[Closed] Join the que or use both lanes?

I queue.At 400 yards I always leave space for 2 cars in front.At 200 yards I always leave space for 1 car in front.At 100 yards you can't get a fag paper between my bumper and the car in front and any wazzock trying to dive in at the last minute gets the bird.

Why would I want to queue, when there is an open lane for 1/2 mile 🙄

The latter. Knowing that its the right thing to do. Then everybody should merge together like a zip. Sometimes it's almost like people [i]want[/i] to queue.

erm, cycle to work and never queue again?

Are you the person that allows me to enter the traffic flow in an orderly fashion, or do you prevent me from entering creating tension and more delays for everyone?

Queue; and if I'm within the last 200 yards and folk are still trying to cut in I pull out and block the lane lorry driver style

Use both lanes, merge in turn in a timely manner. Oh I forgot you're only supposed to merge in turn when there's a sign for it. That way no one needs to apply common sense.

I follow the highway code.

Rorschach +1, unless your driving a Merc, BMW or Audi rep mobile in which case **** you, experience is you never return the favour so why should i bother?

Queue; and if I'm within the last 200 yards and folk are still trying to cut in I pull out and block the lane lorry driver style

Ahha -- a queue maker-- have you ever seen those signs to use both lanes and then merge at the end ? They are for people like you who think they know what they are doing , but really have no concept of lateral thought.

Drives to end and [i]merges[/i]. The recommended method I believe

All for using both lanes and then alternating for access- always amazes that people want to get in one long line!

Drives to end and [i]trys to barge in without making any eye contact or acknowledgement before blowing horn and gesticulating wildly[/i].The reps method I believe.

BenHouldsworth - Member
Queue; and if I'm within the last 200 yards and folk are still trying to cut in I pull out and block the lane lorry driver style

This, as I was taught to do on a defensive driving course by a retired traffic cop...

Drive to the end, merge. Laugh at the person getting angry who decided to queue for no reason 😀

The queue is only that long because people decided not to use a huge amount of empty road!

Dont queue. Merge like a zip, like you are supposed to do. Why have a 10 mile queue which is screwing up lots of junctions and other roads, when you can fit the same amount of cars in to less than hald the space?

The latter. Knowing that its the right thing to do. Then everybody should merge together like a zip. Sometimes it's almost like people want to queue.

This.

Two lanes into one, one merging point, after you after me, smooth and simple with minimum disruptions.

Two lanes into one, multiple merging points over half a mile, chaos, people carving in all over the place, harsh braking as people get cut up, the self-righteous intentionally blocking both lanes at whatever arbitrary point they've decided is 'right', stress, road rage.

What is there to gain by piling into one lane ages before the closure, other than to double the length of the queue (and thus the pinch point)? The road's open for a reason. Use it.

Join the queue early and relax. Let late merging / highway code following (delete as biased) folk in at the end. Stay relaxed.

Of course go to the front. Why on earth would I want to wait behind people who I don't know? Clearly my time is more important than there's.

This is only slightly a troll, I do actually feel like this.

Two lanes into one, one merging point, after you after me, smooth and simple with minimum disruptions.

Two lanes into one, multiple merging points over half a mile, chaos, people carving in all over the place, harsh braking as people get cut up, the self-righteous intentionally blocking both lanes at whatever arbitrary point they've decided is 'right', stress, road rage.

What is there to gain by piling into one line ages before the junction, other than to double the length of the queue (and thus the pinch point)? The road's open for a reason. Use it.

+1

+1 Markie; the problem with the smooth closing zip (which I think is ideal) is that those shooting down the outside aren't interested in traffic moving smoothly, they're interested in themselves

I will stay in the outside lane until it feels cheeky to go any further, probably between 2-400 yards out then merge before people start to get annoyed. Have previously done both blocking the lane and merging at the last minute so can't say one or the other!

Have found myself tending not to do things that will really annoy other drivers though, couple of witnessed (and experienced) road rage incidents make me think twice about blocking people if they're intent on cutting in now.

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Do exactly what it says on the sign.

like deadly says the whole point is that cars should meet at the end and merge in turn where the centre line stops. that is the point of there being 2 lanes. it idiotic to queue. youre just wasting tax payers money on excess tarmac if you dont use it.

the problem with the smooth closing zip (which I think is ideal) is that those shooting down the outside aren't interested in traffic moving smoothly, they're interested in themselves

If everyone did merge at the merge point, there wouldn't be an empty lane to shoot down in the first place.

So they're trying to apply this technique and us in the queue are mistaking it for impatience and preventing them? I knew it would be my fault

's about the size of it.

If you were at the supermarket and there were two checkouts open, the one on the left had ten people waiting and the one on the right was empty, which one would you use?

Assuming you pick the right hand one, is that out of "impatience"?

