dunno, probably?

the internet says so:

It is essential to pre-heat the water before adding it to the Moka Pot to prevent burning the coffee and infusing your brew with harsh metallic undertones

so it must be true

stovetop espresso

Coffee snob says No.

Coffee snob says No.

Are you an expert in these matters or are you talking cobblers? I have to ask given your username. 😉

Depends on where you are in the country and what’s the underlying make up of the water I reckon ... down here in the Downs it’s full of limestone, there’s a taste difference to the water in the Yorkshire Dales for sure.

Hot water 100c ish is burning the coffee?

Beans are roasted up to 240c.

[url= http://www.coffeecrossroads.com/coffee-101/coffee-roasts-from-light-to-dark ]http://www.coffeecrossroads.com/coffee-101/coffee-roasts-from-light-to-dark[/url]

It suspect it's down to a poor blend or coffee that has gone stale.

A true coffee snob would point out that stovetop "espresso" isn't espresso, as stovetop coffee makers don't operate at high enough pressure 🙂

Ive no idea but without bragging too much my two shot flat white is better this morning than the normal £2.60 i have to pay .
50mm of light brown frothy creme left on the side of the cup
My new milk pitcher has turned me into an instant barista although the Rancilio Silvia is money well spent a delight to use

Cold here, secret is low heat. No 4 on elec hob, enough time to eat yr cereal while its heating up.

I make mine with boiled water as it makes the process a bit quicker. If YM's W prefers the taste with cold water, she should definitely carry on doing that.

Hot water 100c ish is burning the coffee?

Beans are roasted up to 240c.

Its not actually 'burning' it - different temperatures of water bring out different flavours from the beans. (which is why you don't make coffee with cold water). Temps around 100c bring out bitter/burnt flavours that you don't get if the water is a little cooler. So while you haven't burnt anything I can taste as if you have.

Also cold and very low heat. I have however just run out of coffee!

which is why you don't make coffee with cold water

Except you can, coldbrew is coffee brewed slowly with cold water. It's also very nice (if you use good coffee)

Dales is limestone too, isn't it? Buttertubs, Malham Cove?

Yeah I've been puzzled about the water thing. Lots of limestone around here (Settle) but the water is very soft (at least, no limescale on anything, ever). I assume it must come from just a bit further west, perhaps Stocks reservoir in the Trough of Bowland. We are just on the edge of the limestone ourselves.

Also, given the rainfall, perhaps any surface runoff won't have time to pick up appreciate carbonate...

Dales is limestone too, isn't it? Buttertubs, Malham Cove?

Yes, you'd think so wouldn't you. Groundwater in that area has high levels of calcium, so much so that streams can be seen with tufa petrifying the stream bed. However, Yorkshire Water supply Malham for example with reservoir water, a calcium content of 8mg/litre. Very soft.

Water Quality
Supply Zone: Skipton/Craven 2015

Areas Covered: Barnoldswick, Earby, Gargrave, Grassington, Hellifield, Horton in Ribblesdale, Malham, Settle, Skipton, Stainforth

Report Period: 1st January 2016 - 31st December 2016

Water hardness type: Soft

Water hardness average: 8mg/l calcium

Temps around 100c bring out bitter/burnt flavours that you don't get if the water is a little cooler.

My personal experience echoes this. I'm not sure of the temperature but I put my two mocha pots side by side with the same coffee and tap water. The aluminium one, as usual, produced the slightly burnt flavour (which I happen to enjoy) but the stainless, weird-shaped jobbie produces a lovely, almost sweet beverage which takes a lot less sugar to bring up to taste.

SUGAR !! NO,!

But I like it...

😥

which is why you don't make coffee with cold water

Except you can, coldbrew is coffee brewed slowly with cold water. It's also very nice (if you use good coffee)

Left mine for about 14 hours in the french press this weekend, tasted bloody lovely yesterday 🙂

And there was an early opt in the the mokka <> espresso.

