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mickyfinn - MemberIf you at actual votes and not seats there's 792248 votes between the two main parties across the whole of the UK. That's not really many at all.
now let's imagine where we'd be if the established labour party hadn't spent the last 2 years telling us how rubbish jezza was. and you know, tried getting on with their ****ing job instead of queuing up to resign from the shadow cabinet.
Calm down a little there
There was a certain amount of irony in my post. If that was unclear, then accept my apologies.
now let's imagine where we'd be if the established labour party hadn't spent the last 2 years telling us how rubbish jezza was. and you know, tried getting on with their ****ing job instead of queuing up to resign from the shadow cabinet.
The irony is, maybot would not have called an election in those circumstances.
deadlydarcy - MemberCalm down a little there
There was a certain amount of irony in my post. If that was unclear, then accept my apologies.
Ahh, misread the tone.
I agree that there's a certain irony to the arrangement though.
DUP Brexit leaflet
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Ahh, misread the tone.
No, my bad.
now let's imagine where we'd be if the established labour party hadn't spent the last 2 years telling us how rubbish jezza was.
We'd be sitting watching TM bungle along for another 3 years as she'd never have called an early GE if JC had looked this strong all along.
possibly, an interesting thought.
but let's not give the useless cowardly bastards too much credit...
I found my brain lapsing into an Ulster accent reading that leaflet.
JC performed way better than expected, and won way more seats than expected but I'm a bit staggered that this is regarded as good news for the Labour party.
Any decent Labour leader and front bench would have beaten this Tory administration with a landslide. (Except the election wouldn't even have happened because May wouldn't have dared chance it with a decent opposition.)
So this election proves he can't win even against an open goal but also ensures Labour will still be saddled with him in the next election.
Mind ewe, I can't see that cheering up Torys, it's a embarrassing disaster for them, and hard to forsee when it's going to stop being an embarrassing disaster.
biggest electoral swing for labour from one election to another and still the haterz want to hateAny decent Labour leader and front bench would have beaten this Tory administration with a landslide
Any decent Labour leader and front bench would have beaten this Tory administration with a landslide
biggest electoral swing for labour from one election to another and still the haterz want to hate
And look at how the press have treated him. A co-ordinated campaign of attacks by the Telegraph, Mail, Sun and Express with only the Mirror being pro-Corbyn and the graun being sometimes pro-labour/libdem but anti JC, and then occasionally being pro-tory for the contrarian-ness.
This is an interesting one: It shows you how quickly theinternet can spread 'facts'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-40220032
Who knows. Jezza may well have energised the youth vote. It's just that, as yet, there isn't a shred of evidence that he has.
The position of Home Secretary isn't an honorary title and requires hard work and commitment.
Seems noone told the last incumbent this...
This is an interesting one: It shows you how quickly theinternet can spread 'facts'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-40220032
He should have known 72% turnout of 18-24yos was highly unlikely, but was probably a bit excited.
Who knows. Jezza may well have energised the youth vote. It's just that, as yet, there isn't a shred of evidence that he has.
There's a reasonable amount of evidence, just no data yet.
It seems to me social media outgunned Murdoch and friends.
Now is the time to push that **** and his poisonous publications out of business. Boycotts like the scousers have done with The Sun.
His manipulation needs to become a public joke we all laugh at.
It seems to me social media outgunned Murdoch and friends.
I think the Daily Mail and co may just be preaching to the converted. Hard to know how effective their lies are with undecided voters?
Now is the time to push that **** and his poisonous publications out of business. Boycotts like the scousers have done with The Sun.His manipulation needs to become a public joke we all laugh at.
Are you willing to boycott all Murdoch products?
Sky, broadband / tv, Fox films,FX, News corp, live sports events sponsored by him?
Ive done it since the Reebok / Macron foundations were laid with the exception of stealing via p2p fox films and the odd fx series so he still gets nowt from me
bit of both some of the mud sticks like terrorist sympathiser and all the EU lies - undemocratic, straight bananas etcI think the Daily Mail and co may just be preaching to the converted
Are you willing to boycott all Murdoch products?
