Jeremy Corbyn

"I dont think you can bully someone by simply pointing out they are factually incorrect"

Do you that instead of the Ad homs, then. Posting jpegs aimed personally at Earnie and the tirades of personal stuff about J debunk nothing.

"Why? Is the Internet going to burst out of your screen and eat you or something?"

Notice how I said 'in the [i]real[/i] world'. Spreading lies, misinformation and distorted facts can, and is, dangerous. It can and has led to genocide and war.

"How about taking ownership of your own emotions?"

What is that even supposed to mean? 😕

as noted challenging him is futile as he does not care that his facts are untrue hence the piss taking - you think folk did not try and they went straight to ad hom? You cannot debunk someone who uses facts that are wrong and does not care- its like trying to debunk David Icke

Anyway enough navel gazing lets get back to the thread

What is that even supposed to mean?

Ninfan means almost nothing he writes he just wants a reaction

IMHO shame as he is often well informed, well researched and he is a bright chap to boot

It can and has led to genocide and war.

So if people stop calling Jamba names, millions will die?

What is that even supposed to mean?

That feeling emotions of fear or hatred over something that someone says on an Internet forum is more reflective on you as a person than it is of them.

sense and comprehension are clearly secondary considerations when goading for a reaction 😉

I have to confess to actually liking ninfan despite generally refusing to engage on here with him

No you don't.

as noted challenging him is futile as he does not care that his facts are untrue hence the piss taking - you think folk did not try and they went straight to ad hom? You cannot debunk someone who uses facts that are wrong and does not care- its like trying to debunk David Icke

Which doesn't even attempt to justify the ad homs aimed at Earnie in this thread which was the original point I made.

People bully either because they're spiteful inadequates or because they're can't defeat the actual argument or usually both. End of.

They always use the same handful of excuses for it as you are doing now. (Google the excuses of bullies.)

There's no 'bullying' on this thread. Get a grip ffs. 🙄

[i]The Labour leader’s team has a bunker mentality, and their genius has been to extend that bunker to accommodate tens of thousands of their followers. Within that bubble, every failure becomes a victory.[/i]

The right wing press appear to be at it again 😆

http://www.newstatesman.com/2016/07/jeremy-corbyn-and-paranoid-style

[quote=ninfan ]No you don't.

See i told you he was bright and just wanted a reaction

Very funny though 😆

Anyway enough navel gazing lets get back to the thread

I think I prefer the naval gazing! 🙄

People bully either because they're spiteful inadequates or because they're can't defeat the actual argument or usually both. End of

They always use the same handful of excuses for it as you are doing now. (Google the excuses of bullies.)

You are free to disagree with the reasons stated and ignore them, you are free to get rude and personal whilst explaining only bullying inadequates do it and i am free to take the piss and laugh at the irony,

The reason he gets the piss taken out of him is for the reasons stated

No one is bullied on here as the mods dont allow it and I dont think the forum would in general but its pretty intolerant of those who dont use facts and just make stuff up that is wrong.

Report posts and get it dealt with if you see bullying. Its not acceptable anymore than calling folk bullies is a way to negate their arguments.

He ignores facts so folk take the piss.
You can blame who you like for this but its not bullying.
End of sidebar for me as i think discussing it like this may be a little unfair on him.

This .....

Corbyn need make no such compromise, which is his whole appeal. Those who expect him to step down after a general election defeat, or to compromise with the rest of the party to achieve greater success, have completely failed to understand what they’re dealing with. For Corbyn and his followers there is no compromise, only purity, and a Red Labour party with 50 MPs is better than a centrist party with 400. That is the reality of the movement that Labour and the left are facing, and it is catastrophic.

that is just bobbins
from the article

Corbyn’s time as Labour leader has been marked by an extraordinary surge of paranoia and conspiracy theory on the left.

has led some to compare Corbynism to a cult or a religious movement.

Lots of folk want to do this cult of personality shite. I have yet to hear it from a corbyn supporter just from those who oppose him and want to maintain the slurs and allusions to "stalinism" hard left BS

There is plenty to criticise without making things up

New interview. Owen Jones.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2016/jul/29/jeremy-corbyn-im-very-optimistic-video-interview

edit: 45min(!) version here

"you defeated the argument"

I'd love to take credit, but your argument was defeated many thousands of years before either of us were born.

