[Closed] Lost it on the train tonight with the guard

At least he made the trains run on time.

(Well, somebody had to!)

In a nutshell, train operators should be monitored by an independent government body. If too many people are having to stand, they get fined.

SWT have announced they are adding 3 extra carriages to the service at the end of the summer. When asked why it has taken so long, you get a lame excuse about sourcing the carriages.

Do you commute?

Cut a long story short, the ticket inspector came around and told me I had to purchase an upgrade or leave first class and resume my standing up position.

[img] [/img]

If you watched the Nick Hewer programme about this recently you'd know that the train operator business operates on very very low margins circa 1%. It is the rolling stock guys who make the money and the operators struggle for years to get new trains and new routes.

The MTB analogy is crashing the uplift at Bikepark Wales because it's pissing it down

[quote=CaptainFlashheart ](Well, somebody had to!)

Had to get it wrong?

Mussolini made the trains run on time (well he didn't, but you know what I mean)

(well he didn't, but you know what I mean)

I know. Wasn't in any way a serious statement, just one of those things that is always said!

If you watched the Nick Hewer programme about this recently

Why are people so friggin weak in the country.

The MTB analogy is crashing the uplift at Bikepark Wales because it's pissing it down

I'd have gone postal

Once again, the throbbers are out in force tonight. *sigh*

Going back on topic, I sympathise with the OP having endured Southeastern's "service" for six years and a 30% price hike in that time.

It's very easy to feel like you're at the bottom of the pecking order when your train is cancelled twice resulting in frayed tempers and standing room only. Or perhaps on the hottest day of the year when the air conditioning fails and the heating system suddenly starts blasting hot air through each carriage on the train and the letterbox sized windows provide inadequate ventilation. You might be aggrieved when you realise that you spend more than a quarter of your take home pay each month on a season ticket that doesn't entitle you to a seat.

Frankly, it sucks great big balls and there's absolutely no redress whatsoever. Our local (Tory) MP doesn't care, neither did anyone in the last government.

In a nutshell, train operators should be monitored by an independent government body. If too many people are having to stand, they get fined.

Would you rather that you didn't get on the train at all then? Bit weird. You can't really magic more stock out of nowhere. the Salisbury line is about the worst too, as it's not electrified, so you're stuck with their limited stock of diesels. Still, 10/10 for showing ignorance and not thinking your post through.

You're still a bit of a pillock though. I got on a train recently (with a first class ticket) and first had been commandeered by people like you (of their own vocation), so I had to stand. It's more expensive for a reason. If it was full and standing every day it would be rather pointless...

Sure you'd get on with Yunki. The two of you could stick it to the man together.

Would you rather that you didn't get on the train at all then? Bit weird. You can't really magic more stock out of nowhere. the Salisbury line is about the worst too, as it's not electrified, so you're stuck with their limited stock of diesels. Still, 10/10 for showing ignorance and not thinking your post through.

You're still a bit of a pillock though. I got on a train recently (with a first class ticket) and first had been commandeered by people like you (of their own vocation), so I had to stand. It's more expensive for a reason. If it was full and standing every day it would be rather pointless..

1) I waited until train had left Waterloo so I was sure I was not taking a seat of a first class paying passenger. That's a slightly different scenario!

2) Please refrain from the personal the insults. I don't know you.

Well if we have Dear red army Ed as PM all of us will be standing in the cattle class then who are you going to blame eh? 🙄

Yes, sorry, bit unfair. You showed pillocky behaviour.

Presumably your fellow passengers didn't join you in your crusade then?

I don't know you either.I can only proceed on the evidence presented here......
I'm with Njee.
Also I believe the term is *swoon,not *sigh.

Presumably your fellow passengers didn't join you in your crusade then?

flanagaj - Member
Yes they did join me, but when the guard arrived they scampered off!

😆

I'm still not clear why the OP thinks it's justified and noble to take something he hasn't paid for?

Should I wait outside Hertz until close of business and then drive home in one of their cars as it's better than walking and no one else is using it?

