8° today on my lunchtime ride here in Derbyshire, at least it wasn't raining.
A mate was doing a 3 day 2 night bike packing trip in the Yorkshire Dale's starting yesterday. His FB feed shows pics of murky greyness and his car is back on the drive. Guessing its not gone to plan then
There has been a high pressure sat over Greenland for like the last month.
This has pushed the Jet stream south resulting in this run of cold weather.
Long range Forecasts are hinting that this may change later next week and things may start to warm up..
Prestatyn visit is now postponed, indoor extended households has been postponed in Wales until 7th June. 🙁
I’ve got to say I pretty impressed with their flexibility in trying to give people confidence for holidays, that should make it quite easy to avoid the Slough Hotels, you’d just move your hols the week before if your destination was in the red.
its not quite as clean as that though, there's no admin fee, but how much do you think a last minute holiday to a greenlist country is going to cost (as the cost difference in package will still apply).
its not quite as clean as that though, there’s no admin fee, but how much do you think a last minute holiday to a greenlist country is going to cost (as the cost difference in package will still apply).
Personally speaking, if I book and have to move it, its going back to October 2022. And yes, I checked that I can.
If you drive to France, where is the pricey enforced quarantine on return?
Currently, you quarantine in your own home.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/red-amber-and-green-list-rules-for-entering-england#amber-list
Currently, you quarantine in your own home.
And variants get spread across borders how, exactly....?
And variants get spread across borders how, exactly….?
and? What is the point in vaccination?
What is the point in vaccination?
Well, I didn't think it was so we could let every stray variant in before we'd finished the vaccination programme
There was a lady on TV last night talking about what testing would be involved in a trip to Portugal. Sounded like a right PITA even before you get to wondering whether by departure day you can actually go at all, or whether things will change while you're away. TBH I'm surprised that people think it's worth the hassle this year.
TBH I’m surprised that people think it’s worth the hassle this year.
Ditto.
Plus there's the challenges of even leaving the UK unscathed...
Look out World the Brits are about to start going abroad again...
So amongst the great rush to Portugal, where apparently the Bar can't wait for the Brits because they "...love to party.."(mm, hot, sweaty and drink closeness!) are people going to Red List places.
How are they allowed? How are the flights allowed? That really really puzzles me - in a nervous way.
So now we have Boris telling people not to fly to Amber countries. Yet, why are the planes allowed to fly, tickets allowed to be booked etc?
This is him about to blame us for bring the virus in, right?
There's a lot of desperate people whinging in the papers that their holidays to amber countries can't be postponed nor refunded and their travel insurance won't cover them.
I have little sympathy and no patience for those that won't wait. Yes you may die before another week in Shagaluf but better that than long covid or any other associated nastiness. You won't die because you can't get away.
I'm having to explain to people weekly that no we don't know what will be possible in September and no I won't take your money on the off-chance. It's not a year for cheap travel it's all going to be last minute and expensive as a result. Ryanair will need to cover that £700 million loss somehow.
I'm currently off work due to the entitled causing me severe mental stress over the last 4 months (not all our clients just a sizeable minority). It's literally ground me down and telling people to **** off on the phone is not good for business. I accept that it's not as bad as working in ICU in a hospital but I have an idea of the stress that's floating around for those of us in public customer facing roles. If you're currently coping great, but do look after yourselves and step away before you break.
It’s not a year for cheap travel it’s all going to be last minute and expensive as a result. Ryanair will need to cover that £700 million loss somehow.
I like your optimism in thinking that there will still be a Ryanair / EasyJet / British Airways / Virgin in a year.
I'm trying to stay up-beat. Thankfully I can retire after another full season. I have every sympathy for those that are stuck and will have to work for 10 or more years longer.
there will still be a Ryanair / EasyJet / British Airways / Virgin in a year.
Something will fill the void, business always goes for the opportunity.
There’s a lot of desperate people whinging in the papers that their holidays to amber countries can’t be postponed nor refunded and their travel insurance won’t cover them.
I said this would happen and it's not like they haven't been warned. My uncle is really struggling to see why he can't just hop on a plane and go to Gibraltar for a week next week, he's moaning about no cheap flights, why does he have to be tested, why can't he nip across the border to Span as he pleases etc. I know he's a moron and really can't understand complex issues but it's depressing to see there are lots of other people out there just like him. I would love to just drive down to the PDS with the bike at the end of July and have the holiday I want but realistically that's very risky and not the brightest idea (no offence to those of you who do this year) with my parents and the India variant running around.
I just wish the weather would get better here so I can have a few days out in my Mini, been too wet to use it all month!
There you go - it's your "personal responsibility" aka your fault when Covid cases ramp up again. Remember, it's not Boris fault, its YOUR fault.
What a bunch of ****ers.
