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the timing couldnt be much worse
Unless you wanted to continue standing at the sidelines while the Tory lot continues to run the UK into the ground.
He is clearly not a good leader. He just doesn't seem to realise/accept it and any good leader would know when to stand down for the good of the party.
Proper grown up thinking, right there
Says the poster who constantly calls Corbyn "Magic Grandad", mentions the fact he has an allotment in a patronising manner, infers people who support the shift of Labour back to its socialist roots are "6th formers" and sneering uses the term "comrade" to belittle those who don't hold your seemingly staunch centrist beliefs.
You attempt to disguise your posts with superficiality learned looking waffle but your child-like debating skills shine through.
What has this to do with Corbyn?
See thread title. Whoops. Forgot to answer with a question.
Says the poster who constantly calls Corbyn “Magic Grandad”, mentions the fact he has an allotment in a patronising manner, infers people who support the shift of Labour back to its socialist roots are “6th formers” and sneering uses the term “comrade” to belittle those who don’t hold your seemingly staunch centrist beliefs.
You attempt to disguise your posts with superficiality learned looking waffle but your child-like debating skills shine through.
U ok Hun?
sneering uses the term “comrade”
Is there another way of using it? Genocidally?
That’s me told, then.
Dominic Cummings has put the party on a war footing, is no doubt putting another Cambridge Analytica style campaign in place, sent Boris out spaffing money like a pissed lottery winner, ready to call a snap election at any point, and what’s Corbyn doing?
Indulging in another bout of pointless naval-gazing to deal with the heretical centrist/Blairite non-believers and secure his stranglehold on the captaincy of the Titanic
I’d imagine a fair amount of them are preparing to jump from the sinking ship, before they’re pushed
and what’s Corbyn doing?
He's visiting Whaley Bridge today. Cos Boris did that 2 days ago so I guess he feels he needs to show his face. Maybe there's an allotment for sale there. 😉
High Peak is now a Labour ward (and actually the MP, Ruth George, is very good). Conservatives lost it when May called her snap election.
Indulging in another bout of pointless naval-gazing to deal with the heretical centrist/Blairite non-believers
Interesting. Dont suppose you can share your source saying he is involved could you?
Well, he may not be involved, as it’s exactly the kind of thing a leader should have a hand/say in… so he’s probably ignoring it and taking reassurances from Lansman and Milne and colleagues that it’s all going just great.
I've still not seen any actual defence of Corbyb's leadership abilities.
He needs to go. Who apart from the few tories on here thinks he shouldn't?
Jeremy Corbyn is not a leader. He’s never going to be a leader, never wanted to be a leader, is totally uncomfortable in the role as leader.
Which makes him uniquely qualified. What's that saying about those who seek power being the least equipped to wield it? Anyway, Alan Johnson is the last person to be giving advice on leadership, seeing as he repeatedly spurned the chance to lead the party because he couldn't handle the pressure or more likely had some skeleton in his closet that he feared would be revealed.
Funny that Corbyn's critics accuse him of navel gazing when they've spent four years doing nothing else. If labour MPs don't like Corbyn, there is a process in place whereby they can remove him. Until they put their money where their mouths are they can shut up quite frankly. Instead they stand on the sidelines, whining like spoilt children who aren't allowed any more sweets. Corbyn and his advisors have a lot of responsibility for the current situation, but not all of it. The MPs and others on the sidelines who still fail to accept that the members chose a non-centrist through democratic means bare just as much responsibilty. Until they accept that, nothing will change, and labour will continue in oppostion.
If labour MPs don’t like Corbyn, there is a process in place whereby they can remove him.
No there isn’t.
Care to elaborate?
The MPs can not replace the Party Leader. They can vote, every single one of them, that they have no confidence in him… and he can just shrug them off… and ask the rest of the party to keep him in his place.
A 2016 link for you…
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36647458
In hindsight, the party should have listened to the people who have sat with him in the commons, and who he is supposed to be leading.