I'm still not clear why the OP thinks it's justified and noble to take something he hasn't paid for?

Imagine you book a flight, but when you walk on the plane all of the seats are taken and you had stand for the duration. Would you find that acceptable? I doubt you would, so why do you think it is ok to have to do it day in day out on a train to London?

ps - your car analogy is not quite the same.

ChubbyBlokeInLycra - Member
I'd have gone postal

Really? Wrap yourself up, stamp yourself, get to the post office, chucked in the back of a van, delivered to the wrong address.. etc etc. Seems a bit of overkill when all you had to do was sit in 1st Class and be nice to the guard.
POSTED 58 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

You should really know what your talking about before posting a smart ass response.

tlr - Member
I'm still not clear why the OP thinks it's justified and noble to take something he didn't pay for

He paid for transportation of a living, breathing, human being, from one place to another in a timely and civilised manner. Facilities were available to provide just hat level of service, but were denied to the OP due his class status being of more importance than civility.

If an airline had overbooked, you'd be more likely to be upgraded than be booked onto a later flight and you'd definite not be forced to stand or sit in someone's lap.

The rail [b][u]service[/u][/b] should be (re) nationalised in order to SERVE the public.

You should really know what your talking about before posting a smart ass response.

You mean like being aware of...

National Rail Conditions of Carriage:

39. Travelling in first class accommodation with a standard class ticket
If you have a standard class ticket (other than a Season Ticket), no standard class
accommodation is available, and staff on that train give their permission, then you may
travel in first class accommodation (or the equivalent) where this is available without extra
charge.

you walk on the plane all of the seats are taken and you had stand for the duration. Would you find that acceptable? I doubt you would, so why do you think it is ok to have to do it day in day out on a train to London?

If you booked a seat on a train then I agree wholeheartedly with you. If you booked transportation from a-b on a train then I don't.

When I book a flight I book a seat, so I would rightly be aggrieved if my seat wasn't available. I usually book a specific seat, at extra cost if necessary to ensure I get as comfortable flight as possible be it Ryanair or long haul Business Class. I assume these kind of options were available when you booked your train ticket?

[img] [/img]

If an airline had overbooked, you'd be more likely to be upgraded than be booked onto a later flight and you'd definite not be forced to stand or sit in someone's lap.

The rail service should be (re) nationalised in order to SERVE the public.

What? Airlines are international companies, and are therefor regulated and monitored to provide a level of control and oversight. This is done because to nationalise a foreign company would be illegal.

The UK rail network is still government owned, but use of the track is granted to private companies who're supposed to provide rail services to the public. They are barely regulated, and often only oversights by the term dates imposed by contract lengths.

Re-nationalising the rail service (Uk companies with contracts to operate on UK held infrastructure) is entirely possible and was one of the key manifesto promises of the 1997 labour government...a pledge they eventually reneged on.

This is done because to nationalise a foreign company would be illegal.

So you think that renationalising the private sector railways will make them work at the same standard as the private sector airlines? How will that work then? Unless you meant to include additional legislation to change the way the railways work, but if that's what you meant, why won't that work without renationalising as, as you point out, the legislation works for the private sector airlines?

Issue here is capacity planning. How would OP feel if he had to be on same train every night in order to take his pre-booked seat (the airline model) would you be happy to be rebooked on to a subsequent service if yours was cancelled? If your meetinf overruns would you be happy to pay more? Perhaps the carrier would provide a hotel if they could not re-book you within 12 hours?

Trains aren't airlines - the quality of service is different, but you know that when you buy passage, so I don't see what the fuss is about.

Having said that - SWT, Berks. Did you know the price of adding zone 1-6 to a season ticket varies depending where the ticket starts from? WTF?

I have been put in first class by a ticket conductor when the carriage was over full.

So I kind of sympathize with the OP, I don't get why more train companies don't do this. It would be good PR - airlines seem to do it more often!

