[Closed] STW 2014/15 Rugby Thread

think Benson Stanley got a knock last week, the Welsh reserve looks to be getting a run-out opposite Barritt in Clermont , worth a watch)

Didnt Rougerie get broken too?

Read an interview with Frank Bunce a while ago and he said the player he most feared going up against was Jeremy Gusset. He said all other centres tried to take him on in a physical contest (and lost) but Guscott stayed clear of all that and his pace/step gave Bunce nightmares.

This kind of sums up the English selection lately for me, as in what they are not doing right. As a Welsh fan, every time the England squad/ team has been released for the past few years I breathe a sigh of relief that the dangerous exciting young players that provide a real threat to Wales haven't been selected (or haven't ever been selected so haven't built up the international experience) 😀

Wales (and probably Scotland/ Ireland to some extent) are forced to spread the experience through a range of players and have more of a culture of trusting the lesser capped players- because they have no alternative. The way a lot of these players come on for the international experience is staggering even if they aren't always world beaters at the end of the day. England seem to have so much talent at their fingertips but fear defeat more than than aim for victory meaning the exciting young guys don't have the structure to come in to the side and succeed.

I know daddy's boy #2 is starting to place a little more and give daddy's boy #1 a rest occasionally but there isn't a lot of tried and tested experience in the England side outside the first choice guys, particularly in the backs. There isn't a single back I'd fear looking at the team sheet... but I guess that isn't England's game plan.... Farrel kick for territory then lineout/ maul for points from the forwards. Lets hope they try and convince themselves then can play exciting rugby and try to play through the backs to give Wales a chance 😀

[i]Didnt Rougerie get broken too?[/i]

Rougerie broke 10 minutes in, so JD got a good 70mins last week.
He was only on the bench because Nalanga pulled out before kickoff, promoted from travelling reserve, but he's back this week.
Should do him good to get a couple of big cup matches in before next week.

Can someone please remind me how to watch Sky red button stuff on the Sky website? It would be nice to see Scarlets - Toulon later today

sorry dan, no sky

roberts v burrell now on bt

So is Burrell easily better?

Whoever said that needs to have a look at the saints v racing game.
Roberts looking v skillful on top of his normal stuff.
Burrell looking flat footed , Imhoff absolutely skinned him earlier.
Farrell and Rowntree in the crowd to see it too, can't see him starting. Only real English ray of light is Corbs looking back to fitness.

JR tryscorer too now

Jeez. Saints have been comprehensively beaten in all areas of the field.

can't see him starting.

Treviso Ospreys was a bloody close one eh?

Ospreys had an awful team out.
Not been able to see any games today as on childcare duty.

Can someone please remind me how to watch Sky red button stuff on the Sky website? It would be nice to see Scarlets - Toulon later today

Anyone have any ideas how to watch the Scarlets game on Sky online? Ulster Leicester will probably be more entertaining but nonetheless 😉

Ospreys had an awful team out.

Burrell wasn't that bad, but the Northants team didn't show up. They can play far better than that! Desperate Dan looked ok, but certainly not stand out (that pickup excepted).
Looking forward to the six nations but suspect I'll be just as disappointed with a crappy English team.

Liverpool v Bolton footie on bt now.

On today's form there's a couple of Bolton players better tacklers than Burrell.

Still.....Treviso?

Its the level they are at.

Has everyone found the new wiziwig?

Adam Jones has retired from international rugby, 3 grand slams, world cup semi final, 5 Lions Tests. Legend.

[img] [/img]

Jeez. Saints have been comprehensively beaten in all areas of the field.
can't see him starting.

He's one of our best defensive (and attacking) centres!
Mylers' been awful.

He's not though has he? I'm sure I read somewhere that his tackle completion rate in the AP was something like 76%. Even Eastmond with his 'poor' defense was in the 80's. I think it's just a different kind of tackle though. Eastmonds a drag em down tackler (similar to Ford) as opposed to a smash em back. Maybe Lancaster feels it's a risk having two people in the middle three that give away gain line metres in the tackle.

Has everyone found the new wiziwig?

I have now. Thanks. 😉

I'd gone over to cricfree.tv after Wiziwig's demise which worked ok too.

He's not though has he?

Ospreys at Trviso, to make some excuses, dead rubber, playing away, none of the Internationals want to get hurt. Yes should of turned Treviso over.

Diolch Adam, a legend and a top bloke as well. 95 caps and the Slams is an incredible achievement.

Aw, Glasgow stuff it at the end. It was there for the taking!!!

What was the score?

Could someone possibly link to the new wiziwig please? Google has thrown up several different ones.