Since the release of traffic light countries list, the government has said all along that going to amber for leisure is not recommended. So i dont understand the confusion. Tell a lie, i do understand, as people are too stupid/selfish/ignorant to heed that advice.
We need a nanny state that tells people to explicitly not go somewhere, rather than relying on common sense.
Or am i missing something?
Or am i missing something?
That under those conditions, people can still book tickets and carriers are still flying planes to those destinations. You are correct, the stupidity and selfishness extends to the carriers, albeit we know they are suffering heavily with losses and no doubt want to claw back some revenue. Note Tui & Jet2 are not flying, although Jet 2 are still a little unclear of their intentions beyond 21st June, although that's not what is says on Tui's webiste re amber countries ( https://www.tui.co.uk/holidays/where-can-i-go-on-holiday?vlid=tuigreenstrip34)
I'm willing to bet the equivelent NZ leadership would have banned flights to Amber and Red areas per se.
relying on common sense.
I think we both know there's plenty not applying common sense, hence it needs decisive leadership to contain the rather positive position we are very close to damaging.
I think we all know the rest of Europe will be put on the green list next month so Boris can be hailed as 'saving summer' by the Daily Mail.
This will probably coincide with the Indian variant taking hold in Europe...
I'm glad we've moved our road trip to Italy to 2022 - too many things to go wrong and i don't want to spend 2 weeks looking at the news and worrying about the rules changing.
Anyone thinking 2024 is a safe bet for European holidays?
I think we both know there’s plenty not applying common sense, hence it needs decisive leadership to contain the rather positive position we are very close to damaging.
I think studies of adherence to the guidelines show that the public have in fact been very good at adhering to social distancing etc. Of course there will be idiots, and publicising those few cases will help the govt gaslight us into thinking its all the public's fault 🙂
Many of the people expressing their incredulity that we are allowed to travel to amber destinations while at the same time being advised by health professionals not to are quite happy legally to buy and smoke cigarettes while at the same time being advised by health professionals not to.
I guess also for a lot of people there might be the prospect of losing money on non-refundable flights etc.
I was willing to take that hit when cancelling this year's trip but it was only £400 which isn't much more than a month's disposable income for me.
Imagine being on near minimum wage and maybe being faced with the prospect of 'losing' the value of an entire package holiday. Heartbreaking.
I agree that the government really needed to step in an create whatever conditions necessary to force refunds. Allowing carriers to keep flying just gives them a loophole to refuse refunds.
Anyone thinking 2024 is a safe bet for European holidays?
Considering most flag carrier airlines think it will be 2024/25 before pre-covid levels of traffic, i'd say you're not far wrong.
Discussed a potential ski trip next year and I'm not really confident as I don't think it would happen. This thing is another 2-3 years away before it has settled on a global scale.
buy and smoke cigarettes
Not even closely related. Cigarettes have an addictive component that is difficult to resist, while I'm not aware of anything in a package holiday that is addictive (unless there's something in the food served on flights that we don't know about).
I’m currently off work due to the entitled causing me severe mental stress over the last 4 months (not all our clients just a sizeable minority). It’s literally ground me down and telling people to **** off on the phone is not good for business. I accept that it’s not as bad as working in ICU in a hospital but I have an idea of the stress that’s floating around for those of us in public customer facing roles. If you’re currently coping great, but do look after yourselves and step away before you break.
Sounds like you need a holiday....
Flipancy aside, for a lot of people a holiday abroad really is the only chance they get to get away from the stress and day to day of life, many many of those people will be in low income employment (eg public facing) live in cramped crappy housing in crowded parts of the country with very little opportunity to "get away from it" by taking a week off in their living room. At the best of times a UK holiday is expensive and, if you're not interested in what the UK has to offer its pretty pants - for the same reason a week on a beach in the Costa del whatever holds no appeal for me a week in the lakes holds no appeal to plenty of others.
I'm lucky enough to live in a nice area, a decent house with plenty of space and a garden, decent neighbours etc. Staying at home still isn't exactly a relaxing switch off There are plenty of folk who aren't that lucky and for whom it would be equally or more stressful.
I like outdoorsy stuff and history for which the UK is a pretty good holiday destination. Lots of people don't and aren't and wouldn't find out pleasurable or relaxing.
I'm in a reasonable job as is my better half and we've no kids but a week in Ambleside for a family of four would be staggeringly costly in a normal year compared with a week in Spain.
We both drive so getting to locations in the UK isn't a huge bind, on the other hand lots of people (esp those on lower incomes etc) don't and can't. Try getting from ass end of Birmingham to the (very nice) beaches of the Northumberland coast or pembrokeshire by public transport, now try getting to magaluf.
It's easy to sit in judgement and talk about people being "entitled" but holiday is a health issue, people need to take time away from work and they need to do that in a way which reduces their stress, not increases it and for a lot of people that is a "package" holiday.