TMH aggravating our neighbours ! They had a chance to offer Cameron sufficient concessions to win the Referendum and they declined with a "gallic shrug". The euro is their problem not ours. The very public self criticism of the IMF is devastating. I cannot see any way they will lend another cent, nor should they until there are some very fundamental changes (eg two or three level eurozone, full banking union by level, joint and several liability by level ? Perhaps even a retrun to individual currencies althoigh I imagine France, Germany, Belgium, Lux and Holland will sort out a eueo level 1 zone)

That feeling emotions of fear or hatred over something that someone says on an Internet forum is more reflective on you as a person than it is of them.

Ninfan, thanks but you are wasting your time. Leopards and spots. It amuses the hell out of me anyway about how much humble pie they must be choking on, thread after thread, issue after issue. I did say I thought Brexit Referendum would be their chance to find me on the losing side of an argument but even that has worked out my way.

Abuse and trolling from the left which we see here is reflective of wider society. We see the same from Momentum. They are unable to keep themselves in check and the agressive behaviour just keeps flowing. The bullying which exists on STW is entirely consistent to that which Labour MPs are currently suffering.

You still confident he is not just a troll after that reply 😉

Dont forget to say you never do the personal Jamby you missed that out

PS when ninfan has your back things are really truly desperate- no one would cite him though it is very very funny- even he chortled at you - the left version was when TJ agreed with you

definitely did not leak to the press

Because JC nor any of his supporters, nor anyone working in his office have ever leaked anything negative about PLP members ever, have they......

Dont forget to say you never do the personal Jamby you missed that out

Just say rude things about Binners, apparently that's OK

"New interview. Owen Jones.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2016/jul/29/jeremy-corbyn-im-very-optimistic-video-intervie w"

Not detailed enough on policy.

I can't help but think that he offered a newspaper an article to be printed without editing, it would get published.

I really don't see why new member participation in campaigning comes up. None of them are going to want to campaign for an MP who's probably voted no confidence in JC. Its a total red herring.

@jambayla - people in glass house and all that....

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/27-times-tory-party-racism-7904018

Just googled 'a history of Tory party racism' and found the above...maybe the Mirror but even so...

So using your logic does that mean you believe Tories are racist..

. The euro is their problem not ours.

A different message to the one you were giving pre-referendum, but yes I agree.

Europe's problem are centred on the absurd idea of a common currency. As a ploy for Germanic hegemony - perfect - for everyone else a guaranteed disaster.

Agree with leftie bullying comments here and in real life - t'was ever thus - the idea that Corbyn/momentum represents a new gentler type of politics is comical. Of course, watching how the mantle gets passed on t'web is equally amusing, as it's the poor attempt to match the standards (sic) set previously.

I wanted to ensure it's their problem, we are not off the hook yet

@eden Racism sadly exists everywhere, I never said the Tories where immune and there has been some appaling anti-semitism from the Lib Dems too. There is a scale issue with those further left and Corbyn is a magnate for them.

We were never on it

(Of course apart from our ongoing potential exposure via IMF)

I dunno if I can take this!

How're lefties bullies?

The leftie ethos is about taking down the bullying, dinner money stealing ways (actions rather than words) of the privileged tories and holding the culprits accountable.. it's about equality and unity

this whole bullying bolleaux is laughable..

I've a thuggish nature, and if I met a staunch, unapologetic, outspoken tory I could imagine losing my temper.. I wouldn't bully you, but I would certainly be awash with passion and anger and frustration, and my delivery would be terse and vigorous..

Not just because I disagree with you, but because you and your team are unashamedly stealing from me, from my family and from my community.. I'm sure that if you met someone who had stolen your bike yet remained pompous about it then you too might respond less than politely

How're lefties bullies?

The leftie ethos is about taking down the bullying, dinner money stealing ways (actions rather than words) of the privileged tories and holding the culprits accountable.. it's about equality and unity

I reckon the family of David Wilkie might disagree

you lot moaning about bullying is worse than Jimmy Saville complaining about child abuse

So, you're accepting it is bullying now?

"New interview. Owen Jones."

Listened to the 45min version.

There was a fair bit of policy in it. Well, a long list of stuff he's going to spend £££s on. It was described as policy, but I assume it's not Labour policy yet. Aspirations perhaps.

Either way, I wish he'd put it all on his website, instead of discussing it on YouTube. 20 Bullet points is far more effective.

you're accepting it is bullying now?

in light of what?
That crass link you made between a victim of a vicious historical class war battleground and people getting 'a bit het up' over an internet debate?

grow up you pompous oaf

[quote=yunki ]
I've a thuggish nature

We gathered that.

a victim of a vicious historical class war

That's right, because dropping concrete fence posts on cars is all part of the non-bullying, peaceful, equality based politics that lefties like yourself believe in.

again..

linking an online spat with an historical pitched battle where people were fighting tooth and claw for their community's survival is a little snide

"historical pitched battle"

He was a taxi driver on a public road.