If someone waiting at the left checkout then jumped out and stood in front of you before you got there, not actually using the till but just being obstructive, what would you think?

yeah kind of. the basic idea is that you fill both lanes. then you merge in turn. this allows twice the number of cars to occupy the same length of road. this in turn prevents traffic backing up too far. that is the principal behind it. if everyone did this the traffic would move faster because everyone would know what everyone else is (supposed) to be doing.

^^Too much punctuation not enough capitals.^^

Merge in turn, always. I once drove a good couple of miles down the A9 past a queue of traffic and must have had several hundred evil stares as I zoomed past them.

I drive a BMW, what's a queue ? 😆

Que?

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Emergency brake and signal at the last minute pretending I've only just realised I need this junction. Hand gesture apologetically.

Never fails to get some kind Samaritan let me in.

I drive a BMW, what's a queue ?

All in good time son, all in good time.

We haven't covered what 'indicators' are yet, when fog lights CAN be used, or what Lanes 1 and 2 are used for.

I have no idea why you wouldn't use the available lane until it runs out. I'm not more important or busy that those who queue, however I 'may' be more intelligent with a greater understanding of fair play and logic.

I tend to queue but don't mind letting people in if they indicate. If someone gets to the cones and isn't indicating to come across I assume that they like it there and am happy enough to oblige in keeping them there.

I tend to do the same as Markie (just join the queue and stay frosty 8) ).

This is despite knowing that the sensible thing to do is to use both lanes and zip together.

Very topical as there was exactly this situation on the Coast Road out of Newcastle today, and I witnessed all the above behaviour, including a plumber's van blocking the outside lane and rolling along at the same speed as the inside lane, and a taxi driver doing 80 right up until the cones started.

Sadly, people often disagree about the right / respectful / safe way to do stuff, and that's before they get into their metal bubbles. And that's why I just take the line of least resistance and queue.

Run to the end, then merge is the sensible way but people just can't manage it and it all gets stressy so I don't try it on generally. On the road I use where it tends to happen, I've only just joined so I'd feel a right git pulling out.

Frankly, I'm generally pleased when somebody "blocks" the empty lane - esp when the consequence is that both lanes fill up behind them (I mean, that's what we all want, right ? 😉 ). Also, the cross people in flash cars then just add to the fun for me.

On roads where it happens routinely they should put up signs telling people to do so, like those in the pic above (use both lanes and merge at the end [b]ONLY[/b]).

Tossers trying to get ahead at others' expense do, of course, exist but they're more obvious when shoving in late at an exit or undertaking a queue and then shoving out.

what really ****s me off is the people who think "oh, the guy in front has only moved two car lengths, I'll not bother moving", thus completely ignoring the folks 30 cars back navigating that chocablock junction/roundabout and trying to free up a space.

+1 to using the road as intended btw. Queueing when you don't need to?! I'm sure some folks just want a reason to get wound up.

undertaking a queue

I may be misunderstanding your point, but generally, if you can be undertaken, you're in the wrong lane; and if it's two lanes of standing traffic then you're all under/overtaking constantly anyway.

I may be misunderstanding your point, but generally, if you can be undertaken, you're in the wrong lane;

Rep/bighitter blasts up to the back of the crane and then swerves out

*why do you think the queue is so slow ?

Make full use of the road space - you are [u]supposed[/u] to use both lanes then merge in turn, that's why the merge signs are at the end not 1mile from the roadworks.

Don't drive like the empty lane is the back straight at Snetterton and show courtesy before and after someone allows you to merge.

Draw a deep breath when the self styled moral policemen drive 3inches from the car in front to prevent someone else changing lane. When I am the car in front that you are tailgating I really really do appreciate you putting mine and my kids safety at risk so you can prove a point.

example: Dual carriageway; crane/tractor/chaingang trundling along at 30 in left. Everyone wants to pass it so there's a queue of around 10 cars getting slowly* past, each leaving what they consider a minimum safe distance from the car in front

Rep/bighitter blasts up to the back of the crane and then swerves out

One car is overtaking. What are the other nine doing?

Point stands.

I may have previously used the verge to drive round people blocking the outside lane due to some arrogant but misplaced sense of duty. These people are the lowest of the low.

I like the supermarket queue analogy. I will use that the next time we have this argument at work.

What are the other nine doing?

It depends on the location. If its a permanent defile, like the mad mile in to the newly developed traffic jam at Poynton, then i queue up with the rest of the good natured locals. If its on the Motorway, then use all lanes up to the defile point. Simples. Unless you drive an Audi and consider yourself better than the rest of us.... or a white van 👿

as I was taught to do on a defensive driving course by a retired traffic cop...

How is blocking traffic 'defensive'? Why would a retired traffic cop encourage you to break the law? No policeman I've ever spoken to has suggested winding up other motorists is a safe course of action.

