I'll open with Chi take away.
People should stop shortening everything, I was watching a kids program* the other day and the presenter actually said "wow, that was redic"!!!
*with my kids by the way, I prefer much more highbrow things like Death in Paradise!!
my thing about the shop was not a proud boast. I just asked all in the building what they would call a Chinese takeaway meal. all said chinky.
I think it may be a northern thing.
the presenter actually said "wow, that was redic"!!!
Totes Unaccept.
Packie, pronounced the same as **** is another one of the million nicknames the yanks have for Patrick. It was a bit of shock to hear first time.
As for the Chinky thing, I have to admit it's a word we use in our house to refer to the food / takeaway, not the people. Hadn't considered it even rude up to now. I heard people in our local say aloud on their mobile "do you want anything from the Chinky?" No eye brows were raised on either side of the counter.
A lot of this comes down to how and why it's said an in what context. **** as a shortening for ****stani was taken and made a slur by the far right and the hard of thinking years ago, it's sad really, I've no desire to use it anymore, but on the face of it, it seems a perfectly harmless shortening like Scott for Scottish, it's arseholes using it as an insult and stealing word and making them nasty. I used that word in everyday use as a child without a hint of malice or hate, but now I wonder if I was upsetting people unknowingly.
So what aboot calling someone a Jock, or dare I say it a Sassenach?
I certainly don't mind ... 😆
Use whatever term you like otherwise life will be boring.
Is "Hamilton Accies" racist?
rushki, polski, frog, paddy, taff, jock. all racist?
Is "Hamilton Accies" racist?
It is in Motherwell.
'rushki, polski, frog, paddy, taff, jock. all racist?'
Don't forget Ginger too
rushki, polski, frog, paddy, taff, jock. all racist?
All can be replaced with a word that actually means where they're from with practically the same syllables, so again whats the point?
Russian, Polish, French, Irish, Welsh, Scot.....
Surely no one actually says "so, there was this Polski...."
Yes it is racist and offensive. Back in the 80s at school I would hit someone for calling me anything derogatory based on race. But then that's how schoolboys tend to deal with all issues.
Knowing that this would happen at an otherwise all-white school, I remember my dad teaching me how to punch properly. It was much tougher for my sister as girls didn't resolve things with a fight.
A Chinese friend of mine considers it racist. That's enough for me. Don't use it.
Did you ask the people behind the counter how they felt about it? My friend wouldn't have said anything in public. Her brother would.No eye brows were raised on either side of the counter.
I do enjoy threads where a bunch of middle-aged white guys (yeah, I'm making that assumption) decide what is and isn't racist.
Surely no one actually says "so, there was this Polski...."
I have a customer in Doncaster. his company name is Polskisat.
Calling a meal chinky: Not racist.
Calling a person chinky: Racist.
Technically it's not racist, in the context of talking about food.. But still it's 2017 no 1983 anymore. It's no great loss to your lexicon if you just forget the word exists and stop using it..
yeah its racist down south.
The meal also implies where it's from and the staff involved in preparing it. Therefore it's racist too.
I do enjoy threads where a bunch of middle-aged white guys (yeah, I'm making that assumption) decide what is and isn't racist.
Surely part of the problem is the intention or at least the attitude behind it. Is 'Jew' a rascist insult? It is when a Nazi uses it. But times do change. I happened to be watching an early episode of 'Yes Minister' & it was cringe makingly embarrassing to see the attitude towards African countries. I doubt if many (white) people noticed at the time.
Gwai lo.
Gwai lo.
No, it's pronounced, Gwai lo
'Technically it's not racist' 'It's not racist when you're talking about food' blah blah blah.
My Chinese friend doesn't see a difference and thus considers it racist whether she's down south or up north (is that meant to be some sort of excuse?!). That's enough for me.
No, it's pronounced, Gwai lo
And your point is?
I think it rather depends on your audience. If you are certain of your non racist credentials and of your audience's too and you are using the term in a semi ironic way I would say it's ok.
But any doubt at all about who you are talking to and best stick with 'a chinese takeaway'.
I don't think I'd use the term chinky anyway but I wouldn't necessarily find it offensive. Applied to a person thought - no dice!
The corner shop local to my work is run by an Asian family (Sorry, I've not engaged any of them in enough conversation to discover their country of birth. It might even be Scotland). The shop is called Chalkies.
Northwind - Member
terrahawk - Member
Do you also debate the rights and wrongs of the term, "**** Shop"?What I kind of like is that around here, "**** shop" is pretty much interchangable with "corner shop"- our corner shop's owned by a white scottish person and always has been but people call it the **** shop. So it's just become completely connected from the racial slur it started with.
Personally I just say "shop". I don't really see the need to distinguish the nationality(however innocently or derogatorily shortened) nor indeed understand why it's important to know that it's located on a "corner"! (particularly when most of the time they aren't even that!) 😆
My most important considerations are - does it's sell milk, bread, square sausage, bacon, ginger, and a varied selection of munchies? 😆
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tpbiker - Member....to refer to a Chinese takeaway as a 'chinky'?