Sky, broadband / tv, Fox films,FX, News corp, live sports events sponsored by him?
It's not deliberate on my part but I can't think of a single penny he get's from me.
I once paid for a Charlie small time Isp provider for my mother, not a big internet user so lowish speeds, just so she could take a stab at modern communications and such, and they ended up being bought out by sky broadband.
The phonecall as to why i was cancelling the service was interesting to say the least
also boycotted them since that Sun headline when they showed themselves to be contemptible scum
Me neither.It's not deliberate on my part but I can't think of a single penny he get's from me.
I nearly went to see the latest Star Wars film at the cinema, but didn't in the end.
I did join in the Manchester Sky Ride, so I suppose I may have inadvertently helped to make them look good for a day.
Sky, broadband / tv, Fox films,FX, News corp, live sports events sponsored by him?
Genuine question - why boycott live sports events sponsored by him? The rest I can understand as it avoids lining his pockets, but consuming an event he has paid to advertise at without giving any revenue back is a win surely (albeit a tiny inconsequential one)?
It's not deliberate on my part but I can't think of a single penny he get's from me.
Same here. I can't think of anything in his empire I'm interested in.
That was more of football / sport being funded by us the fans, alongside the Greg Dyke Alan Sugar /Rupert Murdoch triumvirate , I was stood at the laying of the foundations of the then Reebok , and it just hit me, my season ticket is going up to build that thing, and pay over inflated salaries, and it was all to get Sugars receiving equipment beaming Murdoch propaganda in to our homes, and The Sun did the first thrust of the advertising that persuaded us of the merits. Get Sky sports in to our homes and the other channels follow by default including the insidious Sky News, that gets around slander laws by describing itself as an " entertainment show" instead of news.
Pass the tinfoil!
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I don't support any Murdoch publications, I doubt he gas
I don't support any Murdoch publucations, I doubt he gas
I make you right, Jambs
Avoided this thread as I couldn't be bothered arguing up until now.
Biggest labour gains in ages, pity they didn't get closer and at least form a coalition government, but I'm having fun reading the earlier pages, e.g.
IHN - Member
The problem with the left wingers in the Labour party is that they don't seem to realise that the country as whole is not left wing. As has been proved in basically every election ever, the only way to win is to win over the centre, and really centre-right, ground.Corbyn as leader will be as effective at reigning the Tories in as Michael Foot and Neil Kinnock, i.e. not at all.
It's been PROVED in every election ever, so it must be right. LOL.
And again, I'd like to have seen them win an outright majority, but it's hardly the unelectable mess predicted, is it?
@ ulysse - Already do. Never knowingly spent a penny on anything associated with that scumbag and his poisonous web, never will.
Am I still allowed to support Froomedog?
I'm fairly sure he's not had a penny off me, but that's not particularly a moral position of mine, just don't feel the need to pay lots of money for TV.
If you'd have said Chris Froome, I might have allowed an exception, but there's no chance now.aracer - MemberAm I still allowed to support Froomedog?
Harper Collins
National Geographic
I hope Labour go hard about Leveson & serious fraud office.
I make you right, Jambs
Strange times in which we live.
Yup hogtied and interned to Guantanamo. A touch of weatherboarding just for shits and giggles.
Corbyn has been totally silent on Leveson 2, only Tom Watson and Ed Milliband I've heard anything from. As I said before if you want things to change in the press join and donate to Hacked Off
Corbyn has been totally silent on Leveson 2,
I've not heard a peep from May about it either?
Has anyone heard from Cranberry yet?
He's off to try and claim his £3 back
I've not heard a peep from May about it either?
The second part of the Leveson Inquiry into phone hacking was earmarked to examine the culture, practices and ethics of the press.But the Tories have pledged in their election manifesto not to pull the trigger on the probe, arguing that the “comprehensive nature” of the first investigation means it is no longer necessary.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/18/tories-pledge-drop-leveson-part-two-investigation-corrupt-dealings/
Jambys response to this was as vocal as corbyns 😉 . I asked him directly at the time about it as I assumed he would have been deeply disappointed by this [ both of us are in hacked off] but he did not respond. I doubt he will now.
