Jeremy Corbyn

The cuckoos obviously rely on people believing this stuff. Remarkable

Go on then, why would it cost the exchequer any more that it would a private company looking to make a profit?

And molly/thm , read the rest of what I said about Oz. The wealth came from minerals, yet despite the squandering of much of that by Howard, there was enough for a stimulus package that allowed Oz to avoid recession and the worst of the GFC. It's not like the uk didn't have a huge natural resource off the north east coast, is it.

Zokes, go and have a read of your (now) very own Steve Keen before you ouse any more self-confidence about the outlook for the Aussie economy. Given that the coming story has been played out in many countries before, it smacks of remarkable folly to not prevent the forthcoming problems

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/business-spectator/get-ready-for-a-recession-by-2017/news-story/4f0bba1c54a7c540bda1a9d80d225a76

@daz imo its a mix of youngster voters who have no memories of the 70's and 80's

Younger people are definitely a large proportion of the new members. Does that not ring some alarm bells? See my earlier comments about demographics.

entryists from other parties/organisations

Oh please, you really think that's more than a tiny minority? I'll accept that there may have been lots of £3ers (like myself) who had no previous membership or allegiance to the party, but lots of these then went on to spend £50 on full membership, not to mention the 120,000 since Corbyn was elected leader. The entryist argument just can't explain the numbers given the previous number of members of extreme-left organistations where they're supposed to have come from.

teamhurtmore - Member

Do you have a poster of him too Ernie?

What a truly moronic comment.

did you read the Rafeal Behr article in today's Guardian?

I did. Pretty much a statement of the obvious I thought. Put in the context of the past thousand years where hierarchical power structures and the self-interest of those at the top have been pretty much ever-present, it's inevitable that any political party, organisation or movement fighting against that is going to be at a disadvantage. The past 100 or so years has seen brief breaks from that in the form of leftwing movements inspired by Marx et al, but there's still a huge way to go before the scales tip in the other direction. You could easily argue that winning power, whilst beneficial obviously, is not essential in keeping the pressure moving in a leftwards direction.

That's a no I take it. Not as photogenic as the iron lady and he did cast you boys into the wilderness for some time. Amazed that you quote him really, I would have thought he had been eradicated from the records already. Perhaps someone could renationalise the Ministry of Truth?

@THM: I'm not denying Australia's fiscal luck is likely to finally run out. I'm just giving you some of the reasons as to why we were one of the few nations to avoid the GFC.

Though The Oz as a source is about as reliable as The Fail in the UK. Read with a considerable pinch of salt.

I was aware of that but would avoid drawing parallels between the natural resource wealth of our two home nations!.

No idea on the papers tbh but easier than linking to Keen's website. Joking apart he is an interesting guy not least for his efforts to debunk most of he Economics that is still taught. I would have thought that he would be right u your street tbh.

@ binners

It just mirrors the debate on here

There is the seductive distinction between those who get it and those who don’t: dumb herd and wise shepherds.

No one is covering themself in glory here its a wrestle in a pit of shit as Tories cheer on whilst we debate who is throwing the most shit.

It's all relative. The Bearded Mesiah obviously believes the labour leadership is the endgame. The desired result. No further ambition beyond that. As that would involve compromise and other grown up stuff. Forming the next government clearly isn't really a serious consideration. That would involve compromise and preaching to the unconverted. And we don't do that type of thing.

Great for him. Not so great for everyone who is going to suffer at the hands of the next ten years of unopposed Tory government .

Tragic really. Not for Jeremy obviously. But for those who are thinking that eternal Tory rule is probably going to be a bit shit .

Not to worry though. Jeremy is the leader of the increasingly irrelevent Labour Party! Hurray! That's what we all wanted, right?

Probably all playing out an awful lot better in Islington than Middleton, but hey ho....

Binners i cannot read your posts anymore the bearded messiah and all that guff just makes me despair
Turn it down a few levels will you as I am sure their is something insightful amongst all the name calling memes

What's your alternative binners? Owen Smith? I saw one of his rallies in London Fields.

Amazing sunny day - must have been at least 30 people there to see him speak.

Which I guess explains why Owen Smith said a couple of week ago :

[i][b]"I'd really like to go to some of those Momentum rallies with Jeremy. I've asked him to let me attend and speak to the great masses he's drawing from the Momentum movement. I think that would be really good."[/i][/b]

What's your alternative binners? Owen Smith?