What’s that saying about those who seek power being the least equipped to wield it?
Plato's republic I think.
If your defence of Corbyn's leadership really is that he's least equipped to wield power I'm left shaking my head but yes, you really do have your guy.
Unfortunately he's not going to get to wield power, but at least he and you will be happy with this.
If your defence of Corbyn’s leadership
You miss my point. I'm not defending Corbyn, I'm challenging the idea that we need 'strong' political leadership. If you want strong or charismatic leadership have a look over the atlantic to see what that gets you. Or look at our current PM. I've had enough of narcissists and psychopaths being in power, so in that respect Corbyn represents something different, and interesting.
I’m not defending Corbyn
No one is, really.
So you think Labour needs a new leader, but not one like Trump or Johnson? Who’s going to disagree with you on that?!?
Funny that Corbyn’s critics accuse him of navel gazing when they’ve spent four years doing nothing else.
I wouldn't say they've spent four years doing nothing. They've sniped at Corbyn from afar, fallen over themselves to be 'a Labour source' for any two-bit tabloid hack who is dreaming up a story, stoked the flames regarding 'antisemitism' when the majority is justified criticism of Israel and generally just done the work of the Conservative attack dogs for them.
The Centrists/Blairites are like petulant children. Sulking because they are now finally being held accountable to the rank and file of the Labour Party by democratic means, and upset that can't have their ilk parachuted into safe Labour seats anymore, just by just chucking on a red rosette.
Centrist/Blairite supporters chuck about the word "purge" as if its a thing, but what we're actually seeing is democracy in action. CLPs are the bedrock of the Labour Party and it is only right that they represent their members interests, ahead of the self-interest of a few MPs who have overstayed their welcome.
The MPs can not replace the Party Leader. They can vote, every single one of them, that they have no confidence in him… and he can just shrug them off… and ask the rest of the party to keep him in his place.
When you say "ask", you mean vote? His opponents could try making a better argument than they managed last time.
The MPs can not replace the Party Leader. They can vote, every single one of them, that they have no confidence in him… and he can just shrug them off… and ask the rest of the party to keep him in his place.
I mean heaven forbid all party members have an equal vote eh?
Perhaps we should go back to the old system where everyone was equal, but some were more equal than others...
Funnily enough those who made the most noise about us plebs getting an equal vote to MPs were Centrists and Blairites such as Tom Watson, Chuka Umunna and Chris Leslie, individuals who were parachuted into safe Labour seats by their previous lord and master.
I’m not defending Corbyn, I’m challenging the idea that we need ‘strong’ political leadership
If strong means someone that is able to give a clear message, sort out problems such as the antisematic problem (which could have been sorted out within a week of it being highlighted), get the party to follow them because of their leadership qualities and things like that then yes Labour need a strong leader. People like Trump are not strong leaders by the way.
Perhaps we should go back to the old system where everyone was equal, but some were more equal than others…
Expelling the antisemitism enthusiasts who bought their way in for £3 would be sensible.
A couple of questions for the Corbyn fans then;
Regardless of what you, personally, think of him,
(a) do you think it's likely that he will ever be PM?
(b) do you think it more, or less, likely that someone chosen in his place would become PM?
Expelling the antisemitism enthusiasts who bought their way in for £3 would be sensible.
Antisemitism enthusiasts? Many are individuals who are quite justifiably criticising the apartheid regime in Israel and its brutal actions against Palestinians. Unfortunately people such as yourself jump on any criticism of Israel and label it antisemitism.
Of course there are undoubtedly antisemitic individuals within the Labour Party, as there undoubtedly are in every walk of life, but the problem is nowhere near as bad as the likes of yourself and a disgustingly biased press are trying to make out.
No bunker mentality here. No sir!
I mean heaven forbid all party members have an equal vote eh?