He's off to try and claim his £3 back
Money bloody well spent. 318 vs 262 may feel like a victory, expectations and all that but its a loss
You can spin this any way you want but it's a fact that going from a majority government to a minority one and having to crawl into bed with arcane, homophobic zealots in order to form any kind of government is nothing short of an absolute disaster for the Tory party. What's more, it displays poor judgement in the extreme that will do as much damage to the party as the poor showing in the election. Oh, and don't forget the misguided arrogance of calling the election in the first place.
Corbyn may have lost in terms of numbers, but the Tories have lost a hell of a lot more.
Money bloody well spent. 318 vs 262 may feel like a victory, expectations and all that but its a loss
Still not actually admitting what happened I see. Funny that after months of shouting that Corbyn and his loony left pals are unelectable, will be wiped out, 100-150 majority etc, you're now denying the fact that you were utterly wrong on every front, and now seek solace in the fact that you scraped in with help of a bunch of racist religious fundamentalists. Yes, the labour party didn't win, but I think we all know who lost.
Money bloody well spent.
indeed, brexit thrown into (further) chaos
the Tories and May humiliated, 3 quid for the look on Raabs face after the exit polls when I got back from my night ride and turned on the TV was a bargain imho!
funnily enough cranberry hasnt been on here trumpeting his great success 🙂
Money bloody well spent. 318 vs 262 may feel like a victory, expectations and all that but its a loss
Not even close! May went into this to increase her majority and instead lost it. There's no victory for the Tories and everyone knows it including you.
No one thinks Labour won this election but very few if any really expected it. Instead the objective was to limit the Conservative lead and provide a genuine alternative able to win a significant number of votes. That's why some view the result as a win because it's better than really could have been hoped for.
It is interesting to see how anyone can claim going from a majority to a minority government though your own choices can be anything other than a massive loss.
Overused at this point but spot on.
"Nobody won the election but only one party lost it"
Its a [s]150[/s] [s]100[/s] [s]75[/s] -13 seat victory
exactly as you told us all it would be because May is playing a blinder 😆
I'll put this here rather than in GE thread.
Very interesting to look at Labour wins in England. Tory strategy of taking UKIP voters who had originally been Labour supporters definitely failed wth the UKIP vote either being split fairly evenly with Labour or in some cases Labour taking back the majority (Corbyn's reluctant acceptance of no freedom of movement looks to have been key in that regard). Also the new voter registrations look to have been pivotal in a few key student constituencies where Labour won almost solely based on these new votes. Look at Brighton Kempton for example Labour up significantly but not on a material swing from other parties http://www.bbc.com/news/politics/constituencies/E14000597
@kimbers clearly that's a fair enough point 🙂 wasn't just me was it though - did you see John Snow's intro to C4 news ?
Still its the Tories forming a minority government and we don't have a hung parliament any longer. Seems highly likely we'll have another GE within 2 years, I don't recall minority governments ever lasting much more than 3 and with Brexit negotiations this is even less likely. Labour and Corbyn will be feeling confident but its a while off yet and its hard to see the Tories messing up as badly again strategy wise.
Tory strategy of taking UKIP voters who had originally been Labour supporters definitely failed
maybe theyve just changed their mind on brexit surely thats the most obvious reason for ditching the kippers
😉
this entire election was to get May a strong mandate for Brexit
the electorate has spoken, shes now weaker than ever before
and its hard to see the Tories messing up as badly again strategy wise.
your predictions of Tory electoral capabilities are notoriously over optimistic
Still its the Tories forming a minority government and we don't have a hung parliament any longer. Seems highly likely we'll have another GE within 2 years,
Yes, it's such a shame they had to call the election...
The best thing that has happened is young people came out and voted, the turnout went up and things changed.
