[Closed] That "surplus" Giraffe.

Thought the public dissection was a joke when I first read it.
I get that they've done this before and there are possibly educational reasons for chopping up an animal in public - think they might have swerved it in this case given the international media circus.

Zookeeper surely deserving of a cock punch for letting an unwanted giraffe be born in the first place.

Zookeeper surely deserving of a cock punch for letting an unwanted giraffe be born in the first place.

Yeah, right. You try persuading a 18 foot Giraffe to wear a condom.

Zookeeper surely deserving of a cock punch for letting an unwanted giraffe be born in the first place.

How do you suggest he does that - sits the parents down for a chat about the birds and bees?

Zookeeper surely deserving of a cock punch for letting an unwanted giraffe be born in the first place.

Seriously - if you eat meat, then you are in NO position to complain about this. Giraffes aren't any different to the animals you eat.

Giraffes aren't any different to the animals you eat.

They do have quite long necks.

Missed a trick, if you're going to feed a giraffe to lions why not give it a few minutes of running free first, and the lions a chance to stretch their legs...

DrJ - Member

My reading comprehension is fine, thanks. Test your own on this brief passage:

“Why not transfer the giraffe to a zoo which is not part of the breeding programme or to a zoo that is interested in getting a giraffe?”

“Only zoos that follow certain rules can be part of international breeding programmes. In Europe this is only the zoos that are members of the European Association of Zoos and Aquaria (EAZA). EAZA is an association that counts just over 300 members.

As a member of EAZA you agree to the following rules of not selling animals, working on a scientific basis and ensuring animal welfare. The international breeding programmes are fully controlled and open and are collaborations between institutions that follow from the same set of rules. This is important for the breeding programmes to work.”

DrJ, that says absolutely nothing about transferring to other zoos outwith the breeding programme- only that they can't sell to other zoos. So, reading comprehension again I'm afraid.

They do have quite long necks.

Same number of vertebrae though. They are a type of deer, incidentally, so technically it's venison.

DrJ, that says absolutely nothing about transferring to other zoos outwith the breeding programme- only that they can't sell to other zoos. So, reading comprehension again I'm afraid

It says that if a zoo wants to be part of the EAZA programme - which presumably the CPH zoo does - then it has to follow rules about selling animals etc. Hope that clears things up for you.

venison you say-- could be a good alternative to adulterated meat we are presented with..

Tastes more like pork than venison to me (ditto Carnivore in Nairobi)

Can't really see what the fuss is about here. The much bigger question is whether zoos have a role at all. If you accept that they do, then why hide the killing and the use of the meat. Openness helps education - same as visiting an abattoir. If we want to be squeamish about how animals are killed, why they are being killed etc, why have them in zoos in the first place?

I see a role for zoos but would still prefer that they didn't exist.

DrJ - Member

It says that if a zoo wants to be part of the EAZA programme - which presumably the CPH zoo does - then it has to follow rules about selling animals etc

Er yes, that's exactly the point and exactly the bit you're getting wrong. Selling animals, not transferring animals. Other zoos offered to take the animal, not to buy it.

Hope [i]that [/i]clears it up for you 😛

Hope that clears it up for you

I said he had trouble reading...

This was the correct thing they did.

This doesnt really surprise me from a country with the reputation it does for the way it treats pigs.

Which is why I don't touch Danish bacon.

This was not a Danish pig. This was a giraffe from Africa. The lion must eat also. This is the law of the jungle.

Did I say it was a pig? I am just saying the way they have gone about it doesnt surprise me given their track record.

Cougar - Moderator

By making its execution a show and tell? "Hey kids, who wants to go and see a giraffe get shot in the head?" Yaaaay!!

Someones missed a trick here. How cool would it be to have mounted its neck and head on a plaque like this, and stuck it on your wall?

[img] [/img]

You could have it sticking out of a window on the other side of the room

😀

Which is why I don't touch Danish bacon

Maybe you should ...

[url= http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/danish-pig-farmers-reduce-antibiotics-to-prevent-drug-resistance-a-933344.html ]http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/danish-pig-farmers-reduce-antibiotics-to-prevent-drug-resistance-a-933344.html[/url]

"Danes take a different road

Denmark, the world’s largest exporter of pork, banned the use of antibiotics for growth promotion in animals in 1995 and banned all non-therapeutic uses of antibiotics in 2000. Denmark uses far less antibiotics per kilogram of meat produced than does the industry in the U.S.(see chart)."

[img] http://www.remappingdebate.org/imagebrowser/view/image/623/_original [/img]

It says that if a zoo wants to be part of the EAZA programme - which presumably the CPH zoo does - then it has to follow rules about selling animals [b]etc[/b]

Helps if you read the whole thing ...

