what is a reasonably practical ‘shortest’ time?
25 days I believe
Listen carefully to his words though. He’s angry about
1. The damage done to the Party
2. The fact he never had a cabinet job
3. The fact ERG people did
4. Tory MPs are worried about losing their jobs.He only adds at the last moment that he’s worried about constituents. Even now, all he’s actually worried about is his £85k/year with all expenses paid and subsidised meals gravy train hitting the buffers.
Just another bitter jealous self-serving Tory.
My thoughts exactly - couldn't give 2 F's about the country first & foremost, more bothered about "oh woe is me". I'd be spitting teeth if I was one of his constituents. Only added it in at the end as an afterthought it seems. Disgraceful.
Should a decision be made to have an ‘immediate’ election, what is the shortest amount of time that is required? And, what is a reasonably practical ‘shortest’ time?
I think this whole saga has shown that we need a constitution.
An American friend pointed out that it's still better than their system of two frantic years then 2 lame duck years. But we definitely need some mechanism by which we can call a GE without the ruling party having to concede first. The FTP act has effectively just made the opposition beholden to the government calling elections when it thinks it can win them, which is what it was meant to avoid.
Studying medicine/law/engineering and practicing it “easier than being an MP”?
Hmmm let me think about that for while…
It looks pretty easy to be a useless MP. And it’s probably hard to be a good one. Like most jobs then?
what is a reasonably practical ‘shortest’ time?
25 days I believe
Cheers ernie
I now know what I’d like for Christmas 😀
Listen carefully to his words though. He’s angry about
TBF to him he's being asked a very specific question about the vote in the Commons last night and whether he'll support the leader.
It's all feeling like the next series of Blackadder really.
TBF to him he’s being asked a very specific question about the vote in the Commons last night and whether he’ll support the leader.
+1
and I particularly like this quote
'There's nothing as ex as an ex MP'
Studying medicine/law/engineering and practicing it “easier than being an MP”?
Hmmm let me think about that for while…
It looks pretty easy to be a useless MP. And it’s probably hard to be a good one. Like most jobs then?
Like most arguments along these lines, if that that easy and well paid, why are you complaining about it and not an MP.
Politicians are always banging on about how much more money they could earn in a 'proper job' in the private sector, so none of them should be scared of losing their seat! 🙂
I think this whole saga has shown that we need a constitution.
We do have one. Its just not designed for this mix of incompetence and malice.
The FTP act has effectively just made the opposition beholden to the government calling elections when it thinks it can win them
The FTP act has been repealed and never meant anything. It was created purely as a sop to the Libdems to make them feel the coalition was going to work. It could always be overruled at the whim of government assuming their MPs were in favour.
There’s got to be easier ways of earning £85k, it’s a lot, but if you’re clever enough you could probably have an easier time earning it by studying engineering, medicine or law at uni and having a straightforward career in any of those.
Its not 85k though is it... the £85k is just the chump change compared to what they can be paid for their day job.
Like most arguments along these lines, if that that easy and well paid, why are you complaining about it and not an MP.
Because it is a position that requires contacts and opportunity, and has sweet **** all to do with competence and intellect, as has been laid bare for the past few years. Although I suspect it has largely always been the case, the exposure of the corruption, arrogance and stupidity of those in office has become very clear.
Studying medicine/law/engineering and practicing it “easier than being an MP”?
Hmmm let me think about that for while…
It looks pretty easy to be a useless MP. And it’s probably hard to be a good one. Like most jobs then?
taking home an 85k package isn't particularly difficult in IT. most senior devs in the south east are on that kind of money, London would be more. I would definitely consider that job a tonne easier than being an MP.
Like most arguments along these lines, if that that easy and well paid, why are you complaining about it and not an Doctor/lawyer/engineer.
Etc etc
Because it is a position that requires contacts and opportunity, and has sweet **** all to do with competence and intellect, as has been laid bare for the past few years. Although I suspect it has largely always been the case, the exposure of the corruption, arrogance and stupidity of those in office has become very clear.
Either that or it involves joining your local Labour* party group, attending meetings, door knocking, working in the parish council, district council, then if you're the best person in the area in the party getting nominated for the MP elections? Or going and working in head office on campaigns until you're viewed as the most loyal/competent and get dropped into a safe seat.
*other rosettes are available
Etc etc
Maybe I am 😉
Just another bitter jealous self-serving Tory.