Some fair points in the post above.
I've got no real interest in taking a family holiday in the UK as even pre-COVID it was more expensive than mainland Europe - this year the prices are ridiculous.
The holiday to lake Garda i've just pushed back to 2022 was going to cost us 2300 EUR for 14 nights in an air conditioned bungalow on a 'Eurocamp' type site on the lake.
Yes, i agree i've got to get there but even in you include the channel tunnel, the fuel and a night in a hotel to break the journey up either way we're still under £3k for a 2 week holiday for a family of 4.
Which is about the same as 2 weeks in a crap caravan on a crap Haven site in the Southwest..
Why have an amber list at all?
Yes or No avoids confusion
An amber list, that facilitates travelling to see family, eg for funerals, older members with not long to live, partners about to give birth... etc... while also communicating that holidays are not allowed, and agreeing that with a travel industry now dominated by a few giants, should be possible. It takes organisation and clear communication though.
Red - absolutely no travel to or from the country
Amber - repatriation allowed with quarantine, and travel for important family reasons
Green - holidays allowed with mitigation measures (tests etc)
There needs to be something between "no travel for any reason" and "no holidays".
buy and smoke cigarettes
Not even closely related. Cigarettes have an addictive component that is difficult to resist, while I’m not aware of anything in a package holiday that is addictive (unless there’s something in the food served on flights that we don’t know about).
Another difference - smoking, for the most part, is only harmful to yourself - hence makes sense for it to be a personal decision
Amber - there has to be a way for Stranley Johnson to go on holiday, while denying it to us oiks.
@dangerousbrain Our clientele are not the week on the Costas market. We're at the other end where people lay out 4K or 5K for 6 in good hotels in Norfolk. Some of these are really lovely folk, others are not pleasant at all.
A week away from it should be enough to get me back on track as I went early before a proper crisis struck. Previous experience is that a full crisis is a minimum of 6 weeks away and anything up to 3 months if it's really bad. As a minimum wage drone I can afford a week away.
There needs to be something between “no travel for any reason” and “no holidays”.
also its nice to have a "transition step"
If my prebooked holiday is green, I'm going, with the understanding that it could turn to amber while I am there, but probably wouldn't go to red in the space of 6 days.
A week away from it should be enough to get me back on track as I went early before a proper crisis struck.
Hope you get yourself sorted and pleased you recognised it in good time, that's often not at all easy.
Hey guys, dropping into the thread to see what the mountain bike public is thinking. If we can offer any help or detail on travel this summer and Autumn ask away, we're on the ground in Morzine, Aosta and Finale Ligure.
Summer 2020 was unreal, managing to get 90% of a season in Morzine and an entire Autumn in Finale. 2021 is presenting some new challenges, but at least this time there seems to be a light at the end of the tunnel that means we won't be going back in.
France has just announced it's own traffic light system, full details will be available on June 9th, probably before as that was the date non EU-countries were going to be allowed to visit for tourism.
Full details are not yet available, but what we know so far is -
RED - Complete ban. Travel from red countries is entirely prohibited unless is extreme circumstances in which case a strict quarantine must be observed.
ORANGE - Travel from an orange country will be allowed for any reason, including tourism, with proof of a completed course of an approved vaccine. These vaccine are; Pfizer, Astra Zeneca, Johnson & Johnson and Moderna. The UK's vaccine passport app will be recognised in France. If you are not vaccinated, conditions will apply but the details have not been released.
GREEN - Travel is allowed entirely unrestricted, travellers maybe asked to present a vaccination certificate or a negative test.
Currently, you can visit Italy from the UK without the need for quarantine, you must have a negative PCR or antigen test no more than 48 hours old.
In Morzine and Finale, lifts are starting to run (this weekend) and shuttles are uplifting. Yes there are some restrictions but the do not inhibit the experience, they are the same as they were at the end of last summer. They worked well. We've got all the timetables and latest information HERE.
Whether you are staying with us or not, if you've got any questions about travel this summer you think we can help with drop us a line on info@mtbbeds.com
Fingers crossed!
THe worry is, what is the situation when there ? Cleaning on the lifts ? Bars open ? restaurants indoors and out ?
that's without throwing in the complexitites of what happens if you're abroad and a country changes status.
Depending on where you go the situation is different and as you'd have to expect anywhere, there is alot of personal responsibility involved. Dealing with something like a chairlift, it's not practical to sanitise every inch of it before and after use.
This is why they are very strict on mask wearing on the lifts and in the lift lines, with sanitising points for yourself at the entry and exit points. But if you go rubbing your hands on everything and itching your nose when on the lift....