Www.wiziwig.ru

20-15 I think. Glasgow on the bath line at 78 mins.

It was Bath's forwards who won it for them in the end. Carl Fearns and Dave Attwood coming off the bench gave them the impetus. Exciting game though - Glasgow played with real attacking intent and scored a cracking try late on.

Bath win the group after Toulouse were pipped at the death by Montpelier.

Just watching Clermont v Sarries and Farrell was taken off with a knee injury. Didn't look too serious .....but you never know.

Mad set of score this weekend.
Montpellier do Bath a massive favour, and leinster too.
By my reckoning, that's made it a home quarter final for them, when it looked like the draw had blown it. 🙂

Farrell's injured. A shame for any player but I can't help thinking that benefits the England team.

Massive applause for Adam Jones. A legend of the game despite being Welsh*.

*last 3 words purely for AA's benefit.

Yeah , A Jones always came across well, old school.
Sad the way it ended for him, deserved more respect from his manager IMO.

Oh well, 4 English sides qualify for the last 8 but all away from home.

Wasps were let off the hook by Leinster then lost the chance to snatch it at the death. Saints hammered by Racing. Bath fortunate to hang on against Glasgow and Sarries well beaten by Clermont.

Wasps have the un-enviable task of going to Toulon.

Still, at least I saw a good performance from an English back - shame he happens to play for Clermont.

Racing v Sarries

Toulon v Wasps

Clermont v Northampton

Leinster v Bath

loum I agree but this is the cold hearted world of professiona rugby and the game has lost a bit of its heart.

Farrel's injury could make England's RWC

Adam Jones is a legend indeed. I was quite critical of him a while back as he seemed to have slipped from his best and it seems Mr Stubborn agrees. I do think with RWC coming up dropping him from the squad was a mistake and now he's no longer an option. I wonder whether he'll consider a few seasons in warmer climes ?

@loum, being lazy here but what weekend are those games scheduled - normally April post 6 Nations I recall

4/5 april

2 v 4, 3 v 1 semis

Thanks, just checked too and one game might/will be on the Friday.

Any news on injuries? Parling, Wood, Eastmond, Farrel? Burrels pride? Havent heard of any Welsh players. Parling would be a massive loss for England not having him or Wood would really even up the lineouts

I still don't get all the hype about Parling at lineout time. Last time he was in charge internationally (2013 6n's) England had the worst lineout stats of the tournament. Lawes is a much bigger loss imo.

Yeah lawes and launchbury are a very very good pairing good in the lineout and immense work rates. However with Parling out it will be Attwood and Kruiz who dont worry me half as much. Was 2013 when Youngs chucking went haywire?

Yeah Young's didn't help! Pretty sure the biting kiwi was chucking the majority of the first 3 games though at least.

Kruis and Attwood are both very promising players, but together....I'm not sure that there's quite enough grit, especially if Wood isn't there to back them up either.

Injuries are really wrecking our selection choices currently-the way the game is played nowadays I guess that it's just the norm though.

Tom Croft called up. Suspect this is to help shore up the lineout as well (and he works well with Youngs).
I think Youngs currently has better line-out statistics than kiwi biter and the bath hooker.
Anyway, by the end of the tournament we are going to have Burrell and Burgess in the centres with ford popping them into space. I think that'll work OK and even though the back 3 won't get and ball, that's the same as it's been with no penetration from the centres as well.

I think Kruiz has more presence and go forward that he's being given credit for in here, Attwood has a bit of pace about him as well.

So the elephant in the room; Sam Burgess - is he really THAT good? Can a player be so far head an shoulders about the rest in so little time, and will he make a difference to the England set up? Or is this all here worship and media hype? 8)

I've not seen anything of him (in Union) that makes me think he's a wonder player, but that in no way makes me think he won't be in the team by the end of the 6 nations. It's going to happen as sure as the sun will set tonight.

Happy to stand corrected, but he appears to be a bash merchant with reasonable hands? That's not uncommon in Union!

I think Burgess is there simply so Lancaster can have a look at him first hand and get to see how he works. He has masses of potential but still looks very much like someone learning the game. I imagine Lancaster will love him though, according to those in the Bath camp he's honest, incredibly hardworking and has a real willingness to learn. Ex-colleagues in league say he's just a great person to have in camp and to be around as well, which is consistant with Lancaster's philosophy and mantra.

There was a great documentary that Fox Sports did on him, its on youtube, called Slammin' Sam. Obviously it's biased towards him but it gives a pretty good indicator as to the kind of person he is. That, coupled with his freakish athletic ability means he could be a real handful once he gets to grips with the game fully.