There is no choice, the alternative is Owen Smith - it's him or Corbyn, it is as simple as that.

The plotters spent weeks deciding who they were going to get behind and Owen Smith easily won.

If you want Corbyn replaced then it has to be Owen Smith, a man who claims to be just as radical and left-wing as Corbyn but with greater voter appeal - I have no idea why.

I was aware of that but would avoid drawing parallels between the natural resource wealth of our two home nations!

Plenty draw parallels between how Australia handled the mining boom and how Norway has handled its oil reserves. I'm not so sure why the UK would be much different to Norway in terms of the resources it once had, just very different in how it managed them financially.

There is no choice, the alternative is Owen Smith - it's him or Corbyn, it is as simple as that.

As bad as that, more like.

If you want Corbyn replaced then it has to be Owen Smith, a man who claims to be just as radical and left-wing as Corbyn but with greater voter appeal - I have no idea why.

You are not alone. Incredible that a party like Labour cannot find a decent leader. Still some of the recent Tory choices were quite breathtaking too. But at least they dismissed them pretty quickly and got on with parking the bus in the middle ground where most of the votes live. Odd that, what are they thinking?

Most of the voters dont live in the middle ground -if they did the LIB dems would be getting majorities now wouldn't they and not be a a {distant] third party. Did you mean the voters who currently decide elections live there? ie "floating voters"

I'm not so sure why the UK would be much different to Norway in terms of the resources it once had

Well a population of 5.2M vs 65M makes rather a big difference and they have more oil. Despite their wealth Norway's unemployment rate is now 4.1% vs 5.4% of the UK. The UK has much more mixed economy, Norway is heavily reliant on oil with all the pros and cons that brings.

JY - due to our electoral system the government is ultimately decided by a small number of swing voters in a small number of key marginal seats. These people tend to be very middle of the road. Remember Mondeo Man and his like? The one who delivered 3 consecutive victories for the Labour party under..... *spits*... him?

This is who anyone who aspires to be PM has to win over. Cameron understood this. When he described himself as the Heir to Blair, this is what he meant. Reining in the wilder, more right wing, hang 'em and flog 'em elements of the party, who scare centrist voters off

You can rail against it all you like (though not enough to advocate PR, I note), but it is what it is. So essentially ignoring these people in favour of noisier fellow travelers, who wave placards, and nod approvingly at your words is an ultimately futile exercise.

The PLP knows this. Hence the mutiny (or 'coup' for the conspiracy theorists)

PR referendum aswell! Dave bloody loved them!

Reining in the wilder more right wing elements of the party who scare centrist voters

That worked well, didn't it? *cough* BREXIT *cough*

The PLP knows this. Hence the mutiny

Well, appealing to the middle ground did Brown and Millibean a lot of good, didn't it? Worked well for Kinnock a few years ago as well, I recall...

Well, appealing to the middle ground did Brown and Millibean a lot of good, didn't it?

Someone else did it better. The fact that both results were so close illustrates the point. Recent elections, and ones to come will be won on a very narrow centre. Certainly not in the wider areas, left or right. Due to the whole 'key marginals' thing. My own (key marginal) constituency went Tory by 120 votes.

Given Dave won a majority of 12, and no majority before (even against Brown), what would your target be for a labour paty under Corbyn? What do you think would be a realistic majority that he is capable of achieving?

Thats a question for all the Corbynites. At the general election, under his 'leadership' what would you actually predict as an election result? A majority? And of how much?

Go on then, why would it cost the exchequer any more that it would a private company looking to make a profit?

@zokes read my post. Corbyn wants lower fares, more investment, better terms and conditions for workers (even a return to govt guaranteed defined benefit penions?). All of this will cost a lot of money (£100's millions to £ billions), far more than the £50m profit Virgin Trains makes.

Branson IMO does not run Virgin Trains for profit (he's worth 2.5bn so cares not about 25-50m which may or may not come from a very risky business. It's also a JV with Stagecoach). What Virgin trains does is provide him with a giant advertising billboard and particularly as an airline operator some "green credentials". Remember when he bid for the National Lottery it was as a non-profit organisation. Its about profile and brand exposure. He makes his money elsewhere.

Well, appealing to the middle ground did Brown and Millibean a lot of good, didn't it?

