Guy has bought my motorbike on eBay
he's from Portugal, says he is going to transfer funds to my account prior to collection by someone else
his feedback is good, seems decent enough in emails etc., but it also seems to be good to be true - no questions about the bike, just went ahead and offered a decent price. paying fully up front too
I'd have thought once the funds are in my account I'm safe?
just thought I'd check with STW massive
I'd be very nervous, afraid I can't offer any assurances
seems to good to be true
Now what's the old adage...it's right on the tip of my tongue 😉
Is he paying via paypal? You will have no proof of delivery.
Get the name of collector from the buyer, preferably using Ebay messages.
Get proof of ID from collector and photograph it. Ask him to sign receipts, one for each of you.
Or, tell the buyer to transfer money to the collector so he can pay you in luvverly cash!
Then there is no paypal payment or transfer that can be reversed.
I sold a bike like that. Scotland rather than Portugal.
I would be looking for cold hard cash. I think money transfers/ cheques can be cancelled even after cheques have cleared, besides who buys summit like that without seeing it .Do not let your keen-ness to sell your bike cloud your judgement.
direct transfer to my bank account - no paypal
Something not right there......
yes but it's not paypal!!
Unless it was cash I'd not be going ahead with the transaction......
Maybe I'm just not trusting enough but thankfully out of all the stuff I've bough/sold online I've only ever been stung for a £25 bb
Your not certain hence the post.... Walk away
Scam.
Why would someone from Portugal buy your motorbike and ship it over there? (Assuming it's not some very rare / vintage machine)
The money will appear in your account, you'll let the mate take your bike, then the money will disappear again.
Find someone local, or insist on cash on collection - no folding stuff, no keys!
Tell him to transfer the money to the person collecting, then they can pay you in cash when collecting.
Otherwise I would tell him no deal if it was me. To risky for larger amounts.
how can money disappear from my account once cleared? is that possible?
how can money disappear from my account once cleared? is that possible?
If there is something fraudulent in the chain of payment it can be reclaimed. Although it is more likely he will proclaim problems and switch payment methods after it is agreed.
I sold a faulty car to someone in Poland, but I knew it was a problem that could be cheaply fixed by someone with knowledge, but was a expensive repair to pay for a garage to do. And he came and collected and paid cash.
It isn't impossible it is all above board, but I would want cash and maybe even check the money is cosha before handing over the bike.
how can money disappear from my account once cleared? is that possible
Why waste time trying to figure it out though ?
If he can transfer it to you, he can transfer it to his mate who's collecting it, then he brings you cash.
I'll bet my ass he comes up with a lame excuse why that's not possible when you suggest it.
first of all
a LOT of bikes are bought here (they generally have less use than in europe- cos of our weather) and also lower milage
buyers in europe come over and fill vans / trailers full of them, ive sold to buyers who collect 15 harleys per trip for example
if he sends money by bank transfer, once it is in your bank he cant take it back
I had a buell - 90% of them are bought up by german/belgian/dutch buyers
I dont see any prob
how can money disappear from my account once cleared? is that possible?
Yes.
There is a scam whereby a stolen / forged / etc. banker's draft or cheque is paid into the scammer's account. These funds can then be transferred to your account and *appear* to have cleared, however when the original banker's draft, etc. is cleared back to its originating bank (weeks after being paid in), the fraud comes to light, and the transactions get reversed.
It is my understanding that a 'CHAPS' transfer cannot be reversed in this manner, and that once your bank confirms that the money is in your account, you are safe, but you should verify this yourself! (I think there is a small fee for a CHAPS transfer, and any scammer will likely be well aware of the implications.)
Have you had a look at how much your bike would cost in Portugal? May just be worth it to him financially. You are right to be cautious however I think we're in danger of thinking everything is a scam these days.
His mate might have the pleasure of riding it over to Portugal as payment for his troubles...
As said above i'd be wary. I'd 'confront' him in a nice way with your concerns and ask that he sends the money to his agent who can then pay you cash, and confirm receipt etc.
If he's genuine, I'd expect that he'll see your concerns as legitimate and have no major issues in doing as you request.
If he's a scammer, he'll come up with reasons / get abusive, but wgaf, at least then you'll know.
If he's genuine, but gets annoyed / abusive anyway; then he's a **** and doesn't deserve your bike, so tell him to do one.
Why don't you publish the text of the buyer's proposal on here? There will be certain turns of phrase and expressions that will make it clear, especially if he's a Naija 419 man as they can't help giving themselves away.
I've just helped my son's pal fall into the very same trap with a Galaxy he was selling.
I had a similar situation selling a motorbike.
Buyer said he was from Spain, the IP address was traced to Nigeria.
I actually think this buying bikes from UK is quite common
couple of emails below
Hi,
Bike will be collected by a portuguese guy that runs a shipping company in London. I think that sending the money to your account will be the safest way. By the way, are you close to the M 25?
Regards
Hugo
text doesn't look nigerian to me
New message from: hexmax500 (243Turquoise Star)
Hi,
I ve just ordered the money transfer.Bank told me it would get there in aprox 3/4 days. Please mail me when you receive it so that i can make arrangments with the carrier.
Regards
Hugo
ebay profile - he looks like a legit biker (dust covered race plated dirt bike in profile pic - he's buying my KTM). Also - positive ebay feedback
http://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/hexmax500
I've spoken to my bank - once funds are cleared it's irreversable apparently
I have contacted him to ask what he is planning to do with the bike - suspect he's planning a big tour.....
I've spoken to my bank - once funds are cleared it's irreversable apparently
They say that, but...
Get him to wire the money to the bloke who's collecting, who can then pay you in cash.
If they trust him to collect the bike, they must trust him to handle cash!