I didn’t argue against one member one vote, I was just reminding @dazh that the parliamentary party can not remove Corbyn. It’s right that all the members got to re-elect him after the MPs said he wasn’t up to job… it’s just that, with hindsight, they were wrong. He should have gone then. And it’s the whole country that is to pay the price for the misplaced confidence the members had in him, sadly. Corbyn should have stepped aside back in 2016, or after the 2017 “victory”, or the election loses of earlier this year… but that choice is his and the members, it is not that of the MPs… most of them know he’s now just a barrier to a Labour government, even if party loyalty means that they bite their tongues.
I voted Labour in 2017 by the way, and still think he performed a useful task of resetting Labour Party policy to be more inline with the wishes of members and voters on many issues. He’s been the wrong person to be Leader Of The Opposition for years though, even back when he may have been the right person to lead the Labour Party. And now… he is the wrong person to be either. Anyone and everyone can see this now… some are just too stubborn, or too thankful/loyal for his repositioning of Labour to the left, to admit it.
Antisemitism enthusiasts? Many are individuals who are quite justifiably criticising the apartheid regime in Israel and its brutal actions against Palestinians. Unfortunately people such as yourself jump on any criticism of Israel and label it antisemitism.Of course there are undoubtedly antisemitic individuals within the Labour Party, as there undoubtedly are in every walk of life, but the problem is nowhere near as bad as the likes of yourself and a disgustingly biased press are trying to make out.
So you don’t want your £3 back then?
Regardless of what you, personally, think of him,
(a) do you think it’s likely that he will ever be PM?
(b) do you think it more, or less, likely that someone chosen in his place would become PM?
Yes and yes.
What critics fail to recognise is that Corbyn is an idea not just a person.
As long as Labour stick to a radical agenda it really does not matter who leads it.
When someone says they wont vote labour because they don't like Corbyn they are just seeing a narrow subjective view.
If they don't like the policy then there is a debate to be had.
So you don’t want your £3 back then?
Are you trying to imply I'm one of those 'antisemitism enthusiasts' you sneeringly associate with the £3 membership charge? I will hold my hand up and admit I am a critic of the state of Israel, but that does not make me antisemitic, no matter what your rather simplistic understanding of the subject tells you.
As for the £3 membership (which I didn't make use of, having joined the Labour Party in 2007 when I left the military) what's the issue? When it was brought in the Labour Party was repositioning itself as a party of the people and trying to encourage wider participation in politics. Should such participation have a potentially onerous financial barrier or should a party that claims to be of the people only look to cover administrative costs?
The Labour Party is done.
Finished.
The three quid trots in the common room now own it. They own it because they broke it.
They’re now free to wave their placards, sign their petitions and sing ooooooooh Jeremy Corbyn! While the Tories get to carry on with their far right agenda, totally unopposed by anything resembling a credible opposition
Talk about middle class self-indulgence...
Talk about middle class self-indulgence…
Rather rich coming from a nailed-on centrist such as yourself.
Enjoy throwing your support behind the yellow Tories, I doubt anyone to the left is sad to see the back of you. Perhaps you could do one useful thing whilst your at it and take Tom Watson with you?
Sure fire path to government right there, comrade
You know how parliamentary democracy works, right?
You need people to actually vote for you?
You don’t get, like, double points for being self- righteously indignant and bathing in the light of your socialist halo
The Labour Party is done.
Keep saying this and you might get it right one day.
The three quid trots in the common room now own it. They own it because they broke it.
Does this mean you have finally resigned your membership?
Talk about middle class self-indulgence…
Wow the projection here really is quite stunning. For the last several years you seem to have dedicated yourself to trying to destroy the Labour party for having the cheek not to follow your personal beliefs.
The centrists as a whole have shown a rabid determination to destroy the left wing side of the Labour party whilst acting surprised when the favour is returned.