At the moment though I think its definitely hype. There are better English qualified centres at almost every club in the AP. But he looks to be catching up fast!

Although currently isn't there only 12T and JJ that are fully fit centres in the EPS after the weekend? So we may be seeing him sooner than we thought!

Watched a bit of the Wales training session last night.

Biggar dropped a high ball, but 1/2p was banging kicks through the posts to Jenks with consumate ease.

Can I ask a random question.. Something that has bugged me for a while..

Given that attacking mauls are so difficult to stop and well drilled teams (including my own, Sale) often use it to such devastating affect why are they almost always allowed to form?
I am no expert obviously but I know that by not engaging the attacking team any players in front of the ball carrier are offside allowing the defending team to run around and tackle if they want to, or gaining a penalty. Why is this tactic seldom used???

Like this

[url=

not engaging![/url]

he's honest, incredibly hardworking and has a real willingness to learn. Ex-colleagues in league say he's just a great person to have in camp and to be around as well

That's pretty much what people said about Andy Farrell when he was vying for the England 12 shirt and he turned out......rubbish.

Farrell and Barritt supposedly out of the Wales game according to the London Evening Standard.

Bad news for Wales.

The good news for Wales is that this "opens the door for Billy Twelvetrees...."

Who will presumably hold the same door open for Jamie Roberts. 😉

Can I ask a random question.. Something that has bugged me for a while..

Given that attacking mauls are so difficult to stop and well drilled teams (including my own, Sale) often use it to such devastating affect why are they almost always allowed to form?
I am no expert obviously but I know that by not engaging the attacking team any players in front of the ball carrier are offside allowing the defending team to run around and tackle if they want to, or gaining a penalty. Why is this tactic seldom used???

some refs don't seem to like it, more of a problem IMO is the illegal forming of the maul with players coming in ahead of the ball carrier

A much more recent example

[url=

vs Bath[/url]

Farrell and Barritt supposedly out of the Wales game according to the London Evening Standard.

Bad news for Wales.

The good news for Wales is that this "opens the door for Billy Twelvetrees...."

Who will presumably hold the same door open for Jamie Roberts.

Gulp!

I'd go Burrell and Eastmond.

That's pretty much what people said about Andy Farrell when he was vying for the England 12 shirt and he turned out......rubbish.

Farrell was 31 when he started in union and had recently suffered a raft of injuries and a fairly major car crash which injured his back I believe. Burgess is in his prime, regarded as one of the best league players in the world and with time to learn. Completely different state of affairs.

Like I said, whether he's a success or not is yet to be seen. I personally believe he's left it too late for the WC. But, if he's prepared to stick around after that he has the potential to be a player in the mould of Roberts. If he'd come a year earlier I don't think we'd be in this situation of panic now Tuilagi's injured.

Completely different state of affairs.

I agree. It is. The rest of what you say is also accurate.

However, the point was that all that eulogising about Burgess was exactly the same as what was said about Farrell. That didn't mean he was a great union player and talking up Burgess doesn't mean he'll be great either.

I'm a huge fan of Slammin' Sam - as a person and as a RL player. I just have plenty of doubts as to whether he can make the transition successfully.

Jon Callard thinks Burgess has 3 world cups in him 😯

Talking of Sam, isn't it the Main Man's 50th cap against England?

It's all very well everyone having a go at "over lap" Twelvetrees but after this weekend that is twice recently "flat footed" Burrell has been done on the outside. 😆

Callard thinks Burgess has 3 world cups in him

Well he's got one RL world cup under his belt. Does that count as one?

that is twice recently "flat footed" Burrell has been done on the outsid

Yeah Burrell didn't look too clever against Racing Metro did he? 🙁

So Farrell out for 6N with a

high-grade medial ligament strain

[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/31002380 ]http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/31002380[/url]

And it's very wrong of me to be pleased.

I wish the bloke no ill will whatsoever, but I'm pleased that the coaches are going to have to try use Ford and hopefully chippy. Maybe then, a slightly less creative centre could work!

It might focus farrell on his game a lot more time off with players pushing for his spot. I hope Ford's performance is good enough for a permanent spot in September he looks like a more switched on rugby brain than farrell.

I think you englishers are being a bit harsh on Farrell. Starting Ford is a gamble, could be great or could struggle. Mind you if Samson isnt fit Wales will lose.

Farrell has missed so many tackles in defence at crucial moments in games. Time Out will do him good.

Ford has been better than Farrell in every age group they've played in. He's a better runner, distributed and kicker from hand. Farrell is a good place kicker and can be a good tackler (when he's in the right place and not getting involved in niggle off the ball). I know which one I'd prefer to have in my team...

