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Being at the end of my tether with my diseasle Mondeo, I'm looking to sell it whilst it's still worth something (and still moving). As I have bike racks for the roof, and now live in unfurnished property (so moving house with a bed etc is way beyond the scope of even the huge mondy anyway) I'm not too bothered about something gigantic, and would quite like something a bit smaller (and easier to drive down streets designed long before the car).
So, what do people recommend for £2-3k? I'm probably going to go for a petrol, as I don't do enough miles to make up for the extra cost of diesel, and am fed up of diesel-only faults! Plus, i'm now old enough that a petrol engined car won't cripple me on insurance.
I quite fancy a Seat Leon (maybe even the 1.8 sport), and have seen a couple on Autotrader, but none near me. What I have seen is quite a few MG ZSs going for what looks like silly money. Does anyone have any experience of these? There's a couple about for £2.5k with only 40k on the clock, 54-plate - what gives? Or is this actually a realistic price, and if so, why? Any other medium-sized warmish hatches people can recommend?
Cheers!
All I know is that its an old car tarted up IIRC
Alfa 147?
Golf GTI, Timeless classics, great build quality, great image, great drive.
I loved my MK3 I nearly cried when I sold it!
The original and the best.
end of chat
Dont buy an MG-ZS, utter dross.
Reanault clio 172 mk 1 or similar is what your after. Or the venerable golf gti.
mk3 golfs are overweight and underpowered unless its the 16v. Clio Sport are a hoot, also 106 GTi / Rallye.
Opel Manta GTE?
Isn't the Mk3 the worst one they made?
Mk3 and Mk4 are sh*te compared to the others
Looked on Parkers earlier this week and you can get a 147 2.0 '53 plate for under £3k. Was very disapointed as was hoping i might get more for mine, but they are good fun to drive
Will be keeping mine for a bit longer I think
MGs are cheap because MG went tits up
Mk3/4 Golf GTIs are fat and boring even in 16v flavour
get something that's going to depreciate the least or get something that's reliable and that you can just run into the ground over the next 5-10 years
something Japanese
cars are dead
Seeing as lack of reliability is my main problm with my high-mile mondy, I'd dread to think what owning alfa in that price range would be like, so that's out. I guess I suggested the Seat as a cheaper, sportier golf. Does anyone know what's specifically (apart from worrying head gasket stories) wrong with the ZS?
mk3 golf gti is a very nice cruising car with just about enough power to have some fun in.
I had an 8v mkII for 3 years, a 16v mkII for 2 years and a 16v mkIII for 2 years. did about 20K a year average.
The mkIIs are more fun, but the mkIII is a better car for driving on todays roads, as it still feels quite new (ish) whereas the mkII feels its age.
You'll get a good mkIII 16v for a little over a grand, but expect repair bills at that age/milage. mkiv is still expensive for age/milage, but the mkiv 20v turbo with a chip is a fast and fun car 🙂
Hot hatches, 172 defo, maybe even its daddy, a pristine clio williams (avoid the 2, get 1 or 3, 3 has more extras), or even mk2 impreza (pre bugeye), prob 90k on clock 98plate, but it'l be quick (estate for bikes). Even a 206gti, prob x or y plate, 50k on clock poss more, not overly quick, but build quality is o.k. ( try for SP pack). Moving up, a civic jordan, only in yellow, plenty quick (167ish bhp), reliable and rare. how about Seat Ibiza cupra, they depreciate alot at first but then hold out. 180bhp turbo model, quick and will last well. If your lucky, a very high mileage 100k+ 02 plate civic type r. Alot of miles but unbreakable and quick (watch the oversteer and wet conditions though).
2 or 3k seems like a pretty tight budget for a hot hatch to me. For anything that could be described as "hot" you are probably gonna be looking at something high milage and in all likelihood thrashed.
Most petrol performance engines will probably be a bit knackered once they go substantially into 100k + milage.
If I were you I'd be looking for enthusiast owned cars. Restored/refurbed older hot hatches. At your price point you might be able to get a good rebuilt mk1 or mk2 golf, perhaps a 205 gti or 106 rallye. Best bet would be to decide on what you want, do as much research on that car as you can then home in on that particular model.
If its all out bang for buck you want look towards obscure jap imports - some of their seemingly more mundane family cars are raving mentalists in disguise. You'll get slaughtered on insurance though.
Sorry to be down on Mark 3 Golfs, but really, the 8-valve GTi at least, doesn't deserve the GTi badge. It's torquey low down and cruises well on motorways at about 90mph or so, but it's fat and quite ugly and uninvolving - not a patch on the mark 2. The only one I'd seriously look at would be the VR6, and even then I'd go for the Corrado version instead. Oh, I own a Mk3 8-valve as a knock about daily car, bought it because it's light on fuel and practical, drives like a diesel, but hot it ain't. I have a Corrado VR6 for 'hot' 😉
The Mark 2 GTi is nice in theory, but it's hard to find a good one these days and you need to know what you're looking for and at. You could actually get a really nice Mk2 for £3K, but equally there's a lot of overpriced tat out there. Even harder with a Mk 1 because they're older and there are far fewer of them about. Mk2s are ace btw, just really good fun in a small, solid, chuckable, go kart sort of way 🙂
I can vouch for the civic vti if you can find an unmolested one, I had one around 10 years ago and it was great fun. No problem with higher mileages too.
and am fed up of diesel-only faults!
