Practically to hurt someone like this, I’d have them barred for life from holding any licenses for tree work, being a member of any forestry related organisation, and from owning any chainsaw or similar equipment.
How about a number of days community service equal to the age in years of the tree and/or wall spent planting trees, the cost of which is to be provided by the seizure of assets or future pay similar to a student loan repayment - whichever is easier for the government/court?
There are international laws for this both in and out of conflict, but in UK law I can only see references to conflict.
The wall will be a scheduled ancient monument. Which has its own offences, but I think the penalties are actually lower than the max for criminal damage.
Bold look to turn up at court with.
Still, no sweat.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-69011665
If found guilty, what would be a suitable punishment for these two pricks?
Pop them into some quick drying concrete up to their ankles then chainsaw through their legs and watch them fall over. Punishment to fit the crime and all that...
Is that Prince Andrew?
imnotverygood
Full Member
There’s something about that photo that shouts ‘guilty’
Yeah, it's hard to put your finger on it...
I'm guessing they haven't heard of social media as their faces are all over it. Perhaps it's just a new fashion trend rather than an odd attempt at anonymity?
Or maybe they are practicing gimps?
Good to see, although I’m not entirely surprised, Sycamore are basically a very large weed, and are pretty difficult to kill, outside of using chemicals! Unlike Ash, which does have some fungi that’ll eventually kill it.
Two on trial for this today. This is worth a read through, they sound like a right couple of prats!
https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/sycamore-gap-trial-live-updates-31522055
Summary thus far:
-The tree is valued at £660K
-the pair took photos with a wedge of wood, likely the piece cut from the tree in their car
-Both drove there, with their real numberplate on the car (captured on anpr), with their phones switched on for most of the journey
- they shared social media posts to each other about it, commented privately in reply somebody calling them "weak" : "Weak… f*** weak? Does he realise how heavy s is?" "would like to see <person making comment about them> launch an operation like we did last night!" 🙂
...and they claim to be "not guilty".
What was the point other than mindless vandalism?
From what I've read so far it does seem to be a rather open & shut case, looking forward to hearing their defence. Can't see their/his groundworks business flourishing whatever the outcome.
I've been ready the BBC's live reporting from the court. I appreciate that it's currently the prosecution outlining the case, but it does seem pretty damning.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cvg93k0950pt
Lets not forget this nugget:
"The prosecutor adds: “That video was on Graham’s phone, stored in the media/photo data section of the phone. Not sent via WhatsApp or downloaded from somewhere else, but created by- filmed on- this phone. The video was created on Thursday 28th September at 00:32:01 real time."
"Graham’s phone was at Sycamore Gap as the tree was being cut down and Graham’s phone filmed the tree being cut down."
Stupid is as stupid does.
Edit - same thoughts, same time! 🙂
It seems open and shut so far having flicked through. Sentencing guidelines suggest they would start at 18 months. Likely to go up from there though given the significant nature of what hey did.
The defence case is going to be interesting...
"He made me do it!"
From what I've read so far it does seem to be a rather open & shut case, looking forward to hearing their defence.presumably from that prosecution opening statement the defence is "a big boy did it and ran away" possibly mixed with "I was at home with my girlfriend". They are perfectly entitled to put the crown case to the test - the CPS acknowledge they don't know which of them actually cut it down and which filmed it, which makes no difference in law but to lay jurors probably feels important. Bear in mind we are two days in and haven't actually heard any evidence, never mind cross examination.
But if they get off - take a note of their legal team's details in case you ever need a miracle!
I don't know - there's an estates manager for Toby Carvery looking for a tree surgeon with the utmost respect for confidentiality!Can't see their/his groundworks business flourishing whatever the outcome.
is there any update on the motive?
They wouldn't look out of place in the Appalachian Mountains in a banjo competition.
is there any update on the motive?
Dunno about motive but apparently anyone is free to use his range rover and phone whenever they like.. wasn't me honest guv
is there any update on the motive?
From the way its being reported it was simply 'for the bantz'
"I lent my Range Rover, chainsaw, phone and likeness to someone else Guv." seems to be the defence.
I don't know how you can put a value of £660k on a tree. It's priceless.
£660k would not replace it. Some people just don't get how long trees take to grow.
Tree law does give values. Someone cuts down a tree they shouldn't it has a monetary value. That sounds about in line with other cases i have heard.
The open area behind my flat had lime trees around it. The residents of one of the buildings who have the right to park there complained to their factor about the sap dropping on their cars. The factor had the trees cut down. Only problem is they did not belong to that building. He had to replant 14 20ft high deciduous trees to avoid prosecution. That would not have been cheep
"That would not have been cheep"
Great pun - loss of bird habitat.
Double post madness.
Yes, but my point it if you gave someone £660k they couldn't replace it like for like. Unlike a car.
For meaningful compensation the law needs to put value on irreplaceable things such as limbs where the value might include loss of earnings for example. In this context £660k sounds cheap considering how well known a draw the tree was for the local area.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/may/09/two-men-found-guilty-of-felling-sycamore-gap-tree
Verdict just in.
No info on sentencing yet.
Going for the equivalent defence of "An older boy did it, you wouldn't know them, they go to another school" seemed optimistic.
The least surprising verdict since Wagatha Christie case. I was surprised to see both held in remand though, and one of them having been on remand since Christmas.
I was surprised to see both held in remand though, and one of them having been on remand since Christmas.
I think the one held since christmas was requested for his own safety.
quite how the trial went on for so long I have no idea
I think they have achieved an almost perfect "**** about - Find out" score.
Someone said this morning on one of the news reports ‘I know you shouldn’t judge by appearances, but they both look exactly like the type of people who would commit such a stupid, mindless act just for the sake of it’
It does look like there’s a very limited gene pool in the area. Their ‘dog ate my homework’ style defence would suggest they’re not the sharpest tools in the box
quite how the trial went on for so long I have no idea
To allow them to keep digging with ever more stupid excuses and self incriminating statements?😂
I'd hope the continual refusal to admit guilt will lead to a more robust punishment.
I'd throw them in the sea to feed the orca pod currently dining on grey seals along the Northumberland coast.
But I'd film it as a warning to other mindless idiots. Actions have consequences
I'm such a liberal
I'd throw them in the sea to feed the orca pod currently dining on grey seals along the Northumberland coast.
I gather that treeson still is a capital offence.
I gather that treeson still is a capital offence.
This isn't a joaking matter.
Their ‘dog ate my homework’ style defence would suggest they’re not the sharpest tools in the box
Genine question - assume you find yourself lucky enough to be the barrister assigned to defend one of these two, and they spout the shite they have - do you have to run with it in court? It'd be kind of embarrassing!
I loved the judge thanking the jury for their hard work. I'm going to assume they'd made they minds up in the first 10 minutes of the trail and the hard work was mostly involved with staying awake and/or not laughing.
You likely to go to prison for chopping down a tree?