He was on the side of the aggressor in a sinister and brutal class war..
David Wilkie's killers behaved in a sinister and brutal manner in a time of sinister brutality

Anyway..
My argument has nothing to do with the hellish events of 30 years ago

This is about the absurdity right now of tory supporters claiming that the left are 'bullying' them with a few home truths

"he was on the side of the aggressor in a brutal class war"

He was driving *miners*.

And their behaviour was shocking and brutal.. Just as they were experiencing an era of shocking brutality

What does that have to do with the name calling that we're talking about now? Unless you want to bring up food banks, benefit reform deaths, homelessness?

[quote=yunki ]
This is about the absurdity right now of tory supporters claiming that the left are 'bullying' them with a few home truths

Lefties bullying tories ?

Na, lefties* are bullying themselves**.

* corbynites
** red tories.

Maybe you need to see it through the lens of the left justifying acts of violence against people with a different opinion from them

You know, like insinuating that dropping a concrete post on someone's car and killing them was justified because they were "on the side of the aggressor" in an industrial disputes?

You might want to think about that, but then, you've already admitted to having a 'thuggish nature' so it's clear that you feel violence is justified in order to achieve political aims...

meh

you're a tit.. what can I do about that?

I doubt I would try to beat some sense into you, any more than I would drop concrete onto your car..

ooh look... that guy said a mean thing, so I'm going to attempt to use that as justification to keep squeezing the poor
where do you view the world from exactly?
you're a tit.. what can I do about that?

Life admittedly, would be more pleasant if people with your views climbed back into their little box of shame and let society progress in a more principled fashion

"And their behaviour was shocking and brutal.."

Explain.

See, there we go Yunki, someone disagrees with you and you resort to personal insults and thinly veiled threats of violence (I doubt I would... but I might)

Surprise surprise 🙄

"And their behaviour was shocking and brutal.."

Explain.

He obviously drove the taxi under the bridge in an oppressive manner

oob-explain

the men that killed david wilkie were watching their communities crumble
they were seeing troops of policeman turn up to fight them in hand to hand combat

their lives had become shocking and brutal and they responded to that in a shocking and brutal manner

ninfan - you are the Sheriff of Nottingham and I claim my foodbank voucher

Except there wasn't any significant violence between police and strikers in South Wales Yunki. And that's before you remember that most of the pits closed under Labour governments.

so ****ing what!?

what has a dead swimmer, killed by brutalised people living in an brutalised era got to do with an internet spat 30 years later?

or maybe it has everything to do with it

maybe all the warped and anguished perspectives displayed here are a reaction to living through those times?

"so **** what!?"

So they weren't brutalised by battles with the Police.

Oh, look, now he's resorting to swearing as well as calling people names.

Typical leftie, loses an argument and turns nasty 🙁

Edit: (I particuarly like the Google-fu fail whereby he mixes up the Scottish swimmer with the [s]murdered[/s] manslaughtered Welsh taxi driver, revealing that he's never heard of him up until about five minutes ago, how's that for class counciousness?)

[img] [/img]

I'll resist making any comments about suicide now being a laughing matter after you posted that Gif yunki, because I wouldn't want to be accused of bullying you

"mixes up the Scottish swimmer with the manslaughtered Welsh taxi driver"

Something quite poignant about that mixup. Poor bloke. 🙁

yeah, I'm laughing my socks off here ninfan

how many suicides are the tories responsible for though?
how many suicides are you responsible for?

What do you expect me to do, go and check the Score board that all Tory voters (and red Tories as well presumably) keep on the wall?

How many were Labour responsible for when they rationalised the pits, cancelled tsr2, invaded suez, sent troops into Northern Ireland, cleared vilkages in Durham, etc.?

Where's the actual evidence of all these 'bullying' lefties? So far, it's just unsubstantiated allegations by anti-Corbyn types. Local Labour party meetings in various areas have been quite heated recently, but to say it's only Momentum members that are being 'aggressive', is wilful distortion of facts. Stuff like the poor Ruth Smeeth being 'reduced to tears' is laughable; friends who were actually present at that event have testified that she wasn't, and in fact seemed very happy to go off and have a conversation with the Telegraph journo who'd given her the leaflet that Marc Wadsworth had refused to give her. Then we've got the deliberate distortion of the facts surrounding the brick through the window, and other blatant bullshit.

