Out on Cannock chase today I came across four large groups of riders and quite a few groups of three. It was a short ride (25k)in a relatively small area so it seems quite a high density of group rides to me. Is this the new normal?
It appears so. I was on a road ride in the Chilterns yesterday and saw loads of road and mountain bike groups.
I think the accepted wisdom is that there is very little risk of spreading the virus when outside. You can ride in groups if you are from the same household, you can also ride with one other person outside your household so riding with others is allowed, but in larger, mixed groups you would be in breach of the guidelines. I suspect it will be one of the next things to be relaxed, though. There are certainly bigger breaches to worry about than this, especially groups of three (who way not even be against the guidelines)
Up to people to make their own decisions in life.
A major viral pandemic hits the UK, killing over 32,000 and people want to congregate.
Fine, they are the example Charles Darwin was talking about. Stay clear of them.
Apparently not, went for a walk in the Forest of Dean yesterday with the dogs, across the top of Sallowvallets (top end of Verderers) and Cannop Ponds area there were several groups of blokes riding close together and congregating in groups for a chat mid/post ride like nothing has happened, and really didn't give a crap that other people were about and giving them looks/a wide berth.
There was a big group of 8-10 at Swinely yesterday (by random conincidence Im sure, on E-bikes).
Seemed to generally be stopping 2m appart but still.......
I guess people will all interpret the rules is slightly different ways.
Im sticking with my interpretation of the rules, and Im sure there's someone who thinks 5 hours solo on the bike yesterday was taking the piss by their interpretation.
I wish these threads were done with. Or is the new normal even more judgemental than the old one?
Other people behave differently from you. Get over it.
That's all well and good Spin, but it is a fairly deadly global pandemic.
I think this is indicative of the confusion the latest set of 'guidelines' has created.
Added to that having that ****wit Cummings doing what he likes with what appears to be the full support of the ruling classes then I can fully understand why they're getting together for rides.
I did think that you could meet one person from outside your household for exercise outside provided you remained 2metres apart but more than that was a no-no but what do I know?
That’s all well and good Spin, but it is a fairly deadly global pandemic.
That hadn't passed me by but I think it's past time people stopped sharing their outrage at others behaviour. We established quite early on that not everyone is behaving the same way and moaning about it isn't going to help.
I think the accepted wisdom is that there is very little risk of spreading the virus when outside.
Accepted? Wisdom ? It seems to be what people want to hear so I suppose so.
Who gives a toss for science any more if it's politically expedient not to?
I think this is indicative of the confusion the latest set of ‘guidelines’ has created.
Latest?
There was a big group of 8-10 at Swinely yesterday (by random conincidence Im sure, on E-bikes).
Seemed to generally be stopping 2m appart but still…….
What has 2m got to do with it? Is this a magic number?
Riding behind someone 1/4 sec behind them through woodland you might as well forget 2m when you stop.
That hadn’t passed me by but I think it’s past time people stopped sharing their outrage at others behaviour. We established quite early on that not everyone is behaving the same way and moaning about it isn’t going to help.
So yesterday someone posted on FB that some bastard had refused their help when they tried to touch them. The general consensus was either kick them in the head or throw the bike off a cliff or both.
So yesterday someone posted on FB that some bastard had refused their help when they tried to touch them. The general consensus was either kick them in the head or throw the bike off a cliff or both.
Is there more to this than 'some people are pricks'?
A major viral pandemic hits the UK, killing over 32,000 and people want to congregate.
Yeah, but it's not really killing that many healthy people who congregate outdoors and might on occasions be closer than 2m is it?
Although I've not myself broken that particular rule, I'm happy to admit I've assessed risk and broken other lockdown rules recently as we are very far removed from where we were before the lockdown started.
Is there more to this than ‘some people are pricks’?
Depending on your take... the OP was just asking to be fair after he didn't ask them before going to take the bike off them on what was described as a farm track.
The person who'd crashed was fully conscious and ended up shouting at them to stay back.
A good 80%? of the posts were between throw his bike off the cliff or give the ungrateful (assumed) roady a good kicking shouldn't be riding if they can't not crash.
Almost no-one thought they had a right to turn down assistance.
Very very disturbing... as it was "most" not "some"
That thread I think wasn't the refusal. It was how it was refused...
Personally on ones travels it appears more people have gotten bored of the rules and then compound that with the likes of DC being a dick they're more inclined to say sod it.
However everyone loves judging others. It's great fun.
Depending on your take…
I think the story there is as much about people being frightened as people being dicks.
I wish these threads were done with.