Brown lost due to his responce to the financial crises, ie not reigning in spending and seeing the deficit explode and the way he handled the bailouts. Plus the "bigot" remark ignoring Labour voters real concerns about the impact of immigration. He also had no charisma.

Milliband lost as he looked desperately weak in fromt of Sturgeon and Labour had not regained any financial credibility in its 5 years in opposition. He was not particularly middle ground either.

That Tombstone will be needed for Corbyn and Labour so I hope Milliband kept ti

Thats a question for all the Corbynites. At the general election, under his 'leadership' what would you actually predict as an election result? A majority? And of how much?

I think you're probably right in that they don't really care. That's not necessarily a bad thing though. All I hear from anti-Corbyn people is stuff like you've written above, about majorities, swing voters, perpetual tory rule etc. Nothing about actually building a fairer and more equal society. It's all just about winning, and it's taken as read that a labour govt in power will by default fight for the fairer and more equal society that labour members and voters want. Yet the evidence shows that labour govts rarely do that. In many respects I think those on the left are actually far less tribal than those in the centre. It's not just about winning for them, it's about changing things, and that's the real schism in the labour party, not this Corbyn/PLP/Blairite stuff.

Zokes, we did share of votes 20-30 pages ago. It's not rocket science

http://www.ukpolitical.info/ConvLab.htm

The second graph. Pretty conclusive.

But leave aside sectarian Scotland and the collapse of the LDs, what were you left with as reasons for Labour failing to deliver what they expected in the last election? Choice of leader and perception of economic competence, or should we say incompetence. The public believed the "Labour can't be trusted on the economy" tag line

How does this current farce address either of those problems?

How does this current farce address either of those problems?

It makes Milliband look like an exceptionally gifted candidate in comparison

...and May

The law of unintented (obvious in this case) consequences!

Thats a question for all the Corbynites. At the general election, under his 'leadership' what would you actually predict as an election result? A majority? And of how much?

I think you're probably right in that they don't really care. That's not necessarily a bad thing though.

A 'democracy' where one party is handed permanent control by an 'opposition' that absolves itself of the duty to oppose politically isn't necessarily a bad thing?

Obviously you lot on the left are far shrewder and cannier than me, so could you just talk me through the concept of this, because to be honest I'm struggling a bit with it....

A 'democracy' where one party is handed permanent control by an 'opposition' that absolves itself of the duty to oppose politically isn't necessarily a bad thing?

My point was that, and I admit it's unlikely given those at the forefront of it, this movement offers the opportunity to shift the goalposts in a way that has not been possible since the post-war years. It may take a long time, perhaps several election cycles, but if the end result is a more democratic system, where the interests of normal people are represented rather than just the rich and powerful, then it's worth a go.

Obviously you lot on the left are far shrewder and cannier than me

It's pretty simple. It's basically a fight between pragmatism and ideology. The pragmatists had their shot, and on the whole they squandered the opportunity. You can argue why that happened, but the end result was the continuing neo-liberal orthodoxy. Many people, and not just on the left, now realise that neo-liberalism offers them nothing, and they want real changes, not frilling round the edges trying to blunt it's sharpest weapons.

You think that a couple of decades of the Tories being allowed to do what they like, totally unopposed, will ultimately be beneficial to the people the labour party are meant to represent?

Which bit specifically? When they reintroduce workhouses? Or when they legalise peasant hunting?

binners you keep asking questions - you never answered the one about the alternative. Are you an Owen Smith supporter? Do you believe he has a significantly more credible chance of wining a general election than Corbyn?

You seem to hate Blair but want another Blair to lead the party. 😕

Are you an Owen Smith supporter? Do you believe he has a significantly more credible chance of wining a general election than Corbyn?

Does anyone really think that Owen is anything but a fall guy to take the heat until David M can get reelected to Parliament? (the candidate they would have won the last election with if the loonies in the unions hadn't elbowed his brother into place)

Do you believe he has a significantly more credible chance of wining a general election than Corbyn?

I'd say pretty much anyone has more chance of winning a general election than Jeremy Corbyn. Not least because as we've seen shown by the absolutely bonkers attitudes of his supporters, winning a general election doesn't seem to be a particular concern of his. Not a priority. Not for a while at least.