When it comes to actual bullying, there's no-one does it better than the tories. The miners strike, Wapping, Criminal Justice Bill etc, all examples of the government using the police as paid thugs to create disorder. And before the days of social media, the lack of reporting of police aggression. And what about bullying within the tory party itself? They are legendary at being back-stabbing ****s!

[quote=yunki ]how many suicides are the tories responsible for though?

Do you have the numbers ?

"Where's the actual evidence of all these 'bullying' lefties? So far, it's just unsubstantiated allegations by anti-Corbyn types."

JC claimed he received two death threats. Is he an anti-Corbyn type?

Actually, I suppose he is.

@gentlerpolitics is worth a read on Twitter.

"Do you have the numbers ?"

Here you go:

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/uk-governments-fit-work-assessment-scheme-linked-nearly-600-suicides-1529126

As for 'bullying' on here; seriously? Does anyone actually believe that? Don't ever go out into the real world, it's a big, frightening, nasty place. 😆

Bullies? You've got Theresa May as prime minister. The woman who'd press the button. Utter ****ing scum.

Odd definition of bullying you have.

Not surprising however 🙂

****, this thread got depressing.

It's best to stay out of it from 7pm till 7am.

I'm surprised the mods haven't put it out of its misery.

Whilst I dream that the privileged might go away and leave us all to a fairer life, whilst I may chant EAT THE RICH..........

If a member of the tory party utters the words 'kill the poor', you can bet that before long their command will be carried out

"@gentlerpolitics is worth a read on Twitter."

Jesus. 🙁

"@gentlerpolitics is worth a read on Twitter."

Jesus.

+1

Random example from someone I've never met and for all I know don't agree with on a lot of things

https://mobile.twitter.com/MichelleBeckett/status/754597837028126721

It seems that the twitter trolls are focusing their efforts as others are seemingly nearly untouched for example Dan Jarvis MP

[url= http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/31/conservative-activist-elliott-johnson-killed-himself-coroner-rules#img-1 ]Those lovely Tories[/url]

@yunki there are no working mines in Northern France either. With all the environmental pressures added tothe other factors coal is very much yesterdays news. As I have posted before I remember the power cuts in the 1970's and certainly my lifetime Labour voting parents (Dad worked on blast furnace control systems initially btw) weren't sad to see the back of Scargill. Pretty much no Air France flights this weekend due to a strike, petrol and diesel ran out a few minths ago during a strike blockade of the refineries, ultra lefties setting fire to police cars etc etc. Unions are still prevelent here in France and we in the UK are in a mich better place.

How is Paris then Jambbers?

Bedroom tax seems like bullying to me.

Trolling on the internet by who knows who is all a bit meh.

When it comes to actual bullying, there's no-one does it better than the tories. The miners strike, Wapping, Criminal Justice Bill etc, all examples of the government using the police as paid thugs to create disorder.

Here here.

Unions are still prevelent here in France and we in the UK are in a mich better place.

That's dependent on your vantage point.

You could just argue power from the industrial sector has been transferred to the financial sector which has a much greater stranglehold of the country. Just so happens they will get their way through corporatism.

yunki - Member
oob-explain
the men that killed david wilkie were watching their communities crumble

Oh well, that's OK then

yunki - Member

meh

you're a tit.. what can I do about that?

Says the left breast to the right. Did the taxi driver get if for being a class traitor?

and we in the UK are in a mich better place.

...but...but...you're not in the UK?

[url= http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/uk_579a3cd7e4b06d7c426edff0 ] article about BBC bias against JC [/url]

Guilty on the pejorative language - no excuse for that.

Seems a bit harsh to say the BBC are not giving him equal airtime since they can't get him to go on most of their shows.

I'd love to hear him on the Today show. I'd love him to write a detailed article setting out his policy in any newspaper of his choice - I'm sure it would get published.

"Did the taxi driver get if for being a class traitor?"

That's the bit I don't get. He was a taxi driver driving Miners. Are some miners a different class to others? Are taxi drivers a significantly different class to Miners? The whole 'class' justification is nonsense.

Seems a bit harsh to say the BBC are not giving him equal airtime since they can't get him to go on most of their shows.

It's a comparison between those backing him and those critical of him.

Oh god... I made fun of Corbyn/Momentum's crowd panoramas on twitter and instantly gain a few anti-Corbyn followers 🙁
Maybe I should explain that I'm allowed to make fun of something without automatically being on their 'side'.