[quote=charliemort said]
I've spoken to my bank - once funds are cleared it's irreversable apparently
You should have asked them "even if the sourcing account ends up having been hacked ?" and got the answer in writing 😉
From what you've posted though, it does look legit.
Can your bank see that the transfer is in progress? A popular way to scam is to promise to pay by a secure method but at the last minute it "stops working" or similar then they step in with the stolen or fake cheque scam.
Couple of things stand out for me.
1) "portugese guy that runs a shipping company in London" not sure why but that doesn't sound particularly legit
2) why would he specifically choose a payment method that gives him no protection?
Anyway, I'd get confirmation that the funds are cleared and can't be reversed from your bank before letting it go
I'd ask him for some proof of ID. A scan of his passport, picture of him next to today's paper and a proof of address. I have to say, it does sound a bit dodge...
Cash on collection and make sure you have a burly mate with you for protection.
He pulls a knife, you pull a bigger knife etc type scenario.
You can google photos.
Open a second page in your browser and drag the photo into the text entry box.
You will then see how "original" the photo actually is.
Might help.
For ballance agaisnt all the "It's a scam" responses. My dad's sold 4 bikes abroad in the last few years.
Royal Enfield Bullet (newer one, not rare) - guy turned up from Sweeden and rode it down to London where he got on a freight ship with it.
Honda Transalp (sold as it was just too dull) - guy had it shipped to Morocco.
Armstrong MT500 (sold as it was just too rubbish)- guy had a friend pick it up and have it shipped to Canada.
Velocet 1950's trials bike (a Bitsa bike, not a collectors item) - guy turned up in a transit from Swizerland.
At least a few of those were paid for by bank transfer, the rest he got the person picking it up to bring cash. I think he was more woried about people phoning up and complainig they'd bought lemons (the Armstong had done the usual thing for that engine and worn the cam bearings, the velocet wasn't exactly in great condition, the Enfield died on the way to London but turned out to just be a lose conection on the battery).
2) why would he specifically choose a payment method that gives him no protection?
Because he's not out to scam anyone? Maybe, dunno, just a thought.
The OPs' right to be cautious, but that post is just odd!
Not that odd njee if you think about it.
I'm not saying its definitely a scam, just a few things that would slightly worry me, being a cautious type that I am.
Not that odd njee if you think about it.I'm not saying its definitely a scam, just a few things that would slightly worry me, being a cautious type that I am.
Thinking something is a scam because the buyer is wanting to pay via a method that offers him no protection isn't odd?
"No, I don't want your cash, that sounds like a scam, pay via PayPal"?
I'm not really following you to be fair and I don't normally waste time trying to prove/argue my opinions to strangers on the internet. I was just trying to point out a couple of potential things to the OP in an attempt to help him out. If you disagree, nice one, you've put forward your opinion too. I really don't fit in around here do I!
Nah, that sort of logic will never catch on.
so the consensus is I should ask him to:
- wire money to a shipping company
- get shipping company to draw cash
- get shipping company to take risk of carting the cash around
I wouldn't do it if I was him!
I have bought a car and motorbike in last few months. Both times I transferred funds to dealers account
Problem is, so many people have been scammed, have had scammers unsuccessfully attempt to scam them or have witnessed other people scammed here on STW that they have become extremely cautious, including myself. Most people will err on the side of extreme caution so that's why the majority of responses have been rather negative, justifiably or not.
At the end of the day, if you're happy with the way the deal has been carried out, and you get some assurance from your bank that the payment has completely cleared and cannot be reversed then you'll be fine
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-32250283 ]I can see why someone wouldn't want to carry lots of money to buy a bike/car etc...[/url]
It may or may not be a scam. There seems to be arguments here for both cases.
So, why risk it? Is there only one person on the planet buying bikes? Say "no thanks" and cart on.
Well latest
money hit my account Monday
Called bank again - funds are cleared and cannot be reversed
I have spoken to Jaoa the shipping guy - he's collecting tonight, will give me an official shipping note and sign to confrm receipt. Has 4 or 5 clients who regularly buy bikes from UK
if it's a scam it's good!
had a quick blast on it last night - nearly brought a tear to my eye
why didn't I tell him to get lost as suggested on here by some people?:
- he made a sensible offer (top end of my expectations)- not the usual wait til ad has ended then offer stupid amount
- despite plenty of research, I coul;d find no evidence of a scam - they exist with paypal payment, blokes from Nigeria, agreeing to pay for shipping etc
- no tire kicking
- fast payment
- good to deal with
- looked like an enthusiast, not a wheeler dealer
- clearly knew the bike and what he was after
if it goes mamories skywards I'll be sure to let y'all know!
Great news!
You underpriced it, obviously. (-:
When I sold a 70s CB750 all the (decent) interest came from Portugal, I was nervous that it was some well known scam that I had missed. In end the guy paid a fair price for the bike and asked me to deliver at his cost. Cash on delivery. I had visions of 3 days on a classic bike down to Lisbon but it ended up going to his brother in Brighton.
Much nicer to deal with than the british interest all of which tried to threaten me into paying what they wanted to pay.
One last thought: Take a few photos of the bike when it's being loaded / packed up, or whatever. I sold a VFR on ebay to a guy who arranged for a courier to pick it up in a van. Between my house and his, somebody dropped it and smashed up the clocks, fairing & mirror. The company that moved it denied all knowledge and went as far as doctoring their receipt to add details of the damage.
This obviously put us both in an awkward situation. The company kept changing their story (and their paperwork doctoring was laughably bad!) so the buyer eventually believed my side of the story. I left him and them arguing it out.
(Transport company was 'Roads Away' in Holywell run by Chris Jackson. AVOID!)
Paypal doesn't provide buyer protection for vehicles or deposits.