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nim - Member
Junkyard, by the same token there seems to be lack of acknowledgement on the STW threads I've seen that the violence is two sided as it appears only Israel is ever painted in a negative light.In addition, Zionists come in many forms. You don't have to be an Orthodox Jew living in the West Bank to believe that the State of Israel has a right to exist.
There is wrong on both side, but one side is more wrong that the other.
It's not 2 sides of the same coin. much is made of the Israeli right to resist. What about the palestinians right to exist.
FWIW, i think the 2 state solution mentioned earlier is un attainable and just adds to the deadlock. It should be 1 state, 1 man 1 vote. Call it what you will. But the important thing is equal rights and a combined democracy.
The Israeli state has proven that it is unwavering in its expansionism. Fine, you want to expand, take the people as well and extend the right to citizenship to those in the refugee camps.
such a state will still have it's problems with extremeists, from both sides, but the moderates from both side, will be able to overcome them if they worked together without any barriers.
The 2 state solution is a busted flush.
Junkyard, by the same token there seems to be lack of acknowledgement on the STW threads I've seen that the violence is two sided as it appears only Israel is ever painted in a negative light.
In addition, Zionists come in many forms. You don't have to be an Orthodox Jew living in the West Bank to believe that the State of Israel has a right to exist.
Yes the Palestinians aren't blameless but there's only one side holding all the cards here. One is a rich (rogue) nuclear state backed to the hilt by the US, the other isn't. Only one side is routinely stealing land and abusing basic human rights.
It's like people who claim the news should give equal balance to both sides of the climate change debate.
A quick look at the number of civilian casualties on each side is pretty telling.
*waits for a Zionist to explain how it's their fault they got killed*
Dr J - you forgot the recent and ongoing stabbings and car rammings of men, women and children.
Israel is far from perfect but 20% appx are Israeli Arabs who have full democratic rights but do not have to do national service although an increasing number volunteer to do so. However if I were a Christian Arab right now, Israel is probably the safest Middle East country to be in. Same goes for gay Arabs.
Junkyard. Of course I disagree with some of the things Israel does/has done.
I also disagree with the UK govt at times.
"Yes you zionists" - Nice.
As for what Zionism is, self determination in the ancestral homeland which has gone from once being a pipe dream to now being the State of Israel.
Israel is far from perfect but 20% appx are Israeli Arabs who have full democratic rights but do not have to do national service although an increasing number volunteer to do so. However if I were a Christian Arab right now, Israel is probably the safest Middle East count
I don't understand the point here. Yes there are some good things about Israel but does that justify their numerous and flagrant abuses of the human rights of Palestinians?
Is all of this made up?
http://www.breakingthesilence.org.il
Israel likes to promote itself s a beacon of liberal democracy in the Middle East but then gets incredibly upset when it's held to the standards of behaviour of other democracies.
nim - MemberAs for what Zionism is, self determination in the ancestral homeland which has gone from once being a pipe dream to now being the State of Israel. (at the expense of the local inhabitants.)
FTFY.
@gonzy, I looked back and can't find which are the two questions you are referring to. I'd be happy to try and give an answer or express an opinion .
Jambalaya the 2 questions i am referring to are below
Are you saying you hate Jews because of their occupation (I use the world loosely) of Palestine?
Do you have any beef with the Arab governments who instead of accepting the 1947 UN partition plan swore to wipe Israel off the map, fpand fought three wars trying to do so, before abandoning the Palestinians to their fate?
And as for Zionism - I think you could see it as an understandable response to persecution etc but if anyone believes they have a special right to live in a particular place (and kick out the people living there) because they are god's chosen people...
Israel is far from perfect but 20% appx are Israeli Arabs who have full democratic rights
FULL - you sure about that ?