Personally always went from cold through to hot at the lowest setting the gas hob would allow for. 10 minutes easily before it was ready.

Now using filtered water through an espresso machine, think I need a bean grinder now too. It's like cycling, there's an N+1 of accessories for a bloody cup of coffee!

So, hang on a mo - am I supposed to boil the kettle for the water to put in the stovetop?

Scapegoat where'd you get that water info?

I knew someone who claimed they could taste the difference between reboiled water and fresh water when drinking tea.
Since a)I was curious and b)I am lazy I can say for certain they couldnt.

nedrapier - Member
Dales is limestone too, isn't it? Buttertubs, Malham Cove?

Yes, you'd think so wouldn't you. Groundwater in that area has high levels of calcium, so much so that streams can be seen with tufa petrifying the stream bed. However, Yorkshire Water supply Malham for example with reservoir water, a calcium content of 8mg/litre. Very soft.

Yep, last year I lived on a farm in Gargrave which had it's own local water supply, was like living back in London, altho not quite as bad, kettle furred up within a couple of uses. But as above, general Yorkshire Water tap water supply is from big reservoirs that aren't near Malham Cove.

Scapegoat where'd you get that water info?

You need to input a postcode and it'll give you a report on the water quality.

Postcode for the National Park Visitor Centre at Malham is BD23 4DA

Dales is limestone too, isn't it? Buttertubs, Malham Cove?

Plenty of non-limestone catchments in the Dales - the reservoirs and catchments tend to be off gritstone moorland eg Embsay and Barden/Winterburn reservoirs for my area. Ours is the softest water we've ever had.

Groundwater in that area has high levels of calcium, so much so that streams can be seen with tufa petrifying the stream bed

The rivers are too small and environmentally sensitive to allow YW to take much.

I always wait until the water is off the boil before I pour it onto my Nescafe 😆

Plenty of non-limestone catchments in the Dales - the reservoirs and catchments tend to be off gritstone moorland eg Embsay and Barden/Winterburn reservoirs for my area. Ours is the softest water we've ever had.

In addition to that tho, it's a grid system, so some of your water might not have come from the local res. Also, about 12-15 years ago, after Yorkshire Water ran out of water and had to have fleets of road tankers shipping water into Leeds, they laid a massive pipeline connecting North East Water grid to Yorkshire Water grid. So, in theory, if we were in the middle of a long hot summer and you turned on your tap in Malham, a bit of it might have originated in Kielder Water in Northumberland.

[img] [/img] https://www.boroughkitchen.com/rok-copper-espresso-maker?gclid=CjwKCAjwu7LOBRBZEiwAQtfbGPopD0TJ3abKLf-yP61eydjJhVkRHMAWk9Zyb0Iz6y3ImS1bqp6o3hoCwT4QAvD_BwE

anyone got one of these?

I quite like the look of that. Form over function though, getting a consistent cup would be near impossible from a manual pressure device.

Is it not just a fancy aeropress?

should be able to generate significant pressure with the leverage available there. Would hope at over £100 it would make good coffee. It looks nice as well.

Stainless steel Bialetti mokka makes a much nicer brew than the aluminium one.
Please explain...
And always from preheated, not boiled, water over a lowish heat.
TBH though, freshly ground beans makes the biggest difference.

I have an induction hob so use an Ikea Radig stainless moka pot. I always wacked on high until I read this thread but tried it on a medium hob setting and it definitely tastes better to me so thanks STW for that.

I tried making it with cold and hot water in the reservoir but can't notice any appreciable difference there so will probably stick with cold as it's just easier.

Stainless steel Bialetti mokka makes a much nicer brew than the aluminium one.
Please explain...

That was kind of the point I was trying to make above. I assume the materials have a diffent heating properties that are enough to vary the temperature the water achieves and how long. But in reality, **** knows.

mocha pot

Heh. Despite appearances it has nowt to do with chocolate unless that can sometimes mean [i]illiterate[/i].