What was obvious is how younger people are rejecting the Tory policies which have nearly all been bad for them. Stuff will have to change, she can't go to the next election with the same shit.
Also on brexit FOM etc. something that was pointed out repeatedly is all this crap pandering to the 52% while ignoring the 48% will not win you elections.
Given the positions the DUP have many will find it very hard to work with them and their demand list will be unpalatable to many - when will tories accept they can't win a vote and keep some principles. Election by November, May to stand down.
Potentially another election sooner rather than later might be better for the Tories?
If it goes the full five years and the data confirms the youth vote was key this time there'll be another entire generation of first time voters coming through...
Potentially another election sooner rather than later might be better for the Tories?
The other side is the momentum is with the opposition parties, they have bloodied the nose of the SNP enough that they could get seats back, there are some very very close blue holds that could go the other way with a little more turnout. It could possibly finish off this government if people do think it's possible. Voter apathy seems to be highest when they can't see a possible change. Fresh memories and harder campaigning - Labour don't need to change their manifesto - tories might just have to.
I suspect that the Tories will want to wait until next year before they call another GE, as the boundary changes in 2018 will gift them around 20 more seats. (According to R4 yesterday.)
Labour don't need to change their manifesto - tories might just have to.
the Tories had a manifesto?
yes it was trust me I am not jeremy
Strong and stable
Standign with theressa
Worked a treat
Jamby is correct in that the Tories will not be this bad again - then again he was telling us two days before the election that she had led a faultless campaign - would you like me to quote you again Mr flip flop ? - but the question is can they change the momentum which , if not quite with labour, is certainly against the Tories
When they do go for a GE they will be seen as causing yet another election and will be damaged by being weak and wobbly and in bed with "terrorist extremists"
They will be internally divided and Scotland will possibly swing to labour to help boot out the Tories .At this moment in time labour would welcome a GE more than Tories who are in disarray.
I do not personally see a damaged leader, a potential leadership challenge, a weak govt propped up by nutters helping them much
Tories best hope is that th ePLP go for Jeremy again
I hope that all the Corbyn fans on here are suitably grateful to the likes of Binners (and me, to a limited extent).
Were it not for the constant barrage of abuse from the centre-left, Theresa would never have felt confident enough to launch herself into oblivion. 🙂
Must admit, I'm prepared to eat humble pie at this point, although I'm still staggered how the Tories managed to run a campaign that made JC look statesmanlike in comparison.
Even if he were not to fight the next election, he's done his job - motivated a swathe of younger voters who will be a thorn in the side of the Tories for decades to come.
😆Were it not for the constant barrage of abuse from the centre-left, Theresa would never have felt confident enough to launch herself into oblivion.
All i wanted was an attempt to present the idea to the electorate and see if a left wing agenda could energise the young and those who did not vote to see there was an real alternative and it would make a real difference so it was worth voting
The experiment has not fully won yet but it has certainly made some inroads
Also on brexit FOM etc. something that was pointed out repeatedly is all this crap pandering to the 52% while ignoring the 48% will not win you elections.
How did the Lib Dems do? Labour were stopping freedom of movement and stated so
martinhutch - Member
I hope that all the Corbyn fans on here are suitably grateful to the likes of Binners (and me, to a limited extent).
The constant negativity must have had an effect.
I'm not massively impressed by some of the damascene conversions I've witnessed recently, tbh.
Who knows what would have happened if the party and some of it's so called supporters had got behind him earlier instead of doing the Tories job for them?
How did the Lib Dems do?
Lib Dems improved their number of MPs by the highest % point of any party
Who knows what would have happened if the party and some of it's so called supporters had got behind him earlier instead of doing the Tories job for them?
Ask Jamba. He's good at predictions.
In other news - apparently Diane Abbot 's majority was as big as Maybot's total vote.
nice link Dr J
less well at remembering them than making themHe's good at predictions.
It's so disappointing Jamba can't just put his hand up and admit to being wrong. All the May is playing a blinder posts just look foolish now. If he had anything about him he would show a bit of humility that he got it so badly wrong.