Many Arab citizens feel that the state, as well as society at large, not only actively limits them to second-class citizenship, but treats them as enemies, impacting their perception of the de jure versus de facto quality of their citizenship.[179] The joint document The Future Vision of the Palestinian Arabs in Israel, asserts: "Defining the Israeli State as a Jewish State and exploiting democracy in the service of its Jewishness excludes us, and creates tension between us and the nature and essence of the State." The document explains that by definition the "Jewish State" concept is based on ethnically preferential treatment towards Jews enshrined in immigration (the Law of Return) and land policy (the Jewish National Fund), and calls for the establishment of minority rights protections enforced by an independent anti-discrimination commission.[180]
A 2004 report by Mossawa, an advocacy center for Palestinian-Arab citizens of Israel, states that since the events of October 2000, 16 Arabs had been killed by security forces, bringing the total to 29 victims of "institutional violence" in four years.[181] Ahmed Sa'adi, in his article on The Concept of Protest and its Representation by the Or Commission, states that since 1948 the only protestors to be killed by the police have been Arabs.[182]
Yousef Munayyer, an Israeli citizen and the executive director of The Jerusalem Fund, wrote that Palestinians only have varying degrees of limited rights in Israel. He states that although Palestinians make up about 20 percent of Israel's population, less than 7 percent of the budget is allocated to Palestinian citizens. He describes the 1.5 million Arab citizens of Israel as second-class citizens while four million more are not citizens at all. He states that a Jew from any country can move to Israel but a Palestinian refugee, with a valid claim to property in Israel, cannot. Munayyer also described the difficulties he and his wife faced when visiting the country
Not really able to build houses on occupied land either are they
Of course I disagree with some of the things Israel does/has done.
I also disagree with the UK govt at times.
Oh well done you said your criticisms of it were just like your criticisms of here as all the illegal shit Israel does - including state sanctioned murders on foreign soil-= is just like the disagreement here
Perhaps you could be explicit and tell us what illegal stuff it does you most disapprove of - is it collective punishments ?
For every Netanyahu quote I'll show you a suicide bombing on a bus or a Tel Aviv nightclub or a written constitution calling for the destruction of Isreal.
yes Jambalaya, and for each one of those i can show you a multitude of images and videos of dead Palestinian civilians....the vast majority of them are children.
you know for all the wrongs that the Palestinians have done, Israels response is massively disproportionate.
the Israeli attitude/policy is:
[i]"if you fire one of your crude rockets at us, our Iron dome system will blow it out of the sky...we will then blow the shit out of your towns. we will give any civilians 30 seconds to vacate the building before we hit it...if you're too slow to get out then thats your fault innit?
we will decide that we have a right to defend ourselves and in order to do that we need more land and territory so we will forcibly take/steal it from you...if you have the audacity to complain about this then we will do as above....bomb the shit out of you. if that happens you only have yourselves to blame.
we have a divine god given right to this holy land and therefore we will take what we want, how we want and when we want. you as a Palestinian have no claim to this land...even if your family has been living there for centuries...a Jew from anywhere in the world who has never set foot in Israel and has no connections to Israel has a greater right to this and than you.
and if you complain about this....well read the above as the consequences are the same whatever you Palestinians do...because the zionist state of Israel belives that the only good Palestinian is a dead one."[/i]
Yes obviously the governments of the US, UK and the EU are getting those facts wrong too on which they are basing their policy.
This is actually a masterclass in "appeals to authority". When challenged on his use of factually untrue statements, he says that! I do not think that the U.S., UK and EU are unaware of the facts; I think you are! And the examples of you being unaware of the facts (or, perhaps, just lying) are on this thread.
(As an aside, we could also note that according to you, the EU is 100% reliable and insightful about stuff that happens in Israel about prayers, but 100% unreliable and misguided when it comes to stuff that happens in Greece on the Euro).
I don't see anyone here claiming that the Palestinians are pure as snow.
I don't think it's helpful to start assigning collective guilt to entire peoples, whether Israeli or Palestinian, because that opens the way for collective punishment and a moral hierarchy of peoples. I don't see why an ordinary resident of Tel Aviv or Ramallah should bear responsibility for terrorist acts executed by angry hirsute men.