Call me old fashioned, but I'd like the leader of a political party, particularly the one I'm a member of, to have more than a passing interest in not handing a permanent electoral hegemony to the Tories

Maybe that's just me though?

David M ain't the answer to Labours problems. TBH the political landscape will be so changed by the time Labour even get close to power, it's irrelevant whether Owen is any good, as he'll be caretaker anyway. Labour have to be looking to 2025, unless something weird happens between now and then.

Do you believe he has a significantly more credible chance of wining a general election than Corbyn?

Is he competent, able to motivate a shadow cabinet and not accidentally sack them at random or inspire them to all quit? Can he avoid publicity disasters like traingate? Then he can certainly be in with a shout.

...agree with much of what's above. The best we can hope for from this grim pass, and the best Smith could do, is be a focus to hold the party together rather than doing a 'son of SDP'. If we bugger off then that it really is unopposed Tories forever plus a few fun demos to go on.

So the plan is keep putting people up against Corb until one wins, or someone competent comes along from his wing of the party to replace him, it was Corbyn who proposed that Labour should hold annual leadership elections, after all.

grum - Member

Do you believe he has a significantly more credible chance of wining a general election than Corbyn?

I think you are pissing in the wind if you are attempting to get a sensible comment from binners.

binners - Member

Rolf Harris would have more chance of winning a general election than Corbyn.

Posted 1 month ago

You think that a couple of decades of the Tories being allowed to do what they like, totally unopposed, will ultimately be beneficial to the people the labour party are meant to represent?

Of course not, but then I never thought I'd see a labour government/shadow cabinet supporting tuition fees, benefits cuts, privatisation and outsourcing of the NHS, workfare, deregulation of the financial industry, tax loopholes for billionaires, a two-tier education system etc. (and I didn't even mention the war!)

Here's a question, since Corbyn became leader, do you think the tories have moved more to the right or the left?

BTW, just to be clear, I'm not a Corbyn supporter (this time) 😉

Have we got to the stage where people are trawling back through old posts to score points yet?

Morning Comrade!

[img] [/img]

I think Ernie's gone mad Flashy. He's been trawling my posts for the drivel I wrote a year ago to quote back at me. I don't know if he went mad before, or the madness is a direct result of this. Its a chicken and egg situation. I wouldn't wish that on anyone! 😀

CaptainFlashheart - Member

Have we got to the stage where people are trawling back through old posts to score points?

Well it's something which you have been doing for quite a while Flashheart. Would you like me to trawl back and find a few examples ?

ctk - Member
PR referendum aswell! Dave bloody loved them!

POSTED 1 HOUR AGO #

No he didnt. He gave us an AV referendum which nobody asked for knowing full well he could win it (rather than PR in which victory was less assured).

On trains - yes renationalising is going to cripple us. Look at the abject failure that was East Coast and how it twice had to be bailed out by private operators. I got that the right way round didn't I?

And Jamba, Branson didnt't take the ECML for profit, of course. You crack me up. I suppose the small matter of having a monopoly on long distance rail isnt going to earn him anything. You are aware that Virgin is only a brand and the companies are all completely different entities with differing degrees of ownership right?

THM - did you honestly just call Scotland sectarian? Truly awful choice of owrds, if they were deliberate then congrats, I think you just got ****er of the week.

binners - Member

I think Ernie's gone mad Flashy. He's been trawling my posts for the drivel I wrote a year ago to quote back at me.

Well as you can see I don't need go back that far to find drivel which you wrote, unsurprisingly. The example above was a month ago, although I'm sure I could find drivel which you wrote yesterday.

Me reminding you what you wrote is madness, whilst you describing your own posts as drivel is obviously completely sane ! 🙂

Here's a question, since Corbyn became leader, do you think the tories have moved more to the right or the left?

Neither really. Its that centre ground thing. The one that wins elections. Even though nobody actually knows what our new PM is going to do. I suspect its just more of the same really. Meet the new boss.... same as the old boss...

The fact of the matter is though, she can do what she likes. Its not like there's an opposition worthy of the name to frustrate her. Too busy pulling daft stunts in train corridors

Neither really. Its that centre ground thing. The one that wins elections.

Well I'd argue that they've moved to the left under May. I'm sure we can agree though that they haven't moved to the right? The centre ground is a very narrow, constrained place. If as you say a party only has a chance of winning power by occupying this, then surely it follows that there's never going to be much difference between them.

