced with an insane choice- go fight in a futile disastrous war, without the support or gear you need, and with no guarantee of ever being allowed to muster out even if you survive, and also even if you do it turns out you might just get re-conscripted again... The price of accepting is so insanely high that alternatives stop looking insane.
That's the only shooting we know of, but apparently 20 recruitment centres have been torched. And who knows how many suicides have happened or are happening. Someone on the news said people were being radicalised, but that's not it at all. Radical action has been sensibilised.
UN Human Rights update on Ukraine
Horrifying reading.
Extremes seem the normal among Russian soldiers.
Every person helps.
https://news.sky.com/story/amp/edward-snowden-granted-russian-citizenship-by-vladimir-putin-12705918
The Snowden thing is odd a man who campaigns for open free speach (collection of data ECT) lives in a controlled media/,data state.
Meh
Give Snowden a rusty AKM, a day's basic training and a truck ride to Lyman now he's a citizen.
Heard today a leaked documents put the number of potential conscripts to be 1 million.
Investigating cases related to sexual and gender-based violence present specific challenges. The Commission has found that some Russian Federation soldiers committed such crimes. These acts amounted to different types of violations of rights, including sexual violence, torture, and cruel and inhuman treatment. There are examples of cases where relatives were forced to witness the crimes. In the cases we have investigated, the age of victims of sexual and gendered-based violence ranged from four to 82 years.
Reminds me of some of the accounts of soldiers in Vietnam. Not saying it makes it alright but just that in brutal wars that **** people up, ****ed up people do ****ed up things.
Pk
Because if he leaves there he will end up in a us jail for life.
Thats his choice. Russia or life in a us jail
The while Snowden thing, yeah. He's stuck there for life basically.
Putin giving citizenship is just about poking the US in the ribs. A completely impotent Acton from an increasingly impotent leader.
Re: Edward Snowden, as TJ says he's still wanted.
TLDR: Snowden massively damaged spying by countries friendly to the US when Russia and China decrypted a million+ files taken by him.
Russia has said that he won't be conscripted because he doesn't have military experience
He's applied for asylum all over the world and alleges that in 2013 Vice-President Joe Biden put pressure on those countries, including Ecuador who issued travel documents and then withdrew them.
The case is complex because in 2015 bulk collection of US calling records by the NSA was deemed illegal, which is why Snowden is often referred to as a whistleblower.
In 2019 the US issued civil proceedings against him for ignoring his non-disclosure agreement with the CIA and NSA
Patriarch Kirill, leader of the Russian Orthodox Church, believes that the sacrifice made by RF who die in the war "washes away all the sins that a person has committed."
A lot of Russians don't want to be drafted....
https://twitter.com/AlexKhrebet/status/1574429338153340929?t=2oT6gSdUV_Nf5hMHkSSYyA&s=19
Millions of cubic metres of gas have leaked into the Baltic Sea in Danish waters from the unused NordStream 2 pipeline. This war is affecting so many on so many different levels; the environmental disaster from building the unnecessary pipeline is now compounded
I’ll subscribe to that if Pooootin applies. I’d like to see him absolved of his sins in such a manner.
I don’t blame them - it’s not their war - it’s the war of a nutcase. I think the culture there is so different to what we know it’s hard to blame the Russian people for who their leader is. From a political perspective they’ve effectively had dictatorships for a long term - enforced by military / fsb type arrangements from what I read.
Reminds me of some of the accounts of soldiers in Vietnam. Not saying it makes it alright but just that in brutal wars that * people up, * up people do **** up things.
The modern U.S. and NATO armies are built on lessons learned in Vietnam. NATO doctrine is to have professional soldiers who are well disciplined and do not follow a deliberate strategy of targeting civilians. Yes, you will have local breakdowns in discipline, and you will have civilians killed when they get trapped in combat zones, but the doctrine is to target enemy military targets, not to deliberately target civilians. In Ukraine and Syria, Russia has followed a deliberate strategy of targeting civilians purely as a terror weapon, with no military purpose. Big difference between the two approaches.