BigDummy - Member
This ^^^ is what happens when the actual big-hitters get banned.
Big hitter? What is that? I don't play tennis.
I am not a big hitter but merely asking questions.
Big hitter got banned because they threaten other forum user(s).
I don't threaten other user nor do I take offense personally.
I am no troll too because even if my questions may seen provocative, they are provocative only to those who only see things from one dimension. i.e. their perspective only and theirs is the only one "right" perspective. I like to challenge their "right" perspective because they would hijack a forum like this to forward their propaganda. I want to balance things up and to understand more so like to challenge their views... coz they sound rather illogical to me.
In relation to the topic, all I have to say is that they are illogical, inconsistent and bias in the way they present their views. I mean why want to intervene in a place full of sand that does not even have any relation to them? True human nature are never nice.
Why illogical so here are the reasons:
Do they live there - No.
Do they have any economy tie - No.
Do they advocate violence towards each other - No.
Do they encourage each other to fight - No.
Do they have relatives that live there - No. I am sure.
Are they Palestinians - No.
Are they Israelis - No, but I am not sure.
Do they owe either side a living - No.
Do they have the same religion - possibly No because most of you are non-believers anyway.
To summarise, they have no connection to that land or people and yet they trying to defend that piece of land as if their lives depend on it.
Logically I can only deduce that these people are bias towards certain people, although they consider themselves fair, their true nature is always very different. i.e. to use another form of arguments to hide their true intention and trying to influence a particular event because they think they can regardless of the end result.
The other thing that puzzle me is the fact that they seem to have some sort of [b]euphoric empathy [/b](new description! new term!a bit like getting addicted to legal/illegal high or something ...) which I constantly witness in certain people. For example, a bit like the case of Angela Merkel where she was logical until the onset of her euphoric empathy ... the result is a massive "do good" factor with unknown long term result. That is not logical. 😆
No, I am no troll nor am I trying to threaten others.
I am here to ask difficult questions perhaps in my own way but questions I shall ask.
😛
edit: ya, I like the term euphoric empathy ...
People should really stop 'debating' with jambalaya. I'm trying to stop reading his posts (already gave up on chewkw's a long time ago but they are longer and easier to spot).
I know it's tempting to call jambalaya out on his routine fallacious arguments and biased nonsense but it's utterly pointless. Rational arguments don't work against someone with such monumental faith in how right they are about everything.
[quote=grum spake unto the masses]People should really stop 'debating' with jambalaya. I'm trying to stop reading his posts (already gave up on chewkw's a long time ago but they are longer and easier to spot).
Well, this, really. Particularly in the case of this Palestine argument. Pretty much everything that anyone says is cut and pasted from the last time we discussed it (with some noble exceptions like gonzy). Easier just to pass on to discuss the Gregg's menu.
Watch a little of the UK's Colonel Kemp's views on the matter.
"I believe that on the basis of everything that I've seen, that everything the IDF does to protect civilians and to stop the death of innocent civilians is a great deal more than any other army, and it's more than the British and the American armies."
Yes, well if he says it, it must be true.
Not sure I've seen as many appeals to authority on one thread before. I'm sure Facts from the Jambaverse will soon set me straight with plenty more.
grum - Member
People should really stop 'debating' with jambalaya. I'm trying to stop reading his posts (already gave up on chewkw's a long time ago but they are longer and easier to spot).
What I don't understand is people keep mentioning me by saying they ignore me. If you ignore me then don't post my user name in your response.
Very simple. Let me talk to myself and let me post my views. If you disagree then either you let me be or engage with me.
What you are doing now is like trying to influence others. Why do you have to announce to the world that you ignore my comments? Is there some sort of mass euphoria in doing so? 😛
I know it's tempting to call jambalaya out on his routine fallacious arguments and biased nonsense but it's utterly pointless. Rational arguments don't work against someone with such monumental faith in how right they are about everything.