I agree totally with Spin. Loads of these threads. Why not take your mock outrage to Twitter where you can get stroked better by the like minded.
mock outrage? where?
Fine, they are the example Charles Darwin was talking about. Stay clear of them.
Darwin never discussed any such nonsense. Natural selection / survival of the fittest presumes that:
- "nature" decides not the individuals;
- the premise is that for "good genes" to be passed on and "bad ones" to be discontinued, that means any 'bad actions' by an individual after they have bred are not selective (unless they directly harm their own offspring);
- the consequences of a poor gene (e.g. being a **** who goes on group rides in close proximity to others) is felt most by the holder of that gene - or its entire species: i.e. its perfectly "Darwinian" that some poor genetics wipe out the entire human race (or do so in certain ecosystems/geographies).
Saying "Natural Selection" will sort them out, is a bit like the Herd Immunity plan and is not far off Eugenics. Medically fit people survive whilst those who have underlying health issues either die of the illness or from not being able to access the health services they need.
Yeah, but it’s not really killing that many healthy people who congregate outdoors and might on occasions be closer than 2m is it?
Therein lies the problem. It not about person A giving the virus to person B and C who then die (although some will even if normally fit and healthy!). Its about person B and C then unknowingly giving the virus to person D,E,F and G who then give it to H,I,J,K,L,M,N,O and about person X,Y and Z being unable to access their normal medical care (cancer screening, chemotherapy, transplant surgery are all but stopped, because the NHS doesn't have capacity and the relative benefits are less than the risks when the disease is prevalent).
@poly - clearly I'm aware of that, but the transmission risk within a group of mountain bikers out for a ride on Sunday must be pretty small in the first place, no?
duncancallum
That thread I think wasn’t the refusal. It was how it was refused…
In all reality how else could he have refused?
You don't have time for a polite conversation...as I personally realised.
I had a "helpful" delivery guy who I tried to be polite with. I was in the garage with the door open when he arrived and I cheerfully asked if he'd leave the delivery there "just leave it there please" ... he kept going .. "please stop" , "oh I'll just put it in the garage for you" by which point he was quite literally almost in... I ended up shouting him out of his autopilot being helpful...
Yeah, but it’s not really killing that many healthy people who congregate outdoors and might on occasions be closer than 2m is it?
Whoosh… that’s the sound of the point of distancing measures flying over someone’s head.
clearly I’m aware of that, but the transmission risk within a group of mountain bikers out for a ride on Sunday must be pretty small in the first place, no?
Why would breathing in what someone exhaled 1/4 sec ago be safe? It might be perfectly safe to you... but as Poly said...^
However the biggest danger is people just assuming "the transmission risk within a group of mountain bikers out for a ride on Sunday must be pretty small in the first place". Anyone in that group might be H,I,J,K,L,M,N,O or they may live with H,I,J,K,L,M,N,O or X,Y or Z
I've not seen a government rule that say's not to share a waterbottle so long as you don't go within 2m to hand it to the person. Hopefully it's common sense ?
Added to that having that **** Cummings doing what he likes with what appears to be the full support of the ruling classes then I can fully understand why they’re getting together for rides.
I couldn't care what Cummings has done or who thinks what is safe or okay to do, personally I am not about to take risks by congregating in groups like that - why take the risk?
Was out on a walk in my local woods on a public footpath, the other day and a group of four bikers came past, id thought I would have some fun and exclaimed “enjoy your rule breaking” to which the reply was “well we are 2m apart”.
I then had great pleasure in pointing out it was a footpath...
If you night ride with head torches, it’s amazing how (you can see) if someone ahead of you spits sideways, what a huge cloud of tiny droplets is visible in the air and how, if you were 5m behind, you ride through it.
You can’t see it in daylight, but it’s obviously there, just the same. Based on that, I’d suggest 10m wouldn’t be safe if riding behind someone at 20mph on the road.
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Dickyboy
Subscriber@poly – clearly I’m aware of that, but the transmission risk within a group of mountain bikers out for a ride on Sunday must be pretty small in the first place, no?
Dickyboy feel free to back that up with some peer reviewed data if you want. Otherwise it seems like a bunch of people exercising heavily in close proximity to each other for a long period of time with little access to good hygiene facilities would seem to be some risk factors involved: you are breathing faster so presumably inhale a larger dose, you are breathing deeper so potentially get the dose deeper into the respiratory tract, you are sweating so likely to touch/rub face/eyes, “sunday riders” quite likely to cough and splutter on the climbs.