Plenty of petrol only faults too. Diesel should be more reliable than petrol really, you must've got a turkey there.
Bit of a curve ball, but a Ford Puma is an interesting option. Bit of a 'hairdresser' image, but really good to drive. Should be able to get a decent 1.7 for £3K (warm). Spend a bit more and you might even find an FRP (hot). Oh, and still enough space in the back for a bike with the seats down.
MGZS diesel did me fine for three years, comfortable, reliable & brisk (after getting it chipped)
i've got a MKIV Golf and its utter cr@p and costs a fortune in ongoing repairs. every time i google the latest fault there loads of other people with the same problem. Look at the review on honestjohn. VW are selling on an image they gained in the MK 1 & 2 days.
http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/carbycar/index.htm?md=449
Sorry to be predictable, but Octavia 1.8T 150hp is a great drive... Roomy and well put together without being too huge. Warm not hot.
The V6 ZS is basically the same car as a Honda Vti. The engine is smoother, more powerful, and it handles better due to better damping.
I've had both and although the Honda has a better image (and overpriced to suit), the MG was a better car.
Can I throw in something a little different...
Corrado, in either G60 (supercharged) or VR6 form.
To be honest, you'll get a good MkII GTI for a lot less than £3k (finding them is the problem).
I'd second the Puma. Test drove on a few yrs back and it was great fun.
Not sure if they will fit into your budget, but the Mk4 Ibiza petrol FR has got the 1.8T engine and is good for 150bhp.
You might even get a Mk3 Cupra, but they look a bit boxy.
G60 is a real pain to work on, apparently, according to a mate who was a VW specialist.
Corrado fan here too, have had a VR6 for a couple of years and love it...
The VR6 is the one to go for IMO, sounds lovely, just make sure you get one thats had the chains done... G60 is decent too, it just has a supercharger that can be tempramental thats all...
Alfa 147?
Ditto.
I like this on the honest john site
Bad: Huge number of quality problems in direct contradiction to "Few things in life are as reliable as a Volkswagen".
Second Octavia VRs 1.8T.. My made has one, it's fairly quick and practical too. Still prefer a hot diesel tho 🙂
Want reliability and speed? Only one choice IMO - Japanese. I've had a lot of cars but my best is still going - a '96 Honda Accord 2.2 VTEC - goes like stink, does 40mpg if I'm nice to it and I've replaced the radiator once in 5 years and had to sort the rear brakes twice. It has 212000 miles on the clock and is fresher than French cars I've driven with 60k.
Honda Civic VTi was mentioned - subtle but fast. Honda Accord Type R? Serious hot hatch and if regularly serviced then phenomonally reliable (check gearboxes etc beforehand and check honestjohn.co.uk)
Honda Accord and Skoda Octavia* = middle aged family waggons
The kid wants a hot hatch FFS
MG ZS in 190 Saloon form is a great car - great chassis, no HG related problems, smooth torquey engine, a very grown up car. Great value too.
For proper hot hatch fun for 2 or 3 grand, you want a 306 Gti-6.
I dont know what Gnar Gnar is on about with that being too small a budget to get anything nice - for 3 Grand you'll be looking at the absolute mintest late GTi-6's with low mileages and full history.
167bhp, one of the best FWD chassis of its time, superb turn in and ride quality, 6 speed box, all the toys, loads of room for bikes. Deceptively quick due to the gearbox and lowish weight. Loads of room for bikes too.
highly, highly reccomended, read the reviews from when they came out on www.306gti-6.com
Mk3 and Mk4 Golf Gti's are bland, dull and slow in comparison, and should not carry the Gti badge.
Don't even bother getting anything with a GTI badge etc on it 1. It will have been ragged. 2. They're just boring normal cars with a bigger less econmical engine in.
A standard Ford Focus will drive better than any Seat Leon etc, or get some thing that is interesting to drive like an MX5!
Fabia diesel VRS or Lupo GTi...
Mk3 and Mk4 Golf Gti's are bland, dull and slow in comparison, and should not carry the Gti badge.
I'll agree with you here, but people tend to forget that these weren't the top of the range sports models. The VR6, 4Motion, R32 etc. kind of replaced the GTI in a way.
What I have seen is quite a few MG ZSs going for what looks like silly money
There's a reason for that - They went bust.
And there's a reason for THAT - The cars were crap.
16v and williams clio were great cars, really chuckable. 172 was S%^t, biggish engine in a flabby body.
Would really love to have another williams clio.
A coupe rather than a hatch but worth a look......
Gen 7 Toyoyta Celica T-Sport (or VVTLi - same engine, fewer extras)
189bhp, 35mpg+, cheapish insurance, ultra reliable, cheap running costs
Similar type engine to Honda Civic Type R - ie pretty docile when knocking about town but a hoot when you give it some welly and hit the "lift" at 6200prm!)
Fold the back seats down and it swallows 3x mountain bikes (with front wheels removed)
Also do a 140bhp VVTi which is not that much slower and probably cheaper to buy.
I had a gen 6 celica and did about 60k miles in it right up to 150k when the insurance company wrote it off over a very minor shunt. Nothing went wrong on it ever, and the low depreciation meant it was actually really cheap to run. can get good ones for < 2k now.
doglover - I gave an example of an old reliable Honda. He did state that - there are tons of fast, hot older Hondas he could look at. I have VR4s, Honda Civic Type R and have owned RX8 (worst idea ever!) so I know something about fast Jap cars.