Perhaps if the centrists hadnt made it clear to Corbyn that they will still want to put a knife in his back as soon as they can then they might have more influence. As it is he would have to be ****ing nuts to trust them one inch.
This is without going into the centrists triangulation policy under Blair which saw hard right economic policies normalised as he chased them ever rightwards.
The centrists have ****ed up the UK political system by trying to turn Labour and the Tories into clone parties removing the choice from the majority of the population. Hell they have even screwed up the Libdems with the orange book mob.
You know how parliamentary democracy works, right?
You need people to actually vote for you?
This coming from the guy who is throwing his support behind the perennial fence sitters?
How many MPs do they have again? Few enough that they can go to their party conference in a single minibus?
You honestly think that they are the party to challenge a Tory party that is lurching increasingly to the right?
At the national level the Lib Dems are almost completely irrelevant and, at the moment, are as much a single issue (pro-EU) party as the collection of idiots Farage is responsible for. If anyone scratches beneath the surface of this single issue they'll see a party whose remaining MPs were largely responsible for ushering in austerity, with voting records to support this.
So if (when) the UK is dragged out of the EU on the 31st October the Lib Dems will actually become a complete irrelevance, given that aside from their pro-EU stance, many of their policies echo those of the centre-right Tories.
Cheers guys. Thanks for correcting my thought crimes against the glorious leader
If you can manage to so easily convince a lifelong labour voter, temporarily disillusioned (please St Jeremy, forgive me for I have sinned!) to stick with the programme through your open and pragmatic approach, convincing swing voters in key marginals should be a doddle
I keenly await the socialist utopia, outside the E.U., obvs, the upcoming general election will deliver
It's not corbyns socialism that's the problem it's his flip flipping & indecision over brexit and his inability to deal with issues like antisemitism in the party.
As divided as the nation is over brexit, he & labour should be polling much better his popularity ratings on every metric are below both Johnson & May 's
Considering just how much damage they've done to the UK that's bonkers!
The reason many on the left & centre are looking to the lib dems, snp , greens etc is that Corbyns strongest supporters have the party by the balls & just ignore all his negatives.
It’s getting harder and harder to have conversations with people who have (for their own very good reasons) stuck with the Labour Party through to 2019, isn’t it. Everyone else is now a Tory or a Centrist of some kind. Not a past Labour Left (but not Straight Left) voter who has had it with the current leader… those people (in their multitudes) are all made up. The Greens, and LibDems, and National parties are just going to have to be as welcoming as possible to their new voters and supporters, aren’t they.
It’s not corbyns socialism that’s the problem it’s his flip flipping & indecision over brexit and his inability to deal with issues like antisemitism in the party.
Corbyn isn't indecisive on Brexit, he wants Brexit, he wants the Conservatives to take the blame for all the downside and then use that to win a GE where his manifesto is unfettered by EU state aid rules and set up free trade agreements with Venezuela and Iran and use the permanent seat on the UN security council to destroy NATO etc
It’s getting harder and harder to have conversations with people who have (for their own very good reasons) stuck with the Labour Party through to 2019, isn’t it
Given the vitriol aimed here at anyone who doesn't denounce Corbyn as the devil, I suggest you have this the wrong way round.
...and set up free trade agreements with Venezuela and Iran and use the permanent seat on the UN security council to destroy NATO etc
You were doing so well but stopped short of the usual anti- Corbyn cliches.
- No accusation of him being an IRA supporter.
- No mention of him having an allotment
- No accusation of him being a Soviet spy.
- No accusation of those who support him being 6th Formers.
- No suggestive comment regarding his friendship with Diane Abbot.
- A distinct lack of a photoshopped picture of Corbyn in Red Square/stood next to Stalin/with a swastika on his arm* (*delete as appropriate).
3/10, please review and resubmit.
Corbyn isn’t indecisive on Brexit, he wants Brexit, he wants the Conservatives to take the blame for all the downside and then use that to win a GE where his manifesto is unfettered by EU state aid rules
The Tories should take all the blame. Look at the indicative voting.