[img] [/img]

Helps if you read the whole thing ...

It does. Which bit of killing the giraffe and cutting it up was

...[b]ensuring animal welfare[/b].

Which bit of killing the giraffe and cutting it up was

[i]...ensuring animal welfare.[/i]

I guess you need to understand that "ensuring animal welfare" does not necessarily mean being nice to each individual animal.

I guess you need to understand that "ensuring animal welfare" does not necessarily mean being nice to each individual animal.

I do. I'm sure neutering the giraffe would have achieved the same outcome, if there was some reason why it couldn't be transferred to another interested view.

If you were given the choice of a vasectomy or a bolt-gun to the head and becoming lion food, I'm pretty certain you'd happily forsake the need to produce little DrJs

DrJ - Member

Helps if you read the whole thing ...

What, the "etc" that isn't actually in the original text you quoted, so you had to add it in yourself afterwards? Yeah, I read that but ignored it for the obvious reason 😆

Yeah, the "etc" that stood in for parts of the original text that I didn't quote.

This was a giraffe from Africa.

Well, the giraffe wasn't from Africa was it. It was born in Denmark.

Yeah, the "etc" that stood in for parts of the original text that I didn't quote.

Etceteras or not, would you agree that there were plenty of options available to the zoo that meant that the animal's slaughter was unnecessary? Or, as I wrote before, would you prefer to be shot in the head rather than have a vasectomy in the interests of your welfare? Because that's essentially what you're endorsing for the giraffe.

So imagine it does get transferred to another Zoo. What happens when the opportunity comes to get a breeding giraffe but they cant due to this one?

I'm not even sure why people are outraged, is it because it's a cute exotic animal rather than a cat or dog which are put down all across the uk every day?

is it because there was a 'show' of it happening that possibly taught valuable lessons to the people watching?

The two parks that offered to take the giraffe were both part of EAZA, and should have known better than to offer to take the animal in.

If the breeding program had deemed that this animals genes were well described in other specimines, then, by agreeing to be part of EAZA, they'd already agreed to adhere to the breeding program.

Hanging onto an animal for 25+ years, when it won't benefit the species as a whole is a massive waste of resource for all involved. Something like 77% of captive giraffes are [url= http://www.aszk.org.au/docs/giraffe.pdf ]inbred[/url] to a greater or lesser degree, so euthanizing one animal to allow another, more genetically distinct one to be be born and raised will help dilute the future gene pool can only be of benefit to the captive breeding in the long run.

My understanding of this calf being kept alive for 18 months was to allow the mother to fulfil her natural care giving instincts, and reach a point where naturally the calf would be preparing to leave the herd anyway, to diminish stress caused to the other animals. That seems perfectly reasonable to me.

People's objections are purely down to aesthetics, and the idea that a giraffe is somehow more "beautiful" and special than a cow or pig.

would you prefer to be shot in the head rather than have a vasectomy in the interests of your welfare?

If I were to have a vasectomy, I'd lie still while the nice nurse gave me an injection, and not risk breaking my neck after being shot with a tranquiliser.

then why hide the killing and the use of the meat. Openness helps education - same as visiting an abattoir. If we want to be squeamish about how animals are killed, why they are being killed etc

OT but..
we went to the Highland Wildlife Park near Aviemore over the summer. Very nice and you can see all kind of wildlife including red deer which aren't exactly a rare breed round here. Apparently, the deer were there when the park was built so the park builders just put a fence round them. To refresh the gene pool every so often they open the gates and let a few more in, and when there's too many, a few are killed off and fed to the carnivores.
In the cafe, today's special? venison burger. brilliant, go to the zoo and eat the exhibits.

Has any of turned up in any value burgers yet?

Has any of turned up in any value burgers yet?

What've they done with the hide? Make a good stair carpet that.

When they fed the lions, I wonder if they said "are you having a giraffe?"

Im torn. Yes I find it hard to swallow (very sinewy) that there wasnt a happier ending to be found, but that makes me a massive hypocrite as I eat meat everyday and I have virtually no idea of its origin (or treament).

In fact, anyone that eats meat needs to keep quiet. Hypocrites!

Has any of turned up in any value burgers yet?

Greggs were going to make a specula edition pie with a tall covering crust. The lions weren't keen though.

a specula edition pie

😯

I really should get some proper work done, but it seemed rude not too…….

[img] [/img]

😀

Very good. But I would only ever eat Giraffe burgers from M&S.

Nice work binbins 🙂

@dan1980 - you speak the sense, man!

@ Binners - go to the top of the class 😀

DrJ - Member

Yeah, the "etc" that stood in for parts of the original text that I didn't quote.

No, the "etc" which you tried to have stand in for something that's not in the original text.