The fact of the matter is though, she can do what she likes.

No she can't. She's still got to occupy that hallowed centre ground you talk about. If she leaves it, someone else will step in.

binners - Member

"Here's a question, since Corbyn became leader, do you think the tories have moved more to the right or the left?"

Neither really. Its that centre ground thing. The one that wins elections. Even though nobody actually knows what our new PM is going to do.

And there you go again completely contradicting yourself. A while ago according to you the Tories were going to "take a torch to workers rights", just to remind you :

binners - Member

Because they're awful middle class lefties, who will stand by and moan about equal rights for one-armed, free range, organic hermaphrodite marriage, while the Tory party take a torch to workers rights
They are the very worst human beings on the planet

Now "nobody actually knows" what the Tories will do. Although you tell us that the Tories occupy the "centre ground", which according to you is where the Labour Party should be - despite telling us that you are not opposed Corbyn's policies (just to add to your contradictions).

So what exactly is your problem binners, apart from hating everything? You think the country should be led by a party of the centre ground. According to you the Tories now occupy the centre ground and Labour doesn't. Surely it isn't difficult for you to decide who to vote for.

Obviously you hate the Tories but then you are always going to hate whoever you vote for.

Well I'd argue that they've moved to the left under May.

Any evidence of that? She's not done owt yet.

Her problem is that she has a tiny majority. An the more right wing lunatic fringe of here party are feeling massively enboldened by their 'victory' in the referendum, and the fact they've seen off a leader they always regarded as a namby-pamby liberal.

They've shown themselves to be rebellious in the past, and given how dependent she is on them with such a slim majority, I can only see things gong in one direction. And it aint left.

The perfect opportunity for a more centrist opposition to take advantage of this.

Oh... bugger.....

She's not done owt yet.

Agreed - she's certainly made some extremely 'tanks on the lawn' statements indicating nomination of the centre ground, but I agree done nothing yet.

For what it's worth, If I were her I would drop the bedroom tax, more hassle than it's worth for the value, and drop the planned ESA WRAG cut, same reason. Would change press coverage overnight

And there you go again completely contradicting yourself. A while ago according to you the Tories were going to "take a torch to workers rights

when you look at who they've put in charge of negotiating Brexit (I hate that word) - Liam Fox, David Davis - you think that getting rid of the EU workers protections isn't right at the very top of their 'to do' list? What do you think this 'red tape' they so fervently wanted to get rid of consists of exactly?

That's why right now, more than ever, we need a proper, effective labour party, not a sixth form protest group

binners - Member

you think that getting rid of the EU workers protections isn't right at the very top of their 'to do' list?

Well make your mind up ffs. 37 minutes ago you said [i]"nobody actually knows what our new PM is going to do"[/i] now you are asking what I think is [i]"at the very top of their 'to do' list"[/i]

You understand how politics works, right comrade? Surely even a Marxist understands the basic functionality of a parliamentary system?

Maybe not....

She has a majority of 12. What she wants to do is one thing. What her party will allow her to do/demand that she does is another thing entirely. Ask John Major. And the same 'Bastards' that made his life a misery are feeling rather full of themselves right now, and know the power they have

They're also very right wing.

You see this is what the labour party should be worried about right now. Not sitting in train corridors, and chanting kumbyaaaa in the common room

Any evidence of that? She's not done owt yet.

None at all. Just first impression based on her statements and cabinet appointments. Of course it could be empty rhetoric, after all empty rhetoric and soundbites are the modus operandi of the centre ground. As for the tory right, they've been given control of their cause-celebre, I doubt they'll be putting their heads above the parapet for quite some time. Why would they?

I'm much less fearful of what May and Hammond might do than I was with Cameron and Osborne. And besides, they're going to be so occupied with the brexit shambles that I doubt they'll have much time for anything else.

binners - Member

You understand how politics works, right comrade?

I don't understand how your head works.

You claim nobody actually knows what the Tories will do and then half an hour later claim that it's obvious what is at the top of their 'to do list'.

You can't seem to make your mind up about anything. Even from one hour to the next, never mind one year to the next.

they're going to be so occupied with the brexit shambles that I doubt they'll have much time for anything else.