I can happily admit that I was wrong about Corbyn, thought he had no chance but he campaigned really well in the face of increasingly personal attacks by the press as well as May Johnson Rudd etc.
I will never be his biggest fan but I enderestimated the man.
If he had anything about him he would show a bit of humility that he got it so badly wrong.
And if my mother's sister had a sex change ...
Jamba is Jamba.
Pigface - Member - Block User - Quote
It's so disappointing Jamba can't just put his hand up and admit to being wrong. All the May is playing a blinder posts just look foolish now. If he had anything about him he would show a bit of humility that he got it so badly wrong.
Agreed. Sorry Andy, but you did use those precise words re the early election and then, when it was quoted to you yesterday, scrolled on past with no response.
Not that I'm calling for your humiliation- its nothing personal- but your volte-face on this shows that you either didn't really believe it yourself, or you just bend in the wind to agree with whatever the Maybot was doing at that point was the right thing, regardless of what it was.
Can I extend that and say that the whole of your "Hard Brexit=Good" stance might suffer from the same diminishment? Will we expect to see you agree with May soon on a softer Brexit when the DUP are forcing her compromises?
If so, I will do a very heavy ROFL. Hope the knee doesn't get too achey from genuflecting to her.
I will never be his biggest fan but I enderestimated the man.
By extension- you heard it here first- leftish, pre-Blair politics still have a place in our politics- and I am very, very happy about this indeed.
tbh its a result few of us called - myself included - so I am not sure anyone can claim they got it right. However few of us got it as wrong as he did - he even manged to get it wrong about what he had said
One wonders what is the point in engaging with someone when we know he does this though - its not exactly new behaviour and its unlikely to change.
Also, ultra Pro Tories who kept harping on about the IRA thing absolutely must acknowledge that this DUP pact is worse. Otherwise you will never have any credibility.
Obviously an intelligent man.
I initially gave him the benefit of the doubt, offering to meet up for a ride and a chat if he was ever in the area.
However, his refusal to even acknowledge the harm caused by his ideology, let alone engage in debate about it has changed my mind.
I can only go off the evidence he presents on here and that leads me to the conclusion he is a thoroughly unpleasant man.
To extend the pub analogy, I might chat with someone like that when out for a drink, but probably only the once.
Life's too short tbh.
If we're crowing about who got what right can I just stick my hand in the air to say I consistently said that all the loony left hysteria was a load of bollox and that Corbin was not the demon he was portrayed to be by the papers and some on here. Including I might add a certain someone who said labour would have <100 seats right now 🙂
Having said that though, I am also surprised and can't claim to have predicted the result. I thought corbyn's policy on brexit was crazy, and have been proved wrong. I only hope now that we'll get to see what is possible with a united party.
Corbyns manifesto and the positive response to it from many voters is when it turned. Surprisingly? a lot of people do feel society is not fairly governed and that public services are very important and need to be kept in a good state.
A wise government looking to get people to back them would take a lot of those ideas rather than just repeating magic money tree all the time.
I thought corbyn's policy on brexit was crazy,
Really? I think it's the one that would be the best for the UK, other than staying put, of course.
ultra Pro Tories who kept harping on about the IRA thing absolutely must acknowledge that this DUP pact is worse. Otherwise you will never have any credibility.
So you're now trying to indicate a parity between supporting, on an entirely partisan basis, IRA-SF whilst they were *still* engaged in an armed, murderous rebellion against the state, the British nation as a whole, it's Institutions, infrastructure and innocent members of the public, and supporting their aim of a united, socialist Ireland, and telling your supporters that every defeat of the British Government was a victory for all of them
With dealing with a political party, who at best had tenuous links with any murders (certainly not tied to the UDF and UDA the way that SF-PIRA were) many years later, after the multilateral renouncement of violence and an established and steady peace process, a party who have been part of the assembly government for years.
I think you're clutching at straws
There is only one person clutching at straws 😀