I doubt Russia will resort to nukes or chemical weapons as they’ll not win the war for Russia, would certainly lose all support Russia has from any allies and would probably result in Nato countries if not Nato itself actively getting involved
For me it depends on how much control Putin still has (or will have as they suffer more defeats due to UA counter-attacks). I can't see Putin surviving losing the war so he doesn't have a whole lot personally to lose by escalating - it's just whether those around him let him.
Chemical/biological weapons seem much more likely to be used than nuclear, they are far more deniable and part of Putin's playbook is implausible denials, he doesn't care how absurd the denial is as long as it creates enough doubt to allow China and others to continue their support and to deter NATO from taking action.
If he used tactical nukes then it's highly likely NATO would strike Russian military targets inside Ukraine and possibly declare a no fly zone, but they would probably hesitate if some previously unknown nerve agent was used and Russia denied any involvement, blaming it on a NATO false flag operation.
I'm intrigued about how employers are going to backfill all the jobs left behind by the latest conscripts. 300,000 is a lot of manpower, but talk of it being nearer 1,000,000 is insane. I guess a fair few are unemployed, and many others are in manual jobs? Maybe there's a queue of people lining up to take them?
A lot of Russians don’t want to be drafted….
I think the speed of reaction to the mobilisation maybe reveals that Russians have a better idea of whats going on than we've given then credit for. Obviously Putin controls the media and we get the sense the population doesn't know whats really going on, but I think people maybe don't feel free to say what they know is going on.
Listening to accounts of young Russians leaving the country, queuing for 70 hours at the border with one bag - its quite a big thing walk away from your home, job, possessions, friends, family with just one bag. I'd wager those people have known whats been happening and where its heading and that bag has been packed for quite a while.
Don’t they have form for chemical weapons in Syria?
TLDR: Officially, no, it was the work of Syria and ISIL according to the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW)
snip...some previously unknown nerve agent was used and Russia denied any involvement, blaming it on a NATO false flag operation.
Mikhail Gorbachev and George Bush snr signed an agreement in 1990 to destroy CW stocks, stop production and support a global ban. In 1997 most countries signed an international agreement so that CW could only be used for protective research, e.g. suits, medication, etc
Russia has come unstuck a few times and was tasked to produce an independent report into who was responsible for one particularly unpleasant attack in Syria in 2013. The Russians told the UN that it was the work of Syrian rebels. Western intelligence suggested that Syrian rebels had never had CW and the report was shelved by the UN
Salisbury is another infamous example and the UK showed that the attack was the work of Russia rather than an individual Russian and thus was chemical warfare
Germany suggesting that there are issues on Nordstream 1 and 2 - and maybe deliberate...
https://twitter.com/Faytuks/status/1574528767984377856?t=TKvL-unzxo-imVNyuGw6fw&s=19
I’m intrigued about how employers are going to backfill all the jobs left behind by the latest conscripts. 300,000 is a lot of manpower...
It's just talk. The declaration has the "numbers to be drafted" paragraph redacted.
The only protected jobs are in the military-industrial sector and does whiff of desperation that you'd strip every other industry. It also puts Russia's claim of 6000 RF soldiers killed in the Ukraine into context (the US estimates 20,000 killed)
Gerhard Schroeder must be crying in his beer 👍
Salisbury is another infamous example and the UK showed that the attack was the work of Russia rather than an individual Russian and thus was chemical warfare......
...... and continued to accept the political donations
A non-dramatic article here
https://www.voanews.com/a/denmark-reports-leak-in-gas-pipeline-in-baltic-sea-/6763758.html
.
Strange coincidence that there's significant 3 leaks on sub-sea gas pipelines on the same day. And an overnight reduction from 110 to 7bar in Nordstream 2 over that distance of pipe must be a bloody huge leak.
Russia demonstrating it's capacity for sabotage the day before the cross-baltic link to Poland is in operation? All very deniable I'm sure.
I thought it was switched off anyway?
I find myself feeling really sorry for those Russians conscripted. They are just normal people with normal lives now being shoved into the firing line
How would we have all acted if all of a sudden we had been drafted in to fight in Iraqi? Against a much more superior foe and on a very thin pretence of justification
I’d have said no way and found any way out of it I could.