And if there is a G.E and Labour clinch it and we start to reverse the vile policies of the last 10 years then that can be the best thing to come out of the this.
It’s not corbyns socialism that’s the problem it’s his flip flipping & indecision over brexit and his inability to deal with issues like antisemitism in the party.
Exactly, his policies are good and gained a lot of support n the election. He would have got away with it if it hadn't been for Brexit and those pesky jews.
It’s getting harder and harder to have conversations with people who have (for their own very good reasons) stuck with the Labour Party through to 2019, isn’t it.
Anecdotal perhaps?
I don't see the point in joining in a conversation on here that is just an exercise in fringe tabloid hysterics; often not funny or clever but usually without nuance.
Let's also face fact that a forum is not the best place to deal with politics. Our backgrounds, personal circumstances and experiences don't carry the same weight either.
People are generally pretty aggressive and demeaning too. Terrible on twitter too. It's getting increasingly difficult to seek out truth.
Given the vitriol aimed here at anyone who doesn’t denounce Corbyn as the devil
There does seem to be a lot of projection going on. I would have thought, if Kelvin and co, wanted a sensible discussion they would suggest binners calm down his rhetoric and inane picture sprees which, incidentally, he has been doing nonstop since Corbyn got elected.
The Tories should take all the blame. Look at the indicative voting.
Meanwhile, back in the real world....
Corbyn 3-line-whipped his MP's to trigger Article 50
Corbyn 3-line-whipped his MP's to vote against remaining in the single market
Corbyn 3-line-whipped his MP's to vote against remaining in the customs union
Credit where its due
He's a lifelong Brexiteer who has facilitated Brexit at very critical juncture. Ultimately, he is equally as responsible for the impending catastrophe as any member of the ERG. To pretend he isn't is just wilfully myopic
It’s getting harder and harder to have conversations with people who have (for their own very good reasons) stuck with the Labour Party through to 2019, isn’t it.
Kelvin, with the greatest possible respect, are you taking the piss? I know you probably think your very well thought out arguments are obvious and should persuade anyone who hasn’t jumped on the blame Corbyn bandwagon, but I’m afraid there is another side you just don’t see. I know because I was like you not that long ago.
I managed to open my eyes to the fact that millions of working class people don’t like the EU, or are disinterested in it. They do however want fundamental change to services and economic policies which directly affect them. This is why labour haven’t become a single issue brexit obsessed party like all the others. It’s why some of us also refuse to become obsessed by brexit. If you want to have sensible conversations then start by understanding and respecting this.
And the rest of you (because kelvin thankfully hasn’t indulged in this), grow up FFS. What you’re doing on here is classic schoolyard bullying of people who aren’t in your gang. Let’s see if we can go two pages without a monty python pic, or use of the words sixth form, bunker, comrade, or cabal.
Let’s see if we can go two pages without a monty python pic, or use of the words sixth form, bunker, comrade, or cabal.
Sadly these kind of posts have largely come from a single poster, who no doubt sees himself as an otherwise level-headed person. It's almost a 'chewkw' level of repetitive, troll-like behaviour.
This is why labour haven’t become a single issue brexit obsessed party like all the others. It’s why some of us also refuse to become obsessed by brexit. If you want to have sensible conversations then start by understanding and respecting this.
And hows that working out?