Trying to merge...

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Dad content...[/url]

Excuse the belt and braces approach with two links, but I can never remember how to do vids...

Traffic, by Tom Vanderbilt, has a chapter on this. Filling both lanes is the most efficient strategy, but it breaks down because people in the destination lane get upset about the drivers using the merging lane, and end up blocking the merge.

Traffic is fluid dynamics, basically.

I've not read that book; recommended?

One car is overtaking. What are the other nine doing?

Point stands.

So cougar, I'm interested: What would you do if you were driving at 70 and aproached a tractor in LH lane doing 30 with several cars outside it all doing 50 ? There's about 100 yards from the back of the last car to the back of the tractor.

Last time someone got really arsey with me at a merge, I forced my way in and then left a big gap so about 20 cars could get in...

Merge at the end. You sometimes get some "traffic lord" but it's their ulcer so I dont worry about them.
On my daily commute home (A1 J6 North) this seems to work pretty well. Last 200 yards everyone spaces out ready to merge and at the end of the lane. Job jobbed.

Last 200 yards everyone spaces out ready to merge and at the end of the lane. Job jobbed.

I do what the highway code recommends - I drive to the end and filter in.

So cougar, I'm interested: What would you do if you were driving at 70 and aproached a tractor in LH lane doing 30 with several cars outside it all doing 50 ? There's about 100 yards from the back of the last car to the back of the tractor.

I'd ignore the lot of them. I'd already be in the left hand lane as I wasn't already overtaking anything, and I'd continue to pass the queue on the left as per the Highway Code. They're halfwits.

[b]Rule 163[/b]

stay in your lane if traffic is moving slowly in queues. If the queue on your right is moving more slowly than you are, you may pass on the left

On approaching the slower-moving vehicle in the left lane, I'd signal to indicate my intention to change lanes. I'd match my speed with the second lane traffic and attempt to merge. I wouldn't cut anyone up, and would yield to anyone who intentionally boxed me in by accelerating after I indicated.

On finding a gap I'd move out, pass the obstruction, move back left and accelerate back to the speed limit.

On finding a gap I'd move out

there is no (appropriate) gap as they're all safely spaced.

Someone would let me out, almost certainly. If not, then I'd slow and wait. I'd wait longer than the back of the original queue if that's what it entailed.

Congratulations, either way, you've slowed down the line of traffic.

I haven't impacted that line of traffic at all, as per the above. I'll join the back of the shorter queue and wait my turn. A momentary slowing of one vehicle to increase a gap by a few yards to let me out is negligible in the grand scheme of things; certainly it has less impact overall than the entire contents of a multi-lane carriageway squeezing madly into one lane in the first place because there might be a hazard somewhere in the next time zone.

Is this hypothetical single line of yours any more efficient then, with everyone bustling into one single line as far as the eye can see just because there's a tractor on the horizon? Is that preferable?

It's the same daftness as in the OP. If two lanes queued and merged like a zip it'd be a non-issue.

How insecure do you have to be to form a rolling roadblock in the outside lane incase someone queues for slightly less time than you?!

Think it depends. If traffic is building up, or stationary ie through roadworks, drive to the end and zip in. If the traffic is flowing then try and join the inside lane earlier in good time , as barging it last second just causes traffic to brake and concentener.

I've not read that book; recommended?

No. It's quite a dull tedious read but one or two interesting facts about how traffic behaves. The bits worth reading could be in a pamphlet but instead it's a very long book.

Think it depends. If traffic is building up, or stationary ie through roadworks, drive to the end and zip in. If the traffic is flowing then try and join the inside lane earlier in good time , as barging it last second just causes traffic to brake and concentener.

This. If you do something different you are doing it wrong.

iainc - Member
I drive a BMW, what's a queue?

The above tractor situation describes perfectly roads like the a14 or a50 heavily used by lorries
I once travelled 6 miles at 65mph (yes I counted it on the odometer) in the inside lane, 'undertaking' cars that had followed each other to overtake a lorry, as more cars pulled out the end of the queue got further and further away from the lorry until the back of the queue couldn't even see it
Some cars where even sat in outside lane before moving across at 200yards to exit the slip road!
At the front of the queue undoubtedly another lorry doing 1mph more than the one they where tryi g to overtake, my other pet driving hate - why, they take miles to pass each other for what?

I've not read that book; recommended?

Drive to end, use horn to advise that I am now about to filter

So cougar, I'm interested: What would you do if you were driving at 70 and aproached a tractor in LH lane doing 30 with several cars outside it all doing 50 ? There's about 100 yards from the back of the last car to the back of the tractor.

Why are the folk in the outside lane all doing 50mph? If they were not crapping themselves at the thought of having to overtake they'd be doing 70 and the gaps would be bigger, allowing cars to merge easily therefore keeping the speed of the cars higher.