My run this morning took me for a bit onto the South Downs Way and there were a good few groups out, far more in fact than I've seen before in 35+ years I've lived here. On the positive there were a lot of family groups out cycling which in the past was a very rare site up there. So yes plenty of groups stretching the rules but also a whole new group of people just discovering how great riding off road is and what a great place they live in.
I think the story there is as much about people being frightened as people being dicks.
It's about why some people are frightened and others can't afford to get the virus and why some people can't understand that.
My brother for instance has quit his job to take care of our octagenarian mother with multiple auto-immune diseases. If he even thinks he might be infected all that is for nothing.
Perhaps you think my mother shouldn't be scared to go back into the nursing home we took her out of at the beginning of February when it became obvious tens of thousands were going to die in UK nursing homes?
You can ride in groups if you are from the same household, you can also ride with one other person outside your household so riding with others is allowed
2m rule still applies when meeting up with "other person".
Out on a popular local roadie route this morning, didn't see anyone obviously breaching the guidelines - a few non household pairs out 2m plus apart, most pairs obviously households.
Nice social distancing at the cafe as well.
Most of the people dying are over 70.
Transmission is primarily by droplets from infectious people *indoors*.
Me cycling around with my mates, outside, none of us have it, the risk is practically zero.
Risk of being killed by a car is considerably higher.
Plus, Dominic Cummings.
2m rule still applies when meeting up with “other person”.
Has anyone suggested otherwise? Also I think it would be pretty hard to ride less than 2m from someone unless you are pootling (or a roadie)
Me cycling around with my mates, outside, none of us have it, the risk is practically zero.
This statement can only be true if you are certain that all of your mates, or people they live with, have had no outside contact outside their household for weeks. Recently a test of an entire care home and it's workers showed that roughly 1/5 unknowingly had the virus and were asymptomatic...going forward we're going to have to put a lot of faith in asymptomatic 'transmission' not being so big an issue in assessing risk. The risk is likely to be a long way from zero in any group situation. If you have to do it...best spin like billy'o to be at the front of the pack, and no chest bumps.
Me cycling around with my mates, outside, none of us have it, the risk is practically zero.
Possibly correct, but unless none of you have had any contact with anyone or anything else for 3 weeks, you have no way of knowing for sure that you haven't got it and can't pass it on.
Though I accept that as we move further out of lockdown, we may all have to make that kind of best guess on our social contacts
Once again, a group of people riding around outside, if they chose to accept the small increase in risk, then I no longer see any issue, certainly something I’m not going to let bother me.
And compared to pretty much any coastal town, today being Poole, Christchurch & Bournmouth where the towns are ‘very’ busy - maybe not half term busy, but certainly a serious lack of social distancing going on, as most people are sat on (closed) pub tables, having all brought their own beers, having a mass piss up in the sun.
A few guys on bikes, don’t even register on the scale of issues.
Ones personal feelings on this are irrelevant.
Me cycling around with my mates, outside, none of us have it, the risk is practically zero.
Wow you and your mates all got tested today and got the results back?
Once again, a group of people riding around outside, if they chose to accept the small increase in risk, then I no longer see any issue, certainly something I’m not going to let bother me.
likewise, i struggle to get too wound up about it, however it's important to acknowledge that they're making the decision on the small increase in risk not only for themselves, but for everyone else they come in to contact with. we'll find out in a few weeks what the effects of these decisions are.
however it’s important to acknowledge that they’re making the decision on the small increase in risk not only for themselves, but for everyone else they come in to contact with
THIS is the whole point.
the premise is that for “good genes”
Darwin didnt know about genes.
a_a depends what you mean by know about genes? Genetics as a science and even as a word was not known but he did understand the concept of heritable variability which is what we (in 2020) are getting at with “good genes” he had no idea of the mechanism but the concept that parents pass on features to their children was understood.
Most of the people dying are over 70.
Transmission is primarily by droplets from infectious people *indoors*.
Me cycling around with my mates, outside, none of us have it, the risk is practically zero.
Risk of being killed by a car is considerably higher.
Plus, Dominic Cummings.
So Cummings is stupid, and Boris isn’t brave enough to fire him so you think it’s ok to kill 70 year olds (just for your info - whilst most people who die are 70+ it’s certainly nowhere near all). I’d say your risk of being killed by a car mountain biking must be close to zero?
I’m not sure how you know that most infections are indoors (are you trusting the same govt that won’t sack Cummings? Or are you biasing your data from the fact that most prolonged interactions have been indoors)?
I’ve no idea how you could know that none of your friends have the virus? Presumably it’s some sort of similar psychic power than means that you know none of them will will have contact with anyone over 70 (or who in turn will have contact with anyone over 70).