The 'Brexit Shambles' offers the right wing of the Tory party an opportunity they've dreamed of for decades. A 'Year Zero' scenario where they get to scrap all EU workers protections, social security provision, environmental controls, and all manner of other stuff, and start with a clean sheet of paper to re-write the lot.

Think that's going to end well for your average bloke on the street?

Anyone heard anything from the labour party regarding any of this?

No... me neither....

Theresa May may not want to do this. Who knows? But the fact that she's appointed who she has to oversee negotiations doesn't bode well. Seems she's well aware she can easily be held hostage by the right wng loons on her backbenches so she's letting them have what they always wanted. The above....

Comrade - like most Corbynites/Momentum loons/raving Marxist/Trots - you seem considerably more intent on pouring scorn on people like me, who are nominally on the same side as you, than on anything the Tories are doing, or are going to do.

How do you see Theresa's agenda panning out then? What do you think the outcome of Brexit negotiations will be? Think [url= https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/10213/liam_fox/north_somerset ]Liam Fox[/url] has your best interests at heart? Do you even care?

Feel free to enlighten us all comrade....

Rolf Harris would have more chance of winning a general election than Corbyn.

Sadly, this was a sensible statement. That is exactly the point many of us are trying to make Ernie.

Junky if Corbyn cannot stand up to the debate (or coup if you like) within his party then he has zero chance of doing so against the onslaught that will come during a General Election. So far he has shown quite clearly what we've been saying, he has too little ability and far too many skeletons in his closet.

IMO there will not be an SDP style breakaway, nor indeed a radical left breakaway as we already have the SWP. Both sides are fighting for control of the Labour Party as that's the organisation with the rescources to fight a General Election. Momentum/SWP/AWP none have the rescources or organisation to fight a General Election so they are trying to take over the Labour Party. Like I said.

Cuckoo.Cuckoo.

binners - Member

you seem considerably more [b]intent on pouring scorn[/b] on people like me

[u]YOU[/u] are accusing people of pouring scorn ?!?!?.........and after calling me a "raving Marxist/Trot" in the same sentence !!!!!

The beauty of it all is that I have no doubt that you are blissfully unaware of your own hypocrisy and contradictions 😆

The 'Brexit Shambles' offers the right wing of the Tory party an opportunity they've dreamed of for decades.

Prove that they were talking bllx on Europe?

May has placed the Tories firmly in the middle ground (surprising some), given the Brexit BSers enough rope to hang themselves on and is no doubt enjoying the Labour panto like the rest of us.

She probably cant believe her luck.

Binns and Ernie - careful, you are sounding like a Labour Party meeting.

How would you know what a Labour Party meeting sounds like ?

No comment to make on the issues raised then Comrade? No opinions on that?

Its almost like... a protest group. A totally ineffectual self-absorbed protest group....

[img] [/img]

jambalaya - Member

"Rolf Harris would have more chance of winning a general election than Corbyn".

Sadly, this was a sensible statement.

Despite making the comment himself binners today described it as "drivel".

But you think it's "sensible"......righty-O.

I feel as if I've just walked into a a comedy script.

I feel as if I've just walked into a a comedy script.

we all have ....and plenty to come....

Ok crap as an opposition but bloody entertaining otherwise. Whats the expression? You couldn't make it up.

A bargain for only £25

...on which note, has the conference been done yet?

Some on NEC forced and passed a surprise vote - when a large number of NEC members had left and that Iain McNicol had tried and failed to get ruled out of order - to boycott G4S because of its dealings with Israel.

GMB’s gen sec Tim Roache said his union would picket the Lab conference if Showsec won the contract, forcing Labour MPs and members either to cross a picket line or not attend: a major Labour-affiliated union picketing the labour party conference.

McCluskey says the whole thing would then be cancelled (revenge on McNichol for stopping Jeremy's mates from voting for him?): “It is the responsibility of the general secretary of the Labour party, Iain McNicol, to implement decisions or to deal with any problems that may arise,” “I am astonished that we are only four to five weeks to conference and that he has not done so.”

Satire is dead.

If the conference does get cancelled because Labour can't organise an argument in a seaside town then at least there'll be plenty of free seats on the train to Blackpool and no one will need to make an arse of themselves on the floor.