To be fair, they played the full interview on R4 and he went on to say how appalling it was for the country. Strikes me as one of the "Dominic Grieve decent politician, but don't agree with his politics" mould. Whether you agree with a party or not, I think one (and the country) is owed decent and competent leadership. I expect he'd agree with that point. It's called being an adult.
What the hell do we do?
Am I the only one hovering on this page right now...?
.
[ EDIT: not supposed to be clickbait, sorry... that's a link to join the Labour party... seriously considering it this morning ]
Because it is a position that requires contacts and opportunity, and has sweet **** all to do with competence and intellect
Or more accurately there is a major gap between the competence needed to get the job (buttering up the local party members/making connections and so on) vs what is needed to do the job.
Bit like selecting footballers based purely on performance at rugby. There is some carry over but also massive gaps.
Thats before getting into the massive difference between an MP and minister.
Or more accurately there is a major gap between the competence needed to get the job (buttering up the local party members/making connections and so on) vs what is needed to do the job.
Bit like selecting footballers based purely on performance at rugby. There is some carry over but also massive gaps.
I'd agree with that.
You'd hope at least that the first barrier to entry is a desire to make changes/help people/do some good.
THEN the second hurdle is being a good politician and getting nominated/elected. But that is also a necessary qualification for achieving anything once in office. If you just want to shout on the internet about "typical tory scum" in reference to someone who until yesterday you'd never even heard of, you'd probably not do very well when your ideas get challenged on doorsteps (see: Gordon Brown and the "bigoted woman").
We're not going to see an election.
Next ofthe party to go will be (has to be) the health secretary, replaced with another Boris cabinet member (Hunt & Shapps already in place), poss javid (??)then truss will go and instead of another leadership battle will prob see johnson reinstalled as decided by senior tories...
Id love to see an election but every time I think labour should take over they come out with a ridicluous pre written soundbite that makes me realise it'll just be more of the same, detached wealthy people running the country without a clue what we're actually going through...
And I don't think Labour are actually taking advantage of the implosion of the Tories, they seem to be sitting there asking inane questions and making jokes, don't see a lot of action
If you just want to shout on the internet about “typical tory scum” in reference to someone who until yesterday you’d never even heard of
Is that a reference to me calling Coffey scum for her utter disregard towards NHS staff? I stand by that, and I know who she is. She is dangerous scum who should not be allowed anywhere near our public services.
it’ll just be more of the same
You really believe that? Can we put you in a room with Angela Rayner for an hour and see if you still do at the end of it? Or any of the Labour front bench.
don’t see a lot of action
They. Are. Not. The. Government.
Truss tried this line again at PMQs (Johnson used it all the time)... pointing out that the opposition aren't "getting anything done"... they can't... they don't have enough MPs... the voters have to change that before they get their chance to change things.
And I don’t think Labour are actually taking advantage of the implosion of the Tories, they seem to be sitting there asking inane questions and making jokes, don’t see a lot of action
What "action" do you expect though?
Is that a reference to me calling Coffey scum for her utter disregard towards NHS staff? I stand by that, and I know who she is. She is dangerous scum who should not be allowed anywhere near our public services.
It was in reference to the pile on of Charles Walker.
We've all heard enough about Coffey to draw the same conclusion..........
It was in reference to the pile on of Charles Walker.
Ah, ok.
I'm politically a mile from Walker... but he wasn't speaking in his own interests... he's already called an end to his own political career... he was speaking up for his party and his country... both of which the current Tories are wrecking.
What “action” do you expect though?
During this present crises I would expect to see the leader of the Opposition on the telly every time I switch it on.
After Jeremy H unt gave his statement to parliament I saw the leader of the LibDems, the leader of the SNP, and the leader of the Greens, all being interviewed, no sign of the leader of the Official Opposition though.
Presumably he was busy with other stuff - he left it to his Shadow Chancellor to deal with the issues raised. Probably wise mind, he hardly inspires and energizes people when he speaks.
I'm not sure that I have seen him give one single interview during the last week.
And I don’t think Labour are actually taking advantage of the implosion of the Tories, they seem to be sitting there asking inane questions and making jokes, don’t see a lot of action
sun tzu had something to say about that...
don’t see a lot of action
they don't need to. Better to remain quiet and let them self destroy. Whatever you can and will be used as evidence against you.