You have the 'queuers' on the left, the 'mergers' on the right. The troublemakers are those that drive down the right, and then decide to merge before getting to the end of the lane in case they upset everyone. Especially when they stop and block the lane whilst waiting for a gap to move over into.

By merging early, they slow the left hand lane down, their place on the right is taken by the next car, and this is why the left lane always moves slower and people get irate.

I have this on my commute home every day, the left lane queues across a roundabout and causes congestion and blocks buses from getting into a bus lane, the right lane is clear for another 300 metres. Until they erected 'merge' signs I would see road rage and tailgating almost every day at the merge point.

If everyone merged at the pinch point, and [u]not early[/u], both lanes would move the same speed and be the same length. The left may even move quicker as the trucks and buses in the left lane 'claim' more space at the merge point and then the 'queuers' would be in a kerfuffle and decide they should queue in the right hand lane 😆

[i]Why are the folk in the outside lane all doing 50mph? If they were not crapping themselves at the thought of having to overtake they'd be doing 70 and the gaps would be bigger, allowing cars to merge easily therefore keeping the speed of the cars higher.[/i]

So say there is a couple of cars alongside you. You have to slow down before overtaking. Say two minutes earlier a HGV overtook the tractor and slowed the traffic in the outside lane, causing a queue. Unless its dead quiet you can't expect to pass a slow vehicle at 70mph, there will always be a bit of congestion.

I get a fair bit of hatred from other road users for the car I drive anyway (not German, by the way) so I figure I may as well do the correct thing and piss off the queuers by driving to the end before merging.

Traffic is fluid dynamics, basically.

I've not read that book; recommended?

It's a great book, it explains the many reasons why traffic very much isn't fluid dynamics. Highly recommend it.

So say there is a couple of cars alongside you. You have to slow down before overtaking. Say two minutes earlier a HGV overtook the tractor and slowed the traffic in the outside lane, causing a queue. Unless its dead quiet you can't expect to pass a slow vehicle at 70mph, there will always be a bit of congestion.

why is the queue still there if people are driving properly.

Shockwave traffic jams anyone?

[i]Don't drive like the empty lane is the back straight at Snetterton and show courtesy before and after someone allows you to merge.[/i]

The problem is that's generally the way I see these lanes being treated. There are two on my route home from work when I drive. M8 to m77 slip road and m77 at Newton mearns where it goes from 3 to 2 lanes. People hammer up the outside of the 3rd lane and just have to get in front of one more car then slam on their brakes as they've forced their way into a gap that's too small. I generally sit in the inside lane And drive pass lane 2 and 3 chaos. I'm very surprised there aren't accidents here on a daily basis.

As for the m8 to m77 merge I join on the inside so have no reason to move out. I let people in that I indicate in a timely manner. If some fanny doesn't show intention of wanting in then why would I leave a gap for them? If indicating is too difficult for them then **** them, it's not a difficult task.

See that "merge in turn" sign on page one? That's the first time I've ever seen that! Is it used nationwide? 😯

So say there is a couple of cars alongside you. You have to slow down before overtaking. Say two minutes earlier a HGV overtook the tractor and slowed the traffic in the outside lane, causing a queue. Unless its dead quiet you can't expect to pass a slow vehicle at 70mph, there will always be a bit of congestion.

And the solution to this dilemma is for everyone to queue in one lane for miles, obviously.

Again; if people were travelling in the left lane by default unless overtaking, [i]as they're supposed to,[/i] then the situation you describe would be a momentary inconvenience. The truck passes, normality returns, and everyone can go back to overtaking at 70mph.

Having two lanes of traffic squashed into one lane with no thought for braking distances means as soon as someone at the front brakes, everyone else brakes harder to compensate, and you get phantom traffic jams. You know, where you sit at 10mph for half an hour then it suddenly dissipates and you wonder, "what was that all about?" You said yourself, a truck passed [i]two minutes ago,[/i] and there's still knock-on problems.

It's retarded. Stop it.

THC, emphasis mine:

264

[b]You should always drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower-moving vehicles, you should return to the left-hand lane as soon as you are safely past. [/b]Slow-moving or speed-restricted vehicles should always remain in the left-hand lane of the carriageway unless overtaking. You MUST NOT drive on the hard shoulder except in an emergency or if directed to do so by the police, HA traffic officers in uniform or by signs.

268

Do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake. [b]In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to your right.[/b] Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.

Driove slowly down outside empty lane, with headlights on, look for a new car, near the end of the queue, and overtakeit and indicate lef, they always let you in, as they dont want their nice new car damaged, do they.

or pass down parked vehicles till end of lane, and stop dead, with head swiveling like an ostrich tied to a swivel chair, and panic, saw this the other night on the A55,

I ride to the front on my motorbike and then filter down the single file traffic and still people will pull out to block me.