Saying that is all well and good, but Brexit, whether we like it or not, is the only game in town right now. You can't just wish it wasn't happening, because the implications of it are so enormous, politically , financially and socially. The effects of it will dictate this country's future for generations
Thats why a lot of us who would be natural supporters of left-leaning policies are so frustrated by Corbyn. When it comes to brexit, he is, at best, disengaged and ambivalent, but at critical junctures, an enabler. He's a Brexiteer who is happy to nod it through, but doesn't want ownership of it
He seems unconcerned that its a far right project he's actively enabling which will worsen everything he says he wants to improve
And you can talk about all the social reform in the world. You won't be able to do any of that with a contracting economy thats been plunged into recession, so it all becomes academic
He may be well intentioned but his actions won't lead to a fairer more equal society, they will deliver the polar opposite
We end up as a lap dog/satellite of the US, but more importantly all the achievements of the labour party (The NHS, Welfare State, workers rights etc) wil be rapidly destroyed in pretty much any Brexit scenario, particularly the No Deal we're screaming towards at the moment.
Remember... we're heading for no deal because Corbyn whipped his MP's to trigger article 50 (thankfully not the day after the referendum as he wanted) when government Brexit policy (such as it was) consisted of just 3 words .. Brexit means Brexit
Clueless! Totally ****ing clueless!
That may prove to be one of the worst and most far-reaching decisions any labour leader has ever taken
^ that
– No accusation of him being a Soviet spy.
Czech spy.
I managed to open my eyes to the fact that millions of working class people don’t like the EU, or are disinterested in it. They do however want fundamental change to services and economic policies which directly affect them.
These two things are almost entirely interdependent, whether people see it or not. A poor outcome in Brexit can only move social policy in one direction, and it's not a positive one. Whether or not people of any class or voting intention can make that connection, is largely irrelevant.
Not focusing on Brexit, while chatting about reform of the NHS/Welfare System/Workers' Rights is like planning your new car/house/holiday when you've just been given your redundancy notice.
5thElefant
Member
– No accusation of him being a Soviet spy.Czech spy.
Have you Czeched your sources on that?
#Gothenberghumour
So… tell us all how Corbyn has proven to be an effective Leader Of The Opposition, that the voters now see as the next PM… because if he hasn’t, and he isn’t, then what’s the point of him staying in his role as party leader? Just to ensure the party stays pure in the hope of getting the chance to rebuild after the mess of leaving the EU? Why did he stay in place after 2017? To complete a project that is confined to the party, or to genuinely prepare it to become the government at the next election? Or, as now increasingly seems the case to me, to make sure someone else doesn’t take the role who isn’t listening to the anti-Europe “Straight Left” ideologues and might propose stopping Brexit and forming a Labour government while we’re still members of the EU.
Or, as now increasingly seems the case to me, to make sure someone else doesn’t take the role who isn’t listening to the anti-Europe “Straight Left” ideologues
Maybe if the "moderates" hadnt dedicated themselves so much to attacking him he might feel more willing to listen.
It is a mess and he deserves a reasonable share of the blame but the moderates really need to think about their approach. They have been doing their best to undermine him since the beginning. Perhaps rather than the normal frothing hate try to compromise themselves and give alternate views. I am not surprised the Labour leadership does tend towards a bunker mentality with the centrist idiots attacks.
...and is sufficiently entrenched now only a new leader can improve things.
It's not about lefty veruss centrist, it competent versus incompetent.
Maybe if the “moderates” hadnt dedicated themselves so much to attacking him he might feel more willing to listen.
Is a “moderate” anyone that questions Corbyn’s suitability and ability to be Leader? Because if so, that goes around in circles.
I am not surprised the Labour leadership does tend towards a bunker mentality with the centrist idiots attacks.
What about when intelligent people from the left are questioning his approach? Or are we still pretending that anyone questioning the leader and his team are all Tories and Centrists?
Or are we still pretending that anyone questioning the leader and his team are all Tories and Centrists?
When we have no other answer, yes, yes we are.
Is a “moderate” anyone that questions Corbyn’s suitability and ability to be Leader?
A moderate is someone who isn't an extremest. Also see centrist.
Come the glorious revolution they'll be the second against the wall.
Maybe if the “moderates” hadnt dedicated themselves so much to attacking him he might feel more willing to listen.
Awwww Jewemy is being picked on...
Diddums...