Was debated in the pub last night. Been a term in Scotland
How come in Scotland you have Cantonese takeaways but Chinese carry outs?
Or is that distinction less of a thing these days?
I needs to know.
Don't post a picture of your Chinese meal with the chopsticks sticking up from the middle of it, whatever you do.
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-39142260 ]Linky[/url]
Brown - Member
'Technically it's not racist' 'It's not racist when you're talking about food' blah blah blah.My Chinese friend doesn't see a difference and thus considers it racist whether she's down south or up north (is that meant to be some sort of excuse?!). That's enough for me.
Racism for me requires intent. But anyhow, i'm not really defending usage of the word.
As i say it has potential to cause offensive, even if not intended. But it's no reall great loss just to use the correct term.
I like slang as much as the next person, but I'm not tied to it.
Uncomfortable certainly. Why bother?
Unless you're being (as many older folk of my folks' generation are/were won't to do) provocative and deliberately so - see also the occasional posts on FB about "why were the polliwogs ditched from jam jars" and so on.
Did you find it uncomfortable to say, TJ? or even a bit defensive?
People should stop shortening everything, I was watching a kids program* the other day and the presenter actually said "wow, that was redic"!!!
I detest the Americanisation of our language. It's programme not program. Program is IT or information technology to you as I'm guessing you also don't like acronyms? 😉
As i say it has potential to cause offensive, even if not intended.
Even if it is used without racist intent, it's not a very nice word and carries a legacy of racist intent.
Until the word is rehabilitated, then best not to use it in such contexts.
"Don't post a picture of your Chinese meal with the chopsticks sticking up from the middle of it, whatever you do.Linky"
To be fair, she is right - Filipinos are culturally Latin, not Chinese. So chopsticks are hilariously ignorant, it's like having British Fish and Chips with French fries - which I find ****ing offensive.
Although they do eat a lot of things on pandan leaves.
Racism for me requires intent.
I disagree. That implies there's no such thing as casual racism.
If something's said 'without intent' but still upsets people of a particular race based on their race, that's racist, regardless of intent.
I detest the Americanisation of our language. It's programme not program. Program is IT
It's a computer "program" when referring to software precisely because it was originally coined in the US (see also floppy disk and hard disk versus compact disc; the first two are American inventions, the second a joint venture between the non-American companies Philips and Sony).
There was a big debate on facebook about people from Bollington being referred to (and referring to themselves) as Bollywogs.
Fun to watch.
I definitely wouldn't be the person to stand in a Chinese takeaway on the phone saying "Do you want anything from the Chinky?".
I do find it interesting how it is often the same people on each side of these arguments. Makes me wonder what the main differences in our experiences are that lead us to our positions.
agreed.CharlieMungus - Member
As i say it has potential to cause offensive, even if not intended.
Even if it is used without racist intent, it's not a very nice word and carries a legacy of racist intent.Until the word is rehabilitated, then best not to use it in such contexts.
Racism for me requires intent.I disagree. That implies there's no such thing as casual racism.
Hence my post on the first page of this thread. In my twenties I used to think along similar lines but have come to realise it will still cause offence regardless of my intent. It takes very little effort to adjust or understand why you're doing so and sometimes it takes someone to inform you of your error. I was lucky enough not to have some preachy, condescending type help me understand where I was going wrong.
I do enjoy threads where a bunch of middle-aged white guys (yeah, I'm making that assumption) decide what is and isn't racist.
Fair enough, but as the op I can confirm that the person in the pub who actually brought the subject up was chinese. And he had no issues with it at all. Appears to me that those who take issue with it aren't from the areas that grew up with the term.
as pointed out by others, i think the word used to describe an individual is not appropriate in the least...
Makes me wonder what the main differences in our experiences are that lead us to our positions.
Having an Indian best mate since the age of 11 and a Chinese ex girlfriend who've both been negatively affected by racism means that you can probably guess my position on the subject.
Sorry if Teasel finds that condescending or preachy.
Brown - Member
Racism for me requires intent.I disagree. That implies there's no such thing as casual racism.
If something's said 'without intent' but still upsets people of a particular race based on their race, that's racist, regardless of intent.
I can see there being a need to differentiate between overt racism and societal racism that goes back generations, as lets face it does exist(i'm guilty of it myself, born late 70s, growing up in the 80s, hard to avoid it, society moves on though and we learn).
I don't think it's really helpful to call the later racists though, rather than just say, come on, do you realise you sound like a fossil or some such, and just make it known, it's really socially unacceptable to refer to such and such as such and such... (in saying that, I think we're well down that path these days, so anyone that religiously sticks to stereotypical terms can probably be called a racist.)
I grew up with the term but wouldn't use it now. I'm 58 and not past learning. For folk in their 80s, maybe there's more of an excuse.Appears to me that those who take issue with it aren't from the areas that grew up with the term.
Appears to me that those who take issue with it aren't from the areas that grew up with the term.,
I think for the 40somethings in here, we all grew up with the term, just some stopped using it