The way I see it Jambalaya makes sense. On the other hand when the opposing views cannot overcome his comments they start to become highly emotional.
If you look at your comments now you will see that you are highly emotional.
Right? Who is right?
Why do you think someone should always be right?
Do you think you are right? 😯
[quote=nim spake unto the masses]Watch a little of the UK's Colonel Kemp's views on the matter.
[url=
"I believe that on the basis of everything that I've seen, that everything the IDF does to protect civilians and to stop the death of innocent civilians is a great deal more than any other army, and it's more than the British and the American armies."
Obviously complete and utter BS. The IRA were infinitely more effective than the PLO, Hamas et al, yet the British somehow managed to avoid bombing Irish children with white phosphorus.
Watch out chewkw!! With jhj and jambas down, you will be the only target left. Tin hat time. 😉
Indeed, the ignore claims don't stand up to much scrutiny do they?!?
DrJ - Member
Obviously complete and utter BS. The IRA were infinitely more effective than the PLO, Hamas et al, yet the British somehow managed to avoid bombing Irish children with white phosphorus.
Crikey, now IRA is being dragged in ...
teamhurtmore - MemberWatch out chewkw!! With jhj and jambas down, you will be the only target left. Tin hat time.
Indeed, the ignore claims don't stand up to much scrutiny do they?!?
Why are they down?
[b]"You Shall Not Pass!" [/b]Said Gandalf the grey.
My motto is I fear no ZMs! 😆
deleted post to save space.
He may be, if you weren't the only one still bothering to read his posts! 😆teamhurtmore - Member
Watch out chewkw!! With jhj and jambas down, you will be the only target left.
nim - Member
Watch a little of the UK's Colonel Kemp's views on the matter."I believe that on the basis of everything that I've seen, that everything the IDF does to protect civilians and to stop the death of innocent civilians is a great deal more than any other army, and it's more than the British and the American armies."
Aye I remember the RAF incursions in to west Belfast well, along with the complete blockade of the Bogside! 😆
Not relevant? Of course it is. Half the problem with people is they view this as 2 warring states rather than was it really is, an utter bit of a mess of domestic policy.
The IRA were infinitely more effective than the PLO, Hamas et al, yet the British somehow managed to avoid bombing Irish children with white phosphorus.
I feel while you can draw some comparisons between the political agendas it is futile comparing the methods used and how effective they were. The IRA did not have the ability to fire missiles and I doubt Hamas will ever be considerate enough to give Israeli citizens a ten minute warning.
Whilst the IRA at the time were supposedly the most organised terrorist organisation in the world developments since make them look like a bunch of thugs.
People should really stop 'debating' with jambalaya. I'm trying to stop reading his posts (already gave up on chewkw's a long time ago but they are longer and easier to spot).I know it's tempting to call jambalaya out on his routine fallacious arguments and biased nonsense but it's utterly pointless. Rational arguments don't work against someone with such monumental faith in how right they are about everything.
As for what Zionism is, self determination in the ancestral homeland which has gone from once being a pipe dream to now being the State of Israel.i try to do this but i find it hard especially as most of his posts begin with "@Gonzy"
as for Chewkw...even though he denies it, i think he lives under a bridge and likes goats...(in reference to this particular thread anyway)
so if they came over here claiming the UK to be their ancestral home and that they had a god given right, and you ended up being kicked out of your home to make way for them....you'd be happy with that would you?
Easier just to pass on to discuss the Gregg's menu.
is it me or have the pasties in Greggs got smaller?
isto - Member
The IRA were infinitely more effective than the PLO, Hamas et al, yet the British somehow managed to avoid bombing Irish children with white phosphorus.