Farrel does what is needed for an international 10. He is pretty solid in the tackle, kicks territory pretty well and his place kicking is up to scratch. International rugby is (sadly?) often more about being solid than spectacular when winning margins are small. Ford is the more exciting option but could equally be a bit of a liability at this level. Ford's place kicking stats aren't up to much either are they? The bigger issue is what happens if Ford gets broken? Not a lot on international game time for the 10's vying for a place in the team...

The bigger issue is what happens if Ford gets broken? Not a lot on international game time for the 10's vying for a place in the team...

We'll find out if Cipriani really has matured.

Annoying to see the age old question about England centres again. Just when we thought we had 3 or 4 decent ones to choose from, injuries and poor form raise there head. The only two playing consistently well are JJ & Eastmond, but are they World Cup level? No I don't think so. Lancaster may test them & Cips vs Italy or Scotland perhaps.

I can't help thinking that Fridays game will be more forward orienatated than usual. I'd like Burrel to score just to annoy AA 😉 but as usual our 3/4 appears afflicted.

My prediction; England 19 (1 try 4 pens) Wales 16 (1 try 3 pens).

Farrel does what is needed for an international 10. He is pretty solid in the tackle, kicks territory pretty well and his place kicking is up to scratch. International rugby is (sadly?) often more about being solid than spectacular when winning margins are small.

I think that that's what as an England supporter, I'm used to watching, but it's not what a really good fly half should be doing. There's that little thing about being able to spot the right option, and this sometimes involves passing the ball to a player in space, or spotting a developing overlap.

Something that I read about Chris Ashton. He found playing with Flood fantastic because Flood played flat and was happy to pass the ball to a player coming from deep. It worked for the pair of them. As soon as Farrell came along, that type of ball dried up completely so Ashton was of no more use. I'm no fan of Ashton, but there's something wrong if your best finisher simply stops getting any kind of ball...

I'd have thought that Lancaster first choice midfield v Wales was going to be Ford, Farrell, barritt. Two most experienced defenders he trusted and an extra kicker / playmaker to manage the game and keep the ball where he wants it. Not flashy or exciting but sensible to try to negate Wales backs by avoiding them as much as possible. Real back to square 1 for England's plans now.

TB, as someone who used to love watching the French attack off deep 3/4 lines in my youth and the Irish more recently, I get dismayed at England's inability to take the ball at pace. Gain line desperation gone too far? The downside of total rugby was having hookers playing at 13!! It's the RU equivalent of Fallaini ? - waste of time and space in midfield, just slowing things down and being dirty.

Still looking forward to 6N. The draw had already made it wide open - in terms of who has home advantage, when - let's see who makes the flying start. I enjoy the fact that (almost) any team could win.

Frustrating that England don't have a RWC team to blood properly though!

Nicky Thomas gone from Ospreys to Gloucester, big loss to the welsh game, he's a real prospect

Geoff Parling, Brad Barritt, Tom Wood and Kyle Eastmond will miss the Cardiff game

so say the beeb

Farrell was worth his big chance early in his career but he has not progressed. Judged at international standard his goal kicking is adequate, his positional kicking is terrible, his passing/game management modest. In the two head to head games I saw (H-Cup Semi 2013 and Final 2014) an aging JW humiliated him, the gulf in standard was enormous. England have done themselves a disservice by not bringing in Ford for more game time sooner. I don't like to see people get injured (especially knee injuries I winced when I saw it) but his injury has forced Lancaster to make the changes he should have made a while ago.

Nicky Thomas gone from Ospreys to Gloucester, big loss to the welsh game, he's a real prospect

[img] [/img]

Love it 😀

Hahaa what a monumental **** he is!!

Fine player wendyball antics aside though.

England injuries;
Cole
Launchbury
Lawes
Parling
Slater
Wood
Morgan
Farrell
Burrell
Eastmond
Barritt
Tuilagi
Foden
A couple of front rows and that would be a decent team!

England can still field a pretty good pack, but a starting lock will only have one cap, and the bench lock; 0.
The only two remaining centres are twelvetrees who is horribly out of form (and not that good when he's at his best) and Joseph who has not played for england for 2 years.
I'm hoping it will be competitive but a sound thrashing wouldn't be a surprise either. We will not be seeing expansive rugby in this game, well not from England anyway!

Well, we'll see how Wales get on vs our 2nd's.

Excuses coming in early Kryton 🙄

Get the excuses in nice and early!

😉

Beaten to it!

Still valid Captain 😆

Get the excuses in nice and early!