He should MTFU & deal with it - if he can’t then he’s not fit to lead...
Oh, hang on - he’s not!
Awwww Jewemy is being picked on…
Diddums…
Congratulations on proving the point being made here.
CFH, that was gold. Thank you for cheering me up.
it's not his politics. He's simply not up to the job.
Willard, there's more in the thread.
"What do you mean he's not available on a Saturday?"
Brexit is the biggest right wing project this country has ever seen It has the backing of every right wing pundit, journalist & freemarketeer think tank going
It has become THE rallying cry of the far right and the sole purpose of the Tories, who have been cowed utterly by Farage
Corbyn should be trying to oppose it with every fibre of his being
Brexit is the biggest right wing project this country has ever seen It has the backing of every right wing pundit, journalist & freemarketeer think tank going
That's incorrect. The left has always been anti-EU. Just look at the vote that took us in. It's the only thing the left and right agree on. The evil centrists are the ones that aren't so keen.
Brexit is the biggest right wing project this country has ever seen
so why do so many on the left support it ?
The EU is neo-liberal, why would the lefties support it?
What about when intelligent people from the left are questioning his approach? Or are we still pretending that anyone questioning the leader and his team are all Tories and Centrists?
apparently there are red tories, yellow tories, orange tories, green tories, anyone who doesn't agree with JC tories. Looks like othering and conspiracy theory rubbish just look at the Canary annoucement on their job cuts
Brexit is the biggest right wing project this country has ever seen It has the backing of every right wing pundit, journalist & freemarketeer think tank going
It has become THE rallying cry of the far right and the sole purpose of the Tories, who have been cowed utterly by Farage
Corbyn should be trying to oppose it with every fibre of his being
revisionist tripe, Corbyn and the labour left have always backed leave, campaigned for it, had manifesto's with it in and stood with it as a central policy. Corbyn hasn't changed
A moderate is someone who isn’t an extremest. Also see centrist.
Incorrect.
There are Centrists who are equally extreme as those on the left/right and won't countenance any opinions outside of their rather narrow neo-Liberal viewpoint. Blairites, for instance, were/are as cult-like as any other group faced with that accusation within politics.
Since Corbyn was initially elected leader of Labour the so-called moderates/centrists have spent more time and energy attacking their own party leadership than they've spent going after the Tories. This was most obvious when Umunna, Leslie, Gapes, Berger etc flounced off to form their own political entity/party, having spent so much time obsessed with bringing down Corbyn that they lost the backing of their CLPs.
You can’t just wish it wasn’t happening, because the implications of it are so enormous,
And that’s exactly what this new remain fundamentalist movement is doing. The solution to brexit is, and always was a deal of some form, whether that is May’s, Corbyn’s or some other deal.
You and others won’t be happy though until Labour offer to revoke A50. Trouble is if they do that they willl commit electoral suicide and the Tories get a free run at a no deal brexit.
The best/only chance to stop brexit is a labour or labour led govt holding a confirmatory referendum on whatever deal they can agree with the E.U. You should take it, because the alternative of hoping for a libdem govt (and you guys accuse others of seeking unicorns!) will result in Johnson doing all the things you fear most.
Whatever. Would you say things are going well?
will result in Johnson doing all the things you fear most.
You mean... exactly whats happening now?
Crashing us out with no deal?
While the labour party sits idly by with its thumb up its arse?
^ I think Binners managed a whole page before reverting to his silly pictures and abuse. That must be some kind of record.
The EU is neo-liberal, why would the lefties support it?
For me it's because I can't see any real prospect of leaving the EU delivering improvements in the things I care about.
Afternoon comrade
Any requests for the next picture?
I was thinking something like this as metaphor for present Corbyn reaction to the Torys clearly gearing up for an imminent election
Afternoon comrade
Any requests for the next picture?
Unfortunately the Binnersbot seems to be incapable of learning. Perhaps there's lead in its crayons.