I feel while you can draw some comparisons between the political agendas it is futile comparing the methods used and how effective they were. The IRA did not have the ability to fire missiles and I doubt Hamas will ever be considerate enough to give Israeli citizens a ten minute warning.Whilst the IRA at the time were supposedly the most organised terrorist organisation in the world developments since make them look like a bunch of thugs.
The IRA had rocket launchers and mortars and Possibly some SAM missiles as well, but never used the latter if they did have them.
I agree direct comparisons are a bit futile though, but there are some you can make. They are wildly different conflicts though.
seosamh77 - Member
teamhurtmore - Member
Watch out chewkw!! With jhj and jambas down, you will be the only target left.He may be, if you weren't the only one still bothering to read his posts!
Admit it you lot like the free entertainment I have provided for you. You know you do and I certainly get good entertainment here with all sort of weirdos arguing for the ZM die hard views. Consider yourself lucky I have not charged you for fees for my entertainment efforts.
gonzy - Member
Easier just to pass on to discuss the Gregg's menu.
is it me or have the pasties in Greggs got smaller?
What's wrong with Greggs?
Are you the kind of Jamie Oliver crusader that keep banging on about eating healthy and blaming others for you being fat yourself? Stuffing your face then blame the entire world for your own face stuffing activities?
I love Greggs and I do buy from them.
I am offended if the food is not full of lard. I love fish & chips me ...
Size of pasty remains the same ... only fools want to reduce the pasty size to cut his/her fatty weight. I mean eat less and you should loose weight so cutting pasty size?
Are you trying to ban Greggs?
Are you saying they are unhealthy?
Are you trying to educate me on what's healthy and what's not?
Can you cook? 🙄
It's actually quite easy THM - I see the username chewkw and just keep scrolling. Sometimes I accidentally read the first couple of lines. It's a new thing with jambalaya but I'm getting there.
It's a shame mefty doesn't post on these threads much as I think he is actually the only conservative voice on STW who comes across as a reasonable person. Make of that what you will.
grum - Member
It's actually quite easy THM - I see the username chewkw and just keep scrolling.
No, you did not. You read my comments secretly ...
I feel like secretly you are getting some high from reading my comments a bit like reading dirty mags ... 😆
Make of that what you will.
😉 very subtle - ok moderately subtle 😉
I have not charged you for fees for my entertainment efforts.
i wouldn't pay if you did
What's wrong with Greggs?Are you the kind of Jamie Oliver crusader that keep banging on about eating healthy and blaming others for you being fat yourself? Stuffing your face then blame the entire world for your own face stuffing activities?
I love Greggs and I do buy from them.
I am offended if the food is not full of lard. I love fish & chips me ...
Size of pasty remains the same ... only fools want to reduce the pasty size to cut his/her fatty weight. I mean eat less and you should loose weight so cutting pasty size?
Are you trying to ban Greggs?
Are you saying they are unhealthy?
Are you trying to educate me on what's healthy and what's not?Can you cook?
look, a goat is approaching....you better get back under your bridge
gonzy - Member
I have not charged you for fees for my entertainment efforts
i wouldn't pay if you did
Ya right, you want everything free don't you?
You have the right (always think of self entitlement) to have them free don't you?
You are tight aren't you?
See ...
look, a goat is approaching....you better get back under your bridge
Do you actually know how to cook properly?
Very simple where do you get goat meat? 🙄
You are tight aren't you?
See ...
ermmm....no.
you are not very funny at all
Watch a little of the UK's Colonel Kemp's views on the matter.
>
Just because he made that programme on squaddies in Afghanistan, it doesn't mean he's qualified to talk about military strategy. Tbh everything he's done since eastenders has been rubbish
@gonzy, I confess I'm still uncertain, so here are my answers
Are you saying you hate Jews because of their occupation (I use the world loosely) of Palestine?
I don't think you hate Jews. I don't either.
Do you have any beef with the Arab governments who instead of accepting the 1947 UN partition plan swore to wipe Israel off the map, fpand fought three wars trying to do so, before abandoning the Palestinians to their fate?
