I've asked for a leave of absence so I can take my four year old to see the TDF finish in London on July 7th. It's been denied.
My case was built around the importance of cycling to the family, the desire to promote sport to my son (he is really keen and we've done a few 4 mile rides together already) and the rarity of the event.
What with the obesity crisis in our children at the moment I thought the head teacher would understand the importance of promoting sport but she doesn't see it that way.
What do other people think?
While I have every sympathy, I think it's fair enough. If they set a precedent that sporting events are a valid reason for absence, you might end up with half empty classrooms every time there's a test match, Ascot, international footy...
A couple of days for that seem reasonable. Take your kid anyway, or will that result in a fine?
a fortnight's skiing might be argued to be something you're doing in the war against obesity. For most people it's a jolly.
geetee1972 - MemberI've asked for a leave of absence
When you should have just pulled a sicky.
Lesson learnt for next time, though I do side with the school.
It's a day I'm talking about. Not a fortnight plus you can go skiing outside of term time whereas the TDF only finishes in London on that particular day (and it's only been to the UK twice before in 100 years!)
Seems a little bit heavy handed - I'm not sure a four year old is missing anything that will come up in his A levels 😀
(My daughter is four - mostly she seems to spend her time gluing sparkly paper to various bits of recycling which she then brings them home as "art")
What's the comeback from the school if you JFDI?
[i]It's a day I'm talking about. Not a fortnight! [/i]
I think the point I was making is that *everyone* thinks that their reason for absence is the exception.
Schools just have to say 'no' to pretty much everything now bar a close relative dying - it's not really the governors or headteachers fault (unless it's a free school/academy) - LA's and central government make the rules.
Within the context of the rules, it's not an acceptable reason. I assume you know this, and are mildly bored. 🙂
In the real world, I twice took mine out of school for a week when I went riding in the Alps, but that was before the fines became prohibitive.
Rules are a bit silly, but they're there to protect kids- unlikely to be yours, but its there for the good of a few.
[quote=geetee1972 ]What with the obesity crisis in our children at the moment I thought the head teacher would understand the importance of promoting sport but she doesn't see it that way.
As mentioned by edlong, exactly the same case could be made for going to watch any footy/rugby etc. match
LA's and central government make the rules.
But they are applied at the heads discretion.
Be wierd if Geetee jr got a dose the night before wouldn't it?
Plus, at 4, is he legally obliged to be there? (thought school age was 5+, happy to be corrected...)
As mentioned by edlong, exactly the same case could be made for going to watch any footy/rugby etc. match
Sure and if the TDF finished several times a week in London, including the weekend, I would just bloody well take him then. Bit it bloody doesn't! That's why I think it's 'exceptional', like the Olympics.
I do wonder what the schools would have done with requests for taking kids to the Olympics had it been on during term time. I bet they wouldn't have refused that in the spirit of the 'Olympic Legacy'.
And no I don't know the rules but yes I am bored today.
it will be on the tv, better coverage than being there, and cheaper, some kid wanted time off to go to his mums wedding and that got refused.
You decide which rules you want to disobey, and the school will decide which rules they will enforce to be petty.
We took our son out of school for a week's holiday when he was 4. Given that he didn't legally have to be at school, there was nothing they could do about it though they did officially refuse our request. They also unofficially said they couldn't see any issue with it given that he was doing well at school. Unless the rules have changed then that will be the case for the OP's son.
I think everyone bar tom is missing the key point here.
He's only 4 years old
I thought the head teacher would understand the importance of [s]promoting sport[/s] me not missing my favourite sport but she doesn't see it that way.
^FTFY
But they are applied at the heads discretion.
Heads are no longer trusted to have discretion for er..discretionary leave...put simply, it was always going to be refused.
To the OP: Go and take him to see it in Yorkshire. Proper hills, and at t'weekend too.
..some kid wanted time off to go to his mums wedding and that got refused.
Except if you read the details of that story it transpired that his parents only gave the school five days notice and didn't actually mention that it was a wedding.
Still. Good headline.
thegeneralist - Member
I think everyone bar tom is missing the key point here.
He's only 4 years old
so won't give a shit about the tdf
Let's throw this grenade into the room and retreat.....
What would your response be if your son's teacher approached you and informed you that he/she wouldn't be available on a given day because he/she was going to attend the stage 3 finish of the Tour de France?
Assuming you didn't want the day off anyway.
Exceptional circumstances?
No (sadly) imagine giving up lessons because the WC footie is on!
But it is ok for the kids to lose a day when the teachers strike.
duh, nobody that watches footy is fat!
*makes note to keep an eye out in 20 years time for a brit TDF winner saying how he first got into cycling aged 4 after his dad took him to the london finish, despite school saying he couldn't go*
OP, What's the lads name, I feel a bet coming on, much like Chris Kirkland's dad did a few years ago (bet his lad would play for England, won £10k.) It's a sign!