There aren't proper facilities for standing on carriages, too many people standing blocks escape routes and causes numerous other safety hazards. So the....you're booking a journey....not a seat doesn't swing with me.

funny it must be an english thing.

who ever FGWT call them selves now used to do the same as did virgin . trains full no seats you must stand no first class seats for you.

get on a scotrail train. Trains full - pop through to the empty first class and take a seat there - no issues.

Same issue with the virgin and FGWT trains and bikes - absolute nightmare where as scotrail make it as painless as possible - and thus i use them out of preference to the car.

They are their own worst enemy.

I'm lucky enough not to need to commute by public transport (I don't drive an Audi and I'm not in IT), however I absolutely sympathise with the OP

On health, safety and welfare grounds available 1st class seats should be opened up to standing passengers on the understanding that they will be given up to 1st class ticket holders as required, however it can't be allowed to become a free-for-all decided by passengers

The Government should write this into train company contracts (if they don't already) and maybe companies would be less inclined to provide empty, expensive, 1st class capacity

All jolly British - keep calm and keep standing up on crappy overcrowded trains. No wonder the train companies are rubbing their hands with glee and trousering the cash they should be spending on improving services.

Can I just remind those people calling for renationalisation of the railways quite how bad it was under British Rail? I've spent far too much time on trains before and since privatisation and there is no contest.

Under BR the trains had appalling time keeping, were dirty and crowded. We now have fewer delays, better rolling stock and less overcrowding despite more users. It is not perfect in any way but it is so much better than it was.

I always reserve a seat with a window view, table and sitting backwards.
I have had days where you get back into the country and take a random train to get home, stood up for a while etc give
an old lady my seat.

For safety they need more seats and not the Japanese small cramped ones.

Can I just remind those people calling for renationalisation of the railways quite how bad it was under British Rail?

Perhaps but it's false logic to assume that this improvement is down to privatisation. London transport has also experienced enormous improvements over the last few years, but it isn't privatised. Things, public and private, in general, have moved on.

19 comments in before somebody (bearnecessities) said something sensible.
I couldn't agree more with the OP and the fawning, rule-following, please-treat-us-like-crap British public.
As for the guard-was-only-doing-his-job brigade... 🙄

the fawning, rule-following, please-treat-us-like-crap British public

The British have a deep need for a strict nanny. Yesterday's events showed that as clearly as can be imagined. "Austerity? Oh yes please, thank you nanny!"

Train companies do seem to be messed up, just one example: Engineering works near me at the moment so about 50% of the services aren't running, fair enough line upgrades I'm happy with that [i]as long as the interim measures are properly thought out[/i]. Lots of rail replacement buses in use, I was there the other day.
"Would you like to take the replacement bus sir? It's almost empty, the train may be too busy to get on"
"Er maybe, how long does the bus take?"
"we don't know"
excellent!
"Well, I'll see if I can get on the train and if I can't I'll come and get the bus"
"sorry sir the bus leaves before the train"
So it wouldn't have been a better idea for the empty bus to wait to pick up the people unable to get on the train?
idiots.

Took a chance on the train, now bearing in mind 50% of the services aren't running and there's a lot of spare carriages around not doing anything so when the train turns up do you think it's a bigger than usual service or the bare minimum, packed to the rafters, 3 coacher?
Go on guess...

Perhaps but it's false logic to assume that this improvement is down to privatisation. London transport has also experienced enormous improvements over the last few years, but it isn't privatised. Things, public and private, in general, have moved on.

[b]

Can I just remind those people calling for renationalisation of the railways quite how bad it was under British Rail? I've spent far too much time on trains before and since privatisation and there is no contest.

njee20 said - blah blah blah pompous twaddle

I can't help wondering if the phrase 'sticking it to the man' will gain a wholly more literal meaning over the coming 5 years
I guess it depends to what extent further degradations are handed down by the 'haves' to the 'have nots'

Every time I've ever asked if I'm ok to just sit in first if the train is rammed has been greeted with a positive response. That's on London midland, midland mainline or first great western. The only time I've ever been refused was because first was also rammed. I sometimes just sit on the floor.
As previously said your ticket gets you on the train not a seat. Same as most busses.

I blew up.

suicide bomber!