Yes I certainly have a beef with the governments of Egypt, Syria, Jordan in the 1947-1970's who fought wars to obliterate Isreal. However in Jordan and Egypt you have countries who signed a peace and moved on although Jordan only relinquished its claims to the West Bank in 1990's. Both Egypt and Jordan have suffered terrorist attacks from Palestinians. Even Assad/Syria who long supported Palestine has found itself attacked by refugees living in Allepo.
@grum, yiu are free to do as you please but my views reflect those in power in the West so ignore my points of view but don't then decry government policy as being out of touch or inexplicable when you've chosen to ignore a different point of view.
If anyone did bother to read the crisis.org report it points out that further violent conflict is inevitable not least due to conflict between different Palestinian factions. On a similar note ViceNews has a piece today on how Hamas is calling for an intifada but that violence should take place in the West Bank and not in Gaza which can ill afford further violence. Also piece notes the number of rocket attacks in past few months and a trend towards these coming from IS factions within Gaza
[url= https://news.vice.com/article/why-is-hamas-calling-for-intifada-in-the-west-bank-but-not-in-gaza ]Vice News[/url]
@tmh rumours of my demise are exaggerated
I wasn't suggesting that 😉
but my views reflect those in power in the West so ignore my points of view but don't then...
And off you go again. Honestly, it's actually getting funny now 😆 (and not in a good way).
gonzy - Member
You are tight aren't you?
See ...
ermmm....no.
you are not very funny at al
I see ... now I am not funny ... 😆
I am funny that's why I am here to provide everyone with some sort of entertainment ... you guys are tight. Ouch! Tight!
jambalaya - Member
I don't think you hate Jews. I don't either.
Yes, I don't hate them nor the Palestine so they are most welcome to destroy or love each other as much as they like, their choice. Nothing to do with me coz that piece of land is just sand. Desert! They are fighting over sand ...
Then we find our lot here trying to join in the fun to support the cause of fighting for desert sand ... 😯
FFS! Our lot here are trying to fight over the desert sand in a place far far away not even related to them ... 😯
Then calling themselves Friends of this or that ... C'mon! If that is not funny I don't know what is. What Friends of desert sand? Ya, sand. 😆
We are Friends of Sand on the West side and we are enemy of Friends of Sand on the East side ... 😆
Just because he made that programme on squaddies in Afghanistan, it doesn't mean he's qualified to talk about military strategy. Tbh everything he's done since eastenders has been rubbish
Random snippet of the day... Ross Kemp used to be married to [url= https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebekah_Brooks ]Rebekah Brooks[/url] (Wade) (when she would've been Rebekah Kemp)
Pretty incestuous those media types, like the previous mention of James Murdoch's role at Vice...
Even Assad/Syria who long supported Palestine has found itself attacked by refugees living in Allepo.
This is another classic jambalaya line because:
1) having just slagged off Arab countries that ineffectually fought wars against Israel and refused to recognise it, he then says that Syria (which is exactly one of those countries!) "supported Palestine" - despite it not giving Palestinians citizenship and achieving absolutely sod all for the Palestinians!
2) it is entirely backwards: the Palestnian enclave militias in Syria have been some of the last loyalists of the Assad regime
3) it suggests that attacking the Assad regime (responsible for those awful things against Israel that he just criticised) is a bad thing!
How many irreconcilable thoughts can one man hold?
@Jambalaya
i'll rephrase the 2 questions to you as reading back it didnt make sense to me what i had paraphrased to you...
i was asked if i hated Jews....i said no to this and explained why
i was asked if i had beef with the surrounding Arab nations for effectively leaving the Palestinians with virtually no support...i stated yes and gave my reasons.
what i should have asked you, on the flipside, was seeing as you are advocating the Israeli perspective...
do you hate Muslims?
do you have beef with the Israeli government? over the way it has, since 1947, continued to illegally land grab Palestinian territory and forcibly displace the Palestinian population, how it has treated the Palestinian population since 1947 by violating their basic human rights and applies an apartheid policy in its treatment of the Palestinians, how it acts with impunity when reacting to Palestinian resistance (justified or not) and the levels of violence in its responses...i could go on but you catch my drift
Got it.