[img] [/img]

[i]Comrade - like most Corbynites/Momentum loons/raving Marxist/Trots - you seem considerably more intent on pouring scorn on people like me, who are nominally on the same side as you, than on anything the Tories are doing, or are going to do.[/i]

@binners - you write that but at the same time seem to prefer this in-party squabbling than using your time by being critical of the opposition.

For example. A couple of weeks ago I started the Theresa May thread for the sole purpose of hoping to provide a platform for people to be critical/debate the Tories and their policies. Didn't last though. People seems more focused on in-party squabbling than attacking the opposition.

Nifan and co must be giggling hard because they keep stoking this thread and you react to it. You can hardly call Corbyn a weak opposition if you cannot demonstrate a strong one yourself...

Edit: I should note this is directed at all of us in oppostion to the Tories

(random stat) email from my union today:

Over 20,000 members participated in a consultation to inform their nomination of Labour leader. The consultation saw 58.1% of members who voted indicating that the Committee should nominate Jeremy Corbyn and 41.9% for Owen Smith.

fairly solidly pro-Jez. Wonder how much there was a degree of self-selection though...?

For example. A couple of weeks ago I started the Theresa May thread for the sole purpose of hoping to provide a platform for people to be critical/debate the Tories and their policies.

We can resurrect that when she's been in the job for a bit. Her policies/priorities are quite simple, implement the manifesto and get Brexit done. The reality is the Labour leadership election is much more interesting not least as its summer recess.

@john yes I saw all of this re: the security. Really sticking it to Israel cancelling your own conference eh ?

@binners - you write that but at the same time seem to prefer this in-party squabbling than using your time by being critical of the opposition.

For example. A couple of weeks ago I started the Theresa May thread for the sole purpose of hoping to provide a platform for people to be critical/debate the Tories and their policies. Didn't last though. People seems more focused on in-party squabbling than attacking the opposition

Much as we might want it to (or not), posting on STW is never going to offer effective opposition to the government. Also I might break my keyboard.

I've posted a bit on this thread because there is actually a mix of pro and anti Corbyn views, which might be reflected in people who have a quick look at the thread, some of whom might have a vote (I could be wrong about this, but hey...)

Most other places I know tend to be entirely pro or entirely anti Corbyn, so there's not much point joining 'discussion'.

@jambayla....great demonstration of the point I'm trying to make....cheers. 😀

so there's not much point joining 'discussion'.

You'll do well to weed out any discussion from the noise on this thread 🙂

I hadn't really thought about the party conference. I'd imagine its going to dissolve into a level of farce that Amando Illucianelli could never possibly have scripted in the most acid-crazed version of the Thick of It.

It will literally be like watching a car crash. Involving an Austin Allegro. A brown one.

Presuming its not canceled of course

For example. A couple of weeks ago I started the Theresa May thread for the sole purpose of hoping to provide a platform for people to be critical/debate the Tories and their policies. Didn't last though.

Dont be hard on yourself, EVB, the raw material is nowhere near as funny

We did get to learn about the importance of the H tough, so you efforts were worthwhile

48 posts.....

I hadn't really thought about the party conference

i suppose that
when you do you will
post
a
monty python picture
just
a prediction

For all those in despair

The Labour Party is looking to recruit a Head of Policy and Research to the Deputy Leader of the Labour Party. The post holder will be responsible for leading the development and implementation of research and policy development within the deputy leader’s brief, and to manage the Deputy Leader’s research and policy team.

The successful candidate will have experience of delivering high quality political research, excellent organisational skills to ensure quick responses to requests, the ability to work proactively with a variety of stakeholders and excellent attention to detail.

Not sure who the boss might be, but a chance to do more than type on the internet. Off you "trot" (sorry but IGMC)

The second para looks optional as poor attention to detail hasnt stopped others

Well I

THuNk

thIS

bIT

IS

proberberly

releVANT....

Anyway... wheres [s]fred[/s] Clodhopper today? Having lunch with the rest of the cast of Made in Chelsea?

I thought "theauthorities" = Fred.
Clod was clearly someone else before as well.

@johnx2...how will the Tories be defeated if there is no anti-Tory narrative?

Let's say language creates reality. There is much talk of swing voters being important to campaign success. Any swing voters on here will read lots of anti Labour narrative and nothing anti Tory. What reality is then created regarding their impression of Conservative versus Labour?

This is why I suggest someone like @Binners, whilst he may mean, well he's playing straight into Tory hands and fueling their success...