Let's throw this grenade into the room and retreat.....
What would your response be if your son's teacher approached you and informed you that he/she wouldn't be available on a given day because he/she was going to [s]attend the stage 3 finish of the Tour de France?[/s]STRIKE, HAVE A TRAINING DAY, SNOW ON THE GROUND, HEATING NOT WORKING, NO HOT WATER,ETC ETC
Assuming you didn't want the day off anyway.
Exceptional circumstances?
Biscuit anyone...?
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[internet bore] a jaffa cake isn't a biscuit [/internet bore]
Plus, at 4, is he legally obliged to be there?
This - no legal requirement for him to be in school so you can do what you want.
Rules are a bit silly, but they're there to protect kids- unlikely to be yours, but its there for the good of a few.
Rules are a [s]bit silly[/s] massive knee-jerk overreaction, but they're there to [s]protect kids[/s] penalise those parents who are unlikely to let their children miss school through persistent truancy and believe that as responsible parents are best able to assess the likely impact on their own child of planned absence[s]but its there for the good of a few[/s]rather than targeting and doing something about the real problem parents because that would require real socio-cultural change which is bloody hard.
I may have provided a bit of grist deserving of the biscuits...
[quoteLet's throw this grenade into the room and retreat.....
What would your response be if your son's teacher approached you and informed you that he/she wouldn't be available on a given day because he/she was going to attend the stage 3 finish of the Tour de France?STRIKE, HAVE A TRAINING DAY, SNOW ON THE GROUND, HEATING NOT WORKING, NO HOT WATER,ETC ETC
Assuming you didn't want the day off anyway.
Exceptional circumstances? EXACTLY
tell them hes going to the world cup with an headmaster. they wont have a leg to stand on then. see todays paper if this is unclear.
I had a feeling this post might provoke debate.
Legally at four he is not required to be in school but the DFE website says that if you do have a child enrolled at this age, parents need to abide by the rules. That and who wants to pick a grudge with the people responsible for your kids schooling?
Oh and taking him or not taking him has no impact on whether I get to go or not.
why oh why do stupid people keep trying to equate kids missing a day of school and teachers missing a day of school?
The teacher should be there because they are paid to do a job. It's quite simple.
if you do have a child enrolled at this age, parents need to abide by the rules
The rule that children over the age of 5 need to be in school? So how does that work then?
just go anyway, and if you get a fine , pay up.
You should be applauded for trying to do the right thing, but for the sake of a day and no hassle sickie is where its at.
BTW I learned the hard way that trying to do the right thing never works in your favour. Weekend job, wanted to go to a gig, asked EVERYONE if they would cover my shift, all said no, lied to boss and said I had an exam on the Saturday of the gig, another colleague grassed me up and I got the sack. Bastards.
Still. Good headline.
I wish people would stop harpoing on about fines, and perhaps not take press headlines for granted 🙄 I mean you don't for anything else, do you?
Most heads will decline an absence request unless its for absolutely clear cut necessity. Otherwise they could get embroiled in all sorts of 'discrimination' issues.
And you won't get fined.
To administer a fine, the school needs to prove regular unauthorised absences, then take this to the local authority to administer. The whole process is very tedious and time consuming, and even with LA backing very difficult to make stick. You really need to be a very, very bad parent to get stuck with this.
Please stop reading the Daily Mail and get over it
Grrrr
I think the stupid people are saying that a day missed through going to the tdf is no different to a day missed due to a strike. If they say a day off is detrimental then a day off is detrimental.
Or am I stupid?
I'd side with the school given the current regulations.
To administer a fine, the school needs to prove regular unauthorised absences, then take this to the local authority to administer. The whole process is very tedious and time consuming, and even with LA backing very difficult to make stick. You really need to be a very, very bad parent to get stuck with this.
That is good to know. If it means it is used correctly that can only be a positive thing.
they cannot do anything for one day
For a penalty notice to be requested, a child must have been absent from school for five days in the same term or period of 12 weeks. If a penalty notice is issued, it will cover the whole period of the absence. So the fine would be the same amount for an absence of five days or 10 days. For example, a parent could be issued with a £60 fine for a child missing one day of school every week over a five week period, whilst another parent might be issued the same fine for a two week block of absence.
I got some additional feedback.
Basically the head is saying that while it's at her discretion to grant a leave of absence for exceptional circumstances, the scope for her to interpret what is 'exceptional' is extremely limited and this doesn't fall into that narrow definition. However, because it's only for one day, there would be no fine.
So now I'm really confused. The answer seems to be 'no you can't but there is no obvious consequence if you do'.
Just take him. Worst that can happen is he'll have a days unauthorised absence on his record. This may go on his school report, and his parents will find out. They might be cross about him truanting, but he'll get over it.