No I don't hate Muslims. I do think the politics of the region are very difficult and I think aspects of the culture and religion make our idea of a western style democracy very difficult
Do I think Isreal has done some things I find difficult to accept, yes. However Isreal is facing a situation we can't really appreciate surrounded by countries who where very hostile towards it. It is a generally held view amongst Jews that they have been very naive in the past accepting assurances from governments to their safety. Now many chose to trust only their own government and their is certainly very little to zero trust of Palestinians. As far as "land grab" Isreal fought wars against Jordan and Egypt and won so that land is now theirs, full-stop. I do not subscribe to the view that post a war borders return to how they where. Palestinians where offered Isreali citizenship and declined it and the restrictions on their movements are an Isreali to continual attacks.
The current round if attacks will lead to further restrictions and I've no doubt further settlement building. Isreal is sending the message that the more we are attacked the further away from your objectives you will be.thats pretty tough responce in my opinion but I am not faced with the daily reality of violence and rocket attacks.
Isreali Arabs have some of the highest standards of living of any Arabs in the Middle East and live in greater security in a western style democracy. I appreciate its not the perfect solution for them but they are a whole lot better off that the majority.
As far as "land grab" Isreal fought wars against Jordan and Egypt and won so that land is now theirs, full-stop. I do not subscribe to the view that post a war borders return to how they where.
so can you explain who Israel has fought to steal the land that they have as shown in the image below?
[img]
[/img]
Palestinians where offered Israeli citizenship and declined it and the restrictions on their movements are an Israeli to continual attacks.
so you steal their land and then tell them to assimilate and when they refuse you think its justified to pen them into a tiny scrap of land and build a wall around them and tell them they cannot leave without permission. you then restrict food, water medication supplies as well as supplies to support the basic infrastructure of the place. lets not forget what the Israeli government calls controlled calorific diet for the Palestinians...basically they decide how much a Palestinian needs to survive...all this because they refuse to bow down to zionist rule??
The current round if attacks will lead to further restrictions and I've no doubt further settlement building. Isreal is sending the message that the more we are attacked the further away from your objectives you will be.thats pretty tough responce in my opinion but I am not faced with the daily reality of violence and rocket attacks.
so basically if a Palestinian stabs one Israeli then Israel is within its rights to steal more Palestinian land, displacing more Palestinians in order to build more Israeli settlements?
I am not faced with the daily reality of violence and rocket attacks
people get stabbed in London but you dont see the Met Police going round kicking people out of their houses and demolishing them to replace them with more houses for others, you dont see the Met Police or the army blowing up homes, schools and hospitals and killing innocent civilians in the process do you?
as for the rockets, i know you'll spout of the usual unconfirmed Israeli statistics stating how many rockets have been fired at Israel but you know as well as i do hardly any get through Iron Dome and those that do either land off target or do little or no damage...and the Israeli response to this is massively disproportionate.
Isreali Arabs have some of the highest standards of living of any Arabs in the Middle East and live in greater security in a western style democracy. I appreciate its not the perfect solution for them but they are a whole lot better off that the majority.
joke of the week!!
i think this is the point where i no longer respond to the utter bollocks you come out with. i've watched you get pilloried by others for your arrogant support for Israel and i thought i'd give you an opportunity to try and show that you can be critical of those you support but all you have done is dig yourself in deeper by still claiming that while Israel might have been a little naughty effectively its the Palestinians fault and that the world must accept what Israel does with no room for any criticism.
i cant tell where your mouth ends and your arse begins as the crap that comes out is the same
i cant tell where your mouth ends and your arse begins as the crap that comes out is the same
Gonzy hereby wins the internets.