It's being taken very seriously, the lift companies had zero income in 2020 winter season, billions of Euros were lost, so they are extremely keen to get things under way as quickly as possible under safe conditions. However it still has to be practical so while safety precautions will be serious, they have to be functional.
This is taken directly from meetings with the operators.
In bars and restaurants it will be be the same, everyone has enhanced cleaning protocols in place and mask wearing is taken seriously. The alpine resorts rely on tourism, they need to do this right, but again you must take some responsibility for your own safety.
We did a video on Morzine at the start of last summer, it's relatively up to date, mask wearing while on the lift became obligatory, it's tongue in cheek but it was made to show how Morzine can be safe and also be a holiday. HERE.
In our properties I can give specific details as we are in complete control, rather than put everything in a forum, as it's ALOT of detail, if you have any concerns or want to see what kind of measures are going on, check out our webpage HERE.
@mtbbeds
Any info on Switzerland/the procedure of travelling to Morzine via Geneva airport?
Thanks mtbbeds, good to know. We're only coming down for 1 or 2 days this summer to ride, but feel a bit happier it's viable to come.
Hi @ayjaydoubleyou,
Yep, so at present you'll need a negative test to fly, which is nothing new. If you are transiting you have no obligation to quarantine. Proof that you are transiting will be in the form of a reservation at an accommodation in France, you'll need to have these details to hand and put them in the locator form which you need to fill out.
This is also what you would need should you be stopped at border control, but this is unlikely. By the time travel is happening the apps in place or their paper equivalent will carry all the covid related info you need to present, then you'll just need your holiday information to hand if questioned.
It's also worth noting that Geneva airport is actually in France, so there is a french sector and you can arrive and depart without every technically crossing the Swiss border. You can also transit through France without having to drive in Switzerland, though it takes half an hour longer if heading to Morzine.
More practically, the airlines would probably not warrant putting on flights if travel is heavily restricted. On the plus side Switzerland's infection rate is about half that of France, so they are likely to go green before France and as stated, transiting through is no issue.
This article sums it up well - HERE.
On the plus side Switzerland’s infection rate is about half that of France, so they are likely to go green before France and as stated
If I'm not mistaken Malta and Finland both had very similar rates to Portugal (Malta slightly fewer, Finland slightly higher) at the time the last list was compiled yet neither was green listed. Malta "probably" will be this time, despite now being 40% lower than Portugal, Finland still unlikely but its rate is lower than Portugal was at the last issue.
Really it seems green listing is more likely to be linked to buying wallpaper than CV rates.
(officially I believe its a combination of incidence rates, vaccination rates, ability to sequence and "other" considerations)
I do hope you're right and the government start to apply some support of consistent and transparent logic but leopards and spots spring to mind.
Hoping to be able to go via tunnel to France then onto the Aosta valley (It) in a month's time. This does not sound promising:
13:28
France: UK arrivals must quarantine due to Indian variant
Jon Henley Jon Henley
France will impose a compulsory quarantine on travellers arriving from the UK because of growing concerns over the spread of the Indian variant of the coronavirus, the government’s spokesman has said.
Gabriel Attal told reporters at the end of the cabinet meeting this morning that the government would announce the date when the widely expected decision would come into effect “in the coming hours”.
France requires travellers from 16 countries, including Brazil, India, Argentina and Turkey, to undergo a compulsory 10-day period of self-isolation, with a fine of €1,500 in the event of non-compliance.
(from the Guardian live blog)
Hi @dangeourbrain,
Yeah look who knows what the UK Government are really up to, it could be very transparent and honest, there is probably alot of politics involved or maybe no one has any idea what to do. But all we can go off is what the Governments of each country tell us.
This is what the UK Government say they are looking at when assessing a countries status;
Genomic surveillance capability
COVID-19 transmission risk
Variant of concern transmission risk
number of individuals tested over a 4-week period
number of people testing positive per week over a 4-week period
traveller positivity over a 4-week period
number of positives sequenced over a 4-week period
number of variants of concern (VOC) and high-risk variants under investigation (VUI) detected during sequencing over a 4-week period
variant (VOC/VUIs) detection rate over a 4-week period
country/territory epidemiological data
total newly reported cases, per 100,000 population per week
reported number of tests per 1000 population per week
test positivity, based upon reported number of tests and cases per week
country and territory total number of vaccination doses (single doses) administered per 100 people
country and territory total number of positive sequences uploaded to GISAID
In most developed countries, such as Finland, Malta, Portugal, Switzerland, France or Italy, all of which have been brought up, alot of this is covered by simply having a solid and functioning health system (good testing facilities, accurate testing and a tracing system for example).
It would seem that the 7 day average infections, where there are no variants of concern would be a big factor in deciding countries status, but this could be wrong.
Either way lets hope everyone does everything they need to as quickly as possible to get things back to some kind of normality soon!