I know people like to revel in the destruction of the conservatives but this has been bad for democracy and will continue to be until the adults get back in charge of the Tories.
he left it to his Shadow Chancellor to deal with the issues raised
Good. Starmer doesn't have what is needed to win a presidential style election. Labour need to present the whole front bench as ready for office. I think he finally gets this... at PMQs, when talking about Truss, he was very careful to claim that his team were ready to step in and form the government, rather that referring to himself as regards taking over her post. More of this approach please. A shadow cabinet getting in front of the public and showing they are ready. At this point, no one cares who the spokesperson for the LibDems or the Green Party are that are shadowing Hunt in his position... but they absolutely need to see and hear from the person who could be in his (current) job after an election.
it’ll just be more of the same
Anyone who can say that really has no idea what's at stake here.
Tories want small government. That means you're responsible for yourself; if you get into trouble then tough, it's your own fault. They want to do intervene as little as possible in the running of the country and let whatever happens happen.
Labour want big government, which means they want to provide the facilities to help people who need it, and they want to try to manage the country so that we can all be better off.
That is a pretty huge difference, don't you think? Aside from the fact that the set of Tories we've had since 2015 are absolutely incompetent on a scale not seen for a very long time. And now they are not even able to do anything at all, and that fact is really damaging our country.
Tories want small government.
Nah this is buying into their propaganda. They want a big government in the areas they care about but a small government elsewhere.
The problem with sitting back watching the destruction is the vote could still be split between labour and the lib dems, possibly giving the tories a route back in...
as Ernie says they should be shouting from the rooftop what the alternative would be, what they would do, how they would help the UK, I have no idea what labour would do, all the average voter would have in their ears are the comments of the tories saying how bad it would be under labour, why are they not shutting this crap down, leaving no room for Truss and co to try and blame labour for everything?
I'm also surprised theres been no protests specifically against this absolute s***show. Whats changed in the UK since the Poll Tax riots, where people were so angry, that people now just sit indoors getting angry at their computers? Cant help thinking if this was France we'd have already seem riots
I have no idea what labour would do
Did you pay attention during the week of the Labour Party conference? It's about the only time when a breadth of policies from an opposition party can get air time. The rest of the time, the media's focus stays on the government's policies and actions, because they are the ones affecting change (for the better or worse).
as Ernie says they should be shouting from the rooftop what the alternative would be, what they would do, how they would help the UK, I have no idea what labour would do, all the average voter would have in their ears are the comments of the tories saying how bad it would be under labour, why are they not shutting this crap down, leaving no room for Truss and co to try and blame labour for everything?
A bit like saying; 'we'd cap energy prices for 6 months funded by a windfall tax', which forced the government into introducing a knee jerk unfunded energy cap for 2 years, which crashed the economy so they had to U-turn it to 6 months, but still unfunded?
That kind of sensible setting out of policy?
I’m also surprised theres been no protests specifically against this absolute s***show. Whats changed in the UK since the Poll Tax riots, where people were so angry, that people now just sit indoors getting angry at their computers? Cant help thinking if this was France we’d have already seem riots
The fact that, as you're demonstrating, unless you actually pay attention to the details of politics most of the news outlets only report on the government (and mostly with a very positive spin).
Outside of conferences and GE campaigns with manifestos there's very little airtime given to the opposition.
No one's leaking the who said what of shadow cabinet meetings unless Starmer's got a beer in his hand.
remoaners eh....
https://twitter.com/pacarnahan/status/1582997257728950272?s=20&t=HL9aQ5g8l-7ibG-uBY1aXg
Starmer was on tv this morning, a minister was on GB News (I showered after) setting out policies earlier too...
They are doing what they need to imo.
If love to be wrong but they never call an electron
Are you positron?
They are doing what they need to imo.
Starmer speaking at TUC today as well... that should make most news bulletins this evening (unless the Tories create enough fresh chaos to take up all the air time). Anyway... we do have a thread for people to moan about Starmer "doing nothing" despite the evidence.
then if you’re the best person in the area
Depends what you mean by "best", doesn't it.
.
Graham Brady has just been seen entering No.10. Let's see if he comes out carrying a roll of carpet.
Graham Brady has just turned up at number ten
Looks like the gig is up
Bless good old Mad Nad with her continued campaign
https://twitter.com/nadinedorries/status/1583033679990861825?s=46&t=FgbGl62TB3kGiZ33dcWPiQ
Brady is on the way to No10
Beaten to it by @binners , I was just about to say that Nadine is desperate for the return of Our Saviour Boris...
Where she likes to ape Thatcher photo ops, will she do the teary-eyed departure from No10?
The BBC's current headline is "Starmer speech gives guide of what he would do as PM".
